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Female orgasm is a myth, proclaims man who’s never given a woman an orgasm

Clitemis , Goddess of Vibrators, would disagree

By David Futrelle

Today, a brief visit to the Men Going Their Own Way subreddit, where men who claim they’ve given up women — and don’t even think about them any more — spend all day every day talking about women. This time, they’re talking about female orgasm, which according to them doesn’t exist.

Annoyed by a post in the badly named women-centric TwoXChromosomes subreddit in which a young woman wondered if she might possibly have just had her first orgasm while taking a highly stressful physics test, a MGTOW Redditor called TVTestPattern declares flatly that the female orgasm is a “myth.”

The Myth of the Female Orgasm (self.MGTOW)

submitted 1 year ago by TVTestPattern

TwoX

"I think I may have orgasmed during a physics test"

Can you ever imagine, as a man, uttering these words?

No... you can't.

Females enjoy sex, but do not climax, (at least not like you guys understand the term).

All the screaming and drama is for the benefit of the audience, and is as contrived as any other female reaction.

It is known.

Oh, dude. Dude.

I feel a little bad for him. And a lot bad for any woman who may have suffered the misfortune of having sex with him.

Also, dude, the fake orgasm scene from When Harry Met Sally — which is what his final line links to — isn’t actually proof of anything, except perhaps that screenwriter Nora Ephron might just have endured some really shitty boyfriends and husbands in her day (we already knew she had one extra-shitty ex-husband, Carl Bernstein). But I digress.

The commenters in the MGTOW subreddit thought that Mr. TestPattern here was really onto something with his totally original female orgasm theory.

“I have always said this,” wrote YouLoseAgainDipshits.

As men, we know that orgasms don’t feel thatgood. When’s the last time you screamed and moaned while masturbating?

While women are drama queens, it’s clear they don’t even know what an orgasm is.

A guy called Avyctes managed to have an opinion that was somehow even worse than this.

“A female orgasm is irrelevant,” he wrote.

As long as the Man gets off. She’s nothing more, and a whole lot less, than a walking masturbation sleeve.

So weird that there are so many guys out there not only willing to admit that they’re terrible people, but also to make it absolutely clear that they are utter shit in bed. The internet is an amazing thing.

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Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
1 year ago

As men, we know that orgasms don’t feel that good. When’s the last time you screamed and moaned while masturbating?

So, this guy’s inference from that is that women are faking something that, he claims, doesn’t exist anyway? I always figured that women get off less reliably, but when they do it’s better. Whether to compensate (so they’ll be willing to do their bit for genes and chromosomes) or just because.

Of course the only real way to settle it would be with scientific research. Has there been any, or is orgasm quality as sadly neglected as most potential research topics that don’t center straight white cismen?

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
1 year ago

Being shit at sex to own the libs wimmenz

comment image

Victorious Parasol
1 year ago

BWAHAHAHAHA.

Oh, man. This is so very “said the fox about the grapes it couldn’t reach.”

Shadowplay
1 year ago

@Surplus:

There’s been studies. Rather a lot of them, from Finland to Iran. 😛

Got to admit, I found the sponsor of this one rather amusing.

Mexican Hot Chocolate
Mexican Hot Chocolate
1 year ago

I love how they jump to the conclusion that female orgasm is a myth and not “Hey, maybe that one sexual technique from high school of lying on top and thrusting in and out as quickly might not be the best way to give someone an orgasm.”

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

All people with clitori do not scream and loudly moan while orgasming. These dudes have clearly gotten that idea from porn. So their evidence that all women are acting during sex, is footage of women who are being paid to act during sex. Do not realize that porn actors aren’t exactly a representative sample?

Bakunin
Bakunin
1 year ago

“Orgasms don’t feel that good”

Male orgasms don’t feel that good. Trust me, I have some pretty first-hand experience here. And maybe you’re just bad at getting yourself off?

epronovost
epronovost
1 year ago

@weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Porn actress are acting. The reality of it is in the name of their job. Porn doesn’t try to repesent sex more then it tries to represent the public fantasies about sex. I suppose these guys have very little to no experience of sexual intercourse with women and if they do they are terrible at it. Let’s call this form of fallacy argumentum ad masturbari. It’s the closest latin form I could come up with. Basically the fallacy of taking your lack or inept experience at sex as widesprayed truth.

