Categories
MGTOW misogyny pedophiles oh sorry ephebophiles

MGTOW: “There are no real differences between a 16-year-old girl and a 30-year-old woman, other than the teenager being more attractive and less damaged”

Your typical MGTOW has a LOT of opinions about teenage girls

Over in the MGTOW subreddit, the regulars recently found themselves debating “Why do women hate when men get with younger *legal aged* chicks so much?” Naturally, the assorted commenters had a lot of very creepy opinions on the subject.

“Seriously, all I see nowadays is men being called predators for dating legal 18 year old girls,” complained the OP, a felllow calling himself outtacontroIl.

Women, simps, and the new generation practically bombard any post about a legal age gap and call the older party a predator. Teenagers are not children, they are adolescents.

He boasted about his own (alleged) experience with some of these “younger *legal age* chicks.”

I’m 31, live in the UK, age of consent is 16. Fucked and dated plenty 16, 17, 18 year old girls. They’re in their sexual and thoughtful prime.

Ew.

A woman my age is not. A woman my age also cannot be taught anything. Men are supposed to teach. I taught those those young women about being feminist indoctrination [sic], the natural roles of men and women, and liberal brainwashing. I gave them some sense of values. Much better than the “I don’t need no man!” 31 year old cat lady.

Only a tiny handful of the commenters had any problem with outtacontroIl dating girls around half his age. As far as the majority of the commenters saw it, the real problem is that older women are jealous of younger women and girls.

“Women hate younger women,” declared someone called MGTOWlF7xEtsJyj.

“[T]here is no way in the seven kingdoms a bitter FDS [Female Dating Strategy subreddit] hag can compete with a hot legal chick in her sexual and unbaggaged prime,” agreed External-Can-7839.

“[T]hose 30+ women blew their window to settle down with a good man who meets their strict standards,” argued MuchIndependence,

and now they’re left facing the reality that they either have to settle for a 30+ man who isn’t good enough to attract younger or a man who does but is older.

shaming is the last ditch effort to try and convince good men that we’re filthy antisocial predators if we date any younger and that of course would mean having to date women our own age.

“Older women know that they can’t compete with young women,” wrote Jaren01.

Also there is nothing worse to a woman than being shamed so they try to do the same thing to men.

Women have no real morals. Justice, fairness, honor, these are concepts that women can never truly understand. Women will say and do anything to gain an advantage in life, anything. They will lie about rape, they will murder their own children and they wont even think they did anything wrong because to a woman the greatest good is whatever is best for her.

Apparently complaining about predatory dating behavior is the moral equivalent of child murder.

So why do men date younger women anyway?

“Because we can,” sneered bjred78.

I never date anyone over 30. Wymin my age are all fat with crotch goblins. Like I told my 42 year old, obese single mother co-worker, I work out, I’m fit, healthy and have money. Why would I or anyone else in my position throw it away to settle with a land whale roastie?

I’ll stick to the 20 year old who buys me stuff and leaves me alone, all I have to do is fuck her once a week.

Others insisted that there weren’t any real differences in maturity between teen girls and adult women anyway, so the accusations of predatory dating were meaningless.

“Women never really mature past a certain stage,” 0signal0 contended.

What for? The are pampered by the world around them,

This is why there are no real differences between a 16-year-old girl and a 30-year-old woman, other than the teenager being more attractive and less damaged.

Others suggested that the maturity cutoff age for women was closer to 14 or 15.

“Women stop maturing mentally near the end of puberty,” argued Jarin01.

For a woman that is around 14 or 15 years old. They might gain more experience after that but they never really mature beyond the mentality of a teenager.

Women become easy to deal with when you realize that you are talking to a child.

In a followup comment he explained the “science” behind this argument.

A man’s brain is larger and has more grey matter. A woman’s brain is pretty much fully developed by the end of puberty, around 14-16. A man’s on the other hand is still developing until around 25.

No, the brains of men, women and nonbinary folks are all still developing until the age of 25.

It’s very difficult to find scientific studies about this because it wouldn’t be politically correct to say there are physical differences between men and women’s brains. If you Google it everything you find will just say that “kids” brains can take until they are 25 to fully develop. They are very careful to not mention any difference between if those kids are male or female.

