By David Futrelle
Today’s insight into human sexuality comes from an anonymous MGTOW Redditor explaining why, in his opinion, women don’t deserve any help with that whole orgasm thing:
Ladies, I feel very confident in stating that this guy is SINGLE. Line forms to the right.
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This line of thinking is always going to turn out to be tightly wedded to homophobia, because it doesn’t have a choice. If you think the female orgasm is useless, what kind of an opinion are going to have about the orgasm of a gay man? The orgasm of a gay man doesn’t have any biological purpose either, if you happen to think ‘biological usefulness’ equals ‘kids’ — and people never argue in this vein unless they do think biological usefulness equals kids. (One does, however, come away with a understanding of why these guys think being able to abstain from masturbation amounts to a superpower: they live in a world in which the superior man is the one who refrains from biologically useless acts. Oh well. At least it’s an ethos. A super boring ethos, but an ethos.)
I am still confused as to why they think “making oneself dateable” is something that only applies to men? Have they never heard of single women / women who complain about not finding a man who wants to date them?
And why do they care about dating if they’re MGTOW? Begone already!
I’ll never understand the obsessive, burning rage these guys have at the very idea that someone, somewhere, might find sex enjoyable.
I’m not going to cover the practical purposes and effects of female orgasm again because we’ve already discussed them multiple times, but suffice to say that even if there was no purpose, things don’t have to serve an evolutionary purpose to be good. For example, I love listening to music, an act which probably doesn’t serve an evolutionary purpose, but it still is an enjoyable thing worth doing.
I can think of many more selfish and pointless things in the world. Like the whole manosphere circlejerk.
I often wonder what parallel universe MGTOWs live in, but it sounds like a good place to be.
@bekabot
Even though it doesn’t produce kids there does seem to be some level of biological usefulness to masturbation, as it boost the immune system and can reduce stress.
@impudentinfidel
I think it’s that they don’t have good sex (probably because they aren’t good at it and don’t care about their partners), so they are jealous that anyone else does like sex. It reminds me a bit about an episode a few weeks ago when some TERFs found out that some people enjoy anal sex, so they all jumped in to talk about how awful it is and how they are disgusted it exists (note the homophobia inherent in that sentiment as well). In other words, they got rather butthurt (pun intended) about other people’s sex lives.
Funny, I kind of think that incels are selfish and pointless as well!!
@Steph:
More to the point, what are the odds this guy bitches whenever he sees an “unfuckable” woman on the street? Unless he’s one of the variety who literally can’t see them.
As he clearly doesn’t have a sense of humor, meanwhile, his quest for a woman who can make him laugh seems doomed to failure.
@Rabid Rabbit
I’ll bet that he even blames his lack of humor on women, he’ll just say women aren’t funny.
Lack of a sense of humor seems common on the right, probably why there are very few right wing comedians who are actually funny, or why they keep telling the same joke over and over again.
The female orgasm has plenty of biological purpose. Reproductively, It opens up the cervix, and releases more lubrication, which gives the semen an easier path to the egg. Psychologically, it releases calming endorphins and brain chemicals that make one feel “in love” and bonded to their partner, even if that partner isn’t a good one. It’s ten kinds of sad and telling that this human doesn’t know even a whisper of this information.
I love how it hasn’t even occurred to him that sometimes when people date, they actually like each other and enjoy having conversations with another.
If the conversation is horrible and boring on every date you’ve either been in, either you’re a terrible conversationalist, or you’re not doing a very job at choosing who to date. In other words, the problem is probably you.
@Sarah
And I get the feeling that anyone who tried to tell them would be dismissed instantly, so they’ll never learn.
@WWTH
Well, they do seem pretty bad at finding the common denominator.
I think this is a consequence of the zero-sum world view: they think everything is to take advantage of someone else, so they can’t imagine a conversation (or, for that matter, sex) that both participants enjoy.
Everyone get your tiny violins out. Roosh has been booted from YouTube
https://twitter.com/nathanTbernard/status/1282834106515103745?s=20
What’s especially ironic is that this bitter nebbish is, like, three synapse firings away from actually figuring out that YES, A GRIMLY TRANSACTIONAL APPROACH TO DATING AND SEX IS COUNTERPRODUCTIVE AND NO FUN. Anybody who regards sex as their rightful “payment” for doing a bunch of stuff they don’t want to do and don’t enjoy doing is, surprise, not going to find the sex very enjoyable either.
