By David Futrelle
The “involuntarily” celibate fellows who’ve branded themselves incels may not be getting any sex, but that doesn’t stop them from thinking, and theorizing, about sex, much in the way someone blind from birth might theorize about what it’s like to see.
Over on the Incels.co forums, the regulars recently found themselves in a debate on the apparently controversial (amongst incels) proposition “Does Female pleasure matter?”
The fellow asking the question, an Incels.co regular with more than 400 comments to his name, feels that the only correct answer is “no.”
“I’ve been thinking, objectively the purpose for sex is to reproduce,” Salutextm began.
Men essentially enjoy this since they need to climax for reproduction to happen in light of the fact that the nerves that make sex feel pleasurable are in the head of the Penis. So a male’s pleasure is truly essential and will happen more often than not.
Ok, so far so good. We need to reproduce to keep our species going, so evolution has evidently designed sex to be fun so we’ll do it.
But I couldn’t think of any natural reason for the female orgasm or female pleasure.
Wait, what? Putting aside the fact that women do tend to enjoy sex at least as much as men, rendering the entire debate moot, why wouldn’t it be evolutionarily important for women to enjoy sex just like men? After all, don’t they have to agree to sex for sex to occur?
Oh, wait, I think I know where he’s going here.
That is to say, women don’t need to experience any pleasure for reproduction to occur. They simply must be there and take the man’s seed.
That … only makes sense if you assume that evolution has designed men to be rapists and women to be rape victims.
Female pleasure is as of now, harder to accomplish than male due to placement of nerve endings (clitoris) and hormonal differences (testosterone)
Well, I’m no expert on hormones or nerve endings but my informal studies and, er, fieldwork, have suggested to me that female sexual pleasure isn’t some weird unattainable thing seen rarely in nature, like the snow leopard or a Trump supporter who isn’t a racist.
So for what reason do people feel like its the man’s fault for a woman not getting off when their pleasure isn’t to be prioritized to begin with? Naturally, their pleasure doesn’t even matter. Or at least I couldn’t find any reason as to why it would
And with that attitude, you’re probably never going to see female sexual pleasure in the wild.
In another thread, Salutextm cited the results of a weird and tiny study of literally only 15 college couples — which found levels of the so-called “love hormone” oxytocin decreasing in the women after kissing — as proof that women really don’t enjoy this rather common sexual activity that women, on average, definitely do enjoy, in many cases, like, a lot.
“Do women subject themselves to things they don’t want to do for some ulterior motive?” he asked, baffled.
Why else would women engage with men if they do not find most men physically sexually attractive … or barely receive any physical sexual pleasure in most acts involving their man?
Not all the commenters on Incels.co agreed with Salutextm’s hypotheses.
“All a Woman wants is to be fucked hard by Chad and then ignored,” declared IAmJAcksBrokenHeart.
A commenter called Huntedbyhate went even further, suggesting that the fact that women do feel sexual pleasure was really the heart of the problem. His proposed “solution” to this alleged problem was rather gruesome.
“I wish that all females had their clits cut off so they couldn’t experience pleasure,” he wrote. “More foids for us and fewer for Chad.”
It’s not altogether clear why he thinks the “foids” — that is, women — who’ve had their genitals forcibly mutilated would flock to the men who had actually called for this horrific practice. But that’s incel logic for you.
Despite these critics, a significant portion of the commenters seemed to agree that female pleasure doesn’t matter, or at the very least it shouldn’t.
“Their pleasure doesn’t matter,” asserted Danzai. “Foids were made to make babies, not enjoy themselves in it.”
“Why would the pleasure of a toilet matter?” added Insomniac.
Once again, the regulars on Incels.co have made it clear why the women who are refusing to have sex with them — which would be all women, everywhere, on planet earth — are making the right decision.
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@Anonymous
I mean obviously I think every reason you gave is bullshit, but I appreciate that you didn’t deny you’re a racist.
This is straight up not true. Basic stats show that global confidence in the U.S is significantly lower than during the Obama years. https://www.pewglobal.org/2018/10/01/trumps-international-ratings-remain-low-especially-among-key-allies/
What’s this “on your back” thing of which you speak?