PS: I know it’s actually more a form of reification fallacy, but reification is complicated and rater vague.

personalpest
personalpest
1 year ago

Another comment on “Orgasms don’t feel that good”: Dude, if you really don’t enjoy sex, nobody’s forcing you to do it. Oh, wait: nobody except the shitty manospherian culture, which judges men by their ability to be “alpha male” studs and condemns them for not living up to that ridiculous, impossible standard. Never mind.

Monday Middlemarch
Monday Middlemarch
1 year ago

If female orgasms do not exist, then what exactly are lesbians doing with each other? Are they just showing off how loud they can moan at each other? Oh, that’s right, MGTOW’s claim that there’s no such thing as lesbians either.

I really don’t understand the alternate reality these people live in.

BTW, I’m a cis gender, straight woman and I’ve had thousands of orgasms, either with a male partner or with myself and I can attest that it is possible to orgasm without moaning or screaming, etc. Especially when you don’t want to wake up your kids in the next room…duh! (fucking morons).

Viscaria
Viscaria
1 year ago

As men, we know that orgasms don’t feel that good. When’s the last time you screamed and moaned while masturbating?

So we can talk about some noises or actions during sex as being performative, but some of them are also communicative. This is absolutely just my own experience, but quite often I will make more noise when I’m having partnered sex than when I’m playing a solo round because I’m sharing and communicating my enjoyment to my partner.

Like, I’m more vocally appreciative of a tasty bowl of soup when someone else has made it, too. That doesn’t mean pleasurable soup consumption doesn’t exist.

dust bunny
dust bunny
1 year ago

Of course the only real way to settle it would be with scientific research. Has there been any, or is orgasm quality as sadly neglected as most potential research topics that don’t center straight white cismen?

I read about a study recently (maybe it was linked here?) where, secondary to whatever they were actually trying to quantify, they discovered that their operational definition of cis lady orgasms did not agree with the test subjects’ reports of when they were having an orgasm.

One of the scientists thought this meant the test subjects didn’t know what orgasms are. The other thought this meant that their way of “measuring” orgasms was insufficient.

So yes, still some ways to go until we’ll get any interesting research on this. Subjective evaluations are likely to be the best we’re going to get, kind of like we’re dealing with evaluating pain. “How enjoyable would you rate this orgasm on a scale of 1-10 where 1 is mildly pleasant and 10 is the purest, most intense ecstasy and bliss you can imagine?”

kupo
kupo
1 year ago

I’m so confused. So many people saying male orgasms aren’t that good, actually, but men use the promise or hope of an orgasm to justify basically anything and everything.

Tim
Tim
1 year ago

Poor deluded MGTOWer. I will have you know that my wife had several orgasms last night, I was even in the room for some of them

Bluecat
Bluecat
1 year ago

If female orgasms do not exist, then what exactly are lesbians doing with each other? Are they just showing off how loud they can moan at each other? Oh, that’s right, MGTOW’s claim that there’s no such thing as lesbians either.

Well, there’s also a school of thought that lesbians are “only” doing it until a man happens in, or to turn on the imaginary man who isn’t there …

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@tim

That made me laugh a bit.

dashapants
dashapants
1 year ago

Is this another one of those “women aren’t human” things?? Cause while, yes, comparatively speaking our biology varies in how it is arranged, both men’s and women’s bodies possess the same type of nerve clusters, and if they are stimulated, they will produce an orgasm, provided you find the right spot to rub.

As for vocalization, I’m with Viscaria here, I’d say about 85% of noisy sex is communicative and largely depends on how unselfconscious a person is. Though, on occasion the going is so good, whether solo or in tandem, that one gasps quite loudly (and involuntarily) to one’s own surprise (and perhaps the surprise of one’s neighbors on the other side of the wall who are like WTF is going on there, why is she having sex this good at 3 in the afternoon). What I’m sayin’ is YMMV (though maybe not TVTestPattern’s, he seems confused and kind of disappointed in his own orgasms).

ObSidJag
ObSidJag
1 year ago

@Monday Middlemarch:

TMI Warning
Re the “what are lesbians doing with each other?” I’ve got news for these jack wagons: if my (sadly, probably soon 2 be ex) girlfriend was acting when we were intimate with each other, she’s in the wrong damned business.