And yes, this is a big part of why the transactional model of man-pays-and-woman-puts-out gender norms in dating is so toxic for everyone involved.
But he can’t quite manage to achieve that awareness, so he doubles down on the transactional approach by sulking that women are (supposedly) getting more out of the transaction than he is.
I actually would enjoy buying a man dinner, making him laugh, and then going home to have some nice sex together, but then, I lean toward domme. And I certainly wouldn’t be doing it with the likes of this guy (I may be an ugly old pervert but I still have standards; they’re just not visual).
@weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
If it makes him feel any better, YouTube isn’t in the Bible so God probably doesn’t approve of him using it anyway.
Oh hell no.
If the guy doesn’t like the traditional version of dating, then he can just… Not do that?
I mean, I do have some level of sympathy for a situation like this; it does suck to be part of a system that has unfair expectations pressing in on you from all directions, and when it comes to systemic problems it is almost never as easy as “well just say no and refuse to participate in society”.
However, in this case, I’m pretty sure the majority of women are fine with going dutch on dates, and dating is not the cakewalk for women that this dude thinks it is. And even if it was, yelling at women for wanting to have their sexual encounters be pleasurable isn’t going to fix anything, and just reveals the main motives that these guys always seem to have. They don’t want a more fair system, where women and men act like partners who actually enjoy spending time with each other. They want a “return” to an old mythical system where the man pays for dinner and in exchange gets to use the woman’s body to gratify himself however he likes.
It is telling how he assumes that there’s a system, where if he does everything right, he finally gets sex. It goes beyond the “friendzone” view of women where you put enough coins in and eventually you get sex: he sees women as a complicated video game, and thinks it’s unfair that the game is so complicated because you have to make the moves so precisely, and it never strikes him that it’s not that he’s missing the cheat codes, it’s not that he’s not quite as good a player as the next guy, it’s that it’s not a frigging game with a guaranteed “You get laid!” final screen if you just get through the levels properly.
I’m sure that he’s a firm believer in the proposition that male brains are inherently superior to female ones, but it always amazes me how people who believe that lack the cognitive ability to imagine that human interactions might not be reducible to a manual. Though now that I think of it, the fact they’re called manuals suddenly seems very appropriate.
@WWTH:
I love how it hasn’t even occurred to him that whoever he dates might also be pretending to give a shit about his pointless nonsense.
Uh, i lost tracks here. Who were the ones whose say that women do not orgasm ? Were they incels ? I fear i blend them all a bit in the end…
> weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
Fine ! Even if i am not sure he still had that many viewers. As David said, with his turn to god volteface, his audience was backing away at double time.
@WWTH
While they’re at it, can they ban Graham Linehan too? Ever since Twitter gave him the boot he’s been posting long unhinged diatribes and conversations multiple times a week.
@Catalpa
This is the problem, they want to solve problems caused by patriarchy with more patriarchy. I’m reminded of the adage “when all you have is a hammer everything looks like a nail,” as all they have is patriarchy and it’s the only lens through which they can see the world.
@Rabid Rabbit
This sort of view seems to be how we end up with pickup artists. They promise to teach men the cheat codes, but then the men end up resentful incels when the supposed “game” advice doesn’t work.
@occasional reader
I think it was incels, though it seems the manosphere as a whole is split on whether female orgasms exist but are “selfish and pointless”, or whether they don’t exist to begin with.
@WWTH:
Wow, youtube finally wiped.
Well, it’s too bad for all the women out there that the only way they can get an orgasm is if a man gives them one.
@Yutolia
I’m sure that if he doesn’t get rapt attention, he’ll think he’s been slighted somehow or that the date in question was too dumb for him, or both.
Not even just on dates. In general, women are socialized to put up with men to avoid male rage. In social and work spaces and in the media, men -especially the white cishet ones- hold court and expect an audience. And often get that audience. Women can scarcely go a day without receiving an unsolicited man opinion! And this guy’s mad that women usually talk on a date?
@WWTH
I think this is why a lot of men claim they’re being “silenced” when they get banned from some site or when people walk out of somewhere they are speaking. They seem to think freedom of speech means they’re also entitled to a captive audience.
The clarion call of oppressed men everywhere is “why won’t you debate me!?”