Almost never do it….unless I’m really, really tired. Never O’d with a guy while on my back. So screw that.
Pun intended.
One word for you. Yemen. It was ridiculously easy to prove you wrong there.
Thanks for finally revealing your troll status though. I suspected for some time now, but you were straddling that plausible deniability line. Until now.
What does this even mean? I’m sure it sounded smart in your head, but no. There is no parallel here.
He literally talks about the media the same way Hitler did. I do mean literally.
Trump does well because he was born wealthy, white, and male and because he is good at manipulating frightened racist boomers.
Considering that he’s committing genocide under the UN charter with his family separation policy, how fucking dare you claim that outrage against him isn’t justified.
You are a fucking terrible human being. And yes, you’re a fucking racist. Fuckass.
It means he’s old enough to remember when some people considered Rush Limbaugh relevant.
I believe the phrase “citation needed” might be in order.
I’ve lived through numerous US Presidencies going back to Johnson, and I honestly can’t think of a time when America was less respected internationally. Anyone remember the last time a US President was openly derided by the audience to his face while making a speech? Or portrayed in giant inflatable blimp form as a toddler in mid-tantrum? No, me neither.
George W Bush was a low point for the US reputation. But Trump is even lower.
When I was visiting Paris in 2004, I wore a t-shirt that had a picture of Bush with an arrow pointing to it that said “I’m not with stupid” and it go quite a positive reaction, including an “I love you” from some teen boys. Under Trump, if I travel internationally, I may well pretend to be Canadian out of Trump related embarrassment. Many people can’t distinguish between a Canadian and Minnesotan accent, so why not?
@calmdown
Wow, good catch there.
@Anonymous
You should be ashamed of yourself. That is really all I have to say.
I go away for a day to watch endgame and pick up a couch from a dude and the trolls attack basically.
Like, come on. Anyone saying anything like this is just being a contrarian for the hell of it. Trump is a metric ton of horse manure trapped in a suit and you know it. But, hey, enjoy owning the SJWs by voting for him, who cares about all the people who aren’t you that suffer for your lulz, right? Trolling über alles!
Just be honest.
@Anonymous:
Is it Opposite Day? Because I don’t see any of this happening. Our allies no longer trust us. China and Russia are cutting us out of trade deals. Trump is a horrible negotiator, in case you hadn’t noticed. His favorite tactic of making a handshake deal and then stiffing the other party doesn’t work with foreign policy.
Whoa. Gonna stop you right there, chief. Trump is only “doing well” if you’re a white supremacist with no morals or empathy. And even then, he’s somehow failed to stop immigrants from seeking asylum and black athletes from speaking up and women holding sexual harassers to account and Robert E. Lee statues from being removed. He hasn’t been able to completely roll America back to the 1850s like they want.
In every other area, he’s a flaming train wreck. He spends most of his time tweeting out stochastic terrorist wink-wink dogwhistles and golfing. He can’t even string together two coherent sentences. His only policy is cruelty: caging children, mocking the disabled, picking fights with bereaved Gold Star families, bestowing fourth grade playground nicknames, stacking the courts with radical Dominionist judges, and petulantly shutting down the government over his wall. That’s it. That’s the sum total of his accomplishments as president. And even that comes largely from Stephen Miller, because he’s incapable of thinking it up on his own. I have serious doubts as to whether he’s even functionally literate.
If journalists and professors are outraged, it’s because of his constant, relentless assaults on the Constitution, on democracy, on freedom of the press, on the environment, on decency and the future of civilization itself. He’s tipped us over the edge into outright fascism. America is unrecognizable now. It’s a shadow of its former self. He continues to ignore climate change, the single biggest existential threat that humanity has ever faced, in the face of growing and catastrophic evidence from the scientific community. That alone should outrage everybody.
Why aren’t you outraged?
People are already addressing this, but on this point:
As a citizen from one of these allied nations, I have to disagree. It’s not that we’re taking you seriously; it’s that we’re scared that Trump will have a bad day, throw a tantrum, and decide to literally blow up the world.