But I have been able to find some papers that show that most of the brain development takes place during puberty so it would make sense that if girls start puberty earlier and finish earlier than boys that their brains would fully develop earlier too. So by the time her brain is fully developed she is still only about 14 or 15 years old. Which is exactly how most women act, like they are still 14 or 15 years old.

It’s all very scientific, you see, according to the prestigious Journal of Some Papers I Once Saw.

Follow me on Twitter.

Send tips to dfutrelle at gmail dot com.

We Hunted the Mammoth relies entirely on readers like you for its survival. If you appreciate our work, please send a few bucks our way! Thanks!

Subscribe
Notify of
guest

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

74 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
epronovost
epronovost
1 month ago

Today,

30 years old men who behave like boys and think only about their personnal pleasure say that adult women are just like teens and are immature selfish creatures that only think about themselves and sexual gratification because they have been pampered by society. Plus older women are gross because they have highg standards and responsabilities like children…

Is it me or ae MGTOW are so intensily projecting that at that point I think we need a stronger word for it like “solipsist angst” (hating yourself by hating others) or something like that.

Lainy
Lainy
1 month ago

I swear, MGTOW are just incels that don’t want to call themselves incels and their all pedophiles

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

all I see nowadays is men being called predators for dating legal 18 year old girls

Really? That’s all you see? That makes me very suspicious and confused.

I’m 31, live in the UK, age of consent is 16. Fucked and dated plenty 16, 17, 18 year old girls. They’re in their sexual and thoughtful prime.

Oh dear. I would imagine he’s making this up for bravado, but in the event that he’s telling the truth, that is supremely creepy. If a 31 year old man is exclusively dating teenage girls, I can guarantee that he’s taking advantage of them. There’s usually a reason men like this can’t get women their own age.

I taught those those young women about being feminist indoctrination [sic], the natural roles of men and women, and liberal brainwashing.

Ok, this guy is definitely an abuser taking advantage of teen girls. And this behavior is a consequence of the manosphere in the real world.

shaming is the last ditch effort to try and convince good men that we’re filthy antisocial predators if we date any younger and that of course would mean having to date women our own age.

Or you could, you know, go your own way and not date women. That’s probably best for you and the local ladies. Aren’t you supposed to be doing that anyway?

Women MGTOWs have no real morals. Justice, fairness, honor, these are concepts that women MGTOWs can never truly understand. Women MGTOWs will say and do anything to gain an advantage in life, anything.

Fixed that for you.

For a woman that is around 14 or 15 years old. They might gain more experience after that but they never really mature beyond the mentality of a teenager.

I can’t speak for anyone else, but I know that I’ve matured and changed significantly since I was 14 years old. I’d imagine the same is true for most people. I’d like to think I’ve improved since then.

A woman’s brain is pretty much fully developed by the end of puberty, around 14-16. A man’s on the other hand is still developing until around 25.

Wouldn’t this imply that women are more mature than men and should be trusted younger or given more advanced instruction? There’s no misandrist quite like a misogynist.

They are very careful to not mention any difference between if those kids are male or female.

But who could be doing this? An evil feminist conspiracy?

But I have been able to find some papers that show that most of the brain development takes place during puberty so it would make sense that if girls start puberty earlier and finish earlier than boys that their brains would fully develop earlier too.

Were these papers published in the Journal of Your Asshole?

FDS [Female Dating Strategy subreddit] hag

It’s interesting he mentions FDS. For those who don’t know, it’s basically The Red Pill/Pick Up Artist stuff, but repurposed for women to use to get dates. As a result, it’s heavily based on stereotypes of men and women and they have a lot in common with red pillers. It also had a lot of overlap in users with r/GenderCritical before that one was banned, which gives a sense of the kinds of people who used it. Presumably red pillers don’t like it because they don’t like having a taste of their own medicine.

@epronovost

Is it me or ae MGTOW are so intensily projecting that at that point I think we need a stronger word for it like “solipsist angst” (hating yourself by hating others) or something like that.

There’s definitely a ton of projection to unravel. I’m not sure if we need a new term, though, I think “projection” covers it still.

Last edited 1 month ago by Naglfar
Kay
Kay
1 month ago

So, if dating girls half his age was so great, why and how did these relationships end?

Katherine the Adequate
Katherine the Adequate
1 month ago

I know for sure my brain has developed a lot since I was 14 or 15. Of course, I’m an invisible person to miggiez like this (hooray for that). I’m comfortably middle-aged. And despite this mig’s huge confidence in his research, “I saw a paper once” doesn’t cut it as a source to prove a point. The fact he can’t find anything to prove his assertion about cis female brains doesn’t make him look good, either.

