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gender policing TERFs transphobia

Jamie Lee Curtis’ youngest kid comes out as trans; Gender Crits and other assholes are thrilled with this new opportunity to be transphobic

The proud mom

In a recent interview with AARP magazine, Jamie Lee Curtis announced that she has a new trans daughter, saying that she and her husband Christopher Guest “have watched in wonder and pride as our son became our daughter Ruby.”

Ruby, 25, is engaged and hopes to be married next year.

Naturally, the news gave some of the internet’s biggest assholes — a mixture of spiteful trad-cons and Gender Critical “feminists” — a new opportunity to put their nastiness on display.

On Twitter, the assholes responded to Curtis’ interview with catty comments and appeals to SCIENCE or God. Here are some of the responses I found in a thread started by the right-wing “Not the Bee” site.

Squirrelbrain
@WtfFuckery
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
15 years ago,you were not a Hollywood  star without a pet chiuaua. Now,you're not a hollywood star without your signiture pet son daughter.
Microsonic
@microsonics
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
I would wonder why you think this is a normal human thing. There is no known way to change the sex or gender of a living individual. They're just playing dress up. SCIENCE!
Golfishunt
@G0LFISHUNT
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
This is so jacked up. These kids are lost and confused, and society is screwing them over by suggesting the solution is pretending to be the opposite sex. Or non-binary.
Kasey Cubed #MiniDOGE
@KaseyCubed
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
Sick. Their children are nothing but virtue trophies

Olly
@Paul75959124
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
Watched with wonder and pride as he decided to go with the latest trend that will increase his possibility of committing suicide up by 40%. Stunning and brave.
The Dogfather
@miccmaster
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
this akin to parents oohing and applauding as their child tries meth for the first time...

In many ways the comments from Christians were the meanest in spirit.

Marcado Razon
@marcado_razon
·
Jul 31
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
May our Lord forgive me, but I want to see her smug grin about that on judgement day.  God will not be mocked.

David A. Miller
@davidmprose
·
13h
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
And I'm sure they "wondered" and "prided" all the way to the bank. Mutilate for money to try and influence the masses? Sure, where do I sign? There's a problem though.... the masses... see we don't give a crud what she says or stands for. Some of us live by the Word not by lies.

This one, by some sort of eugenics fan (I think), was the strangest.


L0ki
@M0rganaF
Replying to 
@Not_the_Bee
can we talk about ppl 'Darwining' themselves yet?

*no kids before die

this is a very real concern because human genetics is weak because we are not very diverse verses other animals. 

I'm serious

it just make us less diverse and weaker... is this the end game?

I took a quick look over on Ovarit, a Reddit-style hangout for “Gender Crits” kicked off of Reddit. Some responses were merely spiteful, but others were deeply strange.

Some mocked the pre-transition pictures of Ruby that ran in a Daily Mail piece about Curtis’ big reveal.

Researcher1536 wrote:

I read [the Daily Mail] article earlier today and started laughing. It’s so textbook. It’s the biggest farce. Unbelievable that anyone takes any of this seriously. Look at him. Ffs. He’s like every slobby weird gamer bro with a porn addiction. It’s comical until you remember this is actually happening.

Scat added:

Look at him, cliche incel. She must be so disappointed in him.

Pennygadget thought she had an explanation for the transition:

When White men transition, they instantly go from the bottom of the leftie social hierarchy to the top. I almost can’t blame them for wanting to do it.

You’ll have to explain ProxyMusics comment to me because I surely can’t explain it to you.

Slightly off topic, but for an adopted child, [deadname]/Ruby looks a lot like dad Christopher Guest during his “Spinal Tap” days. The face & bod are chubbier, but an image search of Guest from the “Spinal Tap” era shows that the resemblance is strong. IMO, it’s unmistakable.

So the pre-transition Ruby is the spitting image of her adoptive father? How would that work exactly?

Proxy continued:

Because Thomas/Ruby is adopted, he cannot inherit his father’s barony to become Lord Hayden-Guest, 6th Baron Hayden-Guest, though he & his sister can use the title, The Honourable.

Ok, I’m pretty sure no one asked whether or not Ruby was lined up to be Lord Hayden-Guest, 6th Baron Hayden-Guest.

