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It’s IMPEACHIN’ TIME: Open thread

Nancy Pelosi. after an interminable delay, has finally announced the start of a formal impeachment inquiry into Trump’s egregious conduct. We still don’t know what exactly this will mean, but things are definitely starting to heat up for Trump.

Discuss. No trolls.

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Victorious Parasol
1 year ago

@ Lainy

Congratulations! May next month, and all the years to come, bring you joy.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

@Naglfar

Thanks, I had forgotten that C4twoman also thinks autistic people who don’t make eye contact are “lazy.” What an empathetic person!

Dalillama
Dalillama
1 year ago

@Ohlmann
Hillary Clinton was quite popular on these boards as I recall. As far as present day politics, Joe Biden is not currently a government official of any sort, so nothing he’s doing is as outrageous as the head of the House of Representatives actively sanctioning our ongoing descent into utter fascism.

Moon Custafer
1 year ago

Open-thread brag: I completed the first draft of my first novel last Sunday; it’s very short (48,000 words), but I can probably bump that up to at least 50,000 in the revisions.

Big Titty Demon
Big Titty Demon
1 year ago

@Naglfar

Anyone who isn’t standing up to the fascists is one of them.

I understand the rhetorical point you are trying to make, but We Wept Without Tears is a book documenting how it is not always so, and the erasure of entire stories of pain and suffering due to that perception. There are less extreme variants and gradations of similar situations. Not everyone is a fighter.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Big Titty Demon
You’re right, I should have been clearer. What I meant was that by not using her power to stand up to Trump, she is complicit in his regime. I did not mean to erase the suffering of others. Sorry.

Katamount
1 year ago

Gonna second what Naglfar said about Pelosi and her “”””cold calculations””””” leading her not to defend members of her own caucus (namely AOC and Ilhan Omar).

Which makes the blind faith that some of the crowd over on Wonkette have in Pelosi all the more baffling. Granted, opinions in their (non-)comment section are split given Pelosi’s obfuscation since becoming Speaker, but still, there’s enough of them there that post that dumb photo of her with the sunglasses saying “She Got This!”

M’kay. Should happened months ago with some moral fortitude, but I guess if this is all we got….

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@c4twomen

Then leave asshole. No one wants you or your trash opinion here. If we were talking in person I’d say that to your face without blinking even once.

Garnetstar
Garnetstar
1 year ago

Pelosi waited until now because she needs an impeachment case that won’t lose the House for the democrats in 2020.

The first responsibility of the democrats is to preserve democratic government in America, and not let it sink into a fascist dictatorship. The House is the only thing that stands between that and the preservation of the government. If Trump should be re-elected, and the House goes republican, that’s the end of America.

So Pelosi was proceeding slowly to build an absolutely solid impeachment case that could not be seen as some kind of partisan power play. They were collecting information in committees, to try to get that.

What has changed is that Trump confessed on national television to crimes, specifically to bribery, which is mentioned explicitly in the constitution as an impeachable offense. She’s got what she needed out of his own mouth, now she can run with it.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

Trump, while pronouncing that the impeachment was Totally Good For Him, The Best, said the following:

This never happened where we’re in the election,

I know all of these words, but put together like this they have no meaning. Text-generating bots are more coherent than this moron.

moregeekthan
moregeekthan
1 year ago

I would argue that, from a rhetorical standpoint, it’s better to reserve the term “white supremacist” for folks who are Steven Miller/Donald Trump-level racists.

Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
1 year ago

comment image

kupo
kupo
1 year ago

I would argue that, from a rhetorical standpoint, it’s better to reserve the term “white supremacist” for folks who are Steven Miller/Donald Trump-level racists.

And I would argue that not calling out people who uphold white supremacy because they’re not as bad as other people who uphold white supremacy sends the message that white supremacy is tolerable in small amounts. It is not.

Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
Jesalin, Goddess of Lust & Pleasure
1 year ago

And I would argue that not calling out people who uphold white supremacy because they’re not as bad as other people who uphold white supremacy sends the message that white supremacy is tolerable in small amounts. It is not.

This.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

And I would argue that not calling out people who uphold white supremacy because they’re not as bad as other people who uphold white supremacy sends the message that white supremacy is tolerable in small amounts. It is not.

