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armageddon incels MGTOW misogyny we hunted the mammoth

Just another incel fantasy of a nuclear war putting “strong men” in charge again

Nuclear war is cute and funny

Here’s a creepy bit of copypasta i found crossposted on the MGTOW subreddit and the incel-infested Black Pill Club site. It’s a little apocalyptic fantasy envisioning some variety of “WW3” tearing down our allegedly lady-dominated society and putting “strong men” in charge again.

“We need WW3/something really devastating so strong men can take back western society,” the post begins.

Its no secret that western society (so far, its likely that other the rest of the world will be feminist soon as well) has been ruined by feminism and all sorts of degeneracy.

Ah, “degeneracy,” that favorite Nazi dogwhistle.

Men, especially straight white men are villified and get no respect. Everything is blamed on the “evil” patriachy. Lots of men are brainwashed into believe the whole women being oppressed narrative. I won’t even get into the lgbt+ degenerate bs here.

People are ungrateful to men who build and made the US and in general the west so powerful.

WE HUNTED THE MAMMOTH, er, sorry, “built and made the US” to feed you!

And things will only get worse. We have had it too easy in the west so people in the past few decades (and now with social media it has only gotten worse) became focused on dumb shit like feminism.

We’re living in the midst of a pandemic that has already killed more than ten times the number of Americans who died in Vietnam. Fascism is on the rise worldwide. I’m not sure things are quite so “easy” as you think unless you live a pretty cosseted life.

We need real problems, maybe WW3 or something else that is devastating so people grow up and appreciate men again

You really think you’re the grown up in this scenario? You live in a fantasy land.

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Elaine The Witch
Elaine The Witch
11 days ago

OT

Anyone got an recommendations or must see sites in Boston that I should go see? don’t know if any of you have visted there before or live there, But I’m going to see my brother and sister in law in August and I’m going to be doing some site seeing.

Hambeast
Hambeast
11 days ago

When you resort to advocating a global catastrophe (because what else even IS a world war?) maybe, juuuust maybe, your cause isn’t so noble or righteous as you think.

re: printed flour sacks – Both of my parents were Depression kids who were raised on farms in Iowa. My mom used to tell me about the “flour sack dresses” she had to wear to school and she hated them because everyone was familiar with them and the prints were (apparently) readily identifiable.

Even if they were well-enough off not to have to use them to make clothing, people still used the flour sacks as handkerchiefs, toweling, and linens. And then, quilt material.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
11 days ago

@Alan : that fig debate remind me how utterly theoretical the discussions over vegan ethic really are. In the end, their goals should be closer to “minimize suffering on animals and plants”, and not an hypothetical 0 suffering to only a specific category which make them create arbitrary distinction between products.

As for beermaking, I agree, but brewing beer demand more hardwares. You need hops, grains, a bit of time for fermentating ; so it’s lower in my order of priority.

And, yes, survival odds of the average human suddenly propelled in the wild nature is quite low. Like, you break a legs and it’s over ; and especially our modern tall self are quite vulnerable at breaking something.

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
11 days ago

I’ve always thought printed feedsacks were quite brilliant, as they built brand loyalty (one would be enough to make a shirt for a kid, or a dress for a small kid, but if a grown woman wanted to make herself a dress she needed to save up two or three sacks in the same pattern), while encouraging recycling by making the package the product came in into a bonus item. I think with many companies you could also send them a stamped self-addressed enveloped and get free sewing patterns designed to work with the measurements of the fabric you got from the feedsacks.

moregeekthan
moregeekthan
11 days ago

OT @Elaine
Last time I was in Boston, in the early 00s, we went on a walking tour called the Freedom Trail, or something like that. Was pretty cool if you like colonial stuff, or just walking through old parts of Boston. Would skip Paul Revere’s house, since it isn’t really his house, just a much newer house built on that site.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
11 days ago

isn’t that pretty much what “small beer” was? (as in, very low in alcohol and mainly a way of making water safer and more palatable to drink?)

(or is that one of those “everybody knows” things that are really just a vague myth?)

Also, does that have anything to do with the popularity of tea in China?

Incidentally, my friend (who is ethnically Chinese) told me that Chinese people always want to drink their water warm*. As in, not necessarily boiled but at least microwawed, presumably to get the same feel. This is supposedly a cultural habit that people may justify by claiming the heating evaporates some “harmful gases” from the water.

