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MGTOW reddit sex sex workers

MGTOW: Sex work doesn’t count as real work because it “isn’t gonna repair a generator”

Unless you’re literally repairing this, you aren’t working

By David Futrelle

So the MGTOWs on Reddit are discussing the #SexWorkIsWork hashtag, and they have some, well, interesting takes on the subject.

One fellow uses the power of math and a lot of dubious assumptions to “prove” that if sex work is work, those doing the work should only be earning sixty cents per fuck.

I was wondering when ‘SexWorkIsWork’ and for this assumption to be true it should look like this:

1. Paying taxes

2. Minimum wage – The only requirement is legal age

3. Continuous work – with one short break in 8 hours

Example based on data from United States in 2019: 7,25 USD/h is minimum wage

The average intercourse time is little over 5min (date from google)

One hour has 60 minutes so: 60/5 = 12 number of intercourse per hour

7,25 USD / 12 = ~ 0.60 cents

So if ‘SexWorkIsRealWork’ – intercourse should cost 60 cents in such a rich country as USA

Yeah, that’s not how any of this works. Sex work involves a lot more than the literal act of intercourse, as I’m sure everyone but MGTOWs and other misogynists are aware. (Indeed, there are many varieties of sex work that involve no intercourse at all.)

Also, equally obviously, no one can fuck for eight hours. I mean, Jesus fucking Christ. I challenge this dude to peg himself with a dildo for even six hours and see how much he likes it.

But I do think this dude has accomplished a couple of things here. First, he inadvertently shows how shitty minimum wage jobs are, and why we need to immediately raise the minimum wage to $15/hour or more.

Second, he reveals how bad sex is for a lot of people. Five minutes? I hope the people bringing the average down are doing things other than intercourse as well.

Another MGTOW offers this bit of dubious wisdom:

Sex work isn’t gonna repair a generator.

Ah yes, because only mechanical work counts as real work, and everyone other than mechanics is doing fake work.

I can’t help but wonder how many MGTOWs could repair a generator, or even identify one in a room full of heavy machinery. Given how well they handle basic cooking, I can’t say I trust that any of them are very handy with their hands.

Then there’s this guy, who thinks that it’s the johns, not the sex workers, who are doing all the work.

If it’s real work, then it’s low value work. Unless she’s riding that cock like she’s riding a pissed off bison, the man, as always is doing the work. Paying a hooker too much so you do the bulk of the effort is like paying a plumber only so he can watch you unclog the toilet.

Yeah, a few desultory thrusts aren’t “work,” dude. And neither is sex work — or sex — very much like unclogging a toilet.

Well, to be fair, sex with a MGTOW would probably be equally disgusting, and there might be a similar sense of relief once it was done.

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Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

Fixing a generator might not take that long either; but there’s the old engineers’ adage “£1 for tapping with hammer; £99 for knowing where to tap it.”

Miri
Miri
4 years ago

Yeah, because whining and moaning about women on the internet is totally how everyone repairs generators.

Podkayne Lives
Podkayne Lives
4 years ago

Not only are they not having sex, I’m dubious now that any of them have jobs.

KindaSortaHarmless
KindaSortaHarmless
4 years ago

Complaining about women not wanting to be your slave ain’t gonna fix a generator either, so…

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

Some part of me is curious what SWERFs think of this argument.

I challenge this dude to peg himself with a dildo for even six hours and see how much he likes it.

Maybe we define pegging differently, but I thought it was the act of being penetrated by someone else with a strap-on. So how would he do it to himself? This is rather beside the point, but it stuck out to me.

intercourse should cost 60 cents in such a rich country as USA

I don’t think a lot of sex workers are having much physical intercourse right now, it seems a lot now are working remotely due to pandemic and using sites like OnlyFans.

I can’t help but wonder how many MGTOWs could repair a generator, or even identify one in a room full of heavy machinery. Given how well they handle basic cooking, I can’t say I trust that any of them are very handy with their hands.

I’ve never fixed a generator but I’ve fixed problems with my car engine before. I doubt many MGTOWs have. But anyway, TIL that most people I know aren’t working because their jobs don’t involve fixing generators.

the man, as always is doing the work.

And I can only imagine sex with this man is delightful.

And neither is sex work — or sex — very much like unclogging a toilet.