I wonder if Thomas would have “transitioned” to Ruby if the rules allowed him to become Baron Hayden-Guest himself. Wikipedia uses The Hon. before the names of both Curtis-Guest kids: The Hon. Anne Guest and The Hon. Ruby Guest.

Well, I’m certainly glad that all this has been straightened out.

Gender Crits sure are weird.

I’m going to go lie down for a bit.

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BradMoonRising
BradMoonRising
1 month ago

When White men transition, they instantly go from the bottom of the leftie social hierarchy to the top. I almost can’t blame them for wanting to do it.

Okay, I’ll bite. Wtf is “the leftie social hierarchy” supposed to mean?

Dalillama
1 month ago

Right-wingers always act like the left is a mirror version of themselves. Their social hierarchy puts cishet white men on top, so naturally they’re at the bottom of the leftist hierarchy and the people they hate the most are at the top.

Full Metal Ox
1 month ago

@David Futrelle:

Slightly off topic, but for an adopted child, [deadname]/Ruby looks a lot like dad Christopher Guest during his “Spinal Tap” days. The face & bod are chubbier, but an image search of Guest from the “Spinal Tap” era shows that the resemblance is strong. IMO, it’s unmistakable.

So the pre-transition Ruby is the spitting image of her adoptive father? How would that work exactly?

Because children pick up the habits of expression of the adults (regardless of biological relationship) who bring them up? The more gray and disgruntled I grow, the more I see my (adoptive) dad’s resting grouchface in the mirror.

And is the scandal supposed to be that Ruby is Guest’s biological offspring (presumably by adultery?) Should that be the case (and it needn’t be; sometimes resemblances happen to happen), he took responsibility for her and Curtis accepted her.

(Does anyone remember the days when the grapevine used to throw conniptions about Curtis’ own rumored chromosomal makeup, or is that line of Hollywood gossip so last generation?)

Trying
Trying
1 month ago

I wish Curtis hadn’t deadnamed her daughter.

Sinkable John, 100% resunk with fresh ingredients
Sinkable John, 100% resunk with fresh ingredients
1 month ago

That’s bunk, everybody knows cats sit at the top of the leftie social hierarchy.

Also, Ovarit ? Fuckin’ really ?

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
1 month ago

That human genetic is weak argument make me want to shout at the top of my lung “THIS IS NOT HOW ANY OF THIS WORK”.

Which, granted. It’s not like any part of their arguments are grounded in reality. But what they do to science tend to grate me particulary bad.

Especially here ; their actual goal is visibly to spin the lack of actual human races and subraces as a bad thing for “genetic diversity”. Thy would want people to less mix together to increase diversity, the kind of “howling at the moon” logic that is expected for them but make no fuckin sense.

Mexican Hot Chocolate
Mexican Hot Chocolate
1 month ago

What’s with these people? It’s like they can’t be happy unless they’re making trans and non-binary people miserable just for existing.

Crip Dyke
1 month ago

@Trying

I wish Curtis hadn’t deadnamed her daughter.

I get that.

What I find particularly weird, though, is that David replaced Ruby’s old name with
“[Deadname]”
in one place, but left the deadname unedited in other sentences.

I mean, if you consider it wrong the first time, why does it become okay the 2nd & 3rd times?

For me the important thing is that I know folks have my back. As long as Ruby feels confident she has Curtis’ and HaydenGuest’s support, mistakes like that can be overcome (or even just overlooked) the way that I don’t freak that David used the deadname more than once, but edited it out once. I don’t know how it happened, but David has been so consistent for so long, I don’t have to wonder if the cause is that David is actually/secretly some antitrans jerk.

It is what it is. People are imperfect.

DaddyLongarms
DaddyLongarms
1 month ago

My former best friend turned TERF recently wrote me asking if we could “catch up” and I KNOW it’s because our relationship was unhealthy and she misses her door mat, but she’s also a chronic liar and how do you tell someone their “political” views are disgusting if they’re gonna lie and say that they’ve changed. I’m trans, she should want nothing to do with me. And i just KNOW I’m her “I’ve lost people for the cause”-story.

No, i just tell her to go fuck herself in her biological bits, don’t i?