*Also here in Finland, where tap water is excellent.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
11 days ago

re: printed flour sacks – Both of my parents were Depression kids who were raised on farms in Iowa. My mom used to tell me about the “flour sack dresses” she had to wear to school and she hated them because everyone was familiar with them and the prints were (apparently) readily identifiable.

I once saw this exact thing in a Finnish novel depicting life in early 20th century. Thought it was meant to be a plausible but quirky incident (in real historical terms) illustrating general poverty.

Alan Robertshaw
11 days ago

@big titty demon

But why does that make you cry?

Oh gosh, now there’s a question. Let’s just say that, for various reasons, child poverty is something that I can’t apply my normal detachment to.

But I totally agree with you on the general brilliance of utilising materials like this. I’m a big fan of reduce, reuse, recycle. I do most of my shopping in charity and second hand shops. And I hate waste. Seriously, like viscerally. So I love the idea of what would otherwise be packaging being reused like this.

When I’m dictator for life Prime Minister there’ll be a policy that what is now waste should be set up so it can be used for something else. Like if you use stuff to protect goods in transit it should be suitable for home insulation etc.

Cavoyo
Cavoyo
10 days ago

This idea isn’t unique to the incels. Many conservatives believe in a cyclical theory of history that goes “Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.”

GSS ex-noob
GSS ex-noob
10 days ago

@Alan: Thank you for improving my last sentence with your editing. 🙂

I also want to be in BTD’s apocalypse clan. My husband likes beets.

Let’s just have a WHTM clan, I definitely want Elaine and her Marine with us too. And all the ladies who spin, weave, and sew. We’ll keep some chickens to eat bugs, lay eggs, and make fertilizer. We’ll ferment what we can for “beer”, regular or small. I’d put our chances at much better than an incel clan. Plus we’ll have fun stories and jokes to tell around the fire.

Since we’re going to be eating organic, even the vegans are going to swallow a bug or two. I have a couple of small fruit trees in my garden and am in the habit of cutting the delicious tree-ripe noms open, because while I’m not vegan, I prefer not to eat any more bugs than is necessary. We’ll dry the figs and the overripe fruit becomes some kind of booze naturally.

Flour sack clothes were definitely a big thing. My parents grew up in the South in the Depression. Mom’s family was well-off, but others in town weren’t. Dad was literally an Ozark hillbilly, and for both of them, the ultimate put-down of an upper-class woman in my life was “Her dress looks like it’s made from a flour sack.” But everyone used flour sack dish towels.

@Victorious Parasol: I love the Bannerless books, and Vaughan’s work in general.

@Threp: welp, at least they didn’t become jerky?

Last edited 10 days ago by GSS ex-noob
Ted
Ted
10 days ago

I’m curious as to how they think they’d survive the literal fallout from Mutually-Assured Destruction. Sheer dumb luck?

Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
10 days ago

We had flour sack dish towels when I was growing up in the 1950s to the 1970s. They had belonged to my grandmother, rumored to have been not a very nice person, who died in the 1940s. So those towels lasted a long, long time. They were gray with age and I loathed them. In light of climate change, I’m now making my own dish towels last until they give up the ghost — but I don’t think I can make them last thirty years. They’re not as sturdy as the free towels.

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
10 days ago

@Alan, I would vote for you and your programme. Sadly we may have a bit of a problem with FPTP …
(I wonder if that will change after Scottish independence … and Irish reunification when NI chooses, and maybe Welsh independence, and perhaps that of Kernow, and the rise of the NIP* …)

*I mean the Northern Independence Party in this instance, rather than the Northern Ireland Protocol :-s

PS can we have a Pfand system? And a limited number of standard sizes and shapes of glass jars and bottles too, to make re-use by manufacturers even easier?

Last edited 10 days ago by opposablethumbs
Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
10 days ago

@GSS ex-noob

The Bannerless books are great, though I haven’t been able to re-read them the way I did before the pandemic. But the Kitty books are still comfort-reads.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
10 days ago

@opposablethumbs

PS can we have a Pfand system? And a limited number of standard sizes and shapes of glass jars and bottles too, to make re-use by manufacturers even easier?

