Category: hypergamy

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>Take your robo-wives — please!

>

Build your own what?

So the good fellows over on MGTOWforums.com were discussing, as they so often do, the impending arrival of the sexy robot ladies, and some of the practical problems that are holding them back (“Simply getting a robot to walk is an incredible task”), when the commenter calling himself Spidey suddenly directed his attention to me.

Well, not me personally, but all the “women (and manginas) reading this thread” and thinking less-than-charitable thoughts about the robotophile crowd. “If these guys are “perverts” and “creeps” then shouldn’t you be happy that they are releasing their urges on inanimate dolls rather then real human beings and hence not hurting anyone?” Spidey asked.

It’s a good question, and I’d like to offer my humble answer, which is: YES YES A THOUSAND TIMES YES. Please, take these robot ladies, and do whatever it is you want to do to them, and leave the real women of this world out of it.

Not that Spidey would be much interested in my answer. I doubt he would believe it, as he has clearly convinced himself that the women of the world (and, by extension, the manginas) are pissed at this high-tech challenge to their pussy monopoly.  Speaking directly to the ladies, Spidey continued:

It’s because you KNOW that a sex doll can easily compete with you, because these dolls will always get better, they will always come out with newer, better looking sex dolls while you will always grow uglier, fatter and older. These dolls take away the only thing you can provide a man and the one thing you will use to control and manipulate him – sex. Now you can no longer with hold sex when you are wrong in an arguement just to get your way plus these sex dolls are STD free, unlike your used up vagina. Also I am pretty sure you realise that the men who buy these very expensive sex dolls must obviously have money, it must infuriate you that all that money is going towards an inanimate object that is better then you

Honestly, I think that most women will be rather relieved that guys who complain about “used up vaginas” will be voluntarily puling themselves out of the dating scene. But, never mind, because Spidey’s imaginary conversation with the ladies isn’t over yet.

Now I am also sure most women will say “but these things are fake and they will never provide ‘real love and companionship'”. Well guess what? men don’t want your love or companionship because your love is more fake then that provided by a virtual girl and your companionship is just as hollow. Is it “real love” when a woman f***s another man behind her husbands back, not because he has done anything wrong, only because she was bored or confused? how about when a woman f***s another man and pretends that the baby belongs to her hu

Let’s just skip past the rest of that paragraph; life is short, and it was just more of the same. Let’s try his next one:

As for companionship, men don’t want a creature that enjoys watching them suffer. We don’t want companoinship from a creature that demands everything from us but appreciates nothing. We don’t want to come home to a creature that yells at us for not earning enough money or working hard enough and if we do earn enough money we get yelled at for working too mu

Yeah, same deal. Let’s just move directly to his grand conclusion:

Yes ladies we would take a fake body and a fake personality over your aging body and narcissistic personality any day.

Trust me, Spidey, your personality isn’t going to win any awards any time soon either.

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*Yes, that was a Bioshock reference.

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>Days of Whine and Roses

>

The face (and torso) of evil.

Certain kinds of stories are like catnip to the Men Going Their Own Way crowd: Stories about rich airheaded women. Stories about golddiggers and giant divorce settlements. Stories about idiotic or incompetent women. So it’s no surprise that the tale of Patricia Kluge and her not-so-successful foray into the world of winemaking has sent the fellows on MGTOWforums.com into full-on misogyny mode.

Kluge, you see, is the former wife of a media mogul, and her divorce settlement in 1990 netted her hefty alimony payments, which are variously claimed to have been either $1.6 million a week, or “less than $1 million a year.”  The article linked to by the MGTOWers says she was rumored to have collected a settlement of a cool billion bucks and that the reported $1.6 million a week was just the interest on this vast sum. Who knows? It was a shitload of money. Plus a giant fucking mansion. Whatever the amount, Kluge has apparently blown through it all, spending huge amounts on ostentatious luxury crap and burning through tens of millions on her less-than-successful winery. Last month the bank repossessed her mansion.

So: this terrible woman was also a terrible businesswoman. Well, yeah. But to the fellows at MGTOWforums.com, her singular tale is a sign that women in general shouldn’t be trusted with money — or with anything else, for that matter. Chainlightning started off what turned into a veritable misogyny cascade by announcing:

Women should never have access to money. Look at what happened to the US since the 1960s.

Systems1082 saw Chainlightning’s “women shouldn’t have money” and raised him with “women shouldn’t have the right to vote.”

It actually goes back to 1920 when women were given the right to vote. They have learned they can vote themselves other people’s money.

