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“Gender Critical” Redditor: Trans women are ruining porn recommendations

It’s positively shocking!

By David Futrelle

Can “Gender Critical” feminists — a.k.a. TERFs — talk about anything without turning the discussion into an excuse to bash trans women?

I was browsing through the Gender Critical feminism subreddit — Reddit’s main hangout for Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminists —
and ran across a discussion of the ever-more-extreme nature of online porn.

“Stuff from 10 years was your soft porn – missionary, blowjobs, and sure, male orientated but the female had some sort of pleasure at least,” wrote a commenter called DetectiveSpaghetti.

These days the dark stuff (the hardcore youd find ONLY if you really wanted to find) its everywhere. Anal sex, face-fucking, its the norm not the exception. Its disgusting

I don’t doubt that porn is getting more extreme, but anal sex? People have been putting things in their butts for thousands of years, and I’m pretty sure that there were plenty of anal sex videos readily available ten years ago.

Someone called DowntownOrange replied:

Yeah, I went to see what they had in some supposedly soft core/female-oriented category and one of the first vids was something like “skinny teen gets her ***** destroyed by 5 big guys”

She followed up with more results from her, er, research:

I just went to pornhub again to check what they called it and the category name is “romantic”, the first vid is called “Giving her good dick after falling on her Ass In night club”, the third one is “I suck him in the public pool shower and he cums all over me”. Incredible.

She’s got a point, or at least half of one, in that not all of the titles in the “romantic” category are particularly romantic in nature. I just went and browsed the first couple of pages of “romantic” results on PornHub and the titles listed ranged from “Couple have romantic sex” and “Passionate couple falls in love having sex” to slightly-less-romantic-sounding titles like “30-year-old Slav very much asked to work on her fat ass” (huh?) and “Romantic sex leaves her showered in …” well, you get the idea.

It’s at this point the discussion got a little weird.

There’s a separate one “popular with women” that apparently shows the vids that “real women” watch the most. I do wonder how many of those “real women” have dicks though, skewing the results, considering TiMs are obsessed with porn…

Yep, she’s accusing trans women of messing up the video recommendations for cis women with their (presumably) degenerate tastes in porn. (A TIM, or Trans-Identified Male, is deliberately misgendered TERFspeak for trans women.)

I went and looked at the “popular with women” section of PornHub too, and honestly the only particularly weird video I noticed involved someone called Miss Banana taking something called the “Fire Noodle Challenge while getting Fucked.”

I don’t know if it was cis or trans women (or both groups working together) who got that video onto the front page of the “popular with women” category, but I can report that Miss Banana did in fact manage to eat the entire bowl.

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LaserJay
LaserJay
1 year ago

Yep, she’s accusing trans women of messing up the video recommendations for cis women with their (presumably) degenerate tastes in porn.

Why does this sound like an incel complaint?

Talonknife
Talonknife
1 year ago

Isn’t it pretty well known that a lot of titles on PornHub are designed to be YouTube-style keyword search manipulation and not accurate descriptions of the video’s content?

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
1 year ago

Any time I go to PornHub, its location-based algorithm shows me nothing but damn incest (stepmom/ stepsister) videos because apparently that’s what’s hawt in Ireland right now. I suppose that’s trans peoples’ fault too? 🙄

Lyla
Lyla
1 year ago

Her browser cookies, that’s what’s showing her trans stuff. Turn on private bring she’d probs get completely different stuff.

Brandy
Brandy
1 year ago

I can report that Miss Banana did in fact manage to eat the entire bowl.

Thank you for your service.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

I’m actually surprised these TERFs are watching porn at all. I’d imagine most TERFs are also SWERFs/sex-negative and wouldn’t approve of porn use.
As for whether porn has gotten better or worse, I’m no expert, but from what I know, there are way more options available for people with niche interests or who want to see certain things. Sure, the hardcore stuff might be more hardcore, but if you don’t like that then don’t watch it. As well, the amount of feminist and indie porn is much greater than it was 10 years ago, so I imagine more women are watching and enjoying porn now, rather than what these TERFs seem to be implying.
I’m also a little surprised they didn’t mention the presence of trans and non-binary performers, seeing as trans porn appears to be popular now. I’m sure the TERFs are pissed about that too.

