Categories
#gamergate alt-right doxing entitled babies hypocrisy irony alert men who should not ever be with women ever misandry misogyny MRA racism reddit soyboys the c-word white supremacy

Men’s Rights Redditors are aghast that their subreddit has been declared “controversial” by Wikipedia, blame it on “cunts” and “soyboys”

Always mad about something, usually women

By David Futrelle

Men’s Rights Redditors are getting their boxer briefs in a twist over news that Wikipedia is now including the Men’s Rights subreddit on their list of “controversial Reddit communities” alongside such names as r/TheRedPill and the toxic pro-Trump subreddit The_Donald.

“Why the fuck is a site like Wikipedia so against us?” a Men’s Rights Redditor called youhavebeenwobbled asks plaintively.

We contain no hate speech or “misogyny,” so why are we painted so poorly in the public eye?

In fact, Wikipedia includes considerable evidence to back up the charge that r/Men’s Rights is controversial, citing in particular the time that the subreddit mods encouraged subreddit readers to dox a random woman they’d mixed up with a troll posting inflammatory material, and the time that Men’s Rights Redditors, in league with 4chan, decided to spam an Occidental College rape reporting website with some 400 false accusations to render the site useless and make some point about false accusations or something.

And anyone who doubts that the Men’s Rights subreddit is lousy with misogyny is invited to scroll their way through the We Hunted the Mammoth archives for countless examples.

Or you could simply look through the r/MensRights thread devoted to this particular controversy itself, filled as it is with denunciations of feminist “cunts,” defenses of the maliciously antifeminist and anti-woman harassment campaign known as GamerGate, and at least one (sarcastic, I hope) call for women to lose the right to vote. Oh, and for some reason there’s also an extended discussion of “white pride” and why it’s not a bad thing, really, if you think about it.

“THE major reason why this sub will never be treated fairly is that feminism seems to be inherently opposed to the idea of men having rights,” complains one MR Redditor called Peter_Principle_.

Feminists attacked an MRA meeting (angry protests, fire alarm pulls, etc.) that was purely about men as survivors of rape. Despicable hatred made real. Feminists are to MRAs as Klan members are to African Americans. You could wave a magic wand and entirely eradicate from current and former existence whatever male (ostensibly) sexist movements you would care to, and the feminists would still hate MRAs and call the movement a hate movemen. The fundamental idea of feminism is that women are universal victims. The MRA as a movement contradicts this ideology, and so it will be attacked by whatever means necessary. 

None of that is true, but you go on.

“Wikipedia appointed a board of feminists for curating their pages so as to bring pro women face to wikipedia articles,” asserts perplexedm.

They should’ve opted for a neutral role, but women appeasement identity politics is part of many technical divisions these days.

Now, you see the result.

Youhavebeenwobbled puts his complaint a bit more succinctly: “wiki is full of non free speech soyboys”

And then there are the white prideites.

“If women can have pride … And wear a shirt… men should have pride and get to wear a shirt without any blowback,” says TommySawyer. “Same with black pride and white pride.”

“[W]hite people should be allowed to be proud of their race the same EVERY SINGLE OTHER RACE is,” kahuna55555 declares. “White pride isn’t white supremacy.”

Alas, meanpride adds,

Being proud of your white skin is viewed “negatively” by some, the same way being proud of your masculinity is.

Truly amazing that anyone would consider this subreddit “controversial,” huh?

Send tips to dfutrelle at gmail dot com.

We Hunted the Mammoth relies entirely on readers like you for its survival. If you appreciate our work, please send a few bucks our way! Thanks!

Subscribe
Notify of
guest

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

49 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Patty Thinkerer
8 months ago

Weren’t MRAs declared a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center a while back, or was that a different group?

Fishy Goat
Fishy Goat
8 months ago

Feminists are to MRAs as Klan members are to African Americans.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!!

*looks around for corpses of MRA’s hanging from trees*

Nope.

*looks around for MRA’s only drinking fountains/library sections/restaurants/etc.*

Nope.

*looks around for MRA’s disproportionately represented in the prison system*

Nope.

*looks around for roving carloads of Feminists looking to beat up some MRA’s ass*

Nope, nope aaaaaand nope.

*etc. ad nauseum*

ColeYote
ColeYote
8 months ago

Frankly, “controversial” is one of the nicest things Wikipedia could’ve called them.

Bina
8 months ago

We contain no hate speech or “misogyny,” so why are we painted so poorly in the public eye?

Well, gee, you’re holding the very brushes you tarred yourselves with, so it was kind of a foregone conclusion:

Feminists are to MRAs as Klan members are to African Americans.

Nope-nope-nope, no misogyny there! Nosirree…

women appeasement identity politics is part of many technical divisions these days.

