I thought that Reddit’s Red Pillers were all about conning women into bed. But some, it seems, are more interested in debating than dating.
Alas, a good debate can be harder to arrange than a mere hookup, an aspiring Red Pill Redditor reports in a recent post on the Ask The Red Pill subreddit.
Snoopy_ESP complains that the women he meets are all very “basic,” only interested in the most superficial conversations. And when he tries to steer the conversation to what he considers more intellectually engaging subjects the women just can’t keep up with his massive brain.
If you divert [the conversation] to deeper or more complex issues (geopolitics, social changes, new world order, scarcity of resources, politics, philosophy …) they are already lost and they answer with “I don’t know” or they answer you with the simplicities that they have heard in the TV
Yes, I’m sure hearing your thoughts on such fascinating topics as “the New World Order” and “scarcity of resources” must be quite a treat.
They are so basic, you get out of commenting on a series on Netflix and they are unable to have a debate arguing against your ideas because they don’t know about anything that TV hasn’t told them
I almost feel bad for these poor ladies, denied the pleasure of a real debate with someone as notable as Snoopy_ESP just because they’re so basic and stupid.
So Snoopy_ESP has to set aside his desire to debate some random woman he’s buttonholed at a bar.
I think the smart thing to do is to give up and adapt your conversation to theirs so that there are no frictions or they feel intellectually inferior.
Such a thoughtful lad!
A commenter called urbanfoh agrees that women are a bunch of basic bitches of the intellect.
Evolutionary speaking there is no incentive for women to take risk (apart from AFBB [alpha fucks, beta bucks]). Most men will be attracted to them no matter what as long as they are not disabled, very annoying or very ugly.
Evo Psych strikes again!
Womens crab in a bucket mentality even further incentivises women to stay at the mean of the cohort. And being excluded on basis of her views is devastating for a woman while offering no benefit.
Crabs? That’s one small step away from lobsters. I’m betting this guy is a huge fan of Jordan Peterson. Just a hunch.
Men on the other hand need to prove their status in some way. Be it physically, financially, socially or intellectually. Men need to either climb a hierarchy by proving their skills or challenge the very hierarchy itself. Being average is the worst strategy for men.
Definitely a Jordan Peterson fanboy.
One manifestation of that is that womens IQ is closer to the mean while most retards and most geniusses are men. Men are more likely to deviate from the mean of intelligence, interests, acceptable views, politics, finance etc to find a way to prove ones worth to women.
Another one of the “geniusses” who frequent this subreddit offers his boldly heterodox ideas on the subject, which just happen to be exactly the same as his Red Pill brothers and which also — surprise! — bear more than a little resemblance to some of Jordan Peterson’s most famous talking points.
“[T]here’s more genetic variation and risk-taking in men across the board” writes drewcer.
No matter what they say, you can’t go against biology. And biologically, women are the selectors because they hold the key to genetic immortality. Men compete for that genetic immortality in a dominance hierarchy.
“Dominance hierarchy,” huh. Where have I heard this incredibly original idea before? Oh yeah. That last guy, who got it from Jordan Peterson. It’s almost as if these guys have no ideas of their own. Maybe, just maybe, they’re the real intellectual basic bitches.
Which is why their bell curve is more spread-out in areas like IQ, income, etc. And women tend to group around the middle.
Funny that you hear feminists complaining so much about how all the rich people are men but they fail to realize all the homeless people are men, too.
It’s not even a men’s rights issue to me. It’s just biology, and biology is unfair. The good news is we live in a time where we can understand how the game is played (as individuals, anyway – mainstream society is still oblivious) and use it to be our best selves.
Wait, you want to be your own “best self?” Mister, you’ and your pals are in the wrong place for that.
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…Womens crab in a bucket mentality…
That metaphor persistently avoids the point that the fisherman who put those crabs in that bucket is the real problem.
“they are unable to have a debate arguing against your ideas because they don’t know about anything that TV hasn’t told them”
Funny; when I’m in the dating mindset I tend to be hopeful I’ll encounter someone who SHARES my ideas and viewpoints. He’s disappointed that people won’t argue against him. I wonder why that is…
How can there possibly be more genetic variation in men than in women?
Slightly off topic, but a friend of mine wants to get a ultra-portable laptop and I’m wondering if any of you know of a good one to get — or things to look out for when shopping for ultra-portable laptops, brands that are good or bad, etc. Thanks!!
I find this supposed fact a little bit suspicious, but as I am both disabled and extremely annoying I do not have the personal experience to contradict it.
I feel like our Mr. Big Brain is encountering women who peg him immediately as not worth the effort of educating. When that happens to me, my eyes kind of glaze over and I check out of the conversation, hoping that the guy in front of me goes away quietly and with a minimum of danger to myself. YMMV of course.
