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coronavirus open thread

Social Distancing Open Thread

Get out the board games

Hope you’re all safe; hope you’re all washing your hands; hope you’re all hunkering down. Our federal government (here in the US at least) has failed in pretty much every way it’s possible to fail and to a large extent we have to rely on our state and local governments — and each other.

In some ways the most horrific thing I’ve learned in the last few days was this: Trump, who hits new lows as a president and as a human being on a daily basis, has been trying to basically buy a German firm working on a vaccine that he wants to be available exclusively in the US.

Here are some other articles I’ve found useful in making sense of all this. Some of them are disturbing, but we can’t successfully confront what we don’t understand.

The Quiet Terror of Coronavirus, by Talia Lavin, GQ

Cancel Everything, The Atlantic

Social Distancing: This is Not a Snow Day, Medium

These simulations show how to flatten the coronavirus growth curve, Washington Post

The Worst-Case Estimate for U.S. Coronavirus Deaths, NYT

Infected people without symptoms might be driving the spread of coronavirus more than we realized, CNN

Please post any other articles and resources you’ve found to be helpful.

–DF

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varalys the dark
4 years ago

Britain is setting a great example of how not to respond intelligently to the crisis. As a Brit, I’m kind of embarrassed.

Lukas Xavier
Lukas Xavier
4 years ago

@Naglfar
A little more hand washing couldn’t hurt, for sure.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

I don’t know what to make of HMG’s response to the virus.

On the one hand we’re doing things very differently from some other countries; but on the other, the response is being led by someone who’s supposed to be one of, if not the, world’s best epidemiologist.

This article I think captures both sides of the argument.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/16/social-distancing-coronavirus-stay-home-government

Moogue
Moogue
4 years ago

@Ohlmann

Glad you’re feeling better, and try to relax. I don’t care where you live, the odds are still that have another virus, and the odds still are that you did nothing more than give an old person an emotionally much needed visit. As they say, no reason to borrow trouble from tomorrow, and it’s still true that worrying won’t change anything. Even if this person did get COVID19, unless you went around spitting in people’s drinks, there’s no proof that you would be the one that infected them. It a contagious virus, but generally controlled by doing the things that you would normally be doing with people undergoing chemotherapy. Just stay home and chill now that you’re sick.

My mom died from a combination of end-stage COPD/Cancer, and was in such a state that even a normal cold could kill her. I have small kids that are certain to shed virus before they come down sick, but we still visited my mom, because she wanted us to. Sometimes, we came down sick after seeing her, but in the end life is risky, all you can do is to do the best you can. Remember this person chose to see you as well. 🙂

It is another reminder of why everyone needs to take precautions even if they don’t show symptoms of COVID19. At least some of these outbreaks were started by people who weren’t symptomatic at the time. (Boston Biogen conference I’m looking at you). And people are still shedding this virus even when they feel better. All we can do is do the best we can.

I live in the US, and all the schools in my state are closed for 3 weeks. I still have to work, so it looks like my elderly dad with sleep apnea is taking the small kids. 🙁 And I’m one of the lucky ones that has a father to help out.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

Day 1 of trying to work from home while teaching my kids at the Hogwarts Homeschool For Social Distancing. It’s going about as well as can be expected:

numerobis
numerobis
4 years ago

varalys the dark: Britain is probably screwing up royally.

But the the US asked it to hold its beer.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

Day 1 of trying to work from home while teaching at the Hogwarts Homeschool For Social Distancing. It’s going about as well as can be expected:

epitome of incomprehensibility

I think walking outside shouldn’t be a problem. Exercise is good for physical and mental health.

I took an hour-long walk down Parc Avenue yesterday; it was below zero but sunny. I smiled at friendly dogs but avoided touching them (ditto for humans).

It’s been a bit discouraging for me that everything’s getting canceled and the libraries are closed. Now that I’m over my cold, I did get to see my boyfriend and later a friend for an informal creative writing meetup, but everything that’s at a library or community centre or involves large gatherings is canceled, canceled, canceled.

Then again, things are OK for me. I’m worried about the city’s homelesss. They need places to eat and sleep and just go to the bathroom, and that will be harder with more public buildings closed.

Canada is handling this pretty well, I think: good precautions, not too many authoritarian vibes. But this is still a colonial state and it’s the poor/indigenous/immigrant people who fall through the cracks a lot of the time.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

Argh! There’s no rhyme or reason to why this site borks video links. ?

Anyway, it’s a bunch of piglets running around to Nikki Minaj.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

The local supermarket was completely out of TP on Friday, except for one box of tactical “Dude Wipes”. Not sure all the dudes are heeding the call.

And all the bananas were gone, which is baffling. They have a shelf life of about 2 days.

Moggie
Moggie
4 years ago

@Buttercup, maybe people are making banana bread? Or maybe the supermarket isn’t taking deliveries of bananas, so that they can use the truck space for toilet paper?