None there, either…

“wiki is full of non free speech soyboys”

And no phytoestrogenic misogynous dog-whistles there, either…

Being proud of your white skin is viewed “negatively” by some, the same way being proud of your masculinity is.

And certainly no racist or sexist dog-whistling going on there, either.

I’m not hearing anything, but all the dogs on my block just went berserk.

Mabret the Virile Maiden
Mabret the Virile Maiden
8 months ago

*looks around for MRA’s disproportionately represented in the prison system*

Nope.

This is worrying, given they’re disciples of Paul “Bash a Violent Bitch Month” Elam…

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
8 months ago

Feminists are to MRAs as Klan members are to African Americans

They’re forever comparing their paper cuts to someone else’s broken leg. To an MRA, mild pushback on their opinions is indistinguishable from terrorism.

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
8 months ago

Yeah, I guess they’re a controversial group. The controversy is between those who hate women (MRAs and their ilk) and those who don’t.

rv97
rv97
8 months ago

Well, good. We don’t need to go back 50 years in women’s rights or further, ever.

Talonknife
Talonknife
8 months ago

@Fishy Goat

The idea of a group of feminists gathering in the middle of the night to burn a cross on an MRA’s lawn is absolutely sending me.

Ginger
Ginger
8 months ago

I’ve heard several individual misogynists seriously promote disenfranchisement of women. That’s when the trouble started, they say, when women got the vote.

So yes, these bigots want to ban women from voting. They are not at all sarcastic.

Amtep
Amtep
8 months ago

If you have to write long screeds defending your noncontroversiality, doesn’t that make you controversial by definition?

Naglfar
Naglfar
8 months ago

Frankly, I’m surprised it took them this long to make the list.

Feminists attacked an MRA meeting (angry protests, fire alarm pulls, etc.)

[citation needed]

You could wave a magic wand and entirely eradicate from current and former existence whatever male (ostensibly) sexist movements you would care to

Where can I find this wand that eradicates sexism?

“If women can have pride … And wear a shirt… men should have pride and get to wear a shirt without any blowback,” says TommySawyer. “Same with black pride and white pride.”

I’ve never seen anyone referring to “woman pride,” so I’m guessing he’s referring to LGBTQIPA+ pride and women in that group. I’m surprised none of them have brought up straight pride, that seems to be a favorite of the alt-right.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
8 months ago

@ Talonknife:

gathering in the middle of the night to burn a cross on an MRA’s lawn

gathering in the middle of the night to burn a giant penis on an MRA’s lawn

Fixed that for you…

@ Naglfar:

Feminists attacked an MRA meeting (angry protests, fire alarm pulls, etc.)

[citation needed]

I was hoping someone had this example, I’d like to see it.

“white, conservative, male, cis, het, xian” is considered the default condition — EVERYTHING is measured in terms of how it affects the default. You don’t get to talk about “women’s rights”, you get to discuss “white, conservative, male, cis, het, xian’s and women’s rights.” You don’t get to discuss “black lives matter”, you get to discuss “white, conservative, male, cis, het, xian and black lives matter”

Catalpa
Catalpa
8 months ago

I find it a little disturbing that instead of going “what the hell, we shouldn’t have misogyny and threats on our forum, let’s fix that”, the response is instead “the feminists are the ones who are bigoted and violent and therefore anything we do to them is justified, in self defense you see“.

I mean, I do know it’s standard operating procedure for these types, but generally the level of violence that this tactic accuses the other side of is approximately the level of violence that they wish to justify for themselves, and feminists are being equated with a group that committed large numbers of murders.

Naglfar
Naglfar
8 months ago

@Weird Eddie

You don’t get to discuss “black lives matter”, you get to discuss “white, conservative, male, cis, het, xian and black lives matter”

Or if they’re feeling extra charitable, you get to discuss the shorter synonym for “white, conservative, male, cis, het, xian and black lives matter”: “all lives matter.”
Which BTW Pete Buttigieg has said on multiple occasions, just in case people weren’t convinced he’s racist.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
8 months ago

re: All Lives Matter;

The default pushback against any discussion of racist policing…

OF COURSE ALL LIVES MATTER… the point is, SOME lives are being devalued by the techniques police use, and the manner in which they are trained to use these techniques. That’s called “organizational racism”

Fishy Goat
Fishy Goat
7 months ago

@Weird Eddie

gathering in the middle of the night to burn a giant penis on an MRA’s lawn

Fixed that for you…

Don’t you dare make me laugh out loud at work! 😀

CarrieV
CarrieV
7 months ago

“Wikipedia appointed a board of feminists”

DID THEY??? Because last *I* heard, Wikipedia banned many women — particularly feminists — from editing or updating Wiki pages. They didn’t like how the womz were calling ‘rape’ ‘rape’ in a film as opposed to calling it ‘hot sex’, if I recall correctly.

