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Coronavirus Open Thread

“We’re almost all better now.”

By David Futrelle

Fuck. This is all I can think about these days. It looks like it’s going to be bad. And this is the President’s response:

I”m linking to a bunch of articles I found useful; they’re (almost) all from reputable publications you’ve heard of, though I (as a complete non-expert on these things) can’t vouch for everything in them.

How to Prepare for the Coronavirus (NYT)

Preparing for Coronavirus to Strike the U.S. (Scientific America)

You’re Likely to Get the Coronavirus (The Atlantic)

One-page beginner’s guide to the Wuhan coronavirus (theprepared.com)

Trump’s flailing incompetence makes coronavirus even scarier (Vox)

Is It a Pandemic Yet? (NYT)

Trump Has Sabotaged America’s Coronavirus Response (Foreign Policy)

U.S. Health Workers Responding to Coronavirus Lacked Training and Protective Gear, Whistle-Blower Says (NYT)

Pence Will Control All Coronavirus Messaging From Health Officials (NYT)

Let’s Revisit Coronavirus Czar Mike Pence’s History on Public Health Initiatives (Slate)

Oh, and here’s a post that’s totally not helpful, but it’s revealing about the right-wing’s attempts to downplay the virus.

Overhyped Coronavirus Weaponized Against Trump (Rush Limbaugh)

DIscuss! Add links to articles you found helpful! And stop touching your face!

Send tips to dfutrelle at gmail dot com.

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numerobis
numerobis
4 years ago

I look forward to Pence, pale and sweating, announcing to the press that COVID-19 is under control.

It would fit with the rest of the administration modeling itself after Iran’s republican model.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Francis
I’m not really familiar with the group you mentioned, but I took a look at their website and it has a few red flags. The emphasis on being “alpha” is problematic because humans don’t really have alpha and beta males, and this is usually used to justify toxic masculinity and other asshole behavior (“I’m not an asshole, I’m an alpha!”). So I’m a bit suspicious of the group from that. Sorry I don’t know more.

@mothkiller

I actually think that there are way more undocumented cases. From everything I’ve read that is reliable, Covid-19 in 80% of cases is not severe. And I am pretty sure that there are a lot of people that got so little symptoms or were asymptomatic that we are going to find out that that mortality rate is much lower, but that it’s already spread well outside the containment areas.

I agree that there probably are many people who don’t realize they have it or think it’s just a bad cold. I’ve seen predictions that it’s likely that it will be a seasonal thing like the flu in the future where it happens each winter. That’s not ideal, but I doubt it will be the pandemic to end all pandemics that some predict it will be.

Ucalegont
Ucalegont
4 years ago

Anna, what a brutal thing to say.

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
4 years ago

I was supposed to go to Emerald City Comic Con in a couple of weeks. I’m weighing my options. We’ve had our first “community transmission” case in Washington State and two high schools north of me are closed for deep cleaning.

Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
4 years ago

So it will clear society of those who use up resources but not contribute to economic developement.

Fuck. Off.

The libertarian convention is down the hall and off the cliff, if you hurry you can still make it.

Cats In Shiny Hats
Cats In Shiny Hats
4 years ago

@Anna

How absolutely awful of you. Heartless and evil. The elderly are still people and you can’t separate people into “worthwhile” and “worthless”. It’s never a question of who deserves to live, the answer is always “everyone, regardless of race, age, gender, etc”.

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
4 years ago

Anna, I really hope you were just modeling the Trump administration’s thinking for the purposes of sarcasm. You did start off with “if we completely throw away the humanitarian aspect,” but even with that, it’s still not “logical” to say that a pandemic will reduce the surplus population. It’s not like viruses assess your worthiness before deciding to take up residence in your body. That’s the kind of crap we heard during the Reagan administration, and look where it got us.

Yutolia the Laissez-Fairy Pronoun Boner
Yutolia the Laissez-Fairy Pronoun Boner
4 years ago

@Anna:

So it will clear society of those who use up resources but not contribute to economic developement.

Yeah, because making rich people richer is the only important thing and truly the only reason any of us are alive.

*eye roll

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

@Anna : while the morale aspect have been dealt with by wittier people than me, I will also remind you that humans developed longevity because of the added values of grandparents for education, lore sharing and all.

In addition to that, older peoples currently are important economic group because they have more spare time (and sometime money), so they spend and/or use service mores.

Saying they contribute nothing is spectaculary wrong, even in a pure utilitarian viewpoint. You know you fucked up when what you say is senseless gibberish even when framed with your supposed ideology.

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

@Alan
You realize you’re spreading racist propaganda, right? Chinese people are currently in danger in my country because of the bullshit you’re spreading. Stop.

Edit:
@Hippodameia
Oh hey, you’re in WA, too? *waves* I don’t usually go to ECCC, but maybe we’ll run into each other at GGC sometime!

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Anna
Others have pointed this out already, but even if that was a joke it has some real splash damage that you are suggesting elderly people should just die. For one, many elderly people do still work, and many who don’t work do still provide services for the community. And even if they didn’t, people have value as people and shouldn’t have to die of coronavirus just because you deem them lesser.

@Victorious Parasol

it’s still not “logical” to say that a pandemic will reduce the surplus population.