… are you KIDDING??? We can’t even have a cell-fone charger that will work on more than one model of fone!!!

Full Metal Ox
9 days ago

@opposablethumbs:

PS can we have a Pfand system? And a limited number of standard sizes and shapes of glass jars and bottles too, to make re-use by manufacturers even PS can we have a Pfand system? And a limited number of standard sizes and shapes of glass jars and bottles too, to make re-use by manufacturers even easier?

Something I’ve noticed about Coca-Cola’s two-liter plastic bottles in the US: their determination to display the iconic hourglass shape would cost them some volume at standard height, and so they tower arrogantly above the rest of the soft drink ranks—and thus don’t fit into a lot of refrigerators.

Last edited 9 days ago by Full Metal Ox
.45
.45
9 days ago

@ Full Metal Ox

Yes, I worked retail. These little factoids are rather irritating when arranging overstock in the stockroom. Every company acts as though we only stock their products and nothing else.

GSS ex-noob
GSS ex-noob
8 days ago

@FM Ox: I don’t think I’ve ever seen a 2 liter Coke bottle of hourglass shape. All the ones that have ever come into our house are standard 2 L shape. But maybe because all we buy are diet? And also Pepsi and 7 Up diet?

The only curvy Coke bottle in the house is from Mexico, where Coke is still made the way God intended it. I have about 2 of those a year, when I’m really jonesing, usually in the summer.

Mostly I drink fruit-flavored fizzy water, or tea if I need caffeine.

GSS ex-noob
GSS ex-noob
8 days ago

@Elaine: I had some friends who liked the Museum of Bad Art in Boston, if your sense of humor meshes with that.

Full Metal Ox
8 days ago

@GSS ex-noob:

 I don’t think I’ve ever seen a 2 liter Coke bottle of hourglass shape. All the ones that have ever come into our house are standard 2 L shape. But maybe because all we buy are diet? And also Pepsi and 7 Up diet?


The only curvy Coke bottle in the house is from Mexico, where Coke is still made the way God intended it. I have about 2 of those a year, when I’m really jonesing, usually in the summer.

On second thought, the 2-liter Coke bottle has more of a flapper dropped waist—but a waist notwithstanding, and the Coke bottle towers above its competitors beyond the effect that perspective would create:

http://rethinksurvival.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/2liters.jpg

mouse sparrow
mouse sparrow
8 days ago

Re: apocalypse clan

Gosh, I wish I had a talent that’d be useful in an apocolypse.

Alas I’m just as useless as every other average person.

ETA: I’m not meaning to imply people can’t learn good skills, just that it’s hard for me and I’d probably be a burden to the WHTM apocolypse clan.

Last edited 8 days ago by mouse sparrow
oncewasmagnificent
oncewasmagnificent
8 days ago

mouse sparrow “… just that it’s hard for me and I’d probably be a burden to the WHTM apocolypse clan.”

The great thing about survival and subsistence level skills is that anyone and everyone can contribute most of the time. My dad used to line up all our friends (primary school age) at the dining table to help with cutting and peeling, pushing and poking fruit into jars for preserves during summer holidays. (Seeing as those friends continued to visit they must have enjoyed it.) But he didn’t get these not-very-strong 9 yr old girls to handle the huge jugs of boiling syrup or any of the really heavy and/or dangerous tasks required for processing.

Expert weaving or needlework or any other skilled activity is only possible if the practitioner has been through all the beginner stages _and_ has rehearsed, practised, reworked, and practised over and over and over again consistently since then. Normally I knit without looking at my hands. But I’ve neglected it for several years and now that I’ve taken it up again I find I need to watch a fair bit to maintain speed and fluency of motion.

You can learn. Just don’t expect the skills pf your mentors-coaches-teachers to transfer instantly to your novice attempts.

mouse sparrow
mouse sparrow
8 days ago

@oncewasmagnificent

Thank you so much.
I needed to hear that.
I’ve internalized a lot of the “you’re too stupid to learn” comments so I find myself putting myself down.

oncewasmagnificent
oncewasmagnificent
8 days ago

lumipuna This is supposedly a cultural habit that people may justify by claiming the heating evaporates some “harmful gases” from the water.

