Jake Davison, who shot five people dead in a Thursday night shotgun spree before turning the gun on himself, didn’t leave behind a manifesto.
The 22-year-old Plymouth (UK) virgin was more of a YouTube guy, posting assorted rants on the site bemoaning his life and offering his opinions on women (cruel and picky but not, he thought, very smart) and his future prospects (not good, he was sure; he felt old and ugly and washed up at the ripe old age of 22).
He scattered his opinions across Facebook and Reddit as well, launching into tirades against his mother, whom he called “vile” and “abusive.” (All of these accounts have been shut down as of this writing, but you can find traces of what he said in the press coverage of his murder spree; meanwhile some of his videos have been saved and reposted on the Incels.is forum.)
His mother was the first person he shot in his murder spree; in the end he killed two women, two men and, most horrifically, one three-year-old girl.
Most of Davison’s rants — whether about women or his own seemingly worsening life — could almost have been pasted word for word from incel discussion forums. He may have been fervent in his beliefs, but he wasn’t original.
He lamented that he had missed the joys of teenage romance, something that he would never be able to recapture.
“Let’s say I get with a woman my age,” he declared.
She’s had a million relationships. Likely been destroyed and broken and torn apart by a fucking Chad. She’s probably completely incapable of loving anyone like she did when she was 16, 17, 15, when she first got with that fucking Chad.
This weird glorification of teenage love (and teenage girls) is common among incels. (I’ve written about this in a number of posts, and will elaborate on Davison’s obsession in a future post.) It’s not clear how Davison was able to reconcile his fantasies of underage sex with his Qanon-style belief that the government is full of Satan-worshipping pedophiles who need to be put down. Davison was not only an incel but was also something of a Trump-worshipper and gun fanatic who dreamed of moving to the US some day, so it’s not all the shocking to see QAnon-ish conspiracy theories mixed up in his brain with thoughts of Chad and Stacey.
But if we set aside his Trumpian enthusiasm — fairly atypical for incels who are generally not very political –most of what he set forth in his posts and videos was standard issue incel. The biggest difference I can see between Davison and your typical incel is that he actually carried out his fantasy of a Elliot Rodger style “day of retribution.”
Despite his weight worries (he was a bit plump) and his belief that he was ugly and getting uglier, Davison was a fairly typical-looking young man, a sort of Seth Rogan-esque stoner dude who might have had a chance with women had he only trimmed his beard a little more often. It would have helped a lot more if he hadn’t been quite so angry and misogynistic and self-loathing; like most incels, Davison blamed his looks for his lack of success with women, though the real problem was all the poisonous bullshit stuffed in his head.
The most energetic coverage of the shooting spree comes in the British tabloids — among them The Sun, which described incels as “a sinister death cult of miserable, sex-starved loners linked to a string of terror-style attacks.”
A little over-the-top, but … true.
Davison is picking up fans on Incels.is, with some comparing him positively with Elliot Rodger, the original mass-killing Incel “saint.”
“What a hero,” wrote MisterMeme. “I hope he is in heaven rn.”
“We were past overdue for a new ER, [Elliot Rodger]” added Metabuxx.
“Yes I can say it this time,” Lookscel cried out.
ONE OF US! ONE OF US!
A new ER
“It was a long drought but finally it’s ER season again,” added CrackingYs happily.
Over on The Black Pill Club, another incel hangout, one especially edgy commenter wrote that he had “read that a 5 year old whore is among the dead which is very pleasing to hear.” (Actually, she was three years old, which is even worse.)
That’s about all I can take on this right now. I will be back, probably tomorrow, with more thoughts on incel obsessions with “teenage love.”
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@AnhedoniAmelia
Then you also agree with Ohlman. You didn’t say so though and said Ohlman had issue with your points. That seems a little inconsistent to me.
“We have always been at war with Oceania”.
Stop jerking off with a thesaurus.
There is no mystery. Men have become used to women’s submission, and for that to be enforced with extreme violence. This is the first generation of Western men in several hundred years who have had to be likable in order to sleep with other people. For the past few hundred years, women have been forced to get a man or quite literally die and this is the message men have been sold: “Women need men, you don’t need to be likable or decent or anything at all really, you’ll just be awarded a hot woman you can fuck”.