In a functional sense, this is true. The Y-chromosome is about a third the size of an X-chromosome, with a correspondingly fewer number of genes, but one of the two X-chromosomes in a female-karotype human cell will automatically inactivate and only one of them works in any given cell. So a male-karotype cell has more functioning genes than a female-karotype cell, even though the female-karotype cells have more overall genes, due to X-inactivation. X-inactivation occurs so that cells with two X-chromosomes don’t express double the proteins compared with a cell with only one X-chromosome (and one Y-chromosome).
Of course, this has nothing to do with intelligence, or IQ tests, which are written with a bias so that white men do better than women or non-white men.
@Policy of Madness
Yes, I get the impression he is coming across with hostility right off, trying to “debate” women on the first date. I mean, he seems to expect them to debate against him, so this and his reference of the NWO and all suggests he is a conspiracy theorist and starts with a confrontation shortly after saying “Hi”…
Edit: And now I need to look up this crabs in a bucket thing…
Double Edit: David, I know next to nothing about ultra portable laptops, but someone I know was raving about their latest purchase of same to me, so I can inquire tomorrow about it. At any rate, I imagine the more learned heads on laptops will want to know what this friend of yours wants it for. Do they just want to run Microsoft Word and pop in a DVD now and again, or do they want to do graphic design and play the latest video games?
lots of men (not just red pillers and conservatives, but liberals and leftists as well) seem to conflate arguments with conversations, so when a woman doesn’t want to argue with them, they see it as the woman being unwilling or unable to carry on a conversation. also nobody wants to talk about the “new world order,” and nobody wants to debate their date
@david
How much are they able/willing to spend? I know a bit about this area, having helped several friends purchase laptops in the highly portable and/or highly cheap class.
I am NOT a professional in any computer field, so there will be people (maybe here) who know a thousand times more than I do, but I have at least done internet research for comparison shopping several times over the last 3 years. And because of my obsessive personality, I’ve probably spent 20-30 hours reading reviews of the things. It’s not the best you can get, but if it’s helpful I can definitely give you some time.
Major factors to consider:
Money
Touchscreen necessary or optional?
Keyboard: detachable on non-? (detachable is only found on versions with touchscreens and tends to create problems over time as the connection/ hinges can become problematic, but it does allow you to use a single device as both a tablet and a laptop)
Software compatibility desired
Hardware compatibility desired
Top 2-3 primary purposes (gaming, business functions like word processing, spread sheets, etc., making videos, editing pictures, school, etc.)
How important is battery life?
How important is speed?
If you could pass those on, they don’t even all have to be answered if the answer is “I don’t know” or “doesn’t matter”. But the more answers available, the more help that I (or someone who knows more than me) can be.
Debating manospherians is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how well you play, the pigeon will knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it won anyway.
There are homeless women. Everyone knows that.
I had a date kinda like that once, but I like discussing politics and philosophy more than I like dating so this happened: first he wanted me to know he was right wing, because he didn’t like how openly lefty I sounded; then he trotted out a lot of pseudo philosophical bullshit, which I pointed out was untrue or biased; then the day after I got a message that he didn’t think it would work out.
I literally was told that he couldn’t stand to be contradicted so we shouldn’t date more “for my safety”. I was slightly shocked. This was not a raging asshole that you could see a mile away was a misoginist. He just disliked THAT MUCH not having the intellectual upper hand in the relationship.
I agree with @POM and @Megi Stardust
I think what he really wants is a “debate” which quickly devolves into the woman agreeing with him and hanging onto his every dubious, unsubstatiated word.
Aside from all the evopsych bs that followed OP’s post I’m pretty sure that this guy’s inability to find a woman to d(eb)ate has mostly to do with himself and his whole worldview. I’ve never went out on a date with someone that I haven’t talked to at least a bit beforehand (and I’m sure aside from blind dates that’s pretty much the same for anyone else). And his type of non-substantial boastful pseudo-indellectual blubbering sounds like this guy may think of himself as super duper intellectual when he actually has the depth of a puddle. So maybe the actual reason he doesn’t meet any intellectual women is simply because they wouldn’t want a date with him anyway. And even if one ended up on a date with him… he seems like the type of guy who makes a bunch of weird nonsensical or even offensive claims about the state of the world, that you can only respond to with an awkward “Ehhh… I don’t.. know?”. Because where would you even start debating stupid pseudo scientific shit like “dominance hierarchy”?
@ Tyne: First of all: That guy sounded scary… But I’m also not sure that it’s really about intellectual dominance… This is actually a pretty good example of why OP may not get his “debates”. If a guy told me he “doesn’t like” my presumed worldview and told me he opendly identifies with a misanthropic/ xenophobic/ misogynist one – I’m pretty sure I’d keep my opinion to myself out of safety. The fact that he even outright told you to stay away from him for “your safety” is almost ironic. This is a pretty perfect example for the hypocrisy of these people screaming about how their opponents have no arguments, just to turn around and pretty much literally threaten you when you actually dare to argue.
This pompous ass just said that men who are homeless deserve to be because it’s just nature, which is unfair. Meanwhile, feminists are out there helping the homeless in various ways. Because MRAs don’t really care about men.