Chris Oakley
Chris Oakley
1 month ago

I’m 31, live in the UK

No wonder Parliament opens its sessions with “God Save The Queen”.

A woman my age also cannot be taught anything.

I can think of at least two dozen women well past this guy’s age who are far more capable of learning than he is. His education seems to have stopped roughly around the age of 13.

“Seriously, all I see nowadays is men being called predators for dating legal 18 year old girls,” complained the OP, a felllow calling himself outtacontroIl.

Well, he certainly picked the perfect user ID. He is, indeed, outta control.

Women have no real morals. Justice, fairness, honor, these are concepts that women can never truly understand.

This from a guy who’s promoting what amounts to child rape.

Knitting Cat Lady
Knitting Cat Lady
1 month ago

MGTOWs are projecting so hart we could use them for lighthouses.

When I was ~14 I was in the middle of a depressive episode and didn’t care about anything.

I’m pretty sure the MGTOW definition of ‘obese’ is actually ‘not underweight’.

And the real reason those asshats (hope fully claim to) only date teens?

Adult women can see through their bullshit and can tell that they are shit in bed and aren’t as easily manipulated.

mouse sparrow
mouse sparrow
1 month ago

1. Age of consent is about minors being able to consent with other minors, not adults.
2. You go for young girls because they’re easier to manipulate to your liking.
3. The reason those “science papers” aren’t coming up in search results is because it’s either not peer reviewed facts or it’s what science USED to believe before they did more research and figured out they were wrong.

Last edited 1 month ago by mouse sparrow
Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
1 month ago

I’m 31, live in the UK, age of consent is 16. Fucked and dated plenty 16, 17, 18 year old girls.

Okay, outtacontroll, you’re living up to your nym.

They’re in their sexual and thoughtful prime.

A guy named outtacontroll obviously needs to bed women in their sexual prime. But thoughtful prime — that’s a thing? And that’s what you looking for?

A woman my age is not. A woman my age also cannot be taught anything.

What happened to their thoughtfulness? And now they can’t even be taught anything? (By you, presumably?) Is this some kind of Alzheimer’s that strikes women in their twenties?

Men are supposed to teach.

Says who? Teach what? To whom?

I taught those those young women about being feminist indoctrination [sic], the natural roles of men and women, and liberal brainwashing.

So the natural role of a man is to have sex with a cast of young women — certainly not women his own age — and the natural role of a young woman is to accommodate his wishes. Also, the role of a man is to teach teenage girls that they are second-rate people who need to make liberals cry and stuff.

I gave them some sense of values.

Those values being that men need sex from many, many much younger women. And that men need young women to take them seriously when the men pontificate about things alt-right.

Much better than the “I don’t need no man!” 31 year old cat lady.

I guess if that 31-year-old cat lady does need a man she’s out of luck, because she’s way too old for you.

Lukas Xavier
Lukas Xavier
1 month ago

They’re in their sexual and thoughtful prime. A woman my age is not. A woman my age also cannot be taught anything

Translation: Once they reach thirty, they’re wise to all my tricks and I can’t bullshit them anymore. They start having /shudder/ opinions of their own!

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
1 month ago

This seems like the crowd who chants ‘I’m not a pedophile, it’s called an ephebophile!’ as if that is a defense.

Gross.

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
1 month ago

They can’t cope with the fact that to most 15-year-olds, a 30-year-old is not so much sophisticated-worldly-suave as eeew-gross-ancient-yeucchh.

Which is of course why they target the most vulnerable and insecure teenagers, who have been taught to doubt their own judgement or that their own needs don’t matter.

Last edited 1 month ago by opposablethumbs
Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
1 month ago

Main difference between a 16 year old and a 30 year old is a 16 year old often has a very, very pissed off and violent father around somewhere.

Yeah, one of these scum tried it on with number 5 when she were 15 and he were in his 20s. It didn’t end well.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 month ago

They might gain more experience after that but they never really mature beyond the mentality of a teenager.

Wait, if teenage girls stop maturing at 14-15 and are malleable and teachable, wouldn’t they be exactly the same at 31, with brains that are still malleable and teachable? If they don’t mature, how do they transform into self-assured women who no longer put up with bullsh…er, “bitter cat ladies who don’t need no man”? What exactly is the difference between ”gaining more experience” and maturing?