Stonelifter took it even further, suggesting that some women don’t ever deserve the right to live:

i don’t understand why men don’t engage in more murder for hire

He followed this innocent little query up with a reference to the evil feminist Karl Marx and his followers at “some college in Berlin.”

it goes back to about 1870 so so when marx decided tearing down Western civilization was best achieved on many small fronts and women would be one of them. Cultural marxism was tied up into one neat package in some college in Berlin during the 1920’s but the idea to have women voting to fuck everything up came to marx at the tail end of his life

XTC pretty much trumped everyone by taking it back to the source: that bitch Eve.

It goes back to the garden of Eden when Eve screwed us all over.

So there you have it. Eve ate an apple, Patricia Kluge blew through money she didn’t really deserve to have. Therefore, women are evil.

Um, have you MGTOWers ever heard of Nicolas Cage?

(Note: Before you tell me that Nic Cage earned his money fair and square, I ask that you sit down and watch The Wicker Man, Ghost Rider, National Treasure, National Treasure: Book of Secrets, Face/Off, and Con Air. Then get back to me. I will allow that he did a pretty good job in Kick-Ass.)

(Note 2: By “some college in Berlin in the 1920s,” Stonelifter was of course referring to an assortment of Marxist theorists associated with a research institute that started in Frankfurt, not Berlin, in the 1920s, but which achieved its greatest influence after it moved to New York in the 1930s because of, you know, Hitler.)

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*Yes, that was a Bioshock reference.

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>Saturday links: Not-so-nice Nice Guys and not-so-hypergamous women

>

Links

A couple of interesting posts on topics near and dear to readers here:

Amanda Marcotte takes on “Nice Guys,” and the oft-repeated notion that women seek out abusers and assholes to date:

My counter-theory is that Nice Guys® group together traits like confidence with aggression, so they can convince themselves that confident men are always assholes, and thus that they’re being unfairly deprived of pussy by women who are sick fucks that enjoy being abused.  Are some confident men abusive assholes?  Absolutely; look at Charlie Sheen.  But are all confident men?  … [W]hat I can say is I’ve known many men who are great husbands/boyfriends and are also confident … Some shy men are also very nice people, just shy.  But many shy men are inconsiderate fuckwits or even wife-beaters.  I just don’t think there’s a strong correlation between “alpha”-ness and basic human decency. 

And a couple of posts on some new research on gender and casual sex that challenges a lot of manosphere myths about women and hypergamy, suggesting that: 1) women, in general, are as interested in casual sex as men, so long as they feel they will be safe and 2) women, in general, aren’t so addled by their alleged hypergamous proclivities that they actually find Donald Trump to be attractive.  In fact, the study suggests, women considering casual sex are driven by a desire for, er, hot sex with a dude who won’t kill them and who they think will be good in bed, not by a desire to get their claws into some random rich dude. Or, as the paper itself puts it:

Sexual strategies theory clearly predicts that higher status proposers should be accepted by women more readily than low-status proposers. The fact that status did not predict women’s acceptance of casual sex offers is therefore a problem for SST. Neither status, nor tendency for gift giving, nor perceived faithfulness of the proposer (nor, more precisely, the interaction of any of these variables with gender) predicted whether a participant would agree to the sexual offer, contradicting SST.

Here’s a brief summary of the research. And here’s a more detailed (if a bit convoluted) discussion from Thomas on Yes Means Yes, from which I got the above quote.

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*Yes, that was a Bioshock reference.

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>Tall, dark and hansom

>

Future evil feminist, developing her evil mind.

Say what you will about those Men Going Their Own Way, but they have proven themselves again and again to be experts on the enigma that is woman. Over on MGTOWforums.com, the commenter calling himself AC101202 may not be able to spell the word “handsome” or use the correct form of “it’s,” but he knows what women want and why they do what they do. What do they want, what do they really really want? Dudes to boss them around and maybe even oppress them a bit. Because oppression = love. 

Women love being controlled and oppressed. Like children, they are the happiest when they know their boundaries. … Women are overgrown children, hence why they relate to children so well. Like children they need (and occasionally admit that they like) men who (fairly and non-violently) tell them what their place is and keeps them there, and in the process show that they are protecting them and value them.

Alas, not all women are able to find themselves oppressive bossy dudes of their own. These unfortunate lasses all too often become feminists. And instead of learning beauty secrets from their happily oppressed sisters, or from any of the many fine periodicals devoted to the subject, some of these ladies start trying to — get this — improve their lady brains. And that’s where all the trouble begins.

