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Dude insists his love of anime girls is a legit sexual orientation

I doubt his love is reciprocated

By David Futrelle

Unable or unwilling to deal with real-life women, more than a few misogynists have turned to imaginary substitutes — from video game hotties to hypnogogic hallucinations they think are succubi.

But the imaginary ladies they feel the strongest about are of course their anime waifus, whom many misogynists have come to feel are superior to IRL women, and not just because their giant eyes would be better to see with,

Now one dude has apparently decided that his obsessive love of 2-dimensional women isn’t just a slightly sad kink but is his actual sexual orientation. You know, like being gay. According to a quite possibly true posting in the Am I The Asshole subreddit, he recently “came out” as an anime lover to his parents and his extremely annoyed sibling.

Anime dude really needs to learn the difference between a fetish and an orientation.

The post inspired quite a debate on Reddit before it was deleted by the subreddit mods.

H/T — @AITA_reddit on Twitter for the Reddit post and the DisgustedAnimeGirls subreddit (yes, this is a real thing) for the graphic.

Send tips to dfutrelle at gmail dot com.

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Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

@ catalpa

Cheers! Yeah, I was thinking of maybe something like “You’re not my mum; you can’t tell me what to do…oh”; but that’s a bit of a mouthful.

It’s an article for activists. They’ve been on the receiving end of injunctions a bit lately. (Which gave me an interesting case where my clients are “persons unknown”). But we’re also looking at weaponising the law a bit more; so it’s also on how to bring an injunction application.

Catalpa
Catalpa
1 year ago

Ace people absolutely face prejudice. Especially AFAB and trans ace folks. From my own experience almost every ace or proximate person I know has dealt with pressure to be sexual, often in ways that were traumatizing, if not outright forms of corrective rape.

In addition, male-presenting ace folks often face hostility and abuse for not living up to the toxic masculine ideal of wanting sex. For not being a ‘real man’, etc.

If a dude wants sex but is single, that’s one thing (and I’m sure that those guys face their own problems, don’t get me wrong). But if a guy doesn’t want sex (and doesn’t couch it in misogynistic women-blaming MTGOW-ish terms), then there is something seriously wrong with him, he must be gay, he must be lying, he’s some kind of freak, he doesn’t belong, etc.

If the guy wants to stay silent and let other people think he’s a “normal” guy who’s just not lucky with the ladies, then, yeah, he’s going to be treated relatively normally and possibly with sympathy/pity. But if he wants to embrace his asexuality and be open about it? It’s not going to be easy for him in our current culture.

A lot of the ‘ace people don’t experience REAL discrimination’ rhetoric that I’ve seen assumes that ace people should just never talk about it or feel any kind of emotional connection to their identity. And I don’t see “you can always just stay in the closet!” as a privilege.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
1 year ago

As for acephobia, erasure I can understand as an issue. Sexual coercion of AFAB people generally is a widely known issue.

As for the general understanding that sexual orientation means gendered attraction, I’ll go with that, arbitrary or not.

It’s been a great discussion. Now, my time zone says, “go to sleep”.

Masse_Mysteria
Masse_Mysteria
1 year ago

@Lumipuna
I may be way off here, but isn’t it possible for you to identify as “kinky” or some variation thereof without it being your sexual orientation?

It may be because I’m asexual, and it’s always been a bit hard for me to understand why people identify strongly with a sexual orientation, but that’s probably mostly because I don’t socialise much* and all of three people IRL know I’m asexual.

… might have something to do with trying to present as androgynous and people at times reading me as a gay man or something.

* Should probably definitely work on this. Maybe next year?

@Catalpa
I’m sure I’m privileged in the way that I can mostly fly under the radar and be invisible if I don’t make noise, but repeatedly wondering whether or not I can be honest in my self-expression is not the fun part of that privilege.

Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
1 year ago

The best way I can think to put it is: Kinks are what gets you off; Orientation is who gets you off. (With none being a valid option of course).

Also, I don’t have any studies to cite or anything but sexual orientation is as old as humans are.
If it only seems ‘recent’ it’s because the societal default has been ‘straight’ backed up with violence/death/exclusion for those who weren’t/aren’t.

Beyond Ocean
Beyond Ocean
1 year ago

What makes asexuality a valid orientation? I’m curious to hear people’s thoughts on this.