Speaking of which, nothing says maturity like referring to kids as “crotch goblins”. You can just feel the wisdom and gravitas radiating from these old souls.

@Naglfar

There’s definitely a ton of projection to unravel. I’m not sure if we need a new term, though, I think “projection” covers it still.

”Projectile” comes to mind.

Last edited 1 month ago by Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

@Buttercup

nothing says maturity like referring to kids as “crotch goblins”.

Nothing says maturity like MGTOW in general. It’s all stomping one’s feet, blathering about how awful women are and how you’ll go your own way, and then never doing it. I really don’t think MGTOWs mature past the mindset of teenagers.

Lainy
Lainy
1 month ago

It always amaze me how MGTOW talk about how much they want to fuck kids that barely started puberty and then wonder why people get nervous about them talking about wanting to brain wash 12- 15 year old boys to be like them. Cause y’all already outed yourself as a pedophile that’s why mgtow.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 month ago

@Naglfar
At its core, MGTOW is arrested development. It’s perpetual 13 year olds shouting “You can’t make me clean up my room, Mom!” (or eat my vegetables, take my diarrhea medicine, whatever). Which is why I laugh heartily when they go on about self improvement. Anything that makes you a better person, they automatically reject as feminine.

@ Lainy
Yeah, there’s an eerie parallel in their wanting to groom young girls and recruit young boys. They’re trying so hard to normalize pedophilia.

sunnysombrera
sunnysombrera
1 month ago

I really don’t understand why MGTOWs think women are “pampered by society.”

Last edited 1 month ago by sunnysombrera
Lainy
Lainy
1 month ago

@buttercup
It’s always disturbing to think about.

Professor Fate
Professor Fate
1 month ago

“I’ll stick to the 20 year old who buys me stuff and leaves me alone, all I have to do is fuck her once a week.”

We totally believe you sir.

Viscaria, purveyor of briny slattern wine
Viscaria, purveyor of briny slattern wine
1 month ago

Why do women hate when men get with younger *legal aged* chicks so much

And then

Fucked and dated plenty 16, 17, 18 year old girls […] I taught those those young women about being feminist indoctrination [sic], the natural roles of men and women, and liberal brainwashing. I gave them some sense of values.

Hey, that’s neat how you answered your own question.

Also, hey, maybe the “adolescent girls’ brains are indistinguishable from adult women’s brains” dudes should chat with the “I deliberately target teenagers because they are easy to manipulate and women my age are not” dude who started the thread so they can get their stories straight.

Last edited 1 month ago by Viscaria, purveyor of briny slattern wine
Viscaria, purveyor of briny slattern wine
Viscaria, purveyor of briny slattern wine
1 month ago

It feels a bit hypocritical to talk about relationships with large age gaps without acknowledging my own relationship meets that definition. My husband is 14 years older than me, and we met when I was 22. I will just say that while I am glad I met someone kind and wonderful, I would caution any young woman against dating a man in his 30s since the majority of those men who are seeking out younger women are doing it for the same reason as outtacontroIl up there: because they want to be with someone easier to manipulate and control than a woman their own age. And while my husband is one of the best people I have ever met, I don’t know what would have happened if I had agreed to date him and then he ended up being a manipulator. Would I have been able to recognize warning signs and bail at 22, when I’d only had two prior adult relationships? I’m not sure I would have.

I could talk a lot more about some of the work we did to navigate the power differentials between us when we first started dating, but that’s long and boring, so I’ll just conclude by pointing out that my husband has the strongest case of babyface I’ve ever witnessed. He looked 8-10 years younger than his actual age when we met. If he didn’t, I would not have been interested. For all that manospherians believe that they age like fine wine, most 20-year-olds are not physically attracted to most 35-year-olds. It’s just not a thing.

Xoxo
Xoxo
1 month ago

It’s projection. They claim that women are jealous teen girls, but grown men made fun of teen idols like Justin Bieber and N Sync and called them gay. They also say that K Pop singers are effeminate and make fun of teen girls for liking them. They don’t understand that young girls don’t like middle-aged pickup artists. They like young, sensitive men! :p

Xoxo
Xoxo
1 month ago

Their theories are also disproven by many couples, including celebrities – Gerard Pique, Jason Momoa, Chris Hemsworth, Ryan Gosling, Hugh Jackman, Joe Manganiello, Sergio Ramos, Zlatan Ibrahimovic, and many other athletic, attractive, and rich men married older women and had even children with them when they could have gone for jail bait.