Nequam
Nequam
1 year ago

Funny– David Foster Wallace’s “Big Red Son” essay posited that the more brutal porn was being driven by misogyny, not trans people. Make of that what you will.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

I expect the TERFs are looking at porn for the same reason their close allies in the Religious Right claim to – to find evidence of how evil and degenerate their targets are. Especially given the massive crossover between TERFs and SWERFs, like Professional Liar Gail Dines.

Fact is, misogynistic porn IS a lot easier to find these days. So is feminist porn. And porn catering to virtually every fetish. (Except freckles, for some reason.) Because porn in general is easier to find.

(That said, the seeming ubiquity of “step-incest” porn – on mainstream sites – recently seems pretty bizarre to me. It seems like every studio, and every performer, is getting in on it.)

So yeah, unsurprisingly I did recognize Cory Chase in the header photo. The internet is for porn, after all.

Dormousing_it
Dormousing_it
1 year ago

Christ, that whole thread. Shades of the Huxley novel, Brave New World. It makes me feel grateful to be a married, middle-aged person.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

TERFs always sounded shitty, but it seems they’ve gotten worse the last couple of years. Like the MRM, they are now virtually indistinguishable from Nazis. It’s sort of interesting and terrifying how various terrible internet subcultures have morphed into one even worse mega subculture.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Allandrel
Freckles are hard to find? I’m surprised. That seems like a common enough thing that it wouldn’t be so hard.
I recall Gail Dines being a SWERF, but I don’t remember her being transphobic. It doesn’t surprise me at all though, seeing as like you said there is definitely an overlap.

@WWTH
It seems like there are more of them as well. I thought they had decreased in number, but apparently they are back. I’m worried that soon they will become violent and start publicly assaulting trans people.
It’s also probably not long before they become white nationalists and declare that only white cis women are women.

TheKND
TheKND
1 year ago

Ok, let’s be serious for a moment:
Softcore porn was a thing to get around network requirements!
FFS, I remember back in the days, when there was a noticeable difference between the softcore stuff on late-night TV and the stuff on late night pay-TV.
And that softcore wasn’t “female-oriented”.
Oh… and tag-cheating on an online video platform? STOP THE PRESSES!

vaiyt
vaiyt
1 year ago

(thing) is ruined! It must be the fault of (people I hate)!

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

@Naglfar

It’s REALLY WEIRD what gets tagged and what doesn’t. Like, I think about the sexiest thing a woman can do is laugh, but good luck finding that through search algorithms.

@TheKND
Yeah, the “stuff 10 years ago was softcore” is patently ridiculous. Porn on the internet has always run the gamut to meet audience preferences.

Of course, many of these TERFs/SWERFs engage in a lot of Humpty-Dumptying with the terms “softcore” and “hardcore.” The industry has a pretty simple definition – “softcore” means any sex acts depicted are simulated, and “hardcore” means the depiction of unsimulated sex acts.

Whereas TERFs/SWERFs usually use “hardcore” to mean “anything I don’t like,” as seen in the OP.

(The workings of the porn industry are one of the special interests that I developed an autistic fixation on and read way too much about. Right after medieval angelology and right before the history of the G.I. Joe franchise.)

kupo
kupo
1 year ago

I can report that Miss Banana did in fact manage to eat the entire bowl.

I love a good ending. Thanks for…uh…researching this for us.

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
1 year ago

I’m actually surprised these TERFs are watching porn at all. I’d imagine most TERFs are also SWERFs/sex-negative and wouldn’t approve of porn use.

I have no idea what the stats are on who uses porn and how much and why, but I do have an impression that men use porn more than women, and guess what?

Over on Pharyngula & FtB generally almost all the “gender critical” people seem to be men bravely protecting women from the sexism of having gender categories destabilized and the resulting rape of the women no longer protected by rigid gender categories by the “undesirable” humans.

It is, of course, a truly noble, feminist calling in which men have selflessly engaged for centuries in their efforts to stamp out oppression.

:eyeroll:

Moon Custafer
Moon Custafer
1 year ago

@Allandrel:

That said, the seeming ubiquity of “step-incest” porn – on mainstream sites – recently seems pretty bizarre to me. It seems like every studio, and every performer, is getting in on it.