Excuse me, what the fuck?

You know, I’d really like to hear your reasons you think (thought?) it isn’t.

Especially since it doesn’t relate in any way to your post of “I’m sceptical of the distinction of sexual orientation vs kink, and also asexuals”.

Beyond Ocean
Beyond Ocean
1 year ago

*[asexuality] doesn’t relate to the rest of your post

Sorry, couldn’t edit my previous post.

otrame
otrame
1 year ago

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape),

There is no should. Not about your sex drive. You don’t feel like masturbating, then don’t.

Some medications do affect sex drive. In those cases, you decide if the side effect is worth the intended effect. There are a lot of anti-depressants out there, not all of them effect your sex drive and there is absolutely nothing wrong with trying out different types. The only down side is that you need about two months to really get a feel for how a new medication is working for you (unless the effect is catastrophically bad), so finding the right one can take some time.

That said, it really is a question of you do you. You are not who you were 10 years ago. Why would your sex drive/sexual needs be the same?

I am starting to push 70 pretty hard and my sex drive is slowly wafting away. But I don’t worry about it. When I feel like it, I do it. The advantage of living alone and/or not having a sex partner is that there is no push to provide what your partner needs. You only have to provide what you need.

Ingmar
Ingmar
1 year ago

I heard about some asexuals still feeling romantically very attracted. There are less romantic men and women who might have more trouble understanding that than people who have a high romantic component in their sexual attractions. By non romantic I’m not shaming any of these people as totally carnal or with no feelings but sex impulses toward those who they desire as it’s obviously not the case at all :D.
But I also read on youtube comments about a woman who says she asexual but loves having sex with his boyfriend because she loves pleasing him despite her lack of sexual involvement, which yeah resonated as weird to me, not judging, and potentially problematic, but as long as she says she’s having a great relationship it would be more problematic of me questioning her outside of simple discrete curiousity, which is what of course some people who commented did, as usual, questioning her integrity, accusing her of gaming him, this one was the usual “bro”, you know who thinks he’s totally reality based and makes his model prescriptive and has been relentless reply after reply.
As for it being an orientation, why not, it’s a matter of evolving definition, not just limited on who, well mostly which group, but also how, it really depends on which definition, dunno :).
Another cases I read of, men and women who still masturbate and hence have a sexual urge to please themselves and potentially orgasm, but don’t connect it to members of either gender, but might or might not as said, being romantically attracted to them, hence loving and in some cases even pleasing them, which I know it should be reciprocal and might echo the idea of women pleasing men as service, though in the case of Ace’s it might be the cases for any of them doing that to their non ace partner, man or woman.
Not sure if Ot, so back to the “anime orientation”, as you said, the bad part might be the possible mysogynist foundation of this orientation, like D. K. Meller’s “love” for dolls was that an orientation, with its baggage of hating women’s agency and autonomy?
By the extended meaning it might be, but it differs from the gay vs straight and bi question or Ace by an order: not involving not even consenting people, but even sentient being, just a mediatic representation, drawing on paper or virtual paper, the non human material of dolls, being the “media”, in both cases idealized versions, far from reality, a refusal of real persons and possibly their humanity and agency.
I already foresess a possibly false equivalence for women from the manosphere, the Prince Charming, though that’s made out of idealizing his status and agency, to which they’d counter it aligns with innate gender differences, women seeking status and men, to them, sign of availability and vulnerability is proxy for availability, though that’s a really sad way of conceiving male sexuality.
Hi to all again :).

A. Noyd
A. Noyd
1 year ago

Naglfar says:

That sounds possible, but if he was asexual would he be attracted to cartoon women?

You can be asexual and get off to images of and ideas about non-real people. You can also be asexual and not realize it and misinterpret your ability to get off to non-real people as the attraction allosexuals feel towards actual people.

Troubelle: Moonbeam Malcontent, Bard of the New Movement
Troubelle: Moonbeam Malcontent, Bard of the New Movement
1 year ago

In reference to the comments discourse, I will note that sexuality and romanticism are two very different things.

In reference to the article itself, it’s unrealistic expectations. Even in a case of recursive fiction, Hifumi Yamada faltered.

