“Why is rape supposed to be so bad?” and other very important questions being debated on the Incels.is forums today

They were surprised to find it meant rape (usually) and were pretty much unanimous in saying death is worse than rape.

Hofezai – your students are sensible people.

I was brought up with the belief that rape was not worse than death, but that it invariably MEANT death to the victim.

It took escaping from some guys who tried to drag me into a van one night for me to finally think that one through – and to realise how it implied that anyone raped but still alive afterwards was not really raped at all, according to the standards I was raised with.

As it happens I got away (a lucky kick and a bit of good hiding skills – they looked for me but gave up after a bit) but I needed to think through the survivability, had I not escaped. And assuming, of course, that they did not in fact decide to kill me too: such things happen.

Later, teaching women students in the Arabian peninsular, I ran into that assumption again, though framed as courage (“if you rape me you’d better murder me too, or I’m coming after you” kind of thing).

@Ariblester: logical consistency is rarely in play when dealing with incels, MRAs, or even many conservatives.

“Why is rape supposed to be so bad?”

One thing that I think is worth pointing out is how these guys compartmentalize their care for bodily autonomy. On occasion, I’ve been dragged into a Twitter argument about affirmative consent and without fail, the CHUD on the other side thinks that initiation or lack of resistance == consent, and rather than getting bogged down in their imaginary hypothetical where both partners are equally drunk and “aren’t they raping each other by your logic?”, I turn it around and say “Okay, so if your initiation is consent, then I’m sure you’d be totally cool if your partner started pegging you without lube, wouldn’t you?” The conversation ends pretty quickly after that.

Because these are the same douchebags that will whine that feminists don’t care about prison rape. So clearly they have some concept of their own bodily autonomy (particularly related to penetration), they just don’t apply it to women. Because douchebags.

[I]f there was a pill that could cut the melanin production of your entire body by 90%, LOADS of curry men could enter the ranks of normal humanity and maybe even be accepted by women.

waitaminnit, I thought ‘foids PREFERRED brown men to white men…???

To “Durbis:” I wonder how he’d feel if his mother or sister (obviously he’ll never have a wife) got raped?

To “clip11:” I presume you were punched in the nose and then hauled off to the assistant principal’s office.

To “RREEEEE:” I’d like to read this theory, but only out of morbid curiosity.

To “starystulejarz:” Given that you haven’t been out of your mother’s basement in longer than that, I doubt anyone will notice for another month, when the neighbors complain about the odor to the police, and the local HAZMAT team descends into said basement, wearing their moon suits.

Back when I was in ninth grade (if I remember correctly), our class had a small assignment where we would have to rank bad deeds from worst to least bad in small groups (2 or 3). Me and three of my friends ranked rape worst, while the rest of the class thought killing someone (can’t remember if it was labeled as a murder or not) was worse. Still, I think everyone had put it at least as the second worst thing…

Well put…in my day, it could also be the girl delivering the punch in the nose…New York girls can be pretty tough.

What happens when you grab someone’s ass?

@Knitting Cat Lady – Story time! In the summer after 10th grade, I was lucky enough to go on an optional school trip to Italy. Before I left, some people told me, kind of jokingly, to watch out because Italian men were prone to grabbing girls’ butts (as if this were a cultural and/or fun thing, but OK).

Well, a group of my classmates were waiting at a bus station. We were near another group of English-speaking teens, all boys. They’d apparently heard of the Italian ass-grabbing stereotype and decided to emulate it, because one went up to a classmate of mine and grabbed her butt. And their group started laughing when she gave him an angry look.

You could tell she was embarrassed and upset, so the rest of us tried to make her feel better. E., the tallest guy, decided the thing to do was to “avenge her honour” with the ancient law of A Butt For A Butt: he snuck up to the unsuspecting offender and grabbed his ass. Cue his surprise, our group’s laughter.

Now, this isn’t necessarily a great idea, nor were we free of problematics (e.g. we also decided that the rude dudes must be American, while we as Canadians were automatically superior), but it was pretty satisfying at the time. 🙂

@Dormousing_it an example of what you’re talking about would be Japan’s Burakumin. They’re physically indistinguishable from other Japanese, but even today face discrimination, despite their outcast status being legally abolished in 1871.

Sexually satifiying yourself to actual footage (he specified no films or fake action) of assault, rape and suffering is a fucking hugeass red flag

I think that it is probably far too common though. Standard hetero porn often includes women being slapped and choked, so the average porn watcher is watching that and possibly internalising it as ‘normal’ sex. Only then a small leap for the damaged and sadistic individuals/

That’s cold, kiddo.

Y’know, what always was ridiculous about the white male fear and trope that black men were coming for their women was this dichotomy:

Black men are supposed to be dangerous, stupid, rapacious, menaces.

So why would white women be attracted to them?

Meanwhile, you never hear from those same white men seeking to protect their “race” about white men chasing black women, which is equally “race-diluting.”

It’s an ass not some sort of rare magic jello. Grab yours and you’ll get a good idea of how it feels

I assumed the result in question was how the girl reacted, or if the incel got in trouble, rather than some physical effect of ass-grabbing.