IgnoreSandra
IgnoreSandra
1 month ago

Look at [REDACTED], cliche incel. She must be so disappointed in him.

…Did they miss the part where Ruby, 25, expects to be married next year? By definition, not incel. It’s also WILD to put words in her mother’s mouth, especially words that contradict both what Curtis has said and left unsaid. She says she supports Ruby, and our best understanding is that she still has a relationship with Ruby.

There is no known way to change the sex or gender of a living individual

Gender is a fantasy, a collective delusion that exists because we agree it exists. Under this paradigm (Which is the current scientific consensus on the topic of gender, though they use the term “socially constructed”), anyone can change their gender at any time, for any length of time, as often as they want.

As for sex – well now. It’s not like he would know about that.

I’m a little disturbed by the implication that you can change the sex/gender of a dead person. I’d argue that basic respect for the deceased would involve leaving their gender where the individual last left it.

When White men transition, they instantly go from the bottom of the leftie social hierarchy to the top. I almost can’t blame them for wanting to do it.

The entire point of leftist social organizing is there is no hierarchy. If there’s a social hierarchy, it’s not a leftist group.

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
1 month ago

When White men transition, they instantly go from the bottom of the leftie social hierarchy to the top. I almost can’t blame them for wanting to do it.

I think tis bit’s actually an important right wing defense tactic. Their opponents (i.e. us, reality) can’t just be wrong, they also have to be powerful. The hated-minority-of-choice can’t just be bad, they have to be domineering. They have to be the underdogs, or their world-view falls apart.

This is how they’re able to tell themselves that they’re good people. They aren’t picking on the most maligned, vulnerable, and suffering minorities in our society – that minority has actually wrested control of our government from the hands of the good, honest folk and is taking everyone’s freedom to suit their agenda. Instant justification. Now it’s heroic to oppress them.

And yeah, it’s the fundamental lie of fascism, too. Our enemy is both pathetic, weak, and degenerate, and also dangerous, powerful, and responsible for everything evil in our society. The difference between a modern conservative and a fascist is largely tailoring.

Full Metal Ox
1 month ago

@David Futrelle:

I posted a comment nine hours ago (as of 10:30AM EDT) that’s still awaiting approval; did I commit some faux pas?

epitome of incomrepehensibility

So my friend’s youngest sibling just came out as non-binary!

The only thing I worried about, when my friend told me, was whether I’d mess up and say “she” instead of “they” sometimes out of habit (they’re using a shorter version of the name they had before, which isn’t hard to remember). But now I’m worried that they’ll get reactions like this. Thanks, world. :/

But I’m glad that they – and that Ruby – have supportive friends & family. That outweighs any bigoted comments from strangers. And solidarity to those who don’t have that kind of support.

Bakunin
Bakunin
1 month ago

Ruby may have given her permission to use her deadname in the article, I wanna be optimistic and hope that’s the case.

And yet again, TERFs reveal themselves to be the worst feminists. Body shaming, mocking appearances, and being obsessed with sex organs

hammerofglass
hammerofglass
1 month ago

I love how they just vaguely invoke SCIENCE as a totem. I guess they finally figured out that every relevant field of science and medicine says they’re completely wrong, so they’re just vaguely waving at the abstract concept of scientific authority and hoping nobody actually checks.

I mean I guess it is the same way they do the “ignore every actual teaching of Jesus and do everything he explicitly condemned” version of Christianity they preach, so it’s consistent at least.

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
1 month ago

@epitome of incomrepehensibility, congrats to your friendsibling! Good for them! That’s great. You’ll do fine. They’ll get reactions like in the article, of course, but that’s the world. Your support will help them cope with that, and together you’ll be making the world a bit better.

@hammerofglass, I’m willing to be that that’s basically how they interact with everything. Application of authority as a totemic power. We lefties seem to care more about challenging our own understanding of things more, and are willing to be wrong about things, whereas their understanding seems to be more about assertion than critique. Interesting!