And if we want to be any better than the Republicans, we need to call out white supremacy no matter what party it appears in.
There is no safe level of white supremacy.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

All form of racism is bad. Calling one worse then the other is like saying it’s okay to catcall a woman because its not like it’s rape. Both are bad and both make up rape culture. Even the smallest form of racism holds up white supremacy and it all needs to be snuffed out

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

Also thanks for the wedding wishes. Its been actually pretty funny planning. I have a lot of older relatives that keep asking me where we are going for our honey moon and it’s like… Fam were generation z. We’re poor. I make 20 dollars an hour and it’s part time.

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@Lainy

Congrats on your wedding!

@Garnetstar

No, she wasn’t “slowly gathering evidence”. There’s been plenty of evidence on several impeachable offenses, and her first reaction to finding out the news about Ukraine was to double down on the whole “we are not impeaching him”.

No, she had to be dragged by her caucus to pursue this. It was also not a calculated effort not to lose the House in 2018, because even after she won she refused to impeach him.

Though I will admit it might be because she knows the Senate will block it and spin a victim narrative. But that strategy can be just as dangerous too, because by staying silent they just empower him to do more harm. So far he’s been attacking democrats nonstop, yet they offer little to no counter.

But other than that the narrative that Pelosi is a brilliant strategist, biding her time until Trump makes a mistake is ludicrous. She has been merely staying inside her comfort zone, so a not jeopardize her own political interests and career. If not she would have been impeaching him over the concentration camps he’s putting people of my ethnicity in, the moment she got the chance.

Johanna
Johanna
1 year ago

So, er, how’s QAnon going to spin this one, do we know? Me? I’m popping the popcorn and resolving to never feeling bad about a typo in an email EVER AGAIN.

https://theweek.com/speedreads/867641/white-house-accidentally-emailed-ukraine-talking-points-nancy-pelosi

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
1 year ago

@Jesalin, Garnetstar, Diego Duarte:
From what I’ve been hearing elsewhere, a lot of the push for impeachment now comes from other ‘centrist’ Democrats like Pelosi who just got back from the House recess and told her of the holy hell they’d been getting from their constituents over all this, along with risks of being primaried from the left and the possibility of a lot more folks like AOC getting into the House. That was Pelosi’s tipping point, that she was losing control within the party and a lot of her ‘safe’ compatriots weren’t feeling safe anymore.

Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Meanie
Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Meanie
1 year ago

Since this is an open thread, I figure it’s as good a spot as any to dump some links. First is an article about the current research into animal consciousness, and the problems inherent in just defining the term ‘consciousness’ to begin with:

https://getpocket.com/explore/item/a-journey-into-the-animal-mind?utm_source=pocket-newtab

The second is an update on the dogfighting dogs seized from Michael Vick a decade ago. The article not only covers the lives they lived after their rescue, but how their successful rehabilitation showed how other rescued dogfighters could also be saved from being automatically put down:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/sports/michael-vick-dogfighting-dogs/?utm_source=pocket-newtab

And now for something completely different: for those who claim that dragons don’t real because nothing could ever get that big and heavy and still fly, I present to you you….Cryodrakon!

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/new-dinosaur-the-size-of-a-plane-discovered-in-canada-a4237611.html

You’re welcome. 😀

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@jenora Feuer

Thank you! THAT sounds like a much, more reasonable and believable explanation than “Pelosi is playing 3D, astral dimension chess with Trump”. She absolutely loathes AOC and progressives, and they know we might be coming after them.

Hopefully she does get primaried because, despite Trump and Right wing pundits encouraging violence against AOC and Latinos, she thought it was a fine idea to attack and isolate her. Part of me wishes it was only a coincidence, but I believe she took the opportunity of all the violence being committed against us to try and “send a message”.

Trump then pounced on the chance and turned up the volume to 11 with his racist attacks, which further emboldened those who already wanted to hurt or kill her.

I will NOT hear a word of defense about Pelosi on this matter. What she did was highly irresponsible at best, and malevolent and manipulative at worst.

Garnetstar
Garnetstar
1 year ago

@diego Duarte:

‘No, she wasn’t “slowly gathering evidence”. There’s been plenty of evidence on several impeachable offenses, and her first reaction to finding out the news about Ukraine was to double down on the whole “we are not impeaching him”.

Yes, at first Pelosi didn’t favor impeachment over the Ukraine scandal.

Then Trump confessed to the crimes on national television. That’s what she needed, and she moved on it.

Betrayer
Betrayer
1 year ago

“The first responsibility of the democrats is to preserve democratic government in America, and not let it sink into a fascist dictatorship.”

No, the first responsibility the Democrat leadership has is preserving capitalism and the status quo, even if that means letting America turn into a fascist dictatorship.