The status quo has shifted. And this group of the current crop of men would really rather do anything else than accept the basic, fundamental fact that we are people with our own wants & desires who deserve to be in relationships that are happy and fulfilling to us. It is a choice they are making, and choosing to lie to themselves about their culpability by passing it off on to us.
In much the same way as you deny their culpability by ranting incoherently about how “Incels are all victims of child abuse”. There’s no evidence of that, it’s less probable than the explanation I have posited, and the function of bringing it up at all since there’s no evidence of it is to shift blame off of the murderer.
As I said, I fucking see you.
This. This.
Damn right!
@AnhedoniAmelia
What do you think about men who believe that they’re nice to women but still get rejected because of their looks?
(I bet I can fucking guess….but go ahead)
@GSS Ex-noob
There’s never been any other kind.
This “cold withholding mothers causes incel violence” thing reminds me of the now discredited theory that autism is caused by cold withholding mothers. That and the old presumption that women are always responsible for men’s behavior even though we’re the weaker, more emotional sex.
Wait what? When did the MRAs seem innocuous? Was it when they put out a film banned in Australia for being “misogynistic propaganda”? Was it when they kept insisting that women need to “give up their privilege” so and “take care of their obligations to men” so that they won’t be “opportunistic parasites in the lives of men”?
I can keep going forever with these quotes from actual MRAs, but the point is made I reckon. Please, when were MRAs innocuous?
@ AnhedoniAmelia
Ok. I get some of what you are saying. I don’t identify as an incel, but I imagine quite a few would try to convert me to their ranks if they were familiar with my life story. And yes, I do blame a lot on my parents. (As an aside, I’d actually say that blaming has been somewhat… freeing, to realize that it isn’t all MY fault for being a failure in life. Long over due that I stand up for myself, whether they like it or not.)
That said, as you point out, that is simply your, or in this case, my particular experience. To make a blanket claim that it’s all or at least mostly the parents fault seems a bit much. There are a hell of a lot of data points, everything from interactions in school, the way society is structured, to the popular websites frequented by basically every incel terrorist prior to actually doing anything, etc, etc.
Some other talking points:
“As for those who mis-direct their violence and aggression against women”
Ummmm… “mis-direct”? Where should violence and aggression on the scale of shotgun-to-the-face be directed?
“People who are designated unattractive and undesireable”
This is a common talking point for incels. And yet, 9 times out of 10, pictures of said incels are invariably average looking, very rarely Phantom of the Opera types. Who exactly does this designating in such cases? It is the incels who do. They disregard any attempts by others to say otherwise because they are usually unable to see why anyone could possibly see them in any sort of positive light.
Depression is a bitch. I usually say something about how the average incel is better looking than me, though the truth is probably I am about average as well, so I get the feeling of being unattractive. I know it because I live it.
This, as well as mention of “Our” looks and stating there is no help or any way to fix the problem of the child abuse, damage done… well no offense, but it seems to be saying a lot about where your head is at right now.
@ epitome
Hey, I realize this might be a personal question and all, but I’m somewhat curious as to the hows and whys to you getting your first kiss at 31. I mean, was that something you were fine with? (In case it isn’t obvious, I am in a similar boat and have never been fine with it my entire life, so just looking for a different perspective.)
@AnhedoniAmelia
You wrote at least two things that, if true, undermine your assertion said murderers always had the free will to step away from their toxic ideology. First, you said incels, the group these murderers come from,
That’s a pretty definite statement these people’s path is set, and they can’t exactly just step away from it whenever they want.
Second, you wrote those who choose incel culture “tend to find themselves backed into a corner from which change is impossible.” I don’t really think I need to explain this one, but asserting change is impossible for someone conflicts with the idea they are at liberty to choose a different path.
Making statements undermining the idea these killers were free to take a different path absolves them of some of their responsibility, and can most definitely come across as condoning their actions. It certainly came across that way to me. I acknowledge that may not have been your intent.
However, *at the very least*, you wrote things that made the murderer described in the article seem less responsible for his actions.
How can anyone focus on just stoking their own resentment and hate in a world with wonders like this in it?