Seth S
Seth S
1 month ago

@bakunin

Oh, but, see, it’s “okay” to mock women for their bodies and sex organs if they’re “not REAL women”. That’s how they think they can justify that nonsense. They truly believe that they’re just mocking men, and that’s (for some reason) totally okay, just like even though I was assumed female at birth and should be off limits for body mockery, it’s fine to make fun of the size of my dick or relatively non-muscular build (because I’m “pretending” to be a man). As long as the mockery is rooted in making fun of some aspect of maleness/manhood that is either in “excess” or “lacking”, then it’s all good.

ugggghhhghghghghhghghhghgh. I look forward to the day we just stop making fun of people for gender based reasons or make it clearer that it’s about the foibles of society that can be improved (only anger and lust are approved emotions for men, Must Man Harder Or Teh Queers Will Get Me attitude, etc), not about aspects people have less control over (penis size, physical build, “effeminate” mannerisms that actually wouldn’t be seen as so funny/a problem if being feminine weren’t seen as a bad thing for a man to be, etc).

I do wonder how Christians like that think they’re not doing what should qualify as real virtue signaling. I mean, how much more supposed virtue can you signal, than “[I’m so virtuous that] I’m going to sit in heaven and watch God wipe that smug grin off your face as you disgusting people suffer for literally eternity”?

North Sea Sparkly Dragon
North Sea Sparkly Dragon
1 month ago

Somewhat on topic, because it’s about TERFs and famous people’s children. Some TERFs are trying to claim that PTerry would agree with them and then tried to argue with Neil Gaimen, Rhiannon Pratchett and even Stephen Briggs! Ms Pratchett got so much hassle because she challenged them for insulting her father’s memory by sullying it by saying he’d agree with them. Oh and there’s a shed load of TERFs screaming about how nobody knows what ‘Gender Critical’ really means. Clearly, TERFs have never read anything by STP or they’d know about Eskerina Smith, Jeffery the calmweaver, Sergeant Jackrum, Gladys, and last but definitely not least Cherry Littlebottom and Queen Blodwen.

Last edited 1 month ago by North Sea Sparkly Dragon
Karalora
Karalora
1 month ago

@North Sea Sparkly Dragon

I’ve been hearing about that all over the Pratchett fandom on Tumblr. What I’m morbidly curious to know is where, exactly, the TERFs got the idea that Pterry would be one of them. Like what even.

Snowberry
Snowberry
1 month ago

Mostly I’m just hoping that such cases are “my child wants to be out to the world and I’m signal boosting them” and not “I want to be out to the world as the parent of a trans child”.

Now,you’re not a hollywood star without your signiture pet son daughter.

This is most likely exaggerated. With a bit research, I was only able to find a total of 7 celebs with a trans or nonbinary child, including adult children in their 20s (and not including Chaz Bono, because that’s not a ‘now’ thing and also he’s one of the parents). Might have missed one or a few, but I can’t imagine it’s that many.

Wait, is this about adoption? Because 3 of them are adopted. Do they think this is part of an upcoming trend? Because some celebrities are too busy to take time off with pregnancy/early childcare and adopt instead, and with the exception of Chaz Bono they’re probably not going to be adopting trans kids on purpose, it just happens.

Crip Dyke
1 month ago

@Scildfreja Unnyðnes
 
I don’t remember seeing you around for a while. I missed you.

With absolutely no pressure, if you’d like to exchange email to be able to stay in touch in the future, I would be very pleased.

Crip Dyke
1 month ago

@snowberry

Wait, is this about adoption? Because 3 of them are adopted. Do they think this is part of an upcoming trend? Because some celebrities are too busy to take time off with pregnancy/early childcare and adopt instead,

Jamie Lee Curtis is out as intersex. She adopted because she literally can’t get pregnant, nor can she impregnate anyone else. For Guest & Curtis, at least, it has nothing to do with too busy. In fact, she has written a bunch of children’s books because parenting and kids are that important to her.

I know this statement was part of your criticism of the TERFs, but I thought I would point out that not just their conclusions are wrong, but the premise is also wrong.

And, of course, I wanted a chance to praise Curtis, since she helped me feel better about my own body in the 90s.

Last edited 1 month ago by Crip Dyke
Nequam
Nequam
1 month ago

@Crip Dyke:

I remember persistent rumors of Jamie Lee Curtis as intersex or trans– usually slung around as insults. But when did she come out? Wikipedia mentions nothing, and I suspect a google search of “Jamie Lee Curtis intersex” will have a lot of trash results.

