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a voice for men citation needed Dean Esmay evil women grandiosity gynocracy imaginary backwards land imaginary oppression mansplaining men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA oppressed men racism that's completely wrong the c-word the sound of his own voice whaaaaa?

5 Arguments Least Likely To Convince A Young Woman That A Voice for Men Isn’t a Misogynistic Hate Site

Hi, girls! Dean Esmay reaches out to the youth of America
Hey ladies! Dean Esmay reaches out to the young women of America

Not that long ago, an 18-year-old student named Carly, appalled by the rampant misogyny on display at A Voice for Men, sent a critical but thoughtful email to a number of the men associated with the site challenging them to rise above their hatred of women.

AVFM “Managing Editor” Dean Esmay decided to take her email as an opportunity to reach out to all the Carlys out there in the world in an attempt to win them over to AVFM’s peculiar brand of “human rights activism,” penning what he called an

open letter … not just to you, but to any young woman who has an open mind and is willing to be challenged on her prejudices.

Naturally, given that Men’s Rights Activists are some of the most verbose douchebags in history, it was long as hell — some 3000 words. But Esmay’s diplomatically worded attempt at outreach didn’t go quite as well as he might have hoped. Carly responded with a note saying that his open letter had merely

reinforced everything I believe. It seems we are at a stalemate, you will never agree with me, and I will never agree with you.

So where might poor Dean Esmay might have gone wrong in his attempt to win Carly’s heart and mind?

Let’s start here, with 5 Arguments Least Likely To Convince A Young Woman That A Voice for Men Isn’t a Woman-Hating Piece of Shit Hate Site, in the form of direct quotes from The Esmay himself. Since Esmay is so long-winded, I’ve highlighted some of my favorite bits in bold.

1)“[Y]ou’re 18, and so, not to put too fine a point on it, you are still a young skull full of mush.

2)[M]en have few to no voices speaking about issues that are specific to men, or defending men as a group, in this society. Until very recently in history men never have had such a voice. Because pretty much all civilizations for the last few thousand years have prioritized the needs and desires of women over those of men. For hundreds, even thousands, of years.

3)If you believe men have silenced women for thousands of years … you believe something that just not true.Furthermore, if you believe that, what you have to believe is that Asian men have been oppressing Asian women for thousands of years, black men have been oppressing black women for thousands of years, European men, Australasian men, and so on, have all been oppressing their women for thousands of years. And those weak women could do nothing about it. So what you believe here isn’t just wrong, it’s racist.

4)For most of history, being female was a privilege. It carried certain special rights that only applied to women, and special responsibilities that only applied to women, and through most of history, being male was a burden, a burden which carried certain rights that only applied to men, and those rights were there mostly so they could discharge their duties to women properly.”

5) “[Y]ou may occasionally see angry remarks or articles on this site. What I would hope you would do with that, when you do see it, is contemplate that there is a difference between righteous anger at real injustice, and what you seem to have misinterpreted as hate.

The funniest thing about Esmay’s “open letter” is that this bizarre crackpottery, easily seen through by anyone with any knowledge of history or sociology or, hell, the real world,  is his attempt to sound as reasonable as possible. He’s reined in the wild conspiratorial ranting he often indulges in when arguing with ideological foes; he’s avoided the misogynistic slurs (cunt, bitch, whore) favored by other AVFMers like Paul Elam and Diana Davison. And this is the best he can manage.

The Men’s “Human Rights” Movement isn’t ready for its close-up. And I suspect that it never will be.

EDITED TO ADD: A commenter has pointed out another quote I should have included as well. So here is BONUS EXTRA LEAST CONVINCING DEAN ESMAY ARGUMENT NUMBER SIX:

6) “The truth is, the most privileged class of people in the whole wide world are young women living in places like the US, UK, Canada, etc.–and if you want to be treated like an equal, you should not flinch or cry like a little girl if someone tells you that.

How dare you accuse us of sexism, you spoiled little girl!