@ AnhedoniAmelia
[Content Note: Rape, child abuse]
So, I was (first) raped when I was three. A toddler It’s literally one of my earliest memories, and unfortunately it’s a pretty foundational one. A non-family-member was responsible, but he told me my parents told him to do it and that, if I complained or told anyone, then he’d do it again. I believed him because, while my parents never sexually assaulted me, they hit me and screamed at me and threatened me and locked me up in the dark whenever the mood struck them. What my rapist said didn’t stretch my imagination.
Like I said, both of my parents were physically and psychologically abusive. It was a team effort, and it’s hard to say who was the worse between the two of them. Dad was much more likely to physically hurt me, but mom was a master of gaslighting and verbal cruelty. I still remember the day that, after dad got done laying into me for the sin moving too slowly, she came into my room and sat down on the edge of my bed. I was curled up on the floor behind it, crying in pain. She said to me: “You know how you said you thought we love the dog more than you? It’s true. At least the dog obeys.”
That’s not true, by the way. The dog was shit at obedience. I was required to “play” with the dog, which consisted of it mauling me while mom screamed at me to stop letting the dog maul me. The dog was bigger than me and, as I said, shit at obedience. The word “no” meant nothing coming from me.
I’m an ugly fucker, too. I’ve got a head like a melon, a nose like a squash, and hair like corn silk after the bloody squirrels have been at the ears. Which they have, the filthy fucking rodents. I had plans for that corn, you overgrown, fluffy-tailed rats!
But, guess what? I don’t blame women for any of that, because that would be asinine. “Women” are not a monolith, and they certainly aren’t responsible for my childhood or my appearance. There’s nothing magically different about women that makes it any more different to be friends with them than with other genders, and my friends have been relatively evenly split between women and men. My great secret in this is that I behave towards women the same as I do towards men.
Too, while I’ve had relatively little dating experience, I have dated at least a couple of women who I consider <em>very</em> attractive. Whether they are/were by society’s standards is irrelevant.
It’s true that I have, in my mid-thirties, not had sex, but that’s not because I’m ugly. I’ve actually had numerous opportunities, but I have issues around trust. I require explicit, clear, and (to hear at least one of my former partners tell it) exasperating consent for every act, and I never, ever take the initiative.
On the other hand, I had my first kiss when I was 6, and I got engaged at 18.
My productivity or lack thereof has fuck-all to do with my appearance. I operate on the principle that it’s rude to at other people, and I expect the same courtesy to be extended to me. If people don’t like the way I look, they’re welcome to put a burlap sack over their heads.
My looks have nothing to do with my abilities as a human being. I may be ugly, but I am neither modest nor humble. I always strive to be friendly, polite, cooperative, and helpful, but I’m nobody’s inferior. Anyone who treats me as one is apt to find out the <em>other</em> reason I wear steel-toed work boots everywhere.
Being abused didn’t turn me into a misogynist, nor did it make it more likely that I’d become one. Being ugly doesn’t make me a pariah, or prevent me from living my life.
Having said all that, I freely admit that I’m kind of a monster, but that’s not because I was abused or because I’m ugly, and it really isn’t germane to the topic of this post.
Your “theory” is bad and offensive.
@Prophet : what get me with that definitive judgement of “no help can change them now” is that implicitely it mean no redemption is possible for them. The logical consequence in term of justice are too grim for me, and the concept that some people are irredemable is one of the cornerstone of the far right for a reason.
—
Apart for that, I reiterate my judgement that this is a long winded troll who lack writing skill. One of the verious obvious reason to say so is that his wall of text contain exactly 0 (zero) proof of any of his assertions, even when a lot of them are very visibly wrong. (stuff like “lack of good looks preclude genuine social and professional advancement” is so utterly and desesperatly wrong that it make me question if that guy ever have gone in any workplace)
In fact, in a way, it’s probably better if it’s a troll, because the alternative of him truly believing that is much sadder.
@ AnhedoniAmelia
Humans like absolutes. It’s horribly easy to think that “anyone who doesn’t have my problems has no problems at all.” It’s also horribly easy to think, “I overcame my problems, so everybody else should be able to.” Nobody gets out of childhood completely unscathed, although the amount of damage varies wildly. Sadly, in the end, you have to do the best you can with the cards you’ve got. That can include asking for help, and usually should, but trying to decide your exact niche in the parade of misery is unhelpful. Dangerously seductive, but unhelpful.