To say she very much enjoyed my giving her pleasure was a freaking understatement–she damned near blew the roof off showing her appreciation–and we were pretty sure the neighbors could hear her.
Me? I was somewhat quieter but no less enthusiastic re her attentions. YMMV

Just goes 2 show how woefully ignorant these dip sticks are. Lord pity the woman who makes the mistake of letting one of ’em near her. She’s going to be severely disappointed…to say nothing of frustrated as hell.

@ Lainy:
Tim’s comment made me smile as well, which I needed 2day. Thx Tim.

Robert
Robert
1 year ago

Kupo – for men like these, sex is a grimly serious competition; orgasms are just their way of keeping score.

kupo
kupo
1 year ago

@Robert
That explains that one reddit post about the bf who has jerk-off competitions with his friends.

Bina
1 year ago

@some migtoe moron:

She’s nothing more, and a whole lot less, than a walking masturbation sleeve.

Well, dude, then why are you wanking and moaning around on the Internets? Go buy yourself a fleshlight and go your own way for real. You won’t be missed, and neither will your drivel!

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 year ago

As men, we know that orgasms don’t feel thatgood. When’s the last time you screamed and moaned while masturbating?

Whee doggie! I just love their arguments from incredulity.

There’s different levels of orgasm. There’s the physical release, but then there’s also a significant mental component (the “mind blowing” part). For some men, ejaculation is a minor sensation, akin to popping bubble wrap. I wouldn’t be surprised if that was more common among these death-grip types.

Mrs. Obed Marsh
Mrs. Obed Marsh
1 year ago

@Bina:

As I like to say, MGTOW don’t really want to go their own way. They’re like little kids who make a loud and dramatic show of running away from home. The kid doesn’t actually want to leave – if they did, they’d slip away quietly without drawing attention to themself. They want their parents to realize they’ve mistreated the kid and grovel for forgiveness. When MGTOW threaten to GTOW, they’re hoping women will think “Oh man, we screwed up and took men for granted. But we need men because [Insert misogynistic myth here]. If we don’t get back in their good graces we’ll really be sorry!”

misophistry
misophistry
1 year ago

With this level of reasoning it is no wonder flat earth is popular again.

Pyxxxie
Pyxxxie
1 year ago

*cringe*

Guys like this make total asses out of themselves by their obvious lack of any kind of sexual experience( let along knowledge) Even jerking off FFS!

Women can fake an orgasm but not squirting! Teehee

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
1 year ago

A female orgasm is irrelevant. As long as the Man gets off. She’s nothing more, and a whole lot less, than a walking masturbation sleeve.

It’s clear to me that this comment and the other two aren’t real. No human being would make claims that are this stupid.

You know how cats like to lie on keyboards, pressing on keys and messing up a Word doc with something along the lines of — and here I quote my own cat — HEELPIMBEEING HELDCAP TIVE SND KIBBL THE GUDKINDD?

Obviously, that’s what happened here. It’s a bunch of nonsense that’s almost like English but makes no sense.

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
1 year ago

I’m so confused. So many people saying male orgasms aren’t that good, actually, but men use the promise or hope of an orgasm to justify basically anything and everything.

This is basically what had me confused for most of my life. People getting into a lot of trouble for a sensation I considered pleasant but nothing special. Until I got introduced to the asexuality spectrum and a lot of stuff clicked for me.

I’m still confused by how far out of their way some men seem to go for sex, but at least I can categorise it under ‘things that exist but do not apply to me, I guess’. Like ‘famous person that people seem to find really attractive but I just don’t get it’.

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
1 year ago

@Kat

OK, that was hilarious.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
1 year ago

While women are drama queens, it’s clear they don’t even know what an orgasm is.

Like, how could women have first hand experience of the male orgasm?

Gaebolga
Gaebolga
1 year ago

Re: male orgasms not feeling that good.

(Obligatory TMI warning)

I’ve had a few partners that elicited unintentional vocal responses from me durning orgasm, so perhaps those with toes of migginess aren’t just shit in bed for their unfortunate partners, but for themselves as well.

…also, I’ve never had an orgasm while mastubating that was better than mid-level sex with another person, so if all they’re doing is masturbating – especially if they’re as terrible at it as they are at sex – then no, their orgasms probably don’t feel that good.

Bitterness just ain’t sexy, morons….