Lainy
Lainy
1 month ago

@Viscaria

tbh it can be really hard to determine someone’s age a lot of the time just by looking at them. There is a kid I work with at my second job at a restaurant who looks like he should be in his mid 20’s, he’s 17. Kid also been smoking like a chimney for the last 3 years so that might have something to do with that as well. My husband is 6 months younger then I am but he looks like he should be much older. like 25 at least, while I still get mistaken for a 16 year old a lot of the time.

There are also people out there that are just really bad at telling peoples ages. I have to friends that have been together for 10 years now. they met when they were 18 and 22, so the oldest is only 4 years older and they didn’t start dating until the youngest was 19. We have a running joke of calling the oldest a cradle robber. well they went to a bar a couple years ago and the guy looks at my friend Phil and goes ” what can I get you and your son”. The youngest also had a really bad baby face so I can give him that but I don’t think it’s that dramatic.

Some Chick
Some Chick
1 month ago

That’s a lot of words to say when women gain any awareness, they want nothing to do with that creature. Seriously, why in the world do these idiots think any woman would want any of their attentions? Also, they need to stop inflicting themselves on girls who are too young to understand they’re being manipulated.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

@Viscaria

For all that manospherians believe that they age like fine wine, most 20-year-olds are not physically attracted to most 35-year-olds.

I think that might be what caused Roosh to have his midlife crisis last year where he converted to Orthodox Christianity. He probably convinced himself that men aged like fine wine, then reality hit him that as he got older fewer young women wanted to sleep with him. This made him pivot to Christianity so he could keep the misogyny and keep the money flowing in.

I will say that some people do age better than others and there are older people I think are good looking, but they’re the exception and not the rule.

@Some Chick

Seriously, why in the world do these idiots think any woman would want any of their attentions?

I don’t think it’s that they think we want them, it’s that they think they’re entitled to us.

Last edited 1 month ago by Naglfar
Magnesium
Magnesium
1 month ago

Off topic, but I’m surprised no one I follow seems to be discussing the now ongoing trial of the Toronto incel van mass-murderer whose defence team is currently arguing he did it because he’s autistic because everything is terrible.

Hambeast
Hambeast
1 month ago

Women have no real morals. Justice, fairness, honor, these are concepts that women can never truly understand.

Sounds like someone’s looking to justify not wanting to treat people who identify as women like human beings or something.

Women will say and do anything to gain an advantage in life, anything. They will lie about rape, they will murder their own children and they wont even think they did anything wrong because to a woman the greatest good is whatever is best for her.

As we know, no man ever has done any of these things! Nope, not once. And this is definitely not projection on the part of Jaren01 or any of his cohort!!1!

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

@Magnesium
I saw that and posted about it in another thread. Personally I find it really frustrating because a) being autistic does not make you a murderer, b) the father’s argument that autistic people lack empathy or don’t understand consequences of actions is false, and c) this is only going to increase stigma against autistic people. I know I’m preaching to the choir, but I’m still so annoyed about the way the trial is going.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 month ago

@Naglfar
You’d think, if men really do age like fine wine and are surrounded by throngs of young women by age 40, that the majority of “how to attract women “ sites would be run by middle-aged men, not 20-something grifters. The usual life trajectory seems to go incel > MGTOW > white supremacy > Nazi QAnon uncle getting blocked on Facebook > elderly Fox watcher. I don’t see any George Clooney phase in there.

Kevin
Kevin
1 month ago

Outtacontrol is not , it seems, privy to the folk wisdom on this side of the Pond which holds that girls grow up faster in terms of developing responsible attitudes to life.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

@Buttercup

You’d think, if men really do age like fine wine and are surrounded by throngs of young women by age 40, that the majority of “how to attract women “ sites would be run by middle-aged men, not 20-something grifters.

One would also think that if this were the case, we’d see it in the way people interact in meatspace. Very few women have ever said to me, “I can’t wait to see how that guy will look at 50!”

The usual life trajectory seems to go incel > MGTOW > white supremacy > Nazi QAnon uncle getting blocked on Facebook > elderly Fox watcher.