Liberals hate socialists more than fascists. Always have.

An Impish Pepper
An Impish Pepper
1 year ago

I don’t really know if this is some kind of white liberal thing, but it astounds me that, even with the system having broken down to this extent, any non-conservative would still insist on defending centrist Democrats’ actions and be more offended by accusations of racism than the actual racism and its consequences. It’s as if they’ve envisioned a line of acceptable racism that was crossed in 2015 when Trump announced his latest, and successful, run for president. Until then I guess racism didn’t exist?

People are like, the Democrats have to strategically cave to Trump, otherwise he’ll gain even more power and break THE SYSTEM and that’s the end of America. Well, “America” is just an idea. It has already been the end of far, far too many Americans, and other people in the world, as a result of, yes, white supremacy, and it stretches back to before Trump. People are like, we can’t let America slip into a fascist dictatorship. Well, again, for far too many Americans, it may as well already have been a fascist dictatorship before Trump. But I guess none of that matters as much as the precious system.

And then they wonder why people under 40 aren’t enthusiastic about voting for them.

Yutolia the Laissez-Fairy Pronoun Boner
Yutolia the Laissez-Fairy Pronoun Boner
1 year ago

@C4twoman:

She may not be a dyed-in-the-wool, sheet-wearing, cross-burning white supremacist, but her refusal to act for so long makes her at least majorly privileged and willfully ignorant.

@Lainy:

That’s really cool! I’m so happy for you. I wish I could come to the wedding.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

I’m sorry that this is ot again but this was just to strange not to share.

I think I just witnessed the strangest form of a cat call in my life? I was with my very pregnant sister in law at forever 21 to look some stretchy dresses to be maternity dresses, and as we were leaving some guy was driving really slowly past us, looked at her and then yelled “next one is gonna be mine girl, get ready” to her and I’m just like??? who cat calls a 7 month pregnant woman. It was both very creepy and bewildering.

She found it gross but also funny. she said to me “I’d rather be able to see my own feet right now instead of anyone’s dick”

I promise this is the last time I’ll go off topic. I’m use to creeps yelling stuff at me but this was just on a whole different world for me. I guess I assumed when I was pregnant is when I’d be more safe from street harassment.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

Happy Wedding Lainy!!!

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@Lainy

Well, you probably know this better than anyone, but catcalling isn’t about romance, just about exerting control. I’ve seen men catcall women with strollers before:

“Hey babe, I can make you another one just like him!”.

The only rationale that seems consistent with the creeps is that women have to be alone and in a public setting. Men cannot tolerate women who dare to be out in public without their fathers or significant others. It’s all about putting women “back in their place”, which in a patriarchal setting is always the private setting.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@Diego Duarte

I wouldn’t say I know it better then anyone. I’m still young and learning a lot about the world everyday. I never thought of catcalling of having to do with romance or even anything remotely close to lust. I’ve always just seeing as creeps being creepy, and to always be watching out because one of those creeps might decided to kill you. It just amazed me I suppose.

@Alan
Thank you.

Big Titty Demon
Big Titty Demon
1 year ago

@Redsilkphoenix

Hey another person interested in this topic! Have you read Are We Smart Enough To Know How Smart Animals Are?? I will definitely read this article and share it around my immediate interest group. ^_^

Also, I have a rescue dog from a fighting ring. She is a sweetie who unfortunately never makes friends because pitbulls have a bad rep and people are so nervous they literally cross the street when she is coming up the road with me, but they can 100% have good lives after the terrible shit people do to them. She was only in for a year and then she was put in a shelter to die, but got sent to the vet hospital to become a student surgery animal instead (and then die), which is where I got her from. I knew the student vet and she couldn’t bear to let her die, but could not have a pitbull at her apartment either. Any rate she has all these belly scars which itch quite a lot in the summer, but other than that and a crippling fear of fireworks and extreme dislike of men not related to me, she came out ok! (To be honest I am ok with her wariness of men as I have been sexually assaulted twice by strangers [and many more than this by a relative but let’s not talk about that], so I find it a wee bit comforting. You will have to forgive me. Recovery is a process.)

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@Lainy

Sorry, didn’t mean to assume, but I also didn’t want to come accross mansplaining something that women have far more experience with, as well as more insight as to why it happens.

ObSidJag
ObSidJag
1 year ago

@Lainy:
Echoing the others who’ve wished you well on you upcoming marriage. I hope your wedding day is everything you want it to be and that you and your beloved will always be the apple in each other’s eyes.