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
1 month ago

@Crip Dyke, I’d love to exchange email, certainly! How would you like to do that.

I also saw on your blog that You Are Chidi and oh my gosh Chidi is amazing, that whole show though. Please tell me that you’re going to watch the whole thing, it’s an incredible production!

Surplus to Requirements
Surplus to Requirements
1 month ago

@Scildfreja Unnyðnes

The difference between a modern conservative and a fascist is largely tailoring.

The difference between a conservative and a fascist is that between a dogwhistle and a bullhorn, so far as I can tell.

Crip Dyke
1 month ago

She came out in the early 90s when she was adopting her first child. I don’t think she ever said the word “intersex” but she mentioned being infertile from birth or always being infertile (not sure how she phrased it) as her reason for adopting. There are many intersex conditions, and for infertility from birth to occur you don’t have to have extreme morphogenic variations (Your genitals might look normal or nearly so to normal visual examination.)

There have been persistent rumors that she did have a pretty extreme morphogenic variation (including stupid rumors about medically impossible combinations of traits that have literally never been observed in humans) which I mostly discount, but because of those rumors she was asked about how she felt about trans people and intersex people and the hostility they face in society (I think this was with a queer mag like Out or something, but I can’t remember), and I remember her answer was thoughtful and accepting and kind at a time when even most gay & lesbian folks weren’t that skilled at talking about the topic. Maybe I wouldn’t think it was a skilled answer today, but it was in the context of the 90s. The point is that it was thoughtful enough to make me think she’d actually spent time thinking about the topic.

She also has never denied being intersex, despite the questions and rumors and many opportunities.

So I think I constructed her discussions of her own infertility into perhaps a more explicit admission than she made. But it’s also important to note that no one knew the term Intersex at the time. Before Cheryl Chase, the term was used exclusively among certain medical providers. Even most medical providers that weren’t specialists would refer to people as “hermaphrodites”, “hermaphroditic [males/females]”, or “pseudohermaphrodites”.

I think her discussions about her infertility were probably as close as someone could come in the early 90s to coming out intersex without actually saying that they’re intersex.

Crip Dyke
1 month ago

@Scildfreya

I also saw on your blog that You Are Chidi and oh my gosh Chidi is amazing, that whole show though. Please tell me that you’re going to watch the whole thing

Yes. I plan to watch the whole thing. I am past Chidi’s hugely important accidental causing of harm in the middle of season 1, but only by an episode. It will probably take me a while to get through, but I’m making progress.

Nequam
Nequam
1 month ago

@Crip Dyke: thanks for the info!

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
1 month ago

@Surplus, are we doing a thing? 😮

The difference between a modern conservative and a fascist is largely tailoring.

The difference between a conservative and a fascist is that between a dogwhistle and a bullhorn, so far as I can tell.

The difference between a conservative and a fascist is that the conservative says this is for the economy first, before doing the awful thing.

@Crip Dyke, I binged the whole thing over the course of a week; that show did things to my brain. It’s an excellent show. I won’t spoil a thing! But I will say that you need to give yourself space for emotions at the end. The finale is a knockout.

moregeekthan
moregeekthan
1 month ago

Just chiming in to recommend The Good Place to anyone with access to stream it. You know, assuming a sitcom about philosophy and metaphysics is in your wheelhouse.

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
1 month ago

@moregeekthan, The Good Place absolutely rescued me in a manner I didn’t realize I needed. I’ve been interminably depressed for ages now, and it was exactly what I needed to slap my brain into an entirely different space. I’ve always been an absolute sponge when it comes to visual media (tv shows, movies, etc) and so I’m always careful about what I choose to watch, but gosh was The Good Place a worthy choice. Oh my gosh, @Crip Dyke, you have to tell me what you think of the end of the first season when you get there too 😮

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 month ago

@Scildfreja

The difference between a conservative and a fascist is that the conservative says this is for the economy first, before doing the awful thing.

Such as calling for the disabled to be left to die of COVID because we are “not productive and expensive to maintain,” rather than straight-up calling for the extermination of us as untermenschen.