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

Wow I never thought I would see acephobia on here. Great! /s 🙄 and to connect someone being misogynist to being ace???? Please, I ask you to kindly fuck off.

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

Here is a good idea: if you are going to talk about ace people/ask ignorant question maybe think about if you will ask/say those things about other sexualities? Maybe think if some of the commenters here are ace? Then dont say those things and google it and read about it yourself.

Catalpa
Catalpa
1 year ago

Yeah, I gotta say that it was a bit unpleasant to come across aphobic rhetoric here. Seconding Valentin.

Ann Hatzakis
Ann Hatzakis
1 year ago

It sounds like the person is asexual but has never really taken the time to understand what asexuality is like — or even the varieties of ace out there. It is possible to be asexual and panromantic at the same time

So, it could be possible to be asexual and attracted intellectually to fictional people

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

Thanks catalpa,

For anyone who really wants to learn about the ace/aro experience I suggest this website: https://www.asexuality.org/

It is very informative, and gives many perspectives, because amazingly not all ace/aro people are the same, some ace people even have sex!

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

So, it could be possible to be asexual and attracted intellectually to fictional people

This is not what is happening – at all. This person fetshises animated women with unnatural bodies and also says mysrogisnistic things (about woman smell we all know that is because of the stereotype about vaginas). Please stop connecting these beliefs and behaviour with ace people. It is really harmful and insulting.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Valentin, Catalpa
Not sure if you are responding to me, but if anything I said came across as acephobic, I am sorry. That was not my intent, and I will more closely watch to make sure nothing I say can be construed as against asexual people.

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

💙💙💙💙💙💙

Catalpa
Catalpa
1 year ago

@Naglfar

Nah, you’re fine, I certainly didn’t notice anything aphobic from you in this thread. Mostly my issue is with the folks who are going “hey these guys who talk about how disgusting and vile women are, they’re clearly asexual since this is standard behavior for asexuals doncha know”, as well as the questions about whether asexuality is a “valid” sexuality and if asexuals really actually face any kind of discrimination. You’ve been very thoughtful and I appreciate your contributions.

But thank you for being so considerate! <3

Beyond Ocean
Beyond Ocean
1 year ago

Everyone, sorry for my previous, barely coherent post. I wrote it when I really should have been going to sleep.

I’m ace myself and I was kinda upset that the question I quoted was seen like a normal thing to just discuss. I shouldn’t have phrased my reply as if I wanted to discuss it further.

Thanks, Valentin, for putting all this much better.

A. Noyd
A. Noyd
1 year ago

For the record, I’m also ace myself and I’m just trying to point out that getting off to something does not mean someone can’t be asexual. You’re an asexual if you lack sexual attraction to actual people (or only experience it under extremely restricted circumstances).

Whatever flavor sundae this numpty’s got filling his dish, there’s a whole can of whipped misogyny cream sprayed on top of it.

Jarnsaxa
Jarnsaxa
1 year ago

I am on the ace side myself and I have actually thought at times that sex is kind of yucky and weird. And of course, other people, like me, are made of meat and blood and icky smelling gases and various slimes. This doesn’t stop me from respecting them as people, it just means I’m not really into sex. I have to be pretty interested in somebody’s mind to be interested in their uh, for lack of a better term, flesh.

And to be clear about it, I am mostly not a sex-repulsed person, but that level of ace people does exist and I don’t think they necessarily disrespect people they don’t want to have sex with either.

To clarify: there are a number of red flags with the guy into 2D representations, but there’s not enough info to totally draw the conclusion that he’s a virulent misogynist either. He may just be a gray ace like me.

WMDKitty
WMDKitty
1 year ago

*wheezing laughter*

Bloody hell, what’s next?

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
1 year ago

Good Morning, everyone

I gather that further discussion on asexuality would be unpleasant for the ace folks here, and probably not helpful for my understanding either. I’ll take people’s words that ace oppression is real. I personally appreciate that my family doesn’t harass me for being single, regardless of whether I’m actually (borderline) asexual or not.

I suppose the main discussion topic should have been all the misogynist red flags present in the quoted story. I certainly didn’t mean to join in the comments drawing a connection between asexuality and misogyny. I think I’ve seen that happen sometimes before in regard to similar misogyny. I get that it’s beside the point and enables acephobia.

