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Malebag: A MGTOW’s origin story

Man Crying His Own Way

By David Futrelle

I sometimes get accused of being unfair to Men Going Their Own Way, accusing them of hating women (which they do) without taking into account the incredible hatred directed their way by women. MGTOWs aren’t born; they’re made, I’m told, and it’s women who made them the way they are today.

So today I will present the origin story of one particular MGTOW — a fellow calling himself Wubba Gubba who tried to post a comment on We Hunted the Mammoth the other day, in which he offered an explanation of the terrible things women had done that had caused him to go MGTOW in the first place. I didn’t let his comment through moderation, but I’d like to share it with you today.

“What makes a MGTOW?” he began, before offering up a numbered list.

1) 1984, she-devil asks, what do you do, I say, engineer, she says, engineers are dull boring conservative and therefore completely undesirable.

So … 36 years ago a woman told him that engineers were boring and undesirable. And he’s still holding a grudge over that.

2) Trump says one particular woman is a pig, lunatic misandrists, by the millions, claim that Trump calls all women pigs.

That’s … not how that happened. There’s a truckload of evidence that Trump is a misogynist; his calling Rosie O’Donnell a pig is only one small data point.

Yes I can continue.
All women angels?
On what planet?

The MGTOW men were not born that way, the lunatic skanks they met all too often in their lives made them that way.

He then returns to his numbered list, adding one last assertion:

3) Trump says he will build a wall, with doors in it, to control immigration, lunatic women scream louder than anyone that he is trying to stop immigration.

No one says that Trump is trying to stop immigration altogether, because he isn’t; he’s trying to stop or at least drastically reduce immigration by Latinos — to the estent that he’s sending refugees back to certain death and kidnapping the children of border crossers. Women aren’t literally screaming about this, though a scream would hardly be an unreasonable response to his policies.

Conclusion, more than one flew over the cookies nest.

The “cookies” nest, you say?

Anyway, there’s your explanation for this guy’s turn to MGTOW: one solitary woman told him he was boring more than three and a half decades ago. And woman overall tend to dislike Trump.

I guess that justifies a lifetime of calling women “lunatic skanks.”

Send tips to dfutrelle at gmail dot com.

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kupo
kupo
8 months ago

@WWTH
I used to be a pizza delivery driver, and some of the drivers at my restaurant were stoked about the snow because it meant really generous tips. When I was shift manager on snow days I let the drivers decide if they would do deliveries or not and if they didn’t want to, we didn’t offer delivery that day. Though that probably varies a lot from one manager to another and one chain to another. So I say go ahead but tip generously.

ColeYote
ColeYote
8 months ago

Call me crazy, but I don’t think someone who generalizes women as “lunatic skanks” is a good judge of whether or not Lord Dampnut is a misogynist.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
8 months ago

Regarding chicken and egg, I think Diego has it. You have people who know they are smart, often grew up with some resentment based on how they were treated for that, but don’t necessarily have the breadth of expertise to realize how each field has its own requirements. Add in background levels of sexism while growing up, then toss them into a almost-all-male environment where they feel they are finally being recognized for the superior individuals that they are, and watch how quickly things turn toxic if there aren’t any outside correction attempts.

I’m pretty sure I’ve told this story before, but…

Back in around 1990, when I was at Waterloo and involved with the Engineering Society there, the president and vice-president were both women, which was a first. By this time the most blatant forms of sexism (like the society newspaper) were gone but a lot of the less blatant ones remained.

One morning I got into the University and discovered somebody had taken a publicity still of the president and vice-president, written ‘for a good time call’ on it, faked the EngSoc approval stamp, and posted that in one of the back hallways in Engineering 3 by where the wind tunnel test room was. I ripped it down and took it into the society office. I got asked where I had found it, because apparently they had been taking these down all morning and wanted to know which hallway they had missed.

So, yes, somebody apparently felt so threatened by the fact that the president and vice-president of the Engineering Society were both women that he paid to print up a hundred copies of a slut-shaming poster and spent a chunk of the previous night sneaking through buildings putting them up.