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antifeminism beta males bunnies creepy dozens of upvotes empathy deficit entitled babies evil sexy ladies evil single moms excusing abuse idiocy imaginary backwards land imaginary oppression irony alert men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA one hundred upvotes only men pay taxes apparently oppressed men reddit sexual harassment

Men’s Rights Redditor: “Going to a strip club as a guy must be like going to a regular nightclub as a girl!”

Peep show
Peep show

How stupid do you have to be to actually believe the following nonsense? Not just regular stupid. Men’s Rights stupid.

Wow, just wow. This blew my mind the other day when I went to the strip club (self.MensRights)  submitted 1 day ago* by horqth  So I went in there, with no intention of buying anything, I just went in there and got something to drink and sat down by myself.  After a few minutes, strippers comes up to me and starts to be nice to me, tells me I look good, that I dress well and, they are just basically trying to charm me and they treats me as a king. (This is just to get me to spend money on them of course, but if we ignore that, these girls are basically making me feel really good about myself)  Then it hit me: going to a strip club as a guy must be like going to a regular nightclub as a girl!  Because when a girl goes to a club all the guys will come up to her and treat her nice, and try to charm her.  Told my friends about this and they said their minds were blown as well, what do you think?  Edit: spelling

Heck, this is even stupid by normal Men’s Rights standards. It made me think of this line from Ruthless People.

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a woman is always to blame antifeminism apex fallacy citation needed crackpottery entitled babies evil women evo psych fairy tales frontman fallacy grandiosity imaginary oppression men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA NAWALT oppressed white men reactionary bullshit straw feminists straw futrelle the spearhead

Happy Women-Who-Really-Run-the-Country Day

The secret cabal that rules the United States
The secret cabal that rules the United States

While the rest of America wastes its time celebrating “President’s Day,” we here at Man Boobz celebrate those who truly run this great nation of ours: Evil, selfish women.

Wait, you were thinking, I thought it was men who mostly ran the world? No. It just looks that way. Oh, sure, all the presidents have been men. The overwhelming majority of elected officials are men. The rich people who seem to have the most influence over politicians tend to be men — it’s the Koch brothers, not the Koch sisters.

But to judge who has power in this world by looking at those who have power in this world is a giant mistake, according to our eminently logical friends in the Men’s Rights movement. That’s the APEX FALLACY.

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alpha asshole cock carousel alpha males antifeminism beta males citation needed crackpottery cuckolding evil sexy ladies evil single moms evo psych fairy tales hypergamy imaginary oppression men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny only men pay taxes apparently oppressed men precious bodily fluids PUA red pill Uncategorized

Sperm Banks: Prelude to male enslavement?

Not a real sperm bank
Not a real sperm bank

So manosphere dudes have a theory of sorts about young women that they frequently boil down to the handy catchphrase “alpha fucks, beta bucks.” The idea is that women — oh, you evil women! — have an insatiable desire to mate with and capture the sperm of hot but unreliable alpha males, and an equally innate tendency to try to con some hard-working beta schlub into paying the bills, with his beta bucks, for the resulting alpha spawn.

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a new woman to hate evil fat fatties evil sexy ladies evil single moms hundreds of upvotes imaginary oppression irony alert lazy women eating bon bons mantrum men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA oppressed men reddit spermjacking

Men’s Rights Redditors confused, angered by random woman’s obvious joke about spermjacking some dude

Dorothy Parker would like to remind you that women are also capable of making jokes.
Frustrated Dorothy Parker would like to remind you that women are also capable of making jokes.

This is the final day of the Man Boobz Pledge Drive! If you haven’t already, please consider clicking the little button below and sending some bucks my way.

Thanks! (And thanks again to all who’ve already donated.) Now back to our regularly scheduled programming:

Yet more proof that Men’s Rights activists live in an imaginary misandrist dystopia of their own making: this post on Reddit, which has the Men’s Righsters there in a tizzy:

567  Heard this gem yesterday at a college. Stay safe, men! (self.MensRights)  submitted 1 day ago by LoudMatt  Thought MensRights would find this interesting.  I teach a class at a small community college and yesterday I was set up at a student activities fair. At the table next to me, one of the staff (not a student, mind you), a chubby, cute woman in her early to mid 20s was talking to two students in their late teens and said (this is verbatim, btw):  "If I don't have a baby by 28, I'm just going to go to some bar and get pregnant from some guy. It's easier and cheaper and I'll get a check too!"  A classy role model right there. Stay safe, boys.      145 comments

Yeah, fellas, assuming that this even happened, I’m pretty sure what we’re dealing with is what the rest of us human beings call a “joke.” A dumb joke, but a joke nonetheless. This young lady, I feel confident in saying, does not actually intend to spermjack some innocent lad so she can spend the next 18-plus years of her life raising a child herself while trying to squeeze child support out of someone who hates her.