If your sex is like unclogging a toilet, you are doing one (or both) of those very wrong.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

These dudes always pretend to love the free market so much. By free market principles, if people are willing to pay hundreds of dollars per hour for sex worker’s services, then don’t sex workers have every right and reason to charge that much?

Tyko
Tyko
4 years ago

Do these dopes know how freelancing works?

Allandrel
Allandrel
4 years ago

I’m reminded of a post that made its way around social media a bit ago. It was a photo of a micrometer labeled “If you don’t know how to use this, you don’t deserve $15 an hour.”

I didn’t even know where to start with how wrong and awful that was.

Dalillama
Dalillama
4 years ago

I didn’t even know where to start with how wrong and awful that was.

Especially since these are usually the very same people who insist that people like Trump, Romney, and Bloomberg deserve their obscene wealth, despite the fact that none of them would know a micrometer if you hit them with one.

Crip Dyke
4 years ago

Notary service for a single signature can cost as much as CAN $40. At minimum it’s $20 up here, though it’s not always per signature. So if you’re doing a bunch of signatures in a collection of documents all at once, you might get $20 + a rate per sig or per hour. If you’re organized when you go in, it takes less than 15 minutes, easy, and probably less than 10 min, to get your group of documents done, even if its 6 or 10 signatures.

So… at a batch rate of $20 + $10/sig, with 10 sigs in 15 minutes, it’s 1.5 minutes per signature and $12/signature.

So assuming the sex worker is doing something for which training is required and doesn’t put too much effort into it, $36 for 4.5 minutes is apparently the going rate, which translates into $40 for 5 minutes.

Hm. That USD $0.60 is seeming a bit low just now.

CriticalDragon1177 (@CriticalDragon1)

Even if sex work isn’t “real work” whatever that means, how on Earth would that be an argument against it? One could make the case that being an actor or a singer, or a super star athlete is not “real work” but look how much we pay people in those professions. Yeah sure, we don’t need them to survive, but they’ve been an important part of almost every civilization that can think of.

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
4 years ago

I’m sure that when a MGTOW is the customer, sex work is horribly, painfully real work. A sex worker would have to contend with the MGTOW’s nonexistent civility, homicidal hatred of women, lack of hygiene, and cheapness. She’d probably be happy to escape with her life. It’s only later on that she’d worry about whether she’d picked up a disease from the hateful man with the unwashed ass who wanted to argue about the price of sex work.

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
4 years ago

Speaking of real work, a few weeks ago a troll was claiming that men were doing all the labor during this pandemic:


Women Are Keeping America Running

Garrett Schlichte

[A]ccording to a report from The New York Times, women are the people currently keeping the United States running, and not only that, they are on the front lines.

This doesn’t mean women’s work is suddenly valuable, it highlights the fact that it has always been, and that their work has long been the invisible infrastructure that allows society to function. According to the Times analysis, 1 in 3 jobs held by women has been deemed essential, and non-white women are more likely to hold these positions than anyone else. As written in the Times:

“Women make up nearly nine out of 10 nurses and nursing assistants, most respiratory therapists, a majority of pharmacists and an overwhelming majority of pharmacy aides and technicians. More than two-thirds of the workers at grocery store checkouts and fast food counters are women.”

In other words, the people who are allowing us to live a life as close to normal as possible right now, and those who are supporting and caring for the people in need, are more likely the be women than they are not to be.

https://jezebel.com/women-are-keeping-america-running-1842936043

jone (social justice cleric)
jone (social justice cleric)
4 years ago

Well I work as a sex worker AND an engineer…but it’s just too damn difficult to do both at the same time (not to mention the safety process violations! Wouldn’t I also need to wear a hard-hat on my ass…a hardass-hat?)

I’m sure some of the machine operators I’ve worked with would love to make it possible though, based on the occasional sexist comment.

And of the two jobs: the repair of big, sticky, oily, filthy machines is the easier, less potentially gross, and more entertaining one. (Men act like women can’t do the “hard jobs” because they don’t want us stealing all the fun work away from them. Truth).

heidi o'nuanain
heidi o'nuanain
4 years ago

It’s a challenge to keep remembering that a handful of women actually gave birth to these guys and that these guys are human, albeit deeply flawed.
clinging onto all that hatred, misogyny and desperately hoarded stupidity must be exhausting. How sad and tired they must constantly feel….*sigh*

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ Jone

Is that where the epithet ‘asshat’ comes from?