I’d think that’s the ‘lore’ arising from the biological law that boiled water is safer than not. Somewhere or other I read that, on the goldfields, in addition to the routine racial rejection of the Chinese, many superstitious miners conjectured that there was some kind of secret oriental magic the Chinese used to keep themselves more or less immune from the cholera and other water borne diseases that swept through the camps with horrifying regularity.

Not really. The Chinese simply boiled their drinking water because they drank it as tea when they could get it and hot and comforting but plain when the tea ran out. (Though I’d expect they did the usual poor people thing of reusing tea leaves over and over again.) Boiled water = less water borne disease.

GSS ex-noob
GSS ex-noob
8 days ago

@Full Metal Ox: Huh. Learn something new every day. You can tell I haven’t bought a 2 L of regular Coke in a long time! I’ll look at the bottles next time I brave the store.

Which I need to, partly for food and partly because this discussion has made me realize I don’t have a bottle of Mexican Coke on hand, and it’s July.

@mouse sparrow: The human race would never have survived if it weren’t for everyone above the age of three being able to do *something* to help the group. You can learn more complicated things while doing simple ones. I’m sure you could keep an eye on boiling water or pull out weeds; my dad made all of us kids weed the lawn. You could learn to make the thread and yarn for the knitters and weavers to use — it’s boring but easy work.

You obviously know how to read and write and operate a computer, which already puts you ahead of millions of people in the world. Pretty sure you weren’t born with those skills.

Full Metal Ox
8 days ago

@mousesparrow:

Here, have a drop spindle. That’s something easily portable (and a utilitarian fidget/stim toy, if that’s something you need) that you can be doing by rote in any unoccupied moment, generating thread for the weavers and knitters.

@oncewasmagnificent:

My dad used to line up all our friends (primary school age) at the dining table to help with cutting and peeling, pushing and poking fruit into jars for preserves during summer holidays. (Seeing as those friends continued to visit they must have enjoyed it.

Sounds as if your dad turned your friends’ visits into a preserve-making bee (and thus got them personally involved in the origin and preparation of their food, and fostered a sense of community.)

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
8 days ago

@mousesparrow

I started out with a Turkish drop spindle, then switched to a spinning wheel once I knew I wanted to spin more frequently and had saved up the money for it. I am a barely adequate spinner with a spindle, but I’m a very decent spinner with a wheel. It’s all a matter of which fiber art tool will work for you.

Full Metal Ox
7 days ago

@oncewasmagnificent:

Not really. The Chinese simply boiled their drinking water because they drank it as tea when they could get it and hot and comforting but plain when the tea ran out. (Though I’d expect they did the usual poor people thing of reusing tea leaves over and over again.) Boiled water = less water borne disease.

And the Chinese folk theory underlying that was (as far as I understand it; anyone with an actual Chinese upbringing or other grounding in Traditional Chinese Medicine is welcome to jump in and amend/correct me) is that a cold beverage would dump an unhealthful degree of yin shock into the system. There’s also a general feeling that hot water is Good For You:

https://www.cheng-tsui.com/blog/hot-water-in-chinese-culture (Note that the majority of diasporic Chinese during the Gold Rush and railroading era came from the Guangdong region in the south—also the reason that Cantonese cookery, in a mutated form, was the first to register on the Euro-American cultural radar.)

But Chinese wouldn’t have a basic character meaning “cholera” (霍,huò) if they were magically immune.

Non
Non
6 days ago

@moregeekthan

Old thread, but in the interests of keeping people from dying and the full picture…

re: nightshade

Aka Deadly Nightshade: White flowers/black to purple black small berries in clusters. the 100% fully ripe berries are not lethal to healthy adults, but they aren’t too tasty either. But for safety they should be thoroughly boiled. They can be mixed with sugar to make a jam; the jam process destroys toxins. It tastes like a cross between blackberry and blueberry, with a hint of tomato. The irony is the “deadly nightshade”, isn’t so much deadly, but will upset the stomach of people with nightshade/solanae allergies.