And now the elderly Fox watchers are deserting Fox after they called the election for Biden and are turning to even more extreme right wing channels like OANN or Newsmax. This is obviously worrying for the future, but I can’t say I have much sympathy for Fox after they’ve lost their viewer base, they played a key role in making the cult of Trump and now it’s come back to bite them.

Some Chick
Some Chick
1 month ago

@Naglfar

I don’t think it’s that they think we want them, it’s that they think they’re entitled to us.

Good point. Still, you’d think something would occur to them the way they seem to think all adult women are going out of their way to be unattractive to them.

Big Titty Demon
Big Titty Demon
1 month ago

@Battering Lamb

This seems like the crowd who chants ‘I’m not a pedophile, it’s called an ephebophile!’ as if that is a defense.

I don’t understand this at all, to be honest. Why make this distinction? I am legitimately asking, because I know someone who makes this distinction. He is not a manospherian. He does not support ephebophilia, and in fact has been an expert witness that has put a pedophile—excuse me, ephebophile—in prison. He absolutely will acknowledge there is no difference mentally between a 12 year old that hasn’t got her period yet and an 11-and-a-half-year-old that has and has started to get boobs. But he still says that there is a distinction even though both sets of abusers should go straight to jail for the same amount of time. I don’t understand the purpose of making that distinction at all.

Crip Dyke
1 month ago

OT: Elliot Page, star of Juno & the Umbrella Academy, just came out as trans. Cool statement, too.

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/laurenstrapagiel/elliot-page-came-out-as-trans-and-celebs-are-tweeting?ref=bfnsplash

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

Also OT:
British courts made a ruling on Keira Bell’s case that means it will likely be harder if not impossible for trans children to access healthcare measures such as puberty blockers.

Re: Elliot Page
I am not familiar with that actor, but good for him.

Last edited 1 month ago by Naglfar
Aachen
Aachen
1 month ago

O, that doublethinking “women are fully developed at fifteen” yet somehow “frozen as fifteen-year-olds!”

Amazing to see such close-formation self-contradiction, if not particular surprising anymore.

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
1 month ago

@Big Titty Demon: Yeah, I’m not sure. I know a lot of self-identified internet libertarians rely on that distinction, probably because it isn’t as well known and doesn’t carry the same stigma as pedophile to deflect criticism of their creeping on younger girls.
@Crip Dyke: I was about to mention the same thing. Good for representation to have a fairly famous trans man come out. Super happy for him too.
@Naglfar: maybe this image helps: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0680983/mediaviewer/rm3600586497/

francis
francis
1 month ago

if we hated younger women we would be encouraging them to date you.

Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
1 month ago

Why make this distinction? I am legitimately asking, because I know someone who makes this distinction. He is not a manospherian. He does not support ephebophilia, and in fact has been an expert witness that has put a pedophile—excuse me, ephebophile—in prison.

Cops and shrinks need to make the distinction. Jailed pedophiles are capable of living a full life on release without re-offending (with a shedload of support, which they rarely get, but that’d be another tale). Ephebophiles generally are not.

The rest of us – we don’t particularly need to make the distinction, and I tend to look at anyone who does so with great suspicion.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
1 month ago

Viscaria wrote:

My husband is 14 years older than me, and we met when I was 22. I will just say that while I am glad I met someone kind and wonderful, I would caution any young woman against dating a man in his 30s since the majority of those men who are seeking out younger women are doing it for the same reason as outtacontroIl up there: because they want to be with someone easier to manipulate and control than a woman their own age.

Curiously, my sister and her ex-boyfriend were about exactly those same ages when they started dating – and she was studying in England, where he was a local.

After graduating from that English university, they tried living here in Finland, and eventually broke up, amicably, because it was too impractical for him – he had an ex-wife and minor children back in England. (And that was shortly before the UK filed divorce from the EU.)

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
1 month ago

I made the mistake of looking at the comments on Elliot Page’s twitter. There was the predictable TERFy nonsense I won’t go over because we’ve seen it all before, but I did see a funny incel comment where the guy was complaining about how now short guys have to compete not just with tall guys but trans guys too.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

@Threp

Ephebophiles generally are not.

Out of curiosity, why are ephebophiles more likely to re-offend? Is it because it’s harder for a person to avoid all contact with adolescents than with young children?

Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
1 month ago

@Naglfar

Sorry, I’m not sure. Only know about the relative re-offending thing because our old next door neighbour were a psych nurse down at Belmarsh prison and we’d have a beer or two from time to time.