And there are other places significantly less progressive than Waterloo was.

Naglfar
Naglfar
8 months ago

@Jenora Feuer

faked the EngSoc approval stamp

This isn’t related to the rest of your comment, but when I saw the word “EngSoc” my brain immediately jumped to IngSoc, the political ideology in 1984. I was then left to wonder how this ideology had taken over universities.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
8 months ago

@Naglfar:
I actually realized that might happen as I was typing it in, but everybody at the University called it EngSoc (pronounced Enj-Sok) anyway so I just left it.

Also with regards to sexism… well, when I was there, the ‘mascot’ of the Waterloo Engineering Society was ‘The Ridgid Tool’, a giant wrench made by the Ridge Tool Company. So when I say some of the more blatant forms of sexism had already been stopped, consider that parading ‘The Ridgid Tool’ around at society events was one of the less blatant forms.

Allandrel
Allandrel
8 months ago

I think maybe there’s a variant of Dunning-Kruger in which people who are genuinely skilled/knowledgable in one area are at risk of assuming themselves equally expert in all other fields,

Oh, yes. Multi-faceted bigot Richard Dawkins is the king of this trope, especially with his laughably non-scientific “meme theory.”

“I understand genetics. Clearly, EVERYTHING works exactly like genetics, including human psychology and sociology. That’s just science. Also, it would be immoral not to abort a fetus with Down Syndrome.”

Naglfar
Naglfar
8 months ago

@Jenora Feuer

consider that parading ‘The Ridgid Tool’ around at society events was one of the less blatant forms.

Does that still happen? I should hope not, but I wouldn’t be at all surprised if it’s stuck around.

@Allandrel

Multi-faceted bigot Richard Dawkins is the king of this trope,

Don’t forget how quickly Dawkins jumped on the ElevatorGate train. Or his Islamophobia, or pedophile apologia, or his other instances of casual misogyny, or his thinly-veiled racism when he talks about his love of “Western culture.”

Allandrel
Allandrel
8 months ago

@Naglfar

It’s like there isn’t a bigotry that he hasn’t endorsed, and then when called on acted all hurt and insisted that people just aren’t smart enough to understand him.

Amtep
Amtep
8 months ago

Scientists are developing new ways to measure the difference between Richard Dawkins and Jordan Peterson

Catalpa
Catalpa
8 months ago

well, when I was there, the ‘mascot’ of the Waterloo Engineering Society was ‘The Ridgid Tool’, a giant wrench made by the Ridge Tool Company.

It was still the mascot when I attended in 2010.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
8 months ago

@Naglfar, Caltalpa:
Not surprised. Something like ‘The Ridgid Tool’ is at least deniable in terms of sexism if you only look at the surface meanings. I mean, it’s a wrench.

And Waterloo has had a pretty good outreach program for Women in Engineering since I was there. (The explicit funded program started in 1992, just after I graduated, but there were discussion and unofficial programs since I started. I’ve directed most of my alumni donations there.) There are obviously still some unexamined assumptions, but as far as I can see, in general they’ve been moving forward.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
8 months ago

Hold on … isn’t a wrench a tool that encloses and grips things rather than one that is poked into things?

(I leave working out the further implications up to the audience.)

Skeleton On a String
Skeleton On a String
8 months ago

cw: abuse mention

As a man who’s spent years in relationships with abusive women, if the worst thing that ever happened to me was being told that my job made me boring, I’d be in a far better place mentally. The MRA types love to target and recruit people in situations like mine, trying to explain life experiences like mine in terms of their misogyny and their agenda, with absolutely zero regard to whether they’re actually improving the lives of their supposed constituents.

So this shit makes me a very special flavor of angry. Like the vast majority of people in my situation, I know better than to blame all of womankind or to turn my back on all feminist praxis because of what two deeply hurt, confused, angry people did to me. Becoming deeply hurt, confused, and angry myself, and staying that way on purpose, is never the solution.