But don’t tell that to the Men’s Rightsers, who assume the worst about this young woman — and then some.

springy 40 points 1 day ago (45|5)  And then when she is a month pregnant, and reality sets in, she will find some sucker that looks like he has good financial prospects, sleep with him and say "You are going to be a father - let's get married". He will do the honorable thing, and then two years later she will kick him out, and she will keep the child, his house, his car, and his savings. He lose everything, including his dignity. He will only get to keep two things: regrets, and child support bills.

Indeed, some of the regulars there are so angry about it they literally want to get the young woman fired or at the very least admonished for making such a terrible, terrible comment in front of young, impressionable students who, I guess, have never heard a joke before.

Another commenter wonders how it is possible for a chubby woman to also be cute. Because fat women are hambeasts AMIRITE FELLAS HIGH FIVE!!!1!

If you scroll down far enough in the comments you will find some Men’s Rights Redditors wondering if maybe, perhaps, possibly, the woman might be making a joke. But these aren’t the comments getting the upvotes. In the Men’s Rights subreddit, anti-woman hysteria trumps rational skepticism pretty much all day, every day.

Q: How many Men’s Rights Activists does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

A: MISANDRY! SPERMJACKING! MALE DISPOSABILITY! THAT’S NOT FUNNY!

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a voice for men a woman is always to blame antifeminism evil women FemRAs hypocrisy imaginary oppression irony alert male studies men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA oppressed men paul elam playing the victim the c-word whores

A Voice for Men calls Tory Shepherd a liar for saying it calls women “whores.” Then it calls her a “whore.”

Male Studies
Male Studies

A couple of days ago, Men’s Rights rageoholic Paul Elam angrily denounced journalist Tory Shepherd as a liar for saying that his A Voice for Men website “regularly calls women ‘bitches and whores,’ which it does not.”

Now, anyone who has actually read his website for any length of time knows this is patently false. As if to underscore just how baldly Elam was lying in his post three days ago, the site today ran a post attacking her with this headline:

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a voice for men a woman is always to blame antifeminism conspiracy theory grandiosity imaginary oppression male studies men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA oppressed men paul elam the c-word whores

Australian “Male Studies” initiative under fire because of its connections to raving misogynists; raving misogynists blame feminists

Antifeminist attorney, A Voice for Men contributor and and would-be Male Studies lecturer Roy Den Hollander bustin' a move on the Colbert Report.
Antifeminist attorney,  A Voice for Men contributor, and would-be Male Studies lecturer Roy Den Hollander bustin’ a move on the Colbert Report.

NOTE: See the end of the piece for an important clarification from the University.

So it seems the new “Male Studies” initiative at the University of South Australia is running into a few problems. Well, one big problem: members of the general public have discovered that some of the people involved with the initiative are raving misogynists, or have chosen to associate themselves with raving misogynists.

Yesterday, a story by journalist Tory Shepherd noted that two of the lecturers have written for a notoriously misogynistic website by the name of A Voice for Men. (You may have heard of it.) One of them, the crankish American attorney Roy Den Hollander, even suggested in a post on that site that men’s rights activists may have to take up arms against the evil Feminists who run the world.

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are these guys 12 years old? attention seeking evil women imaginary oppression men who should not ever be with women ever misandry misogyny MRA reddit self-congratulation shit that never happened

The Men’s Rights subreddit finds its Walter Mitty

MPW-36479

Has the Men’s Rights subreddit found its Walter Mitty? Yesterday, a fellow by the name of Mrwhibbley won himself nearly 200 upvotes from the assembled Men’s Rightsers with a tale of terrible misandry at his local Panera Bread.