Perhaps (since I assume they don’t have to show proof the participants are actually related) it’s a way of selling a fairly standard video as something extra-kinky without requiring the performers to do anything different than usual except use familial terms of address?

The workings of the porn industry are one of the special interests that I developed an autistic fixation on and read way too much about. Right after medieval angelology and right before the history of the G.I. Joe franchise.)

Think of the novel you could write!

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Allandrel, Moon Custafer
I’d read that novel. G. I. Joe shoots a porno with some angels? It can be a companion to the novel about all the things I read too much about. Whenever I find a way to combine airliners, cetaceans, and Greenlandic culture.

As for the thing about incest porn, this article has some ideas as to the popularity. I’m not really into porn, but I can sort of understand the appeal from a Freudian perspective.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

@Moon Custafer, Naglfar

I could easily see Cobra* getting into porn as a way to generate revenue** and put out subliminal indoctrination.

As for the angels, it could be a crossover with In Nomine where Andrealphus, the Demon Prince of Lust and Mammon, the Demon Prince of Greed get involved with Cobra’s porn scheme. So some angels have to infiltrate G.I. Joe to help counter them.

*G.I. Joe’s perennial Ruthless Terrorist Organization Determined To Rule The World
** Cobra’s main source of revenue is not ransom demands, or arms dealing (though they do both). It’s a pyramid scheme based on selling household cleaning products. While many companies and countries in G.I. Joe are given fictitious analogues, this pyramid scheme is never, ever named, strongly implying that it is not “something like Amway” but in fact IS Amway.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

@Naglfar

Oh man, that article mentions “wincest.”

Shadowplay
1 year ago

So yeah, unsurprisingly I did recognize Cory Chase in the header photo. The internet is for porn, after all.

Never did know her name – just recognised her from Ted Cruz’ “accidental” retweet of that one.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

Sometimes straight porn ends up in the gay searches. This just means that the search engine isn’t perfect.

Bina
1 year ago

Amazing how much these “Gender Critical Feminists” actually sound like incel dudes kvetching about “Muh Pornoz”.

Surely just a malign coincidence!

(/s, in case needed.)

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
1 year ago

@ Cat Mara:

I suppose that’s trans peoples’ fault too? 🙄

Obama’s

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

Also the idea that straight cis gender people don’t like anal sex is really odd to me. That’s like saying no one thought of doing oral sex on their partner until internet porn was created.

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
1 year ago

@Lainy:

What is this “oral sex” you mention?

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@Crip Dyke

For a second there I was really concerned that I somehow spelled oral wrong and actually googled it to make sure I spelt it right.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

Also side note when you google search oral it also gives you suggestion that other people have searched for. The second one was “human sexual activity” which I am pretty sure is a bunch of aliens.

Pie
Pie
1 year ago

Uh, isn’t the categorisation on sites like pornhub more or less decided upon by the video uploader? I mean, what’s to stop me uploading a video of a cat being chased off by a cockerel, titling it PUSSY DESTROYED BY GIANT ANGRY COCK and tagging it with “romantic” if I wanted?

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
1 year ago

what’s to stop me uploading a video of a cat being chased off by a cockerel, titling it PUSSY DESTROYED BY GIANT ANGRY COCK and tagging it with “romantic”

I WILL PAY YOU ALL THE MONIES TO MAKE THIS PORN NOW.

Also, too: There’s this guy.
And this woman. [Note: 2nd link is to SFW videos, but the fact that they’re hosted by Pornhub means that inevitably you’ll have NSFW video recommendations on the same page, so… ultimately even if what I’m trying to show you is SFW, the page as a whole is DEFINITELY NSFW.]

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
1 year ago

@Lainy:

It’s safest if you just assume that absolutely, literally everything written by me has a [sarcasm] tag. Only take it seriously if you’ve considered all the sarcastic interpretations and none of them make any sense (and/ or would require you to interpret me as saying something pro-incel/MRA/Gender Critical/racist/dirtbag/Trump).

