NOTE: This page is in desperate need of revision and expansion. In the meantime, I suggest you use Rationalwiki’s Manosphere Glossary.
For newcomers to this blog, here’s a handy guide to some of the strange acronyms and lingo you’ll encounter here and in the “manosphere” in general. (For a definition of that term, see below.) I will update this entry periodically as needed.
First, the acronyms you’ll see most often here:
MRA: Men’s Rights Activist
MRM: Men’s Rights Movement
MGTOW: Men Going Their Own Way MGHOW: Man Going His Own Way.
Ok, so what do those terms mean?
MRM: The Men’s Rights Movement: A loosely defined, but largely retrograde, collection of activists and internet talkers who fight for what they see as “men’s rights.” Unlike the original Men’s Movement, which was inspired by and heavily influenced by feminism, the self-described Men’s Rights Movement is largely a reactionary movement; with few exceptions, Men’s Rights Activists (or MRAs) are pretty rabidly antifeminist, and many are frankly and sometimes proudly misogynistic. Those who oppose the MRM are generally not against men’s rights per se; they are opposed to those who’ve turned those two words into a synonym for some pretty backwards notions.
MGTOW: Men Going Their Own Way: As the name suggests, MGTOW is a lot like lesbian separatism, but for straight dudes. MGTOW often talk vaguely about seeking “independence” from western and/or consumer culture, and a few MGTOW try to live that sort of zen existence. But most of those who embrace the term have a deep hostility towards and/or profound distrust of feminists and women in general. Many MGTOW refuse to date “western women” and some try to avoid women altogether. I think the Man Going His Own Way acronym MGHOW adds another layer of confusion to an already awkward acronym, so I use MGTOWer instead.
Some other terms and acronyms you’ll run across here:
Anglosphere: Countries in which English is the primary language, or, more narrowly, those countries that used to be British colonies. They are full of evil Western Women (see below).
Incel: Involuntarily Celibate. A term, and identity, adopted by some dateless guys (as well as some women, but it’s the men we’ll focus on here). While there is nothing shameful about being dateless, or a virgin, or having a really long dry spell sexually — most of us have been there at some point — the term “involuntarily celibate” seems to suggest that the world owes incels sex, and that women who turn down incel men for dates or sex are somehow oppressing them. For those (male, straight) incels who are genuinely socially awkward or phobic, this can be a self-defeating stance that can lead to bitterness towards women. And often does.
Mangina: Derogatory term used by MRAs, MGTOW, etc. to describe guys who disagree with them — e.g., me. You can figure out the various connotations of this term yourself.
The Manosphere: The loose collection of blogs, message boards, and other sites run by and/or read by MRAs, MGTOW, and assorted friendly Pick-up Artists. The primary source of material for this blog.
NAWALT: Not All Women Are Like That. Dudes in the manosphere make so many ridiculous and untrue generalizations about women that they’ve come up with their own little acronym to describe the most common reaction to their nonsense: “not all women are like that.” Remarkably, many seem to think that making a reference to NAWALT is actually some sort of clever rebuttal of their critics.
PUA: Pick-up Artist. PUAs are obsessed with mastering what they see as the ultimate set of techniques and attitudes — known as “Game” — that will enable them to quickly seduce almost any woman they want. There is a vast literature on “game” online, though PUA (insofar as it is not complete bullshit) is at its essence simply a male version of the age-old ploy of “playing hard to get.”
Western Women: Also known as WW. Evil harpies, at least according to many in the manosphere. Contrasted with “foreign women,” a term that (in the manosphere, at least) sometimes refers to all women outside the Anglosphere, but often refers to a subset of these women from poor and/or Eastern countries, mostly Asian, who are regarded as more pliable and thus more desirable to haters of “Ameriskanks” and other WW.
Kind of silly post. Like the MRA, this post is desperate to differentiate feminism and MRA’s as two opposites when in reality they’re really two sides of the same coin.
Both hate the opposite sex; both hate religions and traditional cultures; both believe in a grand conspiracy of the opposite sex that has led to their own subjugation (“Patriarchy!”, “Misandry!”); both believe in total equality in all roles regardless of biology; etc…
It’s like Democrats and Republicans: Both want to present themselves as being opposite of the other, but in reality they’re two heads of the same hydra.
But hey, if doing do makes you feel better and superior, fine by me. The internet is already filled with these “circle jerk” websites.
@Dar
Another idiot who missed the whole point…
Seriously did you even read the whole thread?
If you do you won’t dismissed it so easily as an attempt to said both sides are just as bad as each other.I’m sorry no it doesn’t work that way..
How many feminists do you know that had send death threats or rape threats against the opposite sex compare to certain MRAs individuals who liken women to whores,cunts and bitches,no to mention the constant malicious threats?
There are many examples you could find on the internet to prove it but just like you said
“The internet is already filled with these “circle jerk” websites” so you can ignore what I said and just find another space to share with others who shared the same views as yours.