Seraph4377
Seraph4377
1 year ago

@ weirwoodtreehugger and Eprovonost – I recently saw a porn outtake where the actress had a genuine orgasm, because even performative sex is sex, and they treated it like, I don’t know, a sneezing fit that had interrupted the scene. She wasn’t in control, after all, and it was very different from the performance she’d been putting on – mostly trembling and a shaky “Oh my God”. Everyone has a good laugh, congratulates her and the actor, and into the “outtakes” section of the DVD special features it goes.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
1 year ago

“It is known”…

“They say”…

“Everybody knows”…

“I’ve heard”…

… the depth of igno-right evidence is just amazing….

“Nuh-UH!”

Drungarios
Drungarios
1 year ago

So these guys not only suck at pleasuring women, they can’t even get themselves off properly? My dude, I don’t usually make noise while masturbating either, but during actual sex I can be, uh, very vocal. Yer doin’ it wrong.

Sheila Crosby
1 year ago

When it comes to great sex vs meh sex, I think what’s going on between your ears is even more important than what’s going on between your legs. Never mind friction and angles, most people with have better orgasms with a valued friend than a “walking masturbation sleeve”. Even solo, fantasizng about someone gorgeous who’s really into you is going to be a whole lot hotter than burning with resentment.

Which do you suppose these guys do?

Katamount
Katamount
1 year ago

As men, we know that orgasms don’t feel thatgood. When’s the last time you screamed and moaned while masturbating?

This is possibly the saddest thing I’ve ever read. And I read the “Fifteen Portraits of Despair” chapter of Sandman: Endless Nights. I actually think this speaks of a deeper lack of knowledge that men (really penis-havers in general, but I suspect that being trans requires one to know more in general) have about our own bodies, or certainly one that porn has warped. One aspect of the vicarious nature of the genre is that the men involved are ancillary. They shouldn’t make noise or express any pleasure of their own, especially during the “money shot.” European productions will sometimes cut to guys reaction shots, but I’ve never seen it in American gonzo stuff. Combining this with the pitfall of falling into the “death-grip” rut that Buttercup mentioned (I’ve been there myself), one can effectively desensitize themselves simply by that kind of repetition. As much as we like to goof on the “no jacking” weirdos for their bizarre ideas of what abstention does, what it does do is permit our minds and bodies to recover and prepare properly for the next pleasureful encounter. Give yourself a couple of days, think about something new and give yourself the space, and more important the time to let it build up gradually. One of the issues with internet-based smut is that it limits the ways we can interact with it. Unless you have something uploaded to a tablet, you’re basically going to be in a seated position at a desk with one hand on the mouse. Sitting in a bed or lying down flat, using toys as aids, these things completely change the experience and results in something far more powerful. This can all seem like common knowledge (and because adult entertainment caters to us so much, guys like the pretend they’re experts in their own anatomy when they really aren’t), but routine is a powerful draw and the ergonomic limits I don’t see discussed very often.

On the vagina-ed side, frankly… it just takes effort and knowledge of the person’s body. If there’s trust, they’ll tell you how they like to be touched. As an aside, this is what always gets me about those that oppose affirmative consent: if you have to somehow negotiate or hoodwink (or worse, coerce) a woman into sex, how great can that sex actually be if there’s no trust established? If that trust and caring is present, you can really get the fireworks going. At the risk of TMI, I’ve had shaking, panting, howling climaxes just from oral and I had enough practice with that particular partner to leave her shaking and wailing within 30 seconds of going down on her. And we both have a hearty laugh afterwards! To second what Seraph4377 mentioned, that’s the kind of real interaction that the best orgasms bring out: laughter. Because it’s fun, like sex should be!

Ann K
Ann K
1 year ago

Thank you for your opinions, gentlemen. Great way to go your own way, with a cast-iron guarantee that you will never be given a “first-hand” opportunity to find out about female orgasms, even if you remember that bit about “first hand”. The internet never forgets…

coilybepraised
coilybepraised
1 year ago

As a male commentator I would just like to say that I do usually make noise when I orgasm from masturbating so that assumption is incorrect.

Victorious Parasol
1 year ago

The difference between performative sex and non-performative sex makes me think of the death scenes Christopher Lee talked about in his autobiography. When he first started acting and had his first death scene, the director was very annoyed at how Lee reacted to being stabbed. Lee had “died the wrong way” and had to learn how to die “the correct way” for the stage.