Because feminists are mostly physically ugly they cannot attract strong well-off hansom men with their shit together. Because they are usually ugly they compensate for their physical short-comings by working and developing an intellect, and because they are jealous of other better looking females, they seek to restrict their actions by passing anti-prostitution laws, laws that restrict free-speech to keep women from selling the image of their bodies etc… You will rarely ever see an attractive women protesting against cheer-leading, or outside a Hooters. That’s because they, unlike the fat pudgy feminists, can profit from selling their image.

AC101202 doesn’t spell out all the implications of these developments for nice, thoughtful guys like himself, but I will.  You see, since women only have sex with alpha male thugboys — those non-thugboys who claim to sleep with women are obviously all lying — nice guys are also forced to develop their minds (though not, evidently, forced to learn how to spell). This doesn’t do them much good, though, given that the ugly smart girls out there that might have otherwise been captivated by their giant brains have all been infected with feminism, and have managed to convince themselves that they don’t actually want dudes bossing them around. (Though they do, they really really do.) What can a poor boy do — except to declare he’s had enough of women, and then prove how little he needs or cares about these foul harridans by spending every waking moment complaining about them online.

Poor AC101202 ends his comment with a lament:

To be fair I would be lying if I didn’t admit to being jealous of the alpha male bad boys who attract women easily. I wish I had their look and natural charisma. I’m also pretty sure the reason most smart people tend to be physically weak, especially in youth is because genetically they are programmed to compensate for their physical short-comings. However, I would never lobby to pass legislation to restrict people’s sexual behavior. I’m quite happy watching this society collapse under the weight of it’s own human stupidity.

Continue Going Your Own Way, young man. It is the only solution.

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*Yes, that was a Bioshock reference.

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>The Cupcake Files, Part Two: NiceGuys Edition

>

Grr! Argh!

As I pointed out in The Cupcake Files: Part One, the Men Going Their Own Way movement has taken the deliciously innocent word “cupcake” and turned it into a synonym for evil-she-bitch-from-hell.

Today we continue our  look at the characteristics of a truly modern cupcake — relying, this time, on the words of the good fellows at NiceGuy’s MGTOW forum. (I’m too lazy to provide links for every example; they all can be found by searching for the word “cupcake” on NiceGuy.)


Cupcake: A fan of cocaine. And abusive criminals.

What attracts the hottest females today? Simple. He has to physically and emotionally abuse her, have a police record and a cocaine habit (and must share the coke with cupcake) then he fucks her up and down the stairs, gets her pregnant, then leaves her forever off to the next hairy hole.

Cupcake: Less interesting than your dude friends, except you can fuck her.

[T]ake away hormones and what’s left?? You’re going to hang around cupcake for: her intriguing political views?, her love of sports, cars and motorcycles?, her culinary skills and the fact that she’s a selfless friend? Point is most women these days have NOTHING to offer a man & reply solely on exploiting men.

Cupcake: The cause of global warming.

Global warming is caused by women, why do you think rich men tear down the planet to make so much money, because some gold digging cunt has to have $20K in cloths a week, 3 SUV’s a year, 8 million shoes, etc, etc

Women constantly brag that they control the world, well why are we blaming the guy destroying the forest to supply cupcake with bubble bath oil. That’s like blaming the slave picking cotton.

Cupcake: Controller of the Nookie Faucet. Not obligated to stick around if she doesn’t want to.

You can have all the discussions you want, but Cupcake has the unalienable right to Change Her Mind, at any time, for any reason or none.

Social convention, the divorce courts, a tradition of chivalry, and Cupcake‘s control of the nookie faucet all conspire such that if you don’t meet her demands, as they change and evolve, you’re fucking toast, Jack.

Stay tuned for The Cupcake Files: Part Three.

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>Now I ain’t sayin’ she’s a gold digger

>

Manosphere men often complain about evil women attempting to drain them of their money. To which there really is a very simple solution: If you don’t want a girlfriend or wife who expects you to support her, don’t seek out women who expect you to support them.

This seems like a  fairly common-sense strategy, and one that would simple enough for even the dullest of man boobz to remember. But apparently it has proved a little hard to put into practice.

For evidence of this, let’s return to our good friend Nightstorm — you know, the mousetrap-vagina, leech-women in the food court of doom guy on NiceGuy’s MGTOW forum. He’s back with another posting called “The List,“which is a list — naturally — of

the soul draining demands a woman puts on a man once their together. He MUST do these things to “make the relationship work”

The list is long, loopy, whiny, and filled with ridiculous things that MGTOWs and many MRAs tend to imagine that all women demand of all men (“Open all doors before and after for her”), but which have not actually been a part of any relationship I’ve ever been in. Aside from some complaints that are ridiculously petty (“Go to borning [sic] family out-goings”) and some that are weird paranoid fantasies (“You get your penis size and bed performance revealed to the sisterhood. Oh yes, their not laughing with you!”),  the complaints come back, again and again, to money:

Pay for dinner …
Buying her yet another useless item she doesn’t need, like shoes or a brand new car ….
You get to pay for the privledge of being with this woman. …
You get to work while she lays around the house doing nothing. …
She can have the government garnish your wages to pay her just for being the female spouse. …  You get to feel like the worthless scum you are and pay her for telling you that you are.