But if Wikipedia has truly changed its ways and is now permitting, nay, ENCOURAGING feminists to participate, then I may just start popping back over to Wikipedia again.

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@CarrieV

DID THEY??? Because last *I* heard, Wikipedia banned many women — particularly feminists — from editing or updating Wiki pages. They didn’t like how the womz were calling ‘rape’ ‘rape’ in a film as opposed to calling it ‘hot sex’, if I recall correctly.

They did that? I knew Facebook banned a bunch of feminist groups for similar, but I didn’t know Wikipedia had as well. Not really surprised, just annoyed.

I haven’t edited Wikipedia much, the most I’ve done was to edit a departed acquaintance’s Wikipedia page after their passing to include their correct birth and death dates.

Victorious Parasol
7 months ago

Anybody else thinking of the difference between men’s and women’s soccer?

rv97
rv97
7 months ago

@CarrieV
Shame to hear that. Wikipedia is one of the few sources out there that doesn’t lock its relatively comprehensive information behind DRM or a paywall or take advantage of restrictive copyright law and a broken system that rewards only things that can make money. This has enticed me so much I’ve donated to them twice in two years, but partly because of my lack of income, and partly because of this, I shall reconsider.

I knew Wikipedia lacked diversity in its authorship of articles and I saw a video of a write-a-thon by women who were trying to address this but I didn’t know they banned such groups for calling out something problematic.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
7 months ago

@ V.P.;

re: men’s and women’s soccer, in the U.S., the only difference I know of is, the women win, while the men don’t qualify….

Is that it?

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@Weird Eddie
The women’s team also has a captain with the guts to stand up to Trump. And there was a great video of a Fox News reporter walking into a sports bar in France after the win and fans shouting “Fuck Trump.” So that there is another difference.

Snowberry
Snowberry
7 months ago

@Weird Eddie: That, plus the men are barely profitable yet get paid 5 times as much. (Or used to, I haven’t followed how it went after they protested wage inequality.) Just “economics”.

Victorious Parasol
7 months ago

And let’s not forget that there’s a lot of footage out there of men’s soccer players getting all dramatic about minor injuries while the women’s teams keep playing no matter what. It’s a classic case of women pushing through pain on a regular basis (periods, childbirth, fatigue, overwork, etc.) because they know they have no choice but to get things done.

Full Metal Ox
7 months ago

@Weird Eddie:
@Fishy Goat:

Ooh–can we make the burnt penis a big ol’ Roman Candle while we’re at it?

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
7 months ago

comment image

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
7 months ago

To be entirely clear, faking an injury in football give your team a non negligible advantage, so I would say it have a lot to do with how referees believe men more than women about pain.

Similar to how an uphill battle it is to get painkillers as a women, at least compared to men.

Masse_Mysteria
Masse_Mysteria
7 months ago

“If women can have pride … And wear a shirt… men should have pride and get to wear a shirt without any blowback.”

I keep telling myself I know what this means. Nevertheless I can’t not picture a dystopian world where men envy women for the right to wear shirts. At the age of thirteen or whatever parents telling their children, “Sorry hon, no more shirts for you – you are a man now.” Defiant punk type guys wearing shirts just to scandalise people. Men wearing shirts in the privacy of their own homes, shirts they sewed themselves because you can’t just buy a shirt that’s tailored to fit a man.

Also makes me wonder about capes and ponchos and such. Court cases settling what constitutes a shirt. Maybe that’s where I should stop.

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@Masse_Mysteria
You should write a short story about that. About the secret network of anarchist tailors who sew together shirts while the clothing police officers in each home are asleep. About the resistance that wears shirts to protest the government.

Out of curiosity, what would the men be wearing instead? Dresses? Robes? Nothing? If they wear nothing, they would be awfully cold in the winter.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
7 months ago

Scifi idea: Turns out that the relatively high testosterone level typical of men, associated with toxic masculinity, is not a part of natural male endocrine balance, but rather a disruption of said system caused by (post)pubescent males wearing T shirts.

After that, banning T shirts for men provides theoretically an easy political solution to toxic masculinity. However, bitter resistance persists among those men who happen to be particularly fond of T shirts.

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@Lumipuna
I’d rather like to live in that society: instead of having to take HRT, I’d be able to transition simply by wearing dresses. Presumably then I’d start producing estrogen on my own.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
7 months ago

I hope you currently produce estrogens 😡

Biological nitpicking apart*, a society where gender switching is quick and easy would have my preference too. Heck, why can’t we be like the fishs that change sex based on their environment ?

* the definition of someone not producing estrogen is “a corpse”, not “a man”.

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@Ohlmann
I know I produce some. What I mean is that in this hypothetical world I’d produce more due to wearing a dress. Because I have testicles instead of ovaries, I don’t produce feminizing levels on my own.