I don’t grace these pills with “debate” because they are so boring. I know enough about JP talking points that I can predict what they’re going to say. Plus I know they are so entrenched in their lobster cult that nothing I say to counter those points will matter to them at all. So why entertain a tedious and meaningless exchange? Better chat about the MCU until the date is over and I can never be bored by him again.
@Policy of Madness
I read an article once, which I would love to cite forever and ever but cannot now find, that gave a history of IQ testing. Apparently at one point during the 50s iirc, test designers came up with a prototype IQ test that was going to be much better than the previous version at testing true intelligence, a great improvement based on the latest science, etc. Then during the testing stage, women scored on average 10 points higher than men, so they rubbished the whole thing because obvs that can’t be accurate. I so wish I could find that article again for anyone who wants to argue with me that IQ tests aren’t just a cover to say the group in power is the smartest group and therefore deserves to be in power.
@David Futrelle
I don’t know what ultra-portable means in this case, but System 76 is where I get my laptops. It’s because they run Linux natively with a smooth OS that I don’t have to bullshit around with, though. Could totally not be what you’re looking for.
@David, I love my Surface laptop as it’s super light & easy to take to and from work on the train. But I’ve no idea what specifics your friend is after, so that may well be a useless contribution, lol.
Re “all the homeless people are men” I know it’s howlingly wrong but I just have to point out that here in Australia one of the biggest (and fastest growing) groups of homeless is made up of women and children fleeing family violence… at the hands of men.
This doesn’t make sense linguistically.
Is this a reference to ‘crab bucket’ theory from STP? Has he seen it somewhere and thinks he understands it? Crab bucket appears in Unseen Academicals, and is a criticism of people who hold others back because they’re afraid of what might happen, what will the neighbours say? Everyone can be part of the crab bucket, it’s used to enforce social conventions, like misogyny or patriarchy.
It seems strange to me to jump straight to “debate” when you’re just getting to know someone. Debate is an adversarial dialogue which will have a “winner” and a “loser”, and the winner will often be the person who is most practised at dishonesty. It can be an enjoyable activity between consenting adults, but it’s not how most people would choose to learn about a potential partner.
Sarah Z on why debating sucks:
I love debates. But it’s hard to debate someone when their idea of a debate is them blathering on about conspiracy theories and refusing to listen to the person they’re talking to. It’s the “not even wrong” thing; I can’t debate you if nothing you say makes sense.
I suppose we don’t know for sure if this guy is engaging in wild rants and calling them “debates”, but his choice of topics (new world order?!) sure makes it seem that way.
Small talk, as tedious as it is sometimes, is necessary to form social bonds. Generally you don’t just jump into the deep end of “intellectually engaging topics” -pool with someone you just met. Yet I don’t have trouble understanding that a person like these don’t understand that. Their sole motivation behind their debating urge is to prove their superiority and gain reinforcement to their own ideas. Someone already mentioned pigeon and chess. The outcome for the likes of Snoopy_ESP would be about the same in any case: women don’t debate him –> they are stupid ignorant skanks; women do debate him –> they are stupid ignorant skanks with inferior spoon-fed arguments.
Messed up the link:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Not_even_wrong
@ Hyber,
Well said. No wonder the women he meets are backing away, scanning the crowd for their friends…
I was once invited to speak on a panel discussion, and an audience member had brought a sheaf of notes with him, full of counter-arguments…all, of course, without first hearing what we on the panel would be saying. It was like a real-life version of an internet troll: same bombast, same unwillingness to actually
readlisten to thearticlediscusion before diving in with ranty comments. And his oft-repeated line was about “having a debate”, too.So odd that this swine never seems to find pearls being cast before him.
First of all, it takes a particular sort of social tone-deafness to think that “scarcity of resources” is a great topic for a first date (unless they met on a prepper forum). I suspect he’s hoping to manipulate his dates into feeling hopeless and depressed and anxious to attach to an alpha male. When his date’s eyes glaze over and she attempts to steer the conversation back to less bleak topics, he’ll feel justified in his contempt. It’s not that he’s offputting, it’s that women don’t have the intellect to appreciate his worldview (in which women are to blame for the state of the world, but are also sheeple who need everything explained to them). Heads he wins, tails women lose.
On top of that, it takes a special sort of misogynistic solipsism to believe that woman are all a hivemind clustered around the same average basic personality, while men are all Unique Fascinating Risk-Taking Snowflakes.
Because guess what? The minute a woman has an opinion or argues back, he’ll shut her down, talk over her or (if he’s losing the debate) denigrate her femininity. Most women have learned it just isn’t worth discussing unconventional beliefs with reactionary men who are determined to win at all costs. It’s an exercise in frustration and futility. In some cases, it can even be physically dangerous.
”Women don’t take risks with debate” has the same energy as “Women just don’t seem to enjoy sex”.
Meanwhile, this guy only knows what the internet has told him (along with some book that instructed him to clean up his room).