@ critical dragon

super star athlete is not “real work”

It used to be considered vulgar here for athletes to be paid. The Olympic spirit and all that. It’s why we have two types of rugby. There was quite a lot of politics involved. But it’s also one of the reasons rugby (union) is still seen as a ‘posh’ game and football has working class roots.

Same in cricket. Hence there used to be ‘Gentlemen vs Players’ games.

Masse_Mysteria
Masse_Mysteria
4 years ago

This reminds me of all the people who think office workers don’t work, because they visited an office once, and people were talking to each other. And all those who think that librarians just read all day at the library, because they’ve been to a library once and seen a librarian reading a book. If they’ve seen something with their own eyes, that has to be all there is to it.

I don’t know much about sex work, but since it’s a customer service job, I imagine some amount of being nice and presentable is involved, and that takes effort. But I suppose MGTOWs think that that’s something women just do, so they probably don’t realise it’s something you should be compensated for.

Sheila Crosby
4 years ago

I concluded some time ago that every single job is harder than it looks. Since then I’ve wondered whether being a professional bullshitter might be an exception, but not hairdressers, grocery clerks, street sweepers, TV presenters …

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
4 years ago

The average intercourse time is little over 5min (date from google)

The singular for data is not “date”.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

I never have unclogged a toilet. If it’s like consensual sex, then I actually look forward to it. If it’s like sex work, I guess I will sell my apartment and go somewhere else if the toilets are clogged.

rv97
rv97
4 years ago

I can name a woman by her handle who makes a six figure income and she does sex work part time – she isn’t even into men, too. These miggots simply want to make men look even more pathetic – I don’t know if I could say they’re envious of these women but I guess I’m tempted to entertain the notion.

As for men who are sex workers I imagine they’re a bit few and far between.

Amtep
Amtep
4 years ago

But but… sex workers aren’t minimum-wage employees. They’re small business owners, and therefore conservatives should worship them.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@CriticalDragon1177

One could make the case that being an actor or a singer, or a super star athlete is not “real work” but look how much we pay people in those professions.

And being a corrupt politician is definitely not “work” by this definition, but I feel like every MGTOW in America probably voted for Trump.

@Lumipuna

The singular for data is not “date”.

Nor is it “anecdote” (a mistake many manospherians seem to make).

@Amtep
Ah, but the small business is question isn’t one that repairs generators or does mining or construction, so it’s not “real work” to them.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

@Lumipuna:

The singular for data is not “date”.

Tell that to the redpillers who routinely extrapolate AWALT based on one (heavily fictionalized) “field report” encounter.

the man, as always is doing the work. Paying a hooker too much so you do the bulk of the effort is like paying a plumber only so he can watch you unclog the toilet.

This guy is confusing effort with service. In therapy, the patient does most of the talking and puts in the effort required to get better, but that doesn’t mean the therapist isn’t working.

If he thinks sex workers truly don’t provide any valuable services above and beyond, say, a sock, then why do people pay large sums of money to engage a real live human being?

for this assumption to be true it should look like this:

1. Paying taxes

2. Minimum wage – The only requirement is legal age

3. Continuous work – with one short break in 8 hours

“For this assumption that I disagree with to be true, then my own unrealistic assumptions also need to be true.”

1. A lot of “under the table” work doesn’t get taxed. A lot of billionaires pay little or no tax on income, and a much lower capital gains rate.

2. Any work that isn’t compensated at exactly minimum wage doesn’t count as work? That rules out about 90% of the workforce (in the US), including their beloved plumbers, miners, and generator repair technicians.

3. Continuous work – so now only illegal sweatshop conditions count as work? And most of those workers don’t pay taxes or make anywhere near minimum wage.

In conclusion, no one anywhere is actually doing any work. That still doesn’t prove his argument that sex work is fundamentally different from any other type of work.

@Kat – Anecdatally, the limited interactions I’ve had with essential workers during the pandemic (groceries, pharmacy, doctor’s office) have all been with women. Men are working alongside them too, of course, but after the experiences of the last few months, MGTOWs can’t keep pretending that men are 100% responsible for running society.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Buttercup

In therapy, the patient does most of the talking and puts in the effort required to get better, but that doesn’t mean the therapist isn’t working.

Maybe that’s another part of why incels are so opposed to therapy: they think it’s a waste of money because they think they’re the ones doing the work.

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