I love the idea that tactical dude wipes are so embarrassing that shoppers would rather go unwiped than buy them.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
4 years ago

moregeekthan:

I have a legit question. I see many folks advising people to stay indoors. Isn’t outdoors-but-uncrowded a good place to be? I assume many folks in urban areas can’t really get outdoors without being in a crowd, but many of us don’t have that issue. Or is there something about the spread of this disease that makes even alone outdoors unsafe?

I hear a lot of people (including one reputable expert in Germany) suggest that being outdoors and meeting friends outdoors is generally safe, compared to meeting in someone’s home or at a public indoor venue.

Some places have instituted curfews because otherwise people (in urban areas) would hang out in large groups on streets and in parks. I’m curious on how this applies in more rural areas.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Buttercup

except for one box of tactical “Dude Wipes”.

It’s funny that even the supposed target audience for those doesn’t want them. One wonders who bought them in the first place originally.
Well, I guess if you really need wipes…

And all the bananas were gone

Maybe people didn’t realize how short the shelf life is.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

@Lumipuna : there’s absolutely damning photos of Paris with packed parks. That is totally stupid, and the reason for basically martial law from wednesday on. (it’s not official, but dude, they aren’t moving the armored personal carriers for an impromtu exercices)

But there’s no problem in being alone in a park anymore than being alone at home. It’s just easier for logistic to be at home, most of the time.

@Alan Robertshaw : the baffling part is that there’s no certainty that herd immunity is achievable, *and* the heavy duty lockdown of Italy and other countries seem to be closer to something that slow down the progression enough for purpose. As is, the hospitals will probably just get clogged by all the 20-60y people who get the harder version of the diseases, because they are still very much at risk.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
4 years ago

Properly termed “state of emergency”, not martial law as I wrote above.

Now, my university seems to be shutting down all contact teaching. My own studies will be likely majorly disrupted. At least I didn’t have a social life.

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
4 years ago

https://www.islingtongazette.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-islington-to-set-up-covid-19-homeless-task-force-1-6558498

Apparently Islington is the first (hopefully first of many) in the UK to have a municipal covid19 initiative specifically targeted at homeless people. Checks for fever, handing out soap, wipes etc. and to help people get access to shelter (also calling “for all, or at least some of, the disused buildings in the capital to be opened up for homeless people to self-isolate in”).

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
4 years ago

@Anonymous, Naglfar

Honestly at this point I wonder if Trump will have a military coup on his hands.

Possibly. The military may be conservative as a whole, but a lot of them hate Trump with a passion. The fact that Trump has organized military parades purely for his own gratification really rubbed a lot of them the wrong way, and the way he pardoned the Navy Seal who had been stripped of his rank as well as a pair of Army officers facing war crimes charges means anybody who cares about military justice hates the way he’s overridden them.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Jenora Feuer
The real question with a military coup is what would happen after. Would there be a military dictatorship, and would they be worse than Trump?

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

@Lumipuna : I don’t refer to current state of emergency, but to the fact they will use the army to impose a curfew. Details in a few hours, but once again : when there’s APCs to impose the rules, I don’t call that simply an emergency.

While I guess it’s necessary on account of how stupid a number of people are, I also think it’s incredibly dangerous.

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
4 years ago

I occasionally wonder if THIS is going to be the thing that prompts somebody to trigger a 25th Amendment removal. If Trump gets sick (not necessarily from COVID-19, just sick), will the GOP leadership seize on it as an opportunity to remove Trump and work with Pence instead?

Also, as a citizen I’d REALLY like to see an honest exam of the POTUS, complete with lab work. None of this crap about how he’s the healthiest individual ever to sit in the Oval Office.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Victorious Parasol

will the GOP leadership seize on it as an opportunity to remove Trump and work with Pence instead?

I rather doubt it. Pence doesn’t have the charisma to win re-election, and any Republican who stands up to him will probably lose re-election as well because millions of people still love him. None of them would put national well-being above party and grow a spine.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
4 years ago

Ohlmann – Sorry, I was referring to Finland’s newly declared state of emergency. Sorry about your situation – I can scarcely imagine not being allowed to walk in the park.

Big Titty Demon
Big Titty Demon
4 years ago

Honestly at this point I wonder if Trump will have a military coup on his hands.

I doubt it. The shifting military posts are meant to make exactly such a thing difficult, and while I have found many officers seem to not favor Trump, many enlisted men (I do mean men here) seem to strongly favor him. Since there is also a strong animosity carried by enlisted men for officers, unless the officer is a mustang, I think a coup would be entirely too difficult to arrange.*

However, if there were an outlandish order from Trump to the military, I could see chaos ensuing as some units follow it and some don’t.

*Granted this is an informal poll with a relatively small sample size of people I happen to know. It’s also feasible that this is a regional military culture of enlisted/officer animosity, although I somewhat doubt it.

Simon
Simon
4 years ago

Show this piece to all the “oh it’s just like flu” wankers.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

@Big Titty Demon : also, and to be blunt : how likely it is that a military coup lead to an even worse regime ? While it do happen that the military revolt to install more democracy, that’s … not … the most common case.