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
1 year ago

@Allandrell:

Do you have any links on the Cobra/Amway connection? I mean, you’re serious right? I mean, yes, the world is fictional, Cobra doesn’t exist, but you’re serious that in that fictional world Cobra is getting its money as Amway?

That is funny as fuck, and puts a great spin on the evil of Betsy DeVos.

Moggie
Moggie
1 year ago

I’m not into porn (because ace), so this may be my naivety speaking, but the argument that “people are into incest porn because it’s taboo” sounds unconvincing to me. If that were true, wouldn’t we witness a similarly large increase in porn depicting other gross taboos, such as necrophilia?

Talonknife
Talonknife
1 year ago

Meanwhile, I know from, uh… research… that when you search “twink” on Pornhub, half the videos that come up involve performers that are clearly hunks instead. Who do I complain to about this?

Lukas Xavier
Lukas Xavier
1 year ago

I’m pretty sure that there were plenty of anal sex videos readily available ten years ago.

Indeed. I had a conversation with a coworker who was complaining about the normalization of anal sex… back in 2001.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
1 year ago

@Weird Eddie:

I suppose that’s trans peoples’ fault too? 🙄

Obama’s

Well, damn. I bet he was the one who made them change the name of their category of porn featuring trans women from a commonly-used slur too! It’s political correctness gone mad ARGLE BARGLE

@Crip Dyke: Ha ha, that Belle Delphine is awesome! The fun is trying to guess how the hell she can put a non-porny spin on some of the clickbait titles before watching them…

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
1 year ago

@Lainey:

Also side note when you google search oral it also gives you suggestion that other people have searched for. The second one was “human sexual activity” which I am pretty sure is a bunch of aliens.

Lies! There are no aliens on the Internet! None! Say, you’re looking lovely tonight… have you decreased in mass?

comment image

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Moggie
I think it’s probably because for most people necrophilia is just a bridge too far. At least, necrophilia grosses me out. On the other hand, if we are to believe Freud about the Oedipus complex, men want to fuck their mothers and so as a result enjoy porn about incest.

EDIT: Apparently there actually is a market for necrophile porn.

I’m going to hazard a guess and say that these TERFs aren’t exactly fond of porn as a whole.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

@Crip Dyke

No links, sorry – the G.I. Joe wiki doesn’t go into much detail about the pyramid schemes, and most of the actual, Amway-like details are buried within thousands of pages of comics.

The details that the comics do provide – multilevel marketing of household cleaning products, selling to friends and neighbors, recruiting those friends and neighbors, an emphasis on presenting a successful lifestyle by going into debt, emphasis on fitting into an “All-American mold,” etc. point to Amway specifically, rather than other pyramid schemes.

The big tell, though, is the lack of brand identity. Larry Hama (the writer of the G.I. Joe comics) almost always uses fictional analogues for real things, to avoid implying that real countries or corporations are in league with Cobra. And virtually all of Cobra’s front companies are fictitious, often with less-then subtle references to Cobra in their names.*

But the pyramid scheme is never, ever named. We never, ever see a logo. So while the country of Frusenland is “basically Finland,” Cobra’s pyramid scheme is not identified as “basically Amway” but clearly leaves the door open to actually being Amway. It’s one of Hama’s most subtle bits (and there are a lot of them).

*If G.I. Joe would just have their operatives memorize all the possible anagrams of “cobra” they would be clued in to a lot of schemes a lot faster. “Broca Beach?” “Arbco Brothers Circus?”

LibrarianBabe
LibrarianBabe
1 year ago

This queer, cis-gendered woman was writing a sex blog 10 years ago – and consuming a lot of porn. (I’m gray ace since a brain infection & surgery a few years ago but I used to be highly sexual.) First off, the poster on reddit who thought porn wasn’t that hardcore 10 years ago was clearly not watching internet porn. The trend has been towards hardcore pretty much since internet porn started being available. She must be thinking of Skinemax, late night, softfcore videos from the 80s. Secondly, there are plenty of cis-women who are kinky AF – plenty who are not – and I’m sure that transwomen are smiliarly diverse.

But then I’m preaching to choir.

Allandrel
Allandrel
1 year ago

As hilarious as Belle Delphine’s trolling is, I’m reasonably sure a lot of people are unironically masturbating to her videos.