Re pitbulls: I’m a contrarian: if I see someone walking a pittie, I go out of my way to approach both owner & dog & ask if I may pet their dog. I also usually comment on how good the dog looks because they’re usually in excellent shape.

It’s my way of trying to offset some of the crap pits & pit lovers have to put up with.

Dalillama
Dalillama
1 year ago

@Big Titty Demon

She is a sweetie who unfortunately never makes friends because pitbulls have a bad rep and people are so nervous they literally cross the street when she is coming up the road with me,

That’s a shame. She should have more human friends. Give her some scritches for me.
IME, pitties are incredible sweeties generally. They’re fairly popular around here, and don’t usually generate nearly such bad reactions. It’s not at all uncommon to see somone sitting outdoors at a bar or cafe with a pibble who’s surrounded by humans gushing over them. Of course, pretty much any dog that’s not a service dog or actively shy or hostile is likely to get that. It’s a very dog-friendly town.

Snowberry
Snowberry
1 year ago

Whoever runs Merriam-Webster’s Twitter has occasionally been taking what appear to be subtle potshots at Trump. This one’s on topic, and more blatant than usual:

https://twitter.com/MerriamWebster/status/1176828700442206209

(I don’t use Twitter and have no idea how to embed tweets)

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
1 year ago

I do the same as ObSidJag when I meet dogs too, especially the big and/or “fierce” breeds, because a) a gorgeous doggo is a gorgeous doggo, and b) there’s no such thing as too much low-key quiet socialisation and c) their owners usually seem to like it when somebody greets and admires their dog instead of skirting away from it 🙂

This dog-greeting impulse goes double since last week because I’m a bit extra shattered from losing ours. We’d had her for fifteen years, from a rescue centre (where she was taken after being found abandoned in the street). Her health was good for most of her life, I’m glad to say, but last week she was at the end of the road and we decided to take her to the vet while she still had a last tiny bit of QoL left (she spent the previous few days lying in the sun mostly). Decent vet, and we could cuddle her while the vet very competently gave her an overdose of anaesthetic.

I’m always very careful to “ask the dog’s permission” when greeting a stranger-dog, of course (you know, the body-language stuff – not looming over them and not staring them in the eye, letting the dog do the last bit of approaching, and making sure they’ve got plenty of room to back away if they want to etc.). It worries me when kids go straight for a dog without checking; if the dog’s nervous or afraid of people, what’s it supposed to do?

Anyway, please ‘scuse the semi-OT and the rambling; I guess the thread has veered a wee bit off Trump at this point :-s and also yay for friendly pit-bulls and other “fierce” dogs.

yours in dog-appreciation
and in hope that both the US’ and the UK’s over-privileged blond liars are at last in enough political trouble to put the brakes on their vile works.

numerobis
numerobis
1 year ago

Betrayer: indeed. The centrist democrats clearly are appalled at the tone and language but on substance they don’t care that much about what Trump is doing. He’s keeping the oil flowing, he’s leaving taxes low, he’s not arresting too many rich people.

Ohlmann: I doubt you’ll find much support for Biden here. There’s no opposition to what he’s doing in his official capacity as head of X in government… because he’s not in government. He’s not even a presidential candidate yet, he’s running for that position (and theres no guarantee he’ll win).

numerobis
numerobis
1 year ago

opposablethumbs: and letting the dog sniff you? I find that’s the part that really gets a mammal to trust me, that I present a body part (usually my hand) for inspection. Works with cats, horses, mice, …

I don’t know about birds and lizards.

A. Noyd
A. Noyd
1 year ago

Diego Duarte said:

Though I will admit it might be because she knows the Senate will block it and spin a victim narrative. […] So far he’s been attacking democrats nonstop, yet they offer little to no counter.

Which is just so fucking stupid because the second Trump made a peep about anything anyone else did in Ukraine, the Dems should have started beating him over the head non-stop with Paul Manafort and his murderous, money-grubbing lobbying work there, all of which ties in so neatly to the Mueller investigation.

I see the MSM is finally beginning to bring up this angle, at least.

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
1 year ago

@numerobis,

and letting the dog sniff you?

Yes, absolutely. Inspection is important 🙂

Catalpa
Catalpa
1 year ago

So Pelosi was proceeding slowly to build an absolutely solid impeachment case that could not be seen as some kind of partisan power play. They were collecting information in committees, to try to get that.