At this point in his life, Christopher Lee had just been demobbed from the RAF, and as he later put it, “Let’s just say I was in Special Forces and leave it at that.” Hunting Nazis was apparently his MOS after V-Day.

And yeah, masturbation is like having a nice hamburger. Really good sex with a partner with whom you share an emotional connection and knows your body and what you like? That’s like a multi-course meal prepared by an experienced chef. I’ve never been terribly vocal during masturbation, but making love with Mr. Parasol … totally different story.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

@ Vicky P

Christopher Lee had just been demobbed from the RAF, and as he later put it, “Let’s just say I was in Special Forces and leave it at that.”

He was in the Long Range Desert (Patrol) Group. That’s the unit David Stirling mooched off to create the SAS.

Kevin
Kevin
1 year ago

Well we certainly can assume the miggy OP is rubbish at getting himself off. On the other hand, I’ve generally found my own climax experiences to be of unpredictable intensity, quality generally declining as I get older. My medical condition may be relevant too. I’ll have to look into it.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

O/T, but my article is up. Gaebolga won the title contest. It’s aimed at animal rights folks; but may be of some use to (English) activists generally.

comment image

https://advocates-for-animals.com/blog/146

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
1 year ago

@Sheila Crosby

Even solo, fantasizng about someone gorgeous who’s really into you is going to be a whole lot hotter than burning with resentment.

Which do you suppose these guys do?

I’m gonna venture a guess that for these guys the main goal of sex isn’t orgasm, it’s degrading a woman. MGTOWs and NoFappers view orgasm as weakness, because it’s a temporary loss of control, what with all the moaning and shuddering and grimaces and involuntary muscle contractions. Strong emotions leak out in unpredictable ways (some people laugh after climaxing, some people cry).

So any orgasmic activity other than ejaculation is bad because it makes them look weak in front of women, and it can be used later as kompromat against them. It’s no wonder they don’t get swept away during climax, when they’re actively trying to repress the emotional side of it.

I swear, when it comes to sex, they act like it’s a goddamn spy novel. DON’T GIVE HER ANYTHING, they warn each other. Name, rank, and serial number, that’s it. Keep all feelings (except for cold contempt) under lock and key. Maintain that all-important mastery.

And then they wonder why “women are incapable of true intimacy”.

@Alan: congrats! Going over to check it out right now.

Bakunin
Bakunin
1 year ago

@Lumipuna
I do. They are… different

AcidTrial
AcidTrial
1 year ago

I am forever perplexed by the number of men on the internet who will proudly and loudly brag of being bad at sex.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

@ buttercup

Going over to check it out right now.

Thank you! Any and all feedback gratefully received. Be as brutal as you like.

varalys the dark
1 year ago

Alan’s article is very good. I am a total layperson and I learned a lot from it.

On the subject of orgasms. I am a lesbian, I’ve don’t tend to make much noise when getting myself off, but one girlfriend I had got me screaming the place down. And I returned the favour. I’ve also faked orgasms too because it was taking to long and I’d got a bit bored but didn’t want to offend that particular girlfriend.

Gaebolga
Gaebolga
1 year ago

@Alan

Nice article, and I’m tickled that you went with my suggested title; thank you!

Victorious Parasol
1 year ago

@ Alan

Y’know, I had a private bet as to who would pick up on Lee’s military record, and if I’d put money on it, you would’ve made me a very rich woman.

Lee’s autobiographies (Tall, Dark, and Gruesome and Lord of Misrule) are fascinating reads. It’s like having dinner with the man and listen to him share the story of his life.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
1 year ago

@ gaebolga

Thank you; for the great title; and to everyone else who chipped in. Much appreciated!

@ Vicky P

Heh, well you know me; and I do like the LRDG. I annoy my Hereford friends by always banging on about them (which is quite intentional).

@ varalys

Well yeah; but you are very clever. Hopefully it will be some use though. Got som good feedback on it already.They were kind enough to post it on LinkedIn and it appears to be doing the rounds with the relevant groups.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
1 year ago

I’ll admit that one of the first things I think about when I hear the name ‘Christopher Lee’ is the ‘Name Your Poison’ song from The Return of Captain Invincible, in which Lee as a supervillain starts practising psychological warfare on the titular recovering alcoholic superhero by singing a pun-laden song about booze. My lord, what a singing voice he had, too.

Mai-tai say that I’m Old Fashioned…

My brain can be a very strange place at times, even for me.