Fuck the Way these Men are Going because they’re going away from therapy, away from the emotion work they actually need to deal with whatever trauma they have, away from the serenity and self-esteem they need not to have to rely on a group of self-destructive fucksticks just to feel like they have any agency at all. They’re held together by mandatory misery. Abuse survivors of all genders deserve better than what these people can ever offer until they walk away from their self-imposed cycle of hatred.

Snowberry
Snowberry
8 months ago

@Surplus to Requirements:
Okay, I LOL’ed.

Naglfar
Naglfar
8 months ago

@Skeleton on a String
I’m sorry you have been abused. Wishing you healing and recovery.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
8 months ago

@Surplus to Requirements:
*snicker* Okay, that’s a good one. May have to bring that one up with some of the other alumni at some point.

@Skeleton on a String:
Agreed. MGTOW are often a very special case of what is often generally called ‘First world problems’, trying to pretend that what is happening to them is on a par with greater problems elsewhere and thus they’re entitled to over-react. And, of course, discussions as to why ‘Men’s Rights Advocates’ so rarely actually help with men’s rights by pushing things like Domestic Violence shelters are common around here.

tim gueguen
8 months ago

Another sexist engineering students anecdote: Back in the ’70s and ’80s the University of Saskatchewan engineering students society paper was The Red Eye. It had a reputation for regularly carrying sexist claptrap(and racist claptrap as well). One edition was so bad it lead to a complaint to the Saskatchewan Human Rights Commission. The complaint took years to come to a conclusion, and even though the commission ruled against The Red Eye it was later overturned by the Provincial Court of Appeals.

PickleFields
PickleFields
8 months ago

I had boys tell me I was fat while in school, and a man I dated once told me I was too opinionated and he didn’t want a second date. The MGTOW approach has taught me that, rather than eventually concluding that some people are rude and romantic incompatibility is a thing, I should instead blame men for all of my problems both personal and professional from puberty onwards. This sounds exhausting and miserable, but that’s a small price to pay for being right about everything forever.

Red Pilled Man
Red Pilled Man
8 months ago

Maybe its about time you realize that men without beta qualities are waking up to your social engineering bullshit. Whether its about how women who don’t like men can’t act like lesbians or the Earth being supposedly round.

Just as we have realized the game that women play including claiming to be ‘lesbian’ in order to drive away undesirable men, we are now realizing that your entire globe notions are complete and utter crap.

Interestingly most beta males tend to be in strong favor of being globeheads, I’m going to look into exactly why. While men who are not weak and are higher in testosterone tend to see past this hoax like they do with climate change.

I feel pity everytime weak men claim the Earth is round and continue to deny all scientific evidence of the actual shape of the Earth, instead being followers listening only to authority. This is really sick how the social engineers have changed men.

No matter, single mothers and simps are going to lose their power very soon.

Tovius
Tovius
8 months ago

Wow, misogyny, climate denial, AND a flat earther. Any other bullshit you want to shovel onto the pile?

Lainy
Lainy
8 months ago

@PickleFields

I know your probably over it by now, but I’m really sorry that you were treated that way. That’s not right and I just want to make that clear.

Red pilled men

You’re a dick, go eat shit. Grow up.

Naglfar
Naglfar
8 months ago

@Red Pilled Man
*fills in a few squares of Alt-right bingo card*
I’m guessing there’s some antisemitism as well, it’s just not as obvious. How does it feel to be wrong in literally every way?

deny all scientific evidence of the actual shape of the Earth

Out of curiosity, show me one piece of evidence the Earth is flat. I have yet to see any, and I’ve got dozens of proofs it isn’t flat.

While men who are not weak and are higher in testosterone tend to see past this hoax like they do with climate change.

Umm…I think it’s something other than testosterone you’ve got there that’s making you think the Earth is flat.

Gaebolga
Gaebolga
8 months ago

@Red Pilled Man

Obvious Poe is obvious.

Myriam
Myriam
7 months ago

I mean, of course it has to be a woman’s fault! As we say in my family (ironically) ‘it has to be someone’s fault, and it’s better if it’s not my own’.
And when are they actually going their own way and stopping being bitter boors??