The only reason America is not a complete laughing stock is that we’re all perfectly aware that you’ll drag us down with you. It makes the laughter stick in your throat.
I have a hard time believing people like this “Trump supporter” troll really believe the things they say. I dont see how it is possible to genuinely believe that we dont have lots of good reasons to criticize Trump, as if there were no news of ie baby jails and all the rest.
I think it’s a game to these types.
I understand people who truly believe stuff as wild as what incels believe, but pretending you dont know what people criticize Trump for, while professing to read actual news and all I just – I dont buy it.
Just a gleeful hater trying to sell the unsell-able imo
>>>>Whoa. Gonna stop you right there, chief. Trump is only “doing well” if you’re a white supremacist with no morals or empathy.
When you consider 100,000,000 or so Americans to be “white supremacists without morals or empathy”, then two things happen. First, due to overuse, people shrug off labels such as “racist” or “white supremacist”, since it all they mean is “shut up!” or “I disagree with you about that”. This is very good news for *real* white supremacists and racists.
Second, anything might be done lest they gain power. Take letting 16-year-old and felons vote. This is a bad idea which also harms the democratic party, since it is an open admission on their part that they think felons and teenagers will overwhelmingly vote for them – an excellent reason to NOT vote democrat. So why is such a lunatic scheme promoted? Because, *anything* may be done to defeat the 100 million racists (cool band name).
Finally, I am an Israeli. Among many Trump-haters, Israel has no right to exist and “liberating Palestine” – destroying Israel – is a worthy goal. Indeed, only yesterday (literally) the NY Times (international edition) published a caricature of the blind, skullcap-wearing Trump (isn’t he supposed to be a Nazi?) being led by a dog, Netanyahu. Those dogs, the “zionists”, are controlling the US – or in other words, “the Jews control the world”. Is it any wonder I prefer Trump to the ‘Trump-haters?
>>>>>>He’s tipped us over the edge into outright fascism.
He did? So why are there still elections? Did any other fascist leader have the national press attack him daily? Where are the concentration camps?
Besides, didn’t America become “fascist” when G. W. Bush, I mean Reagan, I mean Nixon, became president? When every Republican president since at least Nixon is literally a new Hitler, you tend to not take too seriously yet another “descent into fascism”.
Don’t get me wrong. I do not think Obama’s “destruction” of America or his making it “communist” were real either. And wasn”t America “communist” already since that commie Clinton, I mean Carter, I mean Johnson destroyed it?
Well, Trump is still trying to get abortion providers killed:
The US president said mothers who had just given birth were being given the choice of keeping the child or allowing it to be killed.
The claim – which is demonstrably false – came as he spoke about late-term abortions.
“The baby is born, the mother meets with the doctor, they take care of the baby, they wrap the baby beautifully, and then the doctor and the mother determine whether or not they will execute the baby,” Mr Trump said to a chorus of boos.
Source
Well aint that the truth!
I wanted to go back and read anonymous’ previous posts, but searching for “anonymous” in this website is tedious, and I’m lazy. Even if they don’t really mean what they said about Trump, its…..gross to lie. You’re just a gross person for what reasons, to own the libs? Are you that immature and spiteful? Gross.
Oh, I just want to note that Trump gave his ‘choosing whether the newborn lives or dies’ speech in Wisconsin, which is facing an economic crisis due to Trump’s trade policies’ impact on the dairy industry.
Fuck you.
The Trump administration is putting asylum seekers in camps right now. Proposing they be run by the military. Multiple children have already died in these camps. ICE is also detaining legal immigrants.
Seriously. Fuck you.
Fans of your beloved Trump are fucking murdering Jewish people and that’s all fine and dandy and not anti-Semitic because they hate Muslims too. But anyone who opposes the Israeli government (separate thing from all Jewish people BTW) brutalizing Palestinians is automatically anti-Semitic?
Like the “very fine people” in Charlotsville chanting “the Jews will not replace us?”
Oh, I didn’t see the most recent BS from Anonymous.