This sounds a lot like the story we got told about how the Mueller investigation was proceeding so slowly because Mueller was building an airtight case that would absolutely destroy Trump and bring balance to the force the return of reasonable politics and a win for progressive causes everywhere. We just needed to be patient and quiet until then, and we would all be rescued from this hellscape!

And as we all know, that’s exactly what happen– oh wait, no. It didn’t.

But it is a rather handy way of keeping discontent down, isn’t it?

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@Catalpa

Pretty much. How much more evidence do you need when the guy has committed so many impeachable offenses already?

The concentration camps should be ground enough to impeach him. As of today, the DHS still has the 1488 dogwhistles in their website:

https://www.dhs.gov/news/2018/02/15/we-must-secure-border-and-build-wall-make-america-safe-again

No inquiries or sanctions are being leveled at any of the 10,000 Custom Border officers who were sharing memes of AOC being raped by Trump, or mocking dead Latino children.

No inquiries or sanctions have been filed against ICE and their blatant abuse of authority and many crimes against humanity, nor the systematic abuse, torture and rape of children.

One week before the Chrischurch massacre in New Zealand, the asshole shut down the DHS division dedicated to investigating White supremacy and relaying info to the FBI.

He then proceeded to threaten antifascists saying he would declare them a terrorist organization.

All of this has been committed in broad daylight and people still have the nerve to turn around and say “b-but we didn’t have enough evidence to impeach him!”

Fucking really?

Hambeast
Hambeast
1 year ago

My strategy for greeting dogs in public places is to place myself just outside of the dog’s sniffing range (i.e. the dog has to step forward to get a close sniff) while talking to the dog’s people. If and when the dog steps forward to sniff my leg (or whatever), I then “notice” the pup and start talking to him/her: “Oh! Look at you, aren’t you just the nicest doggie here!” At that point, the dog is usually wagging and prancing at me and I’ll get a pet in if the people say it’s okay. This has always worked for me with well-socialized dogs and even a few shy ones.

Of course, the dogs that it won’t work for usually move away to a ‘safer’ position and that’s okay! Also, some dogs will move in right away and climb my leg. I ignore that until they settle and sit before I give attention, which they almost always do.

But I always listen to dog owners and adjust my behavior if needed and never approach an accompanied dog without permission.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

There is an adorable little puppy that lives in my apartment complex. I don’t know the owners name but his name is bean and he’s a little brown floof ball who is the most friendly dog I’ve ever met. He lets anyone pet him and when you try to walk away after petting him he tries to chase after you because he doesn’t want you to go.

his owner says to him “come on bean, you have to let her go” and he doesn’t want to. He wants to make friends with everyone. Even the stray cats and random rabbits that come into the court yard. And he can’t seem to understand why this rabbit or cat doesn’t want to be his friend. He is the sweetest little thing I’ve ever seen.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@Diego

You don’t have to worry. I didn’t read your reply as manslaining at all. I was just saying that because in the last couple of years I’ve went from my very tiny farm town to living in a city and it’s very different. I got harassment before yes, but it happens a lot more frequently now since I’m in a city now full of strangers.

Victorious Parasol
1 year ago

According to CNN, the House now has 218 members who support impeachment:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/23/politics/democrats-impeachment-whip-list/index.html

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
1 year ago

Fortunately two or three of the neighbours have got friendly dogs. I can get the occasional dog-cuddle fix when I’m missing ours too much 🙁

An envelope came today from the vet’s – I was surprised to see anything from them, because I knew I’d paid the fee when we took her in – and turns out they send a condolence card, I guess they send one each time they have to euthanase. I thought I was being all sensible since last week, but it kind of set me off again :-s

Moon Custafer
1 year ago

The other night, a gentleman was in one of my building’s elevators with a cute little French bulldog. When the dog began to wander too far, and pull at the leash, he murmured “Vene, vene,” and then, in a mild but firm tone: “Sedet.”

Was I imagining things, or does his dog know Latin?

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@Moon Custafer

Well, technically French is derived from Latin, so he might get the gist of it. In contrast, English might be difficult for it.

Dalillama
Dalillama
1 year ago

@Lainy

He wants to make friends with everyone. Even the stray cats and random rabbits that come into the court yard. And he can’t seem to understand why this rabbit or cat doesn’t want to be his friend. He is the sweetest little thing I’ve ever seen.

Our pupper is friends with our rats. (Mostly; Baldrick hates him, but he hates the other rats too, so)

http://imgur.com/gallery/waeubL5

http://imgur.com/gallery/8dMi2rO