Drungarios
Drungarios
1 year ago

My understanding is that sudden popularity of incest porn has nothing to do with changing tastes and everything to do with a particular studio that specialized in it managing to get an exclusive deal with Pornhub, so their stuff got spammed all over that site. Other studios, seeing its apparent popularity, boosted by search algorithms, followed suit.

Soy Boi
Soy Boi
1 year ago

Yes… “research”…

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

I would imagine as well that PornHub’s statistics on who watches what are probably not entirely accurate, as not everyone is signing up for accounts to watch and therefore it can’t really be known which videos certain demographics prefer.

@Allandrel
I don’t really know much about G. I. Joe, but that is interesting. MLMs are pretty insidious, so if someone was trying to create a global crime syndicate, an MLM wouldn’t be a bad way to do it.

Catalpa
Catalpa
1 year ago

EDIT: Apparently there actually is a market for necrophile porn.

Rule 34. In general, if you can imagine something, there’s likely someone out there who has a kink for it. And some kind of porn of it probably exists on the internet.

moregeekthan
moregeekthan
1 year ago

@pie @crip dyke

A quick seach shows me that University of South Corolina (the Gamecocks) plays Missouri, Kentucky, and Clemson in foitball this year (all feline mascots). Tempted to up porn-titled videos consisting of nothing but highlights from these games.

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
1 year ago

@Moggie:

I watch porn, but I read porn writing more than I ever watch video porn.

I noticed a porn-writing boom in incest stuff a while ago. I think that one of the opportunities provided by incist porn, (and it’s even more true of video porn than written) is that you can say that it’s incest porn by throwing in the stepmom or step sibling labels at some point and then go on with normal porn and for people who want that fetish/kink they feel catered to, but for those who don’t, the fact that they called themselves related at some point in a story/video is easily set aside.

In fact, one of the things I like about written porn is that there’s a lot I can more easily change in my imagination.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
1 year ago

@ All Andrew:

It’s REALLY WEIRD what gets tagged and what doesn’t.

Nuh-UH… ain’t me….

🙂

🙂

Katamount
1 year ago

Oooh, porn! My kinda topic! *cracks knuckles*

Frankly, if this DetectiveSpaghetti person thinks that porn was vanilla 10 years ago, I’ve got the lingering spirit of Joe D’Amato to introduce them to, to say nothing of any other exploitation filmmaker from the 70s and 80s.

Either way, it sounds to me like they’re lamenting the rise of extreme gonzo porn, which I personally can’t stand and is the kind of thing that has the potential to injure, but its not like that’s all there is to find. The “porn for women” category tends to have content where it looks like the performers are actually enjoying themselves. And while this is by no means universal, “ethical” porn producers tend to be more open-minded when it comes to their performers, casting trans people, people of colour, those with disabilities etc., as well as writing scenarios that are less glaringly exploitative. (Note: I put “ethical” in quotes as there’s still some questionable practices exposed related to those who brand themselves as ethical pornographers).

@Naglfar has it right when he mentions the demographics though (and PornHub is up front when it says it’s tracking accounts that list themselves as female rather than having any actual knowledge of people’s gender identity).

On a semi-related topic, I do lament the sheer laziness of American adult productions (looking your way Wood Rocket), when European companies like Private are willing to go all out on like a three-part Cleopatra-themed historical drama involving time travel or reincarnation (not sure which, I don’t speak Italian). C’mon, guys, as much as it’s profitable to do endless Marvel movie porn parodies, it’s nice to see something a little more ambitious.

Ancient Rome is a goldmine of debauchery (depending on who you read). It can’t be that hard to get some togas, some wigs and a few styrofoam columns, call an actress “Valeria Messalina” or “Julia the Elder” and pretend you’re banging in front of the Pantheon. Although… I dunno, it would feel weird contributing to what is likely myths about real people written by political enemies. It’s telling that for ancient Roman women, if somebody wanted to destroy their reputation in the eyes of the public, it always came down to “they slept around.” Talk about patriarchy and demonizing women’s sexuality.

Moggie
Moggie
1 year ago

Profitable? I thought that essentially nobody was paying for porn any more? Apart from stuff like cam performers, I suppose, where the interactivity is the draw.

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