Since you said the democrats and the republicans are just as bad as each other I assumed you won’t casting your vote during upcoming election..At least the deomcrats are not hypocrites like the republicans..
I’m guessing you’re a feminist, right?
Well, it might be painful for you to admit, but it is true. You and the MRA’s are the same. Anti-religion, anti-traditions and traditional (and natural) gender roles, pro-total equality, including int higs like the military and police.
Oh, and the democrats are just as hypocritical and rotten the the republicans. Witness Obama and his wars, and drones, and torture and spying, all things many democrats condemned under Bush jr..
@Dar
If we happened to think MRAs share many of our views, I think we wouldn’t be as opposed to them as we are. The might claim to be all for equality, but their attitudes don’t reflect that.
Also, nice one. Traditional gender roles are natural, (Which seems kind of a meaningless concept when dealing with human behavior, really) but you won’t say why.
I assume you won’t be coming back.
Why won’t I be coming back, when you’re being so charming.
You can oppose, even hate, something precisely because it resembles you so. Again like Democrats and Republicans.
You hate the MRA’s because they believe the exact same thing as you except the flip side: matriarchy instead of patriarchy; misandry instead of misogyny; men as second-class instead of women as second-class, etc…
They stole your script, flipped the words around, and now you have a mirror image of yourselves to fight.
New comments to this post are always so refreshing and original! I have certainly never heard the “both sides do it” argument, or the “feminists are evil destroyers of nature who hate men” position. These are completely new ideas to me!
Thank you so much, Dar, for popping in to share your infinite, and completely non-rehashed or regurgitated, wisdom with us. We are utterly in your debt forever for bringing enlightenment to us.
Man, you and your politics. I’m not American – I know little of Democrats and Republicans.
By that logic they don’t believe the same thing – they believe the actual opposite. “The exact same thing except” is not the exact same thing.
But let’s leave semantics aside, shall we? The thing with MRAs is not that they stole any script – is that they’re wrong.
If I said “I like ducks because they can swim, fly, and they have feathers.” and you said “I like rocks because they can swim, fly, and they have feathers” I would be upset about you attributing traits that rocks don’t have to them (thus placing them in the same category as ducks), more than I would be upset about you using virtually the same language.
I know MRAs don’t say men are opressed for the same reasons we say women are – but your argument only flipped the subjects, so I did the same when replying to it.
I have another issue with MRAs. They are hateful towards women or people who don’t agree with them as a general rule, and that is an exception from what I’ve seen of feminists.
Where do you see anyone here advocating for a matriarchal society? MRAs specifically advocate for a patriarchal society, so please provide specific quotes.
I’m gonna give a cookie to the first troll who says “Both sides are bad” without then saying or heavily implying “Therefore feminists are worse” and two cookies to the first one who posts an equal anti-MRA rant on an MRA forum. Which means my cookie supply is forever safe.
*Sorry, Darsehole, you didn’t just gotcha an evil mean feminist who wants anybody to brigade or harass MRAs. Not even close. Just snarking that if you BSAB trolls truly believed that we’re the same, then you wouldn’t bug us and only us.
Stick the missing * after “Equal anti-MRA rant on an MRA forum.” My keyboard is falling apart.
@Dar:
Since when have the MRAs been anti-traditional male gender roles? One of the reasons I oppose them is that, as a man, I dislike being told to conform to a very narrow definition of masculinity. By contrast, feminism tells me that I can wear pink and enjoy the company of STEM women at the same time as I watch the rugby. That’s a far better way to live.
As for being anti-religion, well some do and some don’t. Certain feminist thinkers – Greta Christina, for example – are also atheist activists; on the other hand some feminists are themselves religious, including some here. Likewise some MRAs, like Roosh Valizadeh, present themselves as rigid defenders of Christian Civilisation, while others like Carl Benjamin are strident atheists. They’re a mixture, just like the rest of society is. Unless you’re going to argue that all of society is anti-religion, this point simply fails.
@EJ
Isn’t Vox Dai (Dei? I don’t feel like looking him up) a manospherian who is all for traditional gender roles, and is also a racist, religious fanatic?
@RosaDeLava:
Theodore Beale, aka Vox Day, would have been a better example. Thanks for reminding me of it.
“Thank you so much, Dar, for popping in to share your infinite, and completely non-rehashed or regurgitated, wisdom with us. We are utterly in your debt forever for bringing enlightenment to us.”
You’re most welcome.
I live to give.
RosaDeLava:
“The thing with MRAs is not that they stole any script – is that they’re wrong.”
But why are they any more wrong than you?
You bitch that staying at home and raising children is oppression. Well, they bitch that having to go to war and die was oppression.
…inherited from Bush Jr.
FTFY.