Also, presumably someone with ovaries or testes removed doesn’t produce any estrogen.

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
7 months ago

@Naglfar, @Lumipuna:

Since part of the purpose of the modern-day t-shirt is as a medium for statements or logos, would men in a shirtless world wear pendants bearing jokes or the name of their favourite band or sports team? I have a fond memory of a guy I once saw at a New Year’s Eve party in a bling-y pendant that read, simply:

FACULTY.

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@Moon Custafer
They could maybe paint logos on their chests. Or they could wear pants with logos.

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
7 months ago

@Naglfar:

comment image

(hope picture loads)

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
7 months ago

@Weird Eddie, Snowberry:
I mentioned a couple of months ago that at least some sports are taking this seriously:
Pay equity comes to curling: Scotties and Brier winners to cash in same amount (@CBC)
Really, all it requires is someone in charge who does take the idea seriously. That was easier in curling than a lot of other sports because, let’s be frank, curling isn’t seen as ‘manly’ enough to acquire a whole lot of toxic masculinity.

David Rose
David Rose
7 months ago

@Masse_Mysteria

Also maybe men could wear plaid shirts, but only on special occasions in Scotland. Then it’s manly.

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
7 months ago

@Jenora:

Curling’s one of those sports where people who aren’t involved have no idea how difficult it really is—my bosses insisted on booking a curling rink for our Xmas party one year, despite my mutterings that the sport was invented by the Scots to troll people when they realized golf hadn’t gone far enough.

My team actually ended up winning a bottle of Bailey’s each after I (purely by accident) scored the only goal of the day.

TL DR: I’m terrible at curling, but my co-workers are even worse, so I won booze by default. Still wouldn’t do it again, I don’t like cold and slippery surfaces.

Masse_Mysteria
Masse_Mysteria
7 months ago

Of course I didn’t stop thinking about it…

@Naglfar:
My initial take was that while men wouldn’t wear anything in place of a shirt, jackets would be okay, though you’d be the manlier the longer you went without one in the autumn (plus that takes it back to the what counts as a shirt thingie). Maybe overalls would also be acceptable, particularly since there are a lot of situations where going bare-chested might be hazardous.

@Moon Custafer:
Maybe there could be a rise in minimalism and any sort of embellishments would be deemed unmanly? Then there’d be a whole underground industry making and passing around rubber stamps or something so that you could make yourself really fancy really quickly with impermanent tattoos without the risk of someone raiding your home and finding incriminating clothing items.

@Lumipuna:
Plot twist: not wearing a shirt doesn’t actually do anything to your hormone levels, but the whole thing works because of a placebo effect. Our hero finds this out and can’t decide whether to share the information, since that might lead to things reverting back to the way they were.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
7 months ago

O/T but this may be of interest to art fans.

https://news.artnet.com/art-world/jordan-casteel-interview-1781658

It’s about Jordan Casteel; and she’s an up and coming artist well worth keeping an eye on. Also some vaguely gender related themes.

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
7 months ago

@Alan:

Nice! I like that the article shows pictures of her studio and tools as well. Too few artist profiles get into the nuts and bolts.

And at the end, during the Q&A, a woman raised her hand and asked me why I was only painting men. “I think that you should be painting women,” she said. “It doesn’t make sense to me why you’re denying women the opportunity to be seen. All voices need to matter, too.”
She said that to me while I was on this panel, the only woman sitting up there. And I was like, what you’re doing right now is reducing me as a woman making these paintings and reducing my presence within them.

This kind of reminds me of how Yinka Shonibare, CBE, was apparently told as a student his art ought to be “more African.” (In his case he responded by buying up a lot of wax-print fabrics and incorporating them into works that referenced famous European paintings. Also he never misses an opportunity to point out that those fabrics were originally English and Dutch and were exported to the West African market, where they became popular.)

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
7 months ago

@ mooncustafer

Yeah, I love the behind the scenes aspect of art. I love seeing studios as much if not moreso than galleries.

I really like her work though. I’m not particularly moved by anything non-abstract; but I can appreciate how good she is. And there’s something in her paintings beyond the mere capturing of the image. Like the hidden metaphor stuff in Holbein’s work.

Naglfar
Naglfar
7 months ago

@Moon Custafer
Shonibare is a great artist. I took an art history course some years ago and we discussed that aspect of his work and his use of wax fabrics. Plus, I’ve gotten to see some of his work in person because a museum near me has some of his art.

Full Metal Ox
7 months ago

@Moon Custafer:

So this thing exists
In the Simpsons universe:
Haiku sports fandom?

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
7 months ago

@Naglfar:

Plus, I’ve gotten to see some of his work in person because a museum near me has some of his art.

(is envious)