Having said that, I do think opportunity is part of it, as is the complete social revulsion against actual pedophiles. Which is totally understandable.

Last edited 1 month ago by Threp (formerly Shadowplay)
.45
.45
1 month ago

Concerning the distinction thing amongst people who aren’t pedophiles, I wonder how much of that may just be nit picking Grammar Nazi behavor. I.E. so they can smugly inform you “Actually, I think you meant to say…” type thing. Never underestimate human arrogance and the desire to be “right”.

Goth chick
Goth chick
1 month ago

I’m 22 years old & I spend a hell of a lot of time with young girls. I genuinely don’t know a single girl dating a guy 30+.
Its so bizarre to me, how they will constantly cite ‘biology’ yet will ignore the plethora of biology that states time and time again that women find men roughly their own age most attractive. Therefore 18-21 year old girls are not attracted to them. Theyre attracted to 18-21 year old guys. Shock horror? Its not as if thats what you see 99% of the time in the real world. Its hilarious to me how they’ve deluded themselves so far they really think ‘young hot girls’ find THOSE old misogynistic dudes hot? like what???

Seth S
Seth S
1 month ago

@WWTH
I don’t think they need to worry. According to the most recent study I saw, conducted in 2018, 98.2% of straight cis women won’t date a trans man. But they’re in good company, as 88.5% of gay men won’t date a trans man either. And even 48% of trans people wouldn’t date another trans person (NBs were, unfortunately, excluded from the poll, it was binary genders only).

Yet we’re extremely popular as a fetish/one night stand novelty for cis folks. Joy.

I’ve actually been wondering if it’s even worth it, just because of that. Looking at those odds just makes me feel exhausted, and I haven’t even started trying to date yet.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 month ago

@Seth S

I’ve actually been wondering if it’s even worth it, just because of that. Looking at those odds just makes me feel exhausted, and I haven’t even started trying to date yet.

This is just my opinion, but I’d rather be dateless and less dysphoric/able to be out rather than having to keep up the façade of being a gender I’m not and dating people who would abandon me if they knew the truth. Of course, it all depends on how much you value different aspects of life. I have a pretty low sex drive and a lot of dysphoria, though, so I don’t feel the need to have sexual relationships as much and your situation may be different.

FWIW most of the trans men I know are in relationships, granted that’s a small sample but it’s definitely possible to have fulfilling relationships as a trans guy.

Seth S
Seth S
1 month ago

@Naglfar
I had a pretty strong and consistent sex drive even before I started my (microdosed, about halfway between cis male and cis female levels) testosterone, so it’s been, uh… interesting. That being said, my spouse I’m divorcing from hasn’t touched me that way in nearly 3 years and that’s not been helping matters. Quarantine has really driven home how estranged I’ve been and how little actual affection of any sort I get. And I’m the type of guy who REALLY APPRECIATES touch and words as love languages, not just sex. He wouldn’t give me any of it, because as I’ve been told, I don’t “deserve” it.

on a very related note, I’ve also got a lot of bad history because I have a habit of falling for people who are clearly not good for me if not just bad people, so I have a lot of worries and insecurities about whether I’ll ever find anyone who isn’t going to be abusive and manipulative too. That’s not helping, either.

Maybe I could go off testosterone once I’m passable, to give the sex drive a rest, but I still want companionship and family most of all (I would love to raise more kids with someone, even if I can’t sire them myself.) But taking away the T won’t do a thing for that.

It just feels really harsh to think about being rejected for something I can’t control, out of hand, when I’ve already spent most of my life feeling unlovable or like I had to earn what love I got, you know what I mean? I’ve never even been at a place where I had enough optimism about my transition to be like “yes this will absolutely make my life better 100%, can’t wait”. I look forward to it because HOPE it will, because I’ve never been happy. But my parents didn’t… accept things very well when I came out, and I’ve finally realized that they were the first to use withholding affection and attaching conditions as a control lever on me that’s wound up leaving me feeling so broken and unworthy of love. I can’t even be “out” with anyone else in the family yet, probably not for at least another 6 months, and I’m not optimistic about that either, so… I can’t even move any further with my transition, and… it just feels really bad and I want to stop feeling bad for just ONCE in my life because I’ve spent nearly 40 years at some point in this place of bad feels and I’m so tired. lol sorry for the b*tchfest.