I’m not even sure what the fuck he’s even talking about with half of this shit.

But, again, there really is a simple solution to all these money issues. I’ll say it again, in bold  this time: If you don’t want a girlfriend or wife who expects you to support her, don’t seek out women who expect you to support them.

This, evidently, is where Nightstorm’s grand strategy has gone a bit awry.

For, as I discovered from another posting of his from a few days back, it turns out that Nightstorm’s plan to totally avoid evil leech-like women apparently entails spending many hours flirting with women online. Indeed, he included a long transcript of an online chat he’d recently had with an (alleged) 18-year-old (alleged)  girl who’d evidently decided after a couple of online chats that she wanted to be his girlfriend, despite the fact that the two of them have never actually met and in fact live in different states. (Hey, women can be idiots too.)

Nightstorm (posting as “shawnz”) decided they needed to set down the terms of their relationship, and began by asking her what she thought she brought to the relationship. She jokingly suggested: herself, her “sexy hair,” and her vagina.

[20:54] shawnz: if you become my GF..
[20:54] shawnz: I will get you, your sexy hair, and your vagina
[20:55] shawnz: and what do you expect out of me …
[20:55] [name redacted]: ur penis ur cuddles and ur texting/calling/being on cam and coming to visit!
[20:55] shawnz: ok, anything else
[20:56] [name redacted]: nope

That seems pretty straightforward. No mention of “family out-goings” or even paying for dinner.

Nightstorm then set out his terms for the relationship:

[20:58] shawnz: First, I want a girl who cooks and cleans the house, I want someone who doesn’t nag, cripe
[20:58] shawnz: bitch, or complain, someone who cuddles and anytime I want sex
[20:58] shawnz: someone who has ambition
[20:58] [name redacted]: demanding arent we lol
[20:58] shawnz: and someone who wants more than just love in the relationship, after all its hard work

Demanding, to be sure, lol, but he offers some things in return:

[20:59] shawnz: and what I offer is romance, a good paying salary for provision, and intimacy
[20:59] shawnz: I also offer you good self-esteem and reliability and faithfulness

Let’s pause for a moment to consider that bit in the middle after “romance”: “a good paying salary for provision.”

The two haven’t even met, and he’s already offering to support her financially.

It appears Nightstorm not only has not only bungled the whole “don’t pursue women who expect you to support them” strategy I have outlined above. He’s actually OFFERING TO SUPPORT A WOMAN WHO DOESN’T ACTUALLY EXPECT HIM TO SUPPORT HER.

It seems to me that if you want a woman who is financially dependent on you — you provide the money, she provides “anytime [you] want sex” — you pretty much forfeit your right to complain about her being financially dependent on you.

Fortunately for Nightstorm, [name redacted], and the rest of us on this planet, he decided that [name redacted] wasn’t serious enough to be his girlfriend. So, crisis averted. For now.

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>Pay no attention to the man behind the turntables

>

He’s up to his neck in pussy, no doubt.

So the fellows over on NiceGuy’s MGTOW forum are discussing why women seem to like DJs — sorry, “why a womyn so crazy about DJs?” Because that’s what Men Going Their Own Way like to do: spend all their time speculating about the details of the dating lives of the women that they totally don’t want to have anything to do with.

I can’t answer for the, er, womyn, but last year I had a date with a woman who did a bit of DJing, and considering that I’m sort of a music obsessive her DJing seemed maybe just a tiny bit, you know, cool?

But  apparently for the womyn it’s all about status. Also, women are apparently extremely stupid. According to the going-his-own-way-dude Iron John:

Womyn are focused always on two things 1) The immediate situation, as they lack foresight and hindsight, 2) Immediate foodchain. So when they find themselves in a night club they are looking for immediate indications of status. What do they see? A single individual who gets to control the music, lights, etc. They don’t see the artists that created this stuff ahead of time, the business men who owns the establishment, or the bankers who collect the profits. The see just one man who appears to be running everything. They can’t see anything else so to them it does not exist. Since that one man is in control of their immediate environment he MUST be the, “alpha male”. And we all know what girls think of him.