Jamesworkshop
Jamesworkshop
1 year ago

Not sure if it fully fits a concept like orientation but it’s not really that important if it does, what does matter is that its true enough for it to having been announced, considering the private nature of such a setting, maybe putting it on reddit (even anomalized) might be a-holish.

Anime girls can be submissive but who knows from such scarce details, maybe he goes for the tsundere/yandere types or just the default appearances and ignoring any particular types of behaviors.

Kurt H
Kurt H
1 year ago

Technically, Gal Gadot is a 5/10. She’s a 10 in physical beauty, but she loses five points for supporting a colonial, apartheid state.

Crip Dyke
1 year ago

there’s not enough info to totally draw the conclusion that he’s a virulent misogynist either

But I thought the whole point of this is that things that we draw are just as real as we are ourselves?

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 year ago

Ugh, the comments on that thread are full of acephobia as well… “He just needs to get outside and interact with real women…”. “Take him to a strip club…”. “He needs counseling and therapy…”

The brother only needs counseling if he’s bothered by it or it’s affecting his ability to socialize, and he wants support and coping strategies. Otherwise everyone needs to STFU and let him be. He doesn’t need to be “cured” because he isn’t ill. As long as he isn”t spewing hateful, degrading stuff about women, who cares?

It is true, though, that people who badly want the benefits of patriarchy but don’t see a place for themselves in it can react in ways that are harmful, including the inability to accept themselves and others as they truly are. (Come to think of it, people who have a secure spot in the hierarchy frequently do the same thing, out of fear of losing their spot.). Patriarchy’s a helluva drug.

Dave
Dave
1 year ago

As long as he isn”t spewing hateful, degrading stuff about women, who cares?

Well, that’s the problem. He is saying degrading things about women. He isn’t saying that he is uninterested in a relationship or uninterested in sex. He said that he isn’t attracted to real women because they are fat and smell bad. Maybe, he said that because he was pushed into it by family, but it is still wrong.

That isn’t ace. If it is, then it is being filtered through toxic misogyny he has to get over.

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

Yes i just can’t see any evidence here that he is ace. Or any reason to talk about that like it’s an excuse for him???

Gaebolga
Gaebolga
1 year ago

A long time ago, Naglfar wrote:

…but I’m curious as to why anime has such a large amount of fetish stuff relative to other forms of media.

Just my two cents, but I think the fact that the characters and storylines are not just artificial – and thus but can be made to do, say, and like or loathe anything – they can literally violate any physical laws, biological constraints, or kinesthetic limitations contributes heavily to this, especially the more extreme stuff.

Also, it’s a lot cheaper to hire an artist to draw some stuff than to hire actors to perform it, so it works on the email scammer dynamic: it doesn’t take nearly as many customers to make money off fetish anime than it does off RL fetish porn.

Katamount
1 year ago

Just on the topic of ace/aromantic, I’ve long suspected I’m aromantic. I’m far from asexual, but I’ve never been comfortable with the idea of pursuing any long-term relationship, both from the standpoint of inviting another person into my quirky little world and also the change it might represent to that existence. So far, it’s worked alright for me.

@naglfar

Why is it always anime? I’ve never heard about anyone having a fetish for stop motion animation or CGI, but at times it seems like half the internet is hentai and other anime fetish stuff.

Oh, I could venture some guesses. With so much of what permeates the online subcultures originating in Japan (video games, anime series etc.), a lot of the fanservice is going to originate from there as well. As such, there’s more opportunity for connection and familiarity than there are with artwork and material that might come with more obscure western fandoms.

You’re not alone in noticing it; it’s actually kind of irked me how much of it I have to wade through to find some more “western”-styled illustrations. Not that there’s anything wrong with manga-styled art, I just find that the subject matter tends to be… problematic to say the least. Just to illustrate my point, I’ve actually been perusing some Italian fumetti (comics) from the 1970s and 1980s and the giallo themes are somehow less brutal than a lot of the treatments I see of women in hentai.

Just on the topic of CGI are actually groups out there that specialize in 3D-rendered adult material, but I get the impression that it’s far more niche and not a lot of it rests in fanservice.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Katamount

You’re not alone in noticing it; it’s actually kind of irked me how much of it I have to wade through to find some more “western”-styled illustrations. Not that there’s anything wrong with manga-styled art, I just find that the subject matter tends to be… problematic to say the least. Just to illustrate my point, I’ve actually been perusing some Italian fumetti (comics) from the 1970s and 1980s and the giallo themes are somehow less brutal than a lot of the treatments I see of women in hentai.

