By David Futrelle
I sometimes get accused of being unfair to Men Going Their Own Way, accusing them of hating women (which they do) without taking into account the incredible hatred directed their way by women. MGTOWs aren’t born; they’re made, I’m told, and it’s women who made them the way they are today.
So today I will present the origin story of one particular MGTOW — a fellow calling himself Wubba Gubba who tried to post a comment on We Hunted the Mammoth the other day, in which he offered an explanation of the terrible things women had done that had caused him to go MGTOW in the first place. I didn’t let his comment through moderation, but I’d like to share it with you today.
“What makes a MGTOW?” he began, before offering up a numbered list.
1) 1984, she-devil asks, what do you do, I say, engineer, she says, engineers are dull boring conservative and therefore completely undesirable.
So … 36 years ago a woman told him that engineers were boring and undesirable. And he’s still holding a grudge over that.
2) Trump says one particular woman is a pig, lunatic misandrists, by the millions, claim that Trump calls all women pigs.
That’s … not how that happened. There’s a truckload of evidence that Trump is a misogynist; his calling Rosie O’Donnell a pig is only one small data point.
Yes I can continue.
All women angels?
On what planet?The MGTOW men were not born that way, the lunatic skanks they met all too often in their lives made them that way.
He then returns to his numbered list, adding one last assertion:
3) Trump says he will build a wall, with doors in it, to control immigration, lunatic women scream louder than anyone that he is trying to stop immigration.
No one says that Trump is trying to stop immigration altogether, because he isn’t; he’s trying to stop or at least drastically reduce immigration by Latinos — to the estent that he’s sending refugees back to certain death and kidnapping the children of border crossers. Women aren’t literally screaming about this, though a scream would hardly be an unreasonable response to his policies.
Conclusion, more than one flew over the cookies nest.
The “cookies” nest, you say?
Anyway, there’s your explanation for this guy’s turn to MGTOW: one solitary woman told him he was boring more than three and a half decades ago. And woman overall tend to dislike Trump.
I guess that justifies a lifetime of calling women “lunatic skanks.”
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It was probably autocorrect but I’d like to think he mangles all known figures-of-speech, Biff Tannen style.
As for the rest of his comment, either there’s something he’s not telling us or he’s one of the most sensitive, fragile souls to ever tread the earth.
I think it’s funny how this alternates between an incoherent numbered list and what resembles poetry in the middle.
Anyway, I love the Malebag posts where David breaks down comments that didn’t get through. I just enjoy reading David mock them even more than much of the other content.
You’re wrong about one thing: He most certainly is trying to stop immigration by Latinos, but he’s also trying to stop immigration altogether.
Seriously, this administration does not want anyone moving here from other countries. Just look at the record.
Well, if you take Trump at his word (which you shouldn’t, because his word keeps changing) he’s fine with immigrants from Sweden.
jsrtheta: I think 45 has been pretty clear that he approves of (and encourages!) immigration from majority white countries. That was my takeaway from the whole “shithole countries” fiasco, anyway.
Though there must be much fewer people wanting to move from Sweden to the USA. I certainly can’t think why they would.
Ironically, his defense of Trump behaviors and policies gives reason to the prejudices of the 1984 woman who told him that he was a boring conservative thus undesirable. The man can’t even make a good argument for himself. He could have went a more “reasonnable” way by talking about difficult breakups or divorce, being cheated on, being bullied by girls while he was younger or even by women coworkers, etc. These are the sort of things that can explain, if not justify, a certain level of hatred and resentment toward women and girls. Are MGTWO made? Of course they are, I don’t think anybody is born hateful, but this hatred had to be nurtured and not just by encountered with the shitty women of the world.
Trump would love immigration from majority white countries. Unless those immigrants are left-leaning (which many might be). Then he’d hate them…hmm, I wonder why they’re not eager to come here.
@epronovost
I think hatred comes from a culture which is chock-full of misogyny, racism, cisheteronormativity, ableism, and every other bigotry. When people grow up in this culture, especially privileged people (pretty much all the misogynists we regularly mock here are cishet white men, with maybe a few cishet white women), they see the despised groups as scapegoats and blame them for their problems, because that’s easier than actually solving problems. This is how we got to the current political situation.
I would like to live in a cookies nest.
Insert Cookie Monster gif here.
I must admit it. ‘Twas I who told this man in 1984 that he was boring, forcing him to hate all women forever. Sure, I wasn’t born yet, but my deep-seated anti-engineer prejudice transcends such pitiful bounds as space and time.