Yeah, that must be it. That’s why, whenever they get on a bus, women immediately start throwing themselves at the bus driver. He’s driving the thing! Obvious Alpha!  Or why when they go to a convenience store, they throw themselves at the clerk. He controls access to the shriveled hot dogs and lottery tickets! Obvious Alpha! Or why, whenever they get into elevators, they throw themselves at the elevator buttons. They control where the elevator goes! Obvious Alpha.

I just wish I understood women as well as these guys.

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>All out of context

>As the herpes and hypergamy discussion (which also erupted here) reminded (almost) everyone, statistics can be wildly misleading unless you know at least a little bit about the context. I got another reminder of that recently while poking around on a site called NationMaster, a site that aggregates stats about the world found in the (very useful) CIA Factbook and other sources and makes them a little more user-friendly.

Which isn’t always a good thing. As we learn from this contextless factoid I  found festooned at the top of one page:

Yeah. I think if you really do like kids, you might want to think a little about why half the population in Uganda is under 15 before planning your move there.

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>Feminist cat ponders how idiotic the herpes and hypergamy discussion has gotten

>

(Note: In cats, tail-lashing is not a good sign.)
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>On Herpes and Hypergamy

>

Peggy Olson has no time for pseudoscientific PUA crap.

Note: As regular Man Boobz comment readers will notice, this post is an expanded version of some comments I made here and here.

An extraordinary number of men in the “manosphere” — whether they’re wannabe Pick-up artists or woman-avoiding Men Going Their Own Way — have a very strange notion of what goes on (and what doesn’t go on) behind the closed doors of America’s bedrooms. (And sometimes in the bathrooms of dive bars.) They envision a world in which a small number of men are having all the sex they want, with any women they want, while the rest of the men out there — at least the straight ones —  are condemned to lives of celibacy or near-celibacy.

So who gets blamed for this (imagined) state of affairs? Women. And something called “hypergamy.”

The term refers to the practice of “marrying up”in social class. But the dudes of the manosphere aren’t merely content to accuse women of being mere gold-diggers. They’ve combined the notion of hypergamy with some ill-digested evolutionary psych speculations and convinced themselves that women are in fact a giant gang of nymphomaniacal sexual status seekers, compelled by their very genes to throw themselves at the males on top of the sexual heap — variously described as alphas, jocks, bad boys, and thugs.

And, since men are similarly programmed to spread their seed far and wide — by which I mean fuck anything that moves — these women are getting all the attention from the alphas that their hearts and loins desire, while themselves making beta guys beg for scraps, or, more often, rejecting them outright. Or so goes the theory.

Naturally, those manosphere men who find themselves sitting on the sidelines of this  (imagined) orgy tend to build up a great deal of bitterness about this (imagined) state of affairs.

This little mythical tale of alpha males and the hypergamic nymphomaniacs who love them (long time) is repeated again and again on the blogs and message boards of the manosphere. But is there any real convincing evidence for any of this? I haven’t seen any yet.

But in a post earlier this year one of the more influential bloggers in the manosphere, a pick-up guru of sorts who calls himself Roissy, claimed he had found something like the smoking gun of hypergamy:

Twice as many women as men have genital herpes. This could only happen if a smaller group of infected men is giving the gift of their infectious love to a larger group of women. Looks like female hypergamy is conclusively proved.

As evidence for this claim, Roissy pointed to a survey by the Centers for Disease Control which found that some “21 percent of women were infected with genital herpes, compared to only 11.5 percent of men.” (That link takes you to the Reuters article Roissy cited in his blog post; the CDC’s press release on the survey can be found here.)

Case closed? Not exactly. Had Roissy actually bothered to read all of the news story he cited, or the CDC press release, or done even a minute or two of Googling,  he would have seen the real explanation for the disparity: because of biological differences between men and women — you know, the whole penis vs vagina thing — it’s simply much easier for women to be infected with herpes. As one online FAQ notes (and I’ve put the key parts in bold):

Women are approximately 4 times more likely to acquire a herpes simplex type 2 infection than men. Susceptible women have a higher likelihood of contracting genital herpes from an infected man than a susceptible man becoming infected by a woman. In other words, if a non-infected man and woman each have intercourse with an infected partner, the woman is more likely than the man to contract a herpes simplex virus infection. …

Women may be more susceptible to genital herpes infections because:

* The genital area has a greater surface area of cells moist with body fluids (mucosal cells) than men.
*Hormone changes during a woman’s menstrual cycle may affect the immune system, making it easier for the herpes simplex virus to cause an infection.

You’d think a sex guru would know enough about herpes to know this, wouldn’t you?