I don’t really look at porn, but I was on DeviantArt a bit ago looking for something and noticed a lot of anime fetish art. I’m not really interested in that style much, and I do find the misogyny to be problematic, especially in things like ero guro.

I also notice a connection between anime and the alt right. As we discussed in another thread, a significant number of alt right Nazis seem to be anime fans, and 4chan was once an anime board.

Jamesworkshop
Jamesworkshop
1 year ago

Alt right anime fan are an odd bunch, hates “cucked” western media portrayals of limp wrist-ed beta soybois, but somehow think anime males aren’t typified by the cast of Ouran High School Host Club.

Katamount
1 year ago

@Naglfar

I think Gaebolga’s response actually connects those dots. Basically, what anime fetish art does is take all of the unreal things that they get off on and lets it happen to familiar characters they’ve lusted after for one reason or another.

As a furry, I can certainly cop to that. I just happen to value the subject matter reflecting pleasure rather than discomfort.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Katamount

Basically, what anime fetish art does is take all of the unreal things that they get off on and lets it happen to familiar characters they’ve lusted after for one reason or another.

That makes sense. That would also explain the prevalence of physically impossible fetishes which can only be made in art. I can understand people exploring fetishes through art, especially when those fetishes cannot be realized in meatspace.

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

Good Morning, everyone

I gather that further discussion on asexuality would be unpleasant for the ace folks here, and probably not helpful for my understanding either.
I’ll take people’s words that ace oppression is real. I personally appreciate that my family doesn’t harass me for being single, regardless of whether I’m actually (borderline) asexual or not.

This makes me a bit uncomfortable. I dont know if you mean it to sound like this so I will give you the benefit of the doubt that maybe this is becuase of text.

But. Okay. Firstly sentence sounds like you maybe feel that the ace people here are being too sensitive? But I can tell you that some of the questions and the idea that ace needs to be some kind of discussion is really not good, it makes people who are ace feel like we are not valid. And talking about us like we are not part of the discussion. It’s not good.

Also the next sentence about “taking our word for it” sounds a little bit patronising?? I’m not sure how to describe exaclty, but just because you didn’t personally see/experience acephobia, oppression, exclusion doesnt mean that it doesnt exists and that it isn’t a problem. Imagine if we were talking about transphobia and you said this sentence?? It sounds quite arrogant and dismissive and is quite hurtful to the ace people here who are talking about how they are uncomfortable with this discussion.

And finally people bullying for being single =/= not ace oppression. Please I really ask you to read the website i shared, and about the ways people are ace and aro and how is that experience for people. I am ace, I am in a relationship now for almost 10 years. I have sex, not becuase I personally need it, but because I know it makes my partner(s) happy and they enjoy it and I enjoy that they are happy. It is a way they show love and affection.

And finally, just all – deciding that this person in the article is ace is just like what people done before when people say someone might be autistic becuase they behave like an asshole. Dont do that??? Can we not do this? There is no clear evidence that this person is ace so let’s not say that they are??? Becuase otherwise it is associating the misogyny with ace people, if someone is sex repulsed it diesnt mean that they will say mysoginist things or say “real women are disgusting”. Thise are the words and beliefs of someone who hates women, not someone who is ace! Not that ace people cant be mysoginist (or racist or sexist or any bigot) but they are not these things becuase of their sexuality.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 year ago

Well, that’s the problem. He is saying degrading things about women. He isn’t saying that he is uninterested in a relationship or uninterested in sex. He said that he isn’t attracted to real women because they are fat and smell bad.

He said he (personally) doesn’t find their smells appealing, not that all women inherently smell bad. Same with the model whose waistline wasn’t to his taste. It’s not clear whether he feels that way due to phobia/anxiety around physical closeness, or out of generalized dislike of women. I don’t get the same hateful vibe from him that I do from MGTOWs talking gleefully about sexbots and revenge, for example. There may be a lot more to the story that his brother’s leaving out, but the OP is all we have to go on.