Had I known engineers had nests filled with cookies, I might have revised my opinion.
Person recognizes that identifying an isolated occurrence does not justify extrapolating to an entire population.
Does it anyway.
Not an ounce of self-reflection to be seen.
@WWTH
As would I, though I don’t think I’d like living in one with a MGTOW. That would ruin it for me.
All women angels?
This is an important question. If it turns out that not *all* women are angels — for example, if there’s one she-devil lurking among the harps and haloes — then women should be written off as a group. It’s just logic.
On what planet?
I, too, would like to know the name of the planet where all women are angels. It sounds kinda awesome. I’m thinking some combination of Wonder Woman and valkyries.
I….wasn’t aware that immigration, illegal or otherwise, was The Big Hotbutton Feminist Issue. Maybe I need to renew my subscription to the Global Feminist Newsletter and get up to date?
Saying that engineering is boring isn’t all that mean. On a scale of 1 to Melania, it barely even registers.
Maybe it’s because we see women being threatened, harassed, demeaned and insulted, every second of the day. You get inured to it, especially if you’re a regular reader of this blog. Yet here’s this broflake waging a lifelong vendetta on women because three decades ago one of them didn’t fall down and worship his career choice.
If all it took to make people GTOW was a single rude comment, nobody in the human race would be speaking to anybody else.
Anyway…
…I feel like there’s a scene or two or ten hundred missing here. Obviously the she-devil was a stranger, or she wouldn’t have been asking him what he did. Was this a blind date that went wrong? A casual cocktail party conversation? A corporate recruiter who wouldn’t give him her phone number?
It’s a weird convo, and a weird overreaction. Only someone already in the grip of full-blown misogyny would burn down his entire life over some offhand remark by a stranger, and then blame the stranger for it.
Oh yeah, I remember that book. By Ken Keebler.
@Buttercup
I’m guessing the lack of context is because he made the whole thing up. That would explain the lack of context, details, and the vague nature of it. But even if this did happen to him, I agree that it’s not all that mean.
The lack of detail about the incident reminds me of issendai’s “The missing missing reasons”
http://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html
(Content note: abusive relationships)
Come to the dork side. We have cookies. Offers plate of star wars cutout cookies
You know, I really thought engineers would prefer pi over cookies.
@Naglfar
You’re not wrong. We even have office pie competitions on pi day.
Wow one women made a mean comment to him and now he’s damaged for life. Sure does makes my complex ptsd from the year of abuse both mental, physical and sexual seem like nothing now. Could these guys be any more fragile?
Just a note – I married an engineer almost 35 years ago. He’s not dull, boring, or conservative. I’d keep him around even if he wasn’t the sexiest man I ever met, because he Knows How to Fix Things. I wouldn’t have kept him just for that, but he really loves the dogs. And the kids.
tl:dr – Engineers can be really good husbands.
Just saying.
I agree with Naglfar above, he probably made it up. There is a variety of women out there, and a lot have internalized toxic ideas about men and women and thus judge men according to those toxic ideas; however there obviously a lot of men who are the same. Imagine a man who feels ashamed because he doesn’t live up to the ridiculous, toxic version of masculinity he has internalized. Ideally he would reject that model of masculinity for something better, but that requires a lot of critical thinking and introspection, you might even have to talk about FEELINGS. So the easier path is to blame something external, namely women. Of course there are judgemental, shallow, manipulative, sexist women for the same reason there are judgemental, shallow, manipulative, sexist men. Thanks to confirmation bias MGTOW only see one of those groups.
Wow, I’ve far more reason to be wary of women than this miggy has, but there’s no way I’d embrace his toxic worldview just because in my younger days my social ineptitude put me in the path of some dangerous b*****s. In my younger days at various times I was violently mugged at the instigation of a female gang leader, slashed by a would – be girlfriend whose advances I’d been blind to, and even arrested on suspicion of attempted murder (released with no further action) due to a spurious allegation of violence. If that had put me off associating with women, I wouldn’t be with ate, and any time in the company of female relatives would be awkward. That said, I tend to isolate myself when my medication is ‘off’ and there’s none of the family, or of ate’s close friends nearby, but that’s just my risk – averse personality.
If this comment were directed at me, my feelings would be hurt, even decades later.
But what does one woman’s comment have to do with the rest of womankind?
Maybe this is just me — I’m kidding, it’s not — but when a man is awful, I don’t start hating all men. I’m aware that men, like other human beings, are not all alike.