It’s not logical, it’s just horrible.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

In addition, the virus isn’t an anti-elderly bomb. It certainly kill weakened patients first, but that don’t mean only elderly. In fact, since it don’t seem to kill much of the infants, it might be similar to the Spanish Flu of 1918, the one that killed mostly middle aged people. (the fact they were weakened by the war helped, of course, but it tended to be less lethal to elderly and youngers)

@kupo : it’s not racist propaganda to remind that thoses markets are extremely unsanitary, which the article did. And it’s not something you see in every continent either. The concept that without thoses we would not have zoonotic disease is flawed, and perhaps partly racist in origin, but most of the article is sound.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ kupo

How am I? That does seem to be the source for this particular virus.

But as I pointed out, it’s a global thing. We exploit animals and the eco system and we pay the price. Whether that’s fires or floods caused by intensive farming, or diseases like BSE. It’s a human issue and we’re all to blame.

As for racism, I find it ironic that so many supposed progressives will criticise the eating of certain animals whilst happily eating others. Even this site has used puppy eating as a negative. But of course that’s just a matter of the culture you’re brought up in.

I know me constantly bringing animal rights up bugs you; and a lot of people; but you insist on calling out harmful behaviour when you see it, so please allow me the same courtesy.

Moggie
Moggie
4 years ago

Well, if we completely throw away the humanitarian aspect it’s only logical to kill and eat Anna.

If I were completely heartless, and got to decide who should die based on how much they “contribute” to society, I suspect my list would differ a lot from that made by a conservative. But I find it hard to imagine thinking that way.

Kate
Kate
4 years ago

Over and over I’ve been seeing a couple claims about Covid-19 that frustrate me to no end. I may think of more later. The solipsism that infects internet commentators appears to have no end.

1.) “The flu kills more people! Why aren’t you worried about the flu?”

I am worried about the flu. That’s why I get vaccinated. At best we may be about a year out for a Covid-19 vaccine, so vulnerable populations are completely at the mercy of this virus. Furthermore, the flu only kills about (on average) 0.1% of the people who get it. Covid-19 is currently killing about 2% (percentage may change with future information). If we see the same number of people catch Covid-19 as seasonal influenza, and that mortality rate is accurate, we can expect to see between 180,000 and 900,000 deaths in the US alone.

2.) “If you’re a healthy young adult, you’ve nothing to worry about. It’s probably just going to be like a bad cold.”

I’m not worried for me. I’m worried for my parents, my grandparents, my friends. I’m worried for the people in the community I don’t know personally, but who have lives just as valuable and vibrant as mine.

I’ll get down off the soapbox now. I need the soap for washing my hands again.

Naglfar
Naglfar
4 years ago

@Moggie

But I find it hard to imagine thinking that way.

That’s probably a good thing. If you find yourself thinking that way it’s a sign that you a going down a very wrong path.

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

I know me constantly bringing animal rights up bugs you; and a lot of people; but you insist on calling out harmful behaviour when you see it, so please allow me the same courtesy.

That’s what I’m doing right now. The idea that Chinese people eat tainted meat and that has caused this outbreak is racist af and I’m calling you out on it. And your vegan shit is typically calling out non-harmful behavior you have a personal problem with (i.e. joking about eggs being delicious) and you’ve been specifically told to stop it.

Moggie
Moggie
4 years ago

Holy crap:

https://twitter.com/MuseWendi/status/1233754436729700352

That’s a CNN chyron asking “can either coronavirus or Bernie Sanders be stopped?”

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ kupo

Eating eggs is far from non harmful; certainly for the animals at least. And I find it surprising that you of all people would use “it’s just a joke” to defend problematic behaviour.

And I feel compelled to point out that your insistence on meat-eating directly contributes to the genocide of indigenous people in the Amazon; so let’s not be hypocritical here.

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/08/23/americas/brazil-beef-amazon-rainforest-fire-intl/index.html

Also, 85% of starving and malnourished children live in countries that export food for animal fodder; so your burger has a real cost.

https://www.elephantjournal.com/2017/04/why-eating-meat-is-making-the-rich-sick-keeping-poor-people-hungry/

I find it ironic that people use the same justifications for animal abuse as the people this site so often mocks: “It’s nature”; “We’ve always done it”; “It’s just scientific fact”.

And of course the usual criticisms of vegans are “You’re too preachy”; “It’s just virtue signalling”.

So I think a big reason bringing up animal rights makes people uncomfortable is that it illustrates that they use a lot of the same excuses as the people they ostensibly criticise.

I’m certainly not just blaming wet markets though. As the UN point out; diseases caused by livestock farming is a global issue.

http://www.fao.org/news/story/en/item/210621/icode/

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
4 years ago

Alan

Whilst I can have some sympathy for some victims of the virus,

Then why don’t you go through a list of all the dead and tell us who we are and aren’t allowed to feel sympathy for? Really.

Anna thinks the elderly should die. Who do you think should die?

Tell us who deserves it.

Or just fuck off.

francis
francis
4 years ago

@naglfar

thank you for your reply

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

@Alan

You know I have a chronic illness and that I get sicker when I try to cut out meat. Guess I’m one of the acceptable losses.

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
4 years ago

Kupo,

Yup – home of the no-longer world-famous Aroma.

Well, Washington state had the first case of coronavirus in the US, and now we’ve had the first death:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/coronavirus-live-updates-4-unrelated-133448422.html

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

@Hippodameia
I’m in Redmond and it’s not at all alarming that a Microsoft vendor cane down with it, since Microsoft surely offers their contract employees excellent health plans, right? Lolsob.