It’s tricky. Preferences are preferences and can’t be reasoned with, but it’s so easy to weaponize them. Authoritarian men decide their preferences rule the world and women are to be judged and blamed based on how closely they adhere to them. Then it becomes easy to throw women under the bus as scapegoats when men don’t have conventional sex lives and feel like they’re not living up to others’ (impossible) standards.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
1 year ago

Valentin:

Firstly sentence sounds like you maybe feel that the ace people here are being too sensitive?

Not really “too” sensitive as such, I’m just acknowledging that sensitivity is a thing, and the reason why we don’t generally have Rational Debate about other peole’s identities. Basically, I was wondering aloud if should clarify my thoughts a little more or just shut up.

If my discourse in this thread isn’t getting any better, please just tell me to stop, clearly but politely, and I’ll let you have that as a last word.

Also the next sentence about “taking our word for it” sounds a little bit patronising??

I meant it sincerely, but maybe it’s an inherently patronising expression? I sometimes fail language, typically by being overly honest/literal.

Imagine if we were talking about transphobia and you said this sentence??

I’ve literally seen allies say that with regards to trans people’s gender identity and its importance. Now, I’m asking everyone here, is it actually bad form? Or different when talking about transphobia specifically?

And finally people bullying for being single =/= not ace oppression.

Sorry for that personal note, it was misleading and not very relevant.

Please I really ask you to read the website i shared, and about the ways people are ace and aro and how is that experience for people.

I briefly looked at that, but I really need something more like “Ace 101 for Dummies”. Now, I look at Wikipedia and see it cites a few scholars on anti-ace discrimination but there’s no much consensus on what exactly is going on.

Valentin
Valentin
1 year ago

What a nice response!

I am not sure about if there are standard interpretations for certain phrases it is just my interpretations.

For Ace/aro 101 that website has some nice articles. But here is another helpful link: http://www.whatisasexuality.com/intro/

Rhuu - apparently an illiterati
Rhuu - apparently an illiterati
1 year ago

As someone who most comfortingly fits under the grey ace umbrella… I really just couldn’t with this discussion. I know we’ve moved on, and Valentin has said it much better, but i never ever expected to see a regular ask if ace is a real orientation, and then for people to defend it.

It is real.

While i wouldn’t say i’ve experienced ‘oppression’ exactly, i was convinced for most of my life that i was just a broken human, who couldn’t succeed at the most basic of human needs. It sucks to feel broken, constantly broken.

I also wonder why people jumped to ‘ace’ and not ‘steeped in misogynistic chan culture’ for this brother? Yes, you can dislike female smells, and yes, that *might not* be because society has basically been told for years that “any female smell other than a fresh daisy is DISGUSTING, why aren’t you douching with LYSOL, don’t you want a man to want you????????”

But wouldn’t you say that’s probably a huge factor in it…???

About Gal Gadot being too fat for him, again, how is this not a red flag? Sure, he said her ‘waist is too big’, and people went off on preferences here, because apparently if he didn’t use the words “i think *Gal Gadot* is a huge tubbo”, it’s fine?

To remind everyone, THIS IS WHO HE IS TALKING ABOUT.
comment image

What???? She isn’t fat! Frankly, if *she’s* fat, and people here are willing to accept that as a freaking *kink*, i’m afraid to see who isn’t fat!

Basically, i’m surprised that because someone framed this as *coming out*, people are willing to allow some pretty blatantly misogynistic bullshit to pass.

Could he be sex repulsed? Sure. Could he have spent so much time in the depths of the internet that his expectation of what a woman would be to him is now really warped? That seems more likely. And if he is sex repulsed, this time spent in the bowels of the internet is why he’s expressing himself like this.

Could he be ace, and just expressing that in some really misogynistic ways? I guess? But why is that the *first* thing people jumped to???

And as for the people wondering what he has to tell his parents… Yeah, that sucks. It sucks when your parents keep asking you about any prospective partners. But people don’t usually come out as someone who is only attracted to anime. I told mine to stop asking, and that seemed to work alright. (After a few times.)

A reminder that aphobes have been super vocal on how asexuality isn’t real, and doesn’t belong in the LGBTQ+ grouping, for literal years now. So any ‘innocent’ questioning that echoes their bullshit automatically gets a huge side eye from me.