Bitter Sweet Nightshade: small red berries in clusters/small purple flowers- mildly poisonous(upset stomach) and too tasteless to bother experimenting with cooking IMHO

Belladonna: Medium light purple or greenish bellflowers/ large single sticky black berry. Also called Deadly Nightshade some places. THE LEAVES CAN KILL YOU. In fact all Nightshade leaves, including tomatoes, are toxic to some degree. Now FULLY RIPE Belladonna berries are slightly sweet and edible IN SMALL QUANTITIES. But they contain Atropine in addition to Solanine(sp?). They can knock a person out for a couple hours if they don’t have an atropine resistance. Unfortunately, I don’t know of anyway outside a lab to test for this. I only found out I am resistant because I was in a situation with no health care, serious pain and a knowledge of herbs and nothing to lose.

CHILDREN SHOULD NEVER EAT THE RAW BERRIES OF ANY NIGHTSHADE. And to be safe, I won’t even let children my nightshade jam or tarts.
NO ONE SHOULD EVER EAT THE LEAVES OF NIGHTSHADES. That includes all cultivate for food: peppers, tomatoes, potato, etc. Some poor shlub died using what he thought basil but was actually Bellodonna.

If you have an interest in wild food/medicine and foraging, you have to take it as seriously as people who study medicine. If you’re not able for that, leave it.

Okay, lesson’s over. Please don’t die.

Bmaccnm
Bmaccnm
5 days ago

Excuse, please, but I am stuck trying to imagine the calamity that wipes out all of civilization AND the people that built the civilization. The folks with the knowledge to build things would probably build them back in a smaller scale in fairly short order. Food production would be more focused and localized, water can be cleaned, clothing would be fashioned out of old clothing untilsmall ills were up and running, but people built all these things before and would build them again. The model isn’t zombie apocalypse, it’s rural Africa.

oncewasmagnificent
oncewasmagnificent
5 days ago

Bmaccnm rural Africa

Try Aboriginal Australia. Just been reading – and obsessively rereading – some excellent books on life, society, religion and agriculture/horticulture pre-invasion. (Burp, excuse me, pre white settlement.)

If everything’s been destroyed it’s interesting to contemplate organising your society around
1) no large animals which can be used as beasts of burden nor dairy products nor constant supplies of lovely rich manure. (Nor any significant number of deciduous plants to drop heavy seasonal loads of lovely leaves for composting.)
2) no metal tools for building or gardening
3) need a bridge to cross water?
a) “drop” a tree at the water’s edge by undermining the roots.
b) build a canoe by carving out the bark of a suitable tree.
… and so on ,,,

Anyone interested should start with Dark Emu by Bruce Pascoe. Not at all hard to read and he’s willing to stick his neck out to favour some not yet established research proposing much earlier dates of occupation of Australia by Aborigines. For those with lots of time to spare and a keen, dogged interest in understanding some new, quite foreign ideas, Bill Gammage’s The Biggest Estate on Earth: How Aborigines made Australia is a stunning piece of work. But it’s very hard going in some (many) parts. And there are 100 plus pages of bibliography, references, indices alone.

Which reminds me … long long ago, during the early years of New Scientist magazine I think, I read a piece referring to some research of early American settlement/invasion. A whole lot of newcomers living among the forests of the east coast complained that the forests were becoming overrun by brambles and other undergrowth. They had thought that the forests they had found on arrival – well-spaced trees producing lots of nuts for stored food and for timber with occasional clearings surrounded by berry producing plants in their sunny edges – had got that way by the invisible hand of nature/deity. All just waiting for the benefit of their ‘proper’ occupants, white folks, who needed to take no care, do no work, to ensure this bounty continued.

It simply never occurred to them that the original inhabitants came to these forests on a regular seasonal rotation to harvest berries, nuts, mushrooms or whatever and also weeded and cleared between the trees and the patches of other plants and transplanted bushes/trees or scattered seed to maintain the productivity and easy access of those forest products.

Anyone know how to follow up on this?

GSS ex-noob
GSS ex-noob
3 days ago

There’s a fun anime called “Dr. Stone” where one super-genius uses his knowledge and chains up into really big science, while training others along the way after an apocalypse kills off just about everyone.

Meanwhile I looked at 2L Coke bottles in the store today and of course you all were right — they’re slightly curvy and taller than the other flavors.

Gerald Fnord
Gerald Fnord
23 hours ago

Ted:
They know they will survive for the same reason people rarely seem to believe they’re the reincarnations of flea-ridden peasants, as opposed to flea-ridden aristocrats and royalty: they’re special, so their story will be special.