@Vucodlak
I’m so sorry you went through all that.
@surplus
Thanks for the volcano footage. I’m at an age where I don’t always enjoy new technology (“Oh crap, you want me to learn this too?”) but I do love drone footage and that’s wonderful.
@weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee:
And if they’re too attentive to their kids (the male ones anyway) that makes them gay. Or at least too effeminate, cowardly, whiny, soft, etc. to be a functional adult in society. Like, can’t make a decision without Mommy and Daddy telling him what to do level of competence.
In other words, ye olde ‘basic can’t win’ scenario.
@Vucodlak:
That’s not true, by the way. The dog was shit at obedience. I was required to “play” with the dog, which consisted of it mauling me while mom screamed at me to stop letting the dog maul me. The dog was bigger than me and, as I said, shit at obedience. The word “no” meant nothing coming from me.
Dogs are marvelously intuitive creatures (as social animals, and because humans have spent millennia making them that way), and I suspect that the dog was rigorously obeying the implicit rule of the household: everybody pick on Vucodlak! (So it made self-evident sense for you to classify your rapist under that umbrella of Unified Adult Conspiracy.)
@AnhedoniAmelia:
As a person who was abused as a kid by my family, and also experienced plenty of bullying in school because of my disabilities, I really resent the idea of giving incels this excuse. There are plenty of people on this very forum that were abused and don’t do things like this.
Also, all this ignores that people who aren’t conventionally are frequently partnered. Sure, I suppose the hotter you are, the easier it is to find dates, but the incel/incel apologist assertion that some people are doomed to being alone because they aren’t beautiful is just not based in reality at all. You’re right that incels aren’t necessarily “ugly” but even if they all were, it wouldn’t mean they’re doomed to inceldom.
Incel apologia also tends to ignore the fact that incels don’t just want a girlfriend. They want a very conventionally attractive young virgin. “Roasties” aren’t good enough for them.
Why it’s almost like incels are a picture of aggrieved entitlement who are enraged that women have their own wants and needs and the freedom make choices about their own lives!
As someone who’s struggled with body image issues my whole life, it really irritates me when people act like feeling ugly and unwanted inevitably leads to violence. It’s just not true.
But conventionally attractive people have trouble finding partners too. I’m considered very conventionally attractive, straight blonde hair, blue eyes, petite and work out and dance ballet. I had lots of trouble finding partners, not because guys didn’t hit on me but because the almost all the ones who did were all gross, creepy and unattractive it wasn’t like it was some fucking advantage it was a threat of harassment all the time. And even since being in my present situation where I’m in near total control living as a sponsored artist, and creeps are no longer a problem just because a guy that I find acceptable also is attracted to me that doesn’t mean he’s going to be one of the rare ones who is ok with the kind of sexual relationship that I want, which isn’t “dating”. Being “hot” doesn’t help me in dating because the sexual relationships I want aren’t conventional dating relationships. Being conventionally attractive for a woman is no guarantee of sexual satisfaction in a patriarchal society at all.
@.45 – No problem with personal questions! If I don’t want to answer I’ll say so.
The way I read this, you’re asking about my experience not having a (romantic) kiss when I was younger and if I minded. The answer is somewhat, but I didn’t think about it all the time. Sometimes I was amused at being a “bisexual virgin” in contrast to the stereotype that bi women are super sex-crazed. But when I had a crush on someone and they didn’t like me back, I was quite, well, crushed. To the point of crying, a lot of times!
The main thing I wanted/want to do with my life was write stories and novels, so when I turned 30, I was more disappointed that I hadn’t published anything substantial by then (I’m 33 now and working more dedicatedly on my 1st novel, so fingers crossed for that).
And I was also very disappointed with myself for hitting a classmate in the face when I was 23, which threw me off track for a while (that and the ADHD diagnosis that year, though it did help me deal with some impulsivity and organizational problems). But the first thing forced me to acknowledge that I’d had anger issues since I was a kid and that I was abusive to my parents and brother from age 11 into my twenties. Parents abusing children is probably worse on average because of strength and power dynamics – I’m so sorry, @Vucodlak, that you had to go through that – but it was still really stressful for them and horrible of me because I was old enough to know better.
After that is when I got more interested in feminism. One reason is, it provided frameworks for treating people more fairly in general.