Um, haven’t you noticed that Trump is targeting the media? Under his presidency, the US has been added to the list of most dangerous countries for journalists.
Pay attention.
Quack quack, anonymous!
Giving people their voting rights back because of an overly punitive racist justice system is not something to be done to “get votes.” Its goal is to restore justice. Holy shit, sometimes doing the right thing is just to do the right fucking thing.
If you think that a person shouldn’t be able to vote because a cop illegally searched a young black person’s car, found a lil weed, and sent him to jail for 5 fucking years… well, you’re a piece of shit
QUACKBOOT.
How is this confusing? The point (such that it is) is that women would have sex with less desirable men if they were not motivated by pleasure.
It’s somewhat similar to the “logic” of fighting women’s advancement in the workplace. If women were still dependent on men, at least these guys could be “Beta Bux” rather than shut out of the “Sexual Marketplace” altogether. Because many women are doing quite well, they can make choices based on desire (supposedly getting railed by Chad) rather than economic necessity (supposedly starfish sex with Billy Beta).
On female sexual pleasure: Yeah, it’s super important, duh. That’s how you keep them coming back.
Dad is a hardcore Trump supporter, fervent and sincere. I couldn’t even get him to admit that Trump’s major domestic legislative achievement, the tax cuts, were a slap in the face to good working men and women. Corporations got a permanent cut, while we peons got a temporary one half the size (that will be sold as a tax increase if the Democrats win the White House back….a cleverly laid trap).
Nope. He wouldn’t admit any of that. When I asked directly “What has Trump done for Trump supporters” all I got was Faux News talking points. When I pointed out how reprehensible it is for the President to pretend that an attack on him is an attack on our country, I got nowhere.
I really don’t get it. I’d like to think they’re embarrassed that they got suckered by a con-man, but unfortunately it’s likely more malevolent than that.
@anonymous:
For the same reasons Nazi germany had elections? Except that some of those reasons apply to an even greater degree in the USA where constitutional protections combined with a very, very long tradition make for a more independent military less likely to overtly attack US citizens than was true in Germany in the 30s.
Franco did. As did Hitler & Mussolini. That’s WHY the Nazis invented the phrase “lugenpresse”. How do you get a lugenpresse without an opposition press?
Do try to keep up.
1. Concentration camps are not a defining feature of fascism. Although fascism inevitably sets up part of one’s own population as an internal enemy – which, yes, Trump does all the fucking time – the responses to that internal enemy can follow many different strategies, not just concentration camps or no injustice whatsoever.
2. Concentration camps are used by governments that aren’t fascist. I don’t believe that the US government was fascist during WW2 and yet we had concentration camps up & down the west coast. Are you arguing that FDR and Truman were running a fascist United States from 1942 to 1946?
3. In fucking Texas you idiot. And many other places along the southern border of the US. Did you not see the pictures of children in cages? Did you not read that these concentration camps are run as tent cities when they weren’t set up as fields of small cages spaced across the floor of a previously abandoned warehouse? Do you not know that ICE literally enforced rules where 4 year olds were not allowed to touch, hug, or comfort each other?
It’s confusing because it doesn’t make any sense at all. Not even a little. If you couldn’t feel sexual pleasure anymore would that make you more or less willing to have sex with people you’re completely repulsed by?
This is gross. Decent people consider sex something they share with their partner, not something you get from someone else. Decent people want their partners to experience pleasure because they care for their partners.
@John:
If I point you out to some machete-wielding genital chopper who then stabs you in the next with anesthesia and proceeds to hack at your external genitalia to remove any protuberances, are you likely to feel positively disposed to me?
If I then say, “Look, now that there’s no inconveniently sized organ in the way I want you to wear this strap-on harness over your raw stump so I can swap in just the right sized dildo for my preferences at any given moment and you shall pleasure me while getting no pleasure for yourself,” are you MORE inclined to say yes or LESS inclined to say yes to sex with me than before your genitals were hacked off?
Advocating that some third party hack at your genitals is, logically, NOT a strategy that is going to make you more likely to give me orgasms whether I am successful in convincing that third party to mutilate you or not.
How is this confusing?