I am sitting at panera bread. I got here at 6am, when no one was here. After ordering, I took the only comfy chairs next to a nice fire place and started reading. Halfway through my meal two women came up and asked me to move because they wanted to sit where I was sitting.

Ok, but before you say that this didn’t happen, consider this: Only a few minutes ago a woman demanded my seat, and when I didn’t get up to give it to her she simply sat right on top of me. And by woman I mean cat.

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advocacy of violence antifeminism are these guys 12 years old? boner rage homophobia imaginary oppression men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA reddit the c-word

Men’s Rights Redditors respond to imaginary plot to force men to pee sitting down with proposals to kill, pee on feminists

So Reddit’s Men’s Rightsers are in a tizzy over a bullshitty piece in the Daily Telegraph warning of an evil worldwide plot to force men to pee sitting down.

The evidence for the existence of such a plot is a bit on the skimpy side — the Telegraph writer leads off with a reference to a 2012  proposal from a County Council member in Sormland, Sweden that doesn’t seem to have gone anywhere legislatively but that’s been a favorite evil-feminist story on conservative websites ever since.

The very notion that some evil feminist might force them to sit while they spray has Men’s Rights Redditors in an unusually combative mood. Heck, it’s got some of the regulars thinking that it might well be time to start doing some good-old fashioned murdering. No, really.

Spacedatwork 6 points 10 hours ago (7|1)  Feminists are taking it too far now, I pee half the time with a boner and when I do pee sitting my dink dips in the water and it is nasty as fuck. This is the part where the MRA should pull off a campaign to assassinate feminist figures because talking, ranting and blogging is not enough until they take away our ability to naturally produce testosterone through medical procedures at birth.
Yep. In case you’ve been wondering, suggesting “a campaign to assassinate feminist figures” because some local council member in Sweden had a dumb idea will in fact win you upvotes on the Men’s Rights subreddit.

Strikerfm1, by contrast, seems almost moderate with his “tie feminists down and urinate on them” proposal.

strikerfm1 3 points 8 hours ago (5|2)  I so wish I could grab one of these feminists, tie her down,a pee all over her. Just to show her that I'm a fucking MAN and that I will never become the pussified, wimpy broken wrist faggot of a man they so desire. Fuck these lebsbian nazi cunts who want to destroy our manhood. Fuck them. Stand up. Be a man. Pee standing up.  Women think it's gross? it creates puddles? FUCK YOU WOMEN. I cleaned women's bathroom's for a living when I was younger, you fucking cunts leave blood on walls, shit all over walls because you won't sit on the bowl, and your pregnancy tests everywhere. Fuck you if you are gonna piss and moan about piss on the floor.
The World’s Greatest 21st Century Human Rights Movement, folks!

Thanks to the AgainstMensRights subreddit for pointing me to this horrible crap.

EDIT: The “let’s murder feminists” comment has been taken down by the subreddit mods, though the user hasn’t been banned for it; the “I want to tie a feminist down and pee on her” comment remains up, and still boasts upvotes.

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a woman is always to blame alpha asshole cock carousel alpha males antifeminism beta males boner rage creepy empathy deficit entitled babies evil sexy ladies imaginary oppression men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny narcissism not-quite-explicit threats playing the victim PUA rhymes with roosh sympathy for murderers that 80%/20% bullshit that's completely wrong victim blaming

Return of Kings blog: High school girls are responsible for school shootings because they won't have sex with nerds

A memorial for the victim of the shooting
A memorial for the victim of the shooting

Attention pretty high school girls! If a nerdy looking dude in your school shows up one day loaded with guns and Molotov cocktails and starts shooting up the place, it’s actually your fault, for not sleeping with him.

That, in any case, is the argument of a recent post on pickup guru Roosh V’s repulsive Return of Kings blog. In a post titled Why Did Karl Halverson Pierson Attack His School And Kill A Pretty Girl? guest blogger Billy Chubbs looks at a recent shooting at Arapahoe High School in Colorado, throwing out the few bits of information we do have about the shooter and making up a story of his own.