Why, it’s almost as if long-term national security issues don’t neatly wrap up in years divisible by 4. You mean foreign conflicts don’t follow a sitcom format?
I complain about that too. Endlessly, tiresomely and nauseatingly. All my non-feminist friends get angry at me for it.
So tell me: are you a pacifist? Because I am, as are a number of my favourite feminist speakers (Sarkeesian, Christina, McCreight, to name only three.) Pacifism isn’t irreconcilable with feminism. It is, however, somewhat harder to reconcile with either MRAness or traditional gender roles.
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs:
“I’m gonna give a cookie to the first troll who says ‘Both sides are bad’ without then saying or heavily implying ‘Therefore feminists are worse’ and two cookies to the first one who posts an equal anti-MRA rant on an MRA forum. Which means my cookie supply is forever safe.
*Sorry, Darsehole, you didn’t just gotcha an evil mean feminist who wants anybody to brigade or harass MRAs. Not even close. Just snarking that if you BSAB trolls truly believed that we’re the same, then you wouldn’t bug us and only us.”
When did I say they’re both the same but feminists are worse? I say you’re both bad.
I don’t know what BSAB’s is, but I’ve written the same thing to MRA”s and gotten banned.
And honestly, hwo foten to you come across someone saying “both sides are bad”? Do a search for “anti-feminist and anti-mra” and you won’t get anywhere near as many results as just anti-one side.
It seems the majority of people are taken one of those two sides only, aside from the occasional religious website.
@EJ
No problem 🙂 That’s the first person who comes to my mind when I think of MRA and religious.
I’ve never heard of Carl Benjamin. I’ve seen a lot of posts of atheist MRAs who are very vocal about it, but I’ve never heard of one who was famous enough to warrant his name being remembered.
EJ (The Other One):
“Since when have the MRAs been anti-traditional male gender roles? One of the reasons I oppose them is that, as a man, I dislike being told to conform to a very narrow definition of masculinity. By contrast, feminism tells me that I can wear pink and enjoy the company of STEM women at the same time as I watch the rugby. That’s a far better way to live.
As for being anti-religion, well some do and some don’t. Certain feminist thinkers – Greta Christina, for example – are also atheist activists; on the other hand some feminists are themselves religious, including some here. Likewise some MRAs, like Roosh Valizadeh, present themselves as rigid defenders of Christian Civilisation, while others like Carl Benjamin are strident atheists. They’re a mixture, just like the rest of society is. Unless you’re going to argue that all of society is anti-religion, this point simply fails.”
Ofcourse they are against tradirtional roles, thus their compaints about men having to go to war or not having equal access to children etc…. To them these are proof of men being second-class next to women. Paul Elam gave an interview in which he said blunty that such traditional roles should be abandoned for “egalitarianism”.
I’d say most are anti-religious, evcaue they see it as supporting “misandry”.
Roosh certainly is no defendor of Christian civilization, given that he tells his foloowers to use women for sex then leave them.
Mr Benjamin is better known as Sargon of Akkad.
“Men send other (poorer) men off to war and die.”
“Men dictate that women stay home and raise children and never achieve any human fulfillment outside those roles.”
Actually those are quite parallel, although not in the way you’re implying.
Buttercup Q. Skullpants:
“…inherited from Bush Jr.
FTFY.
Why, it’s almost as if long-term national security issues don’t neatly wrap up in years divisible by 4. You mean foreign conflicts don’t follow a sitcom format?”
Ah yes, the old “It’ll always be Bush’s fault” routine.
Promising then not closing down Gitmo…Bush’s fault.
Criminal war on Libya…Bush’s fault.
Drones against civilians…Bush’s fault.
Evil destruction of Syria…Bush’s fault.
Glad to see you Democrats elected such a strong independent guy.
Maybe we should just get rid of elections, since obviously one president’s policies remains in force for ever and ever.
EJ (The Other One):
“I complain about that too. Endlessly, tiresomely and nauseatingly. All my non-feminist friends get angry at me for it.
So tell me: are you a pacifist? Because I am, as are a number of my favourite feminist speakers (Sarkeesian, Christina, McCreight, to name only three.) Pacifism isn’t irreconcilable with feminism. It is, however, somewhat harder to reconcile with either MRAness or traditional gender roles.”
If feminists are against war, why insist on women joining the military?
And if MRA”s are so pro-war, why do they complain about being the only ones to fight?
Also, traditional roles are neither pro- nor anti-war. Many religious people are pacifists AND traditional.
Also, I would not classify Sargon of Akkad as an MRA as he stated a few times he has problems with them. He is still ant-feminist though.
@Dar:
Oh, I see. To you, MRAs and feminists are identical because we both belong in the set called “people who don’t obey priests.” You seem to define yourself outside of that set, and thus oppose us all. I’m glad we cleared that up. It must be comfortable to live in such a black and white worldview.
Tell me, which particular sect of priests do you personally take instruction from?