Anyway, I dated someone when I was 26, but we never got to the point of kissing. I guess because we were in areas where people could potentially see us, and when he invited me to his place after an event, I didn’t feel comfortable to saying yes because of the implication of sexual activities when we hadn’t kissed yet and when I wasn’t super familiar with him yet. But his idea was that I was religious and objected to such a thing on principle…which showed I hadn’t communicated that well in the first place. It was the communication thing that made us break up (his first language was French, mine English, and we came from quite different backgrounds). He seemed like a good and decent person, probably more so than me at the time; we just wouldn’t get along well enough.
I’m happy with my current boyfriend, he’s kind and thoughtful and we get along well, but the relationship still comes with complications, one of them being that he’s living elsewhere for two years. It’s weird that incels think people in relationships are living in some perfect world.
…
Anyway, that’s more than you wanted to know, and probably quite disorganized!! But I hope you’re doing well and you don’t think that being single now reflects badly on you. There’s nothing bad about being single or otherwise, it’s kind of a neutral thing morally, even though being lonely or conflicted can be emotionally tough. At least, that’s how I see it.
@weirwoodtreehugger
“You’re right that incels aren’t necessarily “ugly” but even if they all were, it wouldn’t mean they’re doomed to inceldom.”
This is the prevailing myth of their movement. They act like being a “4” or something completely precludes you from a normal life, when not-beautiful people are literally everywhere living normal, happy, successful lives. They have basically appropriated the real struggles and oppression of people with facial deformities (horrible word but I can’t think of another) or extensive burns/injuries to their petty, piss-weak whining that they aren’t gifted a sexually submissive cheerleader on their 14th birthday.
I get that how you feel about your looks can hold you back and be emotionally distressing. I thought I was ugly (now I’m getting older, I don’t really know why) and it sucked. But it wasn’t oppression. I had exactly the same opportunities as everyone else. Being sad I wasn’t the prettiest girl in the room was just self obsessed nonsense that might not have been entirely my fault in terms of society and make up ads or whatever, but it was still my responsibility to have enough personal growth to get the fuck over it.
@LollyPop : that’s nowhere more visible than when that troll is saying he cannot get a good job or a good social position because of his look.
Now, attractive people do have an easier time advancing in society. Or at least, attractive *men*, IIRC it’s less clear for attractive women. But it’s like a small bonus, and you can be uncharismatic and become the president of a country or the PDG of a firm.
In the end, looks is a very convenient scapegoat for them. They use it in the exact same way as xenophobe use stranger.
True, but I just meant if you’re conventionally attractive more people will likely be interested in you. Although there are other factors involved too. But finding a date and finding sexual satisfaction are definitely not the same thing.
I understand what you mean but was just pointing out that if it’s not the people you want it doesn’t do much good. Also I think that the tendency of patriarchy to devalue women’s work encourages people to think that a woman who does choose to try to meet conventional standards of attractiveness has to put in a lot effort. It’s hard and requires actual exertion. My time in the beauty industry definitely showed that. For me looking and dressing the way I do was and is art but it’s also work.
That definitely are not, and I think that part of the insidiousness of patriarchal culture is that it uses slut-shaming and kink-shaming to try to enforce the idea that finding a date and finding sexual satisfaction are and should be the same thing, at least for a woman.
@Vucodlak
I’m so sorry all of that happened to you and my heart breaks for you. I’m disgusted that anyone could treat a child like that. I don’t have anything else I could say other then I’m so sorry and I wish I could go back in time and still little you away from all of that.
@AnhedoniAmelia
the majority of incels aren’t actually unattractive. they are just whinny entitled white boys who screw themselves over because they won’t approach women to actually talk to them or they just decide that all women are the enemy, so if a woman does come up to be friendly with them, they ruin it with their hate. they are normal looking. there is actually no such thing as being to ugly for intimacy or a relationship. my good friend had his face ripped off by a dog when he was a child. he is deformed now. I love him and he is an amazing person, but he is not what anyone would call beautiful. small children and babies cry when they see his face and it is an insecurity for him. But he has such a beautiful personality that when you get to know him, that just becomes his whole face. He has a boyfriend that he moved with and see him as the most beautiful thing in the world. The only thing that make an incels, an incels, if their own hatred and entitlement.