A better framing would be: “i don’t know much about asexuality, could anyone recommend some links or articles, or if they feel comfortable, share their experiences?”

Note how i never allowed the idea that it wasn’t freaking real in my question. Imagine doing this with anything else!

Catalpa
Catalpa
1 year ago

Also the next sentence about “taking our word for it” sounds a little bit patronising??
[…] Imagine if we were talking about transphobia and you said this sentence??

I meant it sincerely, but maybe it’s an inherently patronising expression? I sometimes fail language, typically by being overly honest/literal.

I’ve literally seen allies say that with regards to trans people’s gender identity and its importance.

I accept that you meant taking our word for it genuinely and intended no harm. However, for future reference, I’ll try to illuminate why your use of the phrase came across as patronizing when the phrase doesn’t always do that.

Someone who says: “I’ve never witnessed or experienced transphobia, but I take trans people’s word that it does exist, because they have more knowledge on the subject than I do.” is doing fine.

Someone who says “hey, is being trans really a valid identity? I mean, is it really any different from experiencing bullying for not conforming exactly to prescribed gender roles?” is not doing fine.

And after that second person gets educated about transphobia and the challenges that trans people face, saying something like “whoa, I had no idea people were so sensitive about this. All right, I’ll take your word for it.” Comes across as incredibly patronizing and basically saying ‘whatever, I don’t really believe you, but if this will get you off my back then fine’.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
1 year ago

Rhuu:

A reminder that aphobes have been super vocal on how asexuality isn’t real, and doesn’t belong in the LGBTQ+ grouping, for literal years now. So any ‘innocent’ questioning that echoes their bullshit automatically gets a huge side eye from me.

OK, that’s a landmine I totally failed to anticipate. Generally, I failed to consider how my wording could be seen as expressing reluctance towards asexual inclusion. I was starting from the premise that, in progressive consensus, asexuality is indeed considered both an orientation and a real thing generally.

A better framing would be: “i don’t know much about asexuality, could anyone recommend some links or articles, or if they feel comfortable, share their experiences?”

I might have asked for resources on how sexual orientation is defined (and why that way), particularly in LGTBQ+ discourse. Or better yet, I might have just done the research myself, starting from Wikipedia.

My mentioning asexuality was unnecessary to begin with, since I was mainly interested in the orientation vs. kink distinction, which describes sexual attraction, not lack thereof. Besides, extensive wanking on that distinction in this thread would have been kind of derailing from the misogyny.

Rhuu - apparently an illiterati
Rhuu - apparently an illiterati
1 year ago

That’s really well put, Catalpa.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
1 year ago

Catalpa – Thanks.

Sheila Crosby
1 year ago

@alan

DON’T! (with a subtitle)
The Injuction Function
Judge is the boss of you.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

@ Shiela

Thank you! I definitely need something. Currently it’s the “You’re not my mum…” one; and that’s a bit clumsy.

We do have a new pic for the animal law page on my website though. What do peeps think? Is this the right sort of image?

comment image

Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Meanie
Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Meanie
1 year ago

@Alan,

My idea was similar to Shiela – ‘Injunction Junction, What’s Your Function?’, but I strongly suspect that the number of non-USAsians who’d get the joke is rather small.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NWBO9NAYm-U

(Schoolhouse Rock for the win. 😀 )

And was I the only one reading the OP who thought the ‘anime orientation’ guy was actually trying for (for lack of a better term) a share of the SJW cookies? Like, for example, gay people can get limited job protection based on their orientation; perhaps this brother thought if he declared himself an ‘anime sexual’ (or whatever that would be called), he could get identical protections for himself?

Without, you know, making himself an icky gay person (from his POV) to get those sweet sweet legal protections. And if he doesn’t like the way people like him are portrayed in the media, he can say so and the world will fall over itself to make things ‘right’ again, just like they do with gay people when they don’t like their media portrayals.

(And I know that that’s not how it works in the real world, but from what I can tell from David’s reporting, their are a fair amount of guts who do think it’s that easy for the ‘not like them’ people to change the world. If that makes sense.)

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
1 year ago

@Alan something referencing not being “up the (in)Junction” – is that still well-known enough an expression? dunno quite how one might phrase it, though.
(for non-Brits, it’s an old London slang expression something like “up shit creek/up the creek”)