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advocacy of violence baby men douchebaggery empathy deficit entitled babies foids hypocrisy incels men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny not a cult oppressed men penises playing the victim post contains sarcasm racism rape rape culture rape is good actually roasties self-hatred taking pleasure in women's pain violence against women

“Why is rape supposed to be so bad?” and other very important questions being debated on the Incels.is forums today

A completely normal response to visiting the Incels.is forums

By David Futrelle

While the lamestream media wastes its time on trivial issues like the government shutdown and the latest extremely-damaging-to-the-president revelations in the Mueller investigation, the public-spirited fellows over on the Incels.is forums are discussing the issues that really matter in the world today, like “why is rape considered so bad anyway” and “isn’t it hilarious that some dude in India beheaded his cheating wife?”

So weird that these guys have such trouble finding dates.

Here’s a quick look at some of the very important topics being discussed on Incels.is today, a public service I provide from time to time to readers of this blog. (Clicking on the headlines will bring you to an archived version of the thread; virtually all are NSFW.)  It’s possible that some of my comments below (and above, come to think of it) might contain some sarcasm.

Why is rape supposed to be so bad?

In this thread, a concerned incel called Durbis raises some questions about this always-controversial topic:

I don’t understand why rape is considered one of the worst things that could possibly happen to someone. Sure it probably sucks in the moment but as if they can’t just move past it? If I was a woman and I got raped I don’t see why it would be so hard to just move past it. They’ve all had sex before so why is rape apparently so traumatizing? 

Yeah, women sure are weird thinking rape is some big deal, huh?

Mankind desperately needs a cure for brown skin

In this thread, a self-described “curry” — that is, a fellow of Indian descent — laments that

women of every race fucking hate us.

We desperately need a cure for brown skin. It wouldn’t fix our shitty heights/features/muscles/frames, but it would fix one enormous problem. …

[I]f there was a pill that could cut the melanin production of your entire body by 90%, LOADS of curry men could enter the ranks of normal humanity and maybe even be accepted by women.

If we could have this, we could redeem almost 1/5 of the global male population. …

India should be investing at least 10-20% of its GDP in a Manhattan Project scaled enterprise to find and produce the cure for brown skin. 

Clearly this is an absolute necessity because at the present time no Indian men are able to find women to marry and have families with as evidenced by the population of India being seven people.

[JFL] every woman you have talked to has CHOCKED on a COCK at one point in her life

Incels are as obsessed with this issue as Rachel Maddow is with the Mueller investigation. Which is funny because the COCK CHOCKING issue is so much more important!

[LifeFuel] 5 teenage foids die in an escape room after man sets fire to it

Nothing to see here, just a bunch of incels cheering because a Polish man “accidentally” killed five teen girls by setting fire to an escape room where a birthday party was being held.

[NSFW] The final solution to the roastie question.

Nothing to see here, just some incels enjoying a news story on a “gore” site, complete with graphic photos of an Indian woman beheaded by her husband after he discovered her cheating on him.

[Serious] what are some good sites to whack off to females being abused in a sexual way?

Mr. Chadani is just looking for a site where he can watch, er, females

being punched, choked, kicked etc. and being sexually abused … maybe even rape clips if they exist and arent filmed on a calculator. nothing makes me stiffer than watching a female suffering.

I’m not going to link to this thread in case some incel there actually provides him with this information.

women shouldnt hold positions of power

Modern women are a plagueEver grabbed a girls ass when you were in school...jr high or high school. What were the results

Once again, it is absolutely inexplicable why women aren’t interested in dating these fellows!

Anti-incels, I invite you to get in here!!!! I will put an end to the mainstream belief that the reason incels exist is because of our personalities.Yeah, the problem DEFINITELY doesn’t have anything to do with their personalities.

[News] I haven't took a shower in over a month.

Huh. To be honest, that probably doesn’t help, exactly. But really, shouldn’t women be able to overlook a little thing like this? Women are just so shallow, aren’t they?

Incels remain the most persecuted people on planet earth.

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Jerdle
Jerdle
2 years ago

“Die Endlösung der roastiefrage” is a direct reference to “die Endlösen der Judenfrage”, the Nazi term for the Holocaust. So they’re basically planning a genocide of women.

But then how’ll they get laid?

Fishy Goat
Fishy Goat
2 years ago

@Jerdle Sexbots?

Alexis Filth
Alexis Filth
2 years ago

Welp, that’s enough of humanity for me for the year.

16 Cats and Counting
16 Cats and Counting
2 years ago

More brilliant critical thinking from the Incel crowd! I’ve tried to explain the Incel movement to some acquaintances, most of whom find it almost impossible to believe any group could be quite so repugnant. The usual response I get is that these posters must be an exception or mentally ill. No to the first, yes quite possibly to the second!

Just to obtain additional evidence I decided to check out Incels.IS. Among other things I learned that women are in charge of the CIA. Apparently, “That’s why US drones always strike ugly ethnic dudes.” “Ugly” ethnic dudes beware, u are in the sights of cruel, superficial froids!

Ariblester
Ariblester
2 years ago

@16 Cats and Counting

Please adhere to the comments policy regarding Internet diagnoses of mental illness

@David

Nothing to see here, just a bunch of incels cheering because a Polish man “accidentally” killed five teen girls by setting fire to an escape room where a birthday party was being held.

The current theory of investigators is that gas cylinders used to heat the building, a converted private house, leaked, starting a fire. There were also no emergency exits. The operator of the escape room was charged with “deliberately creating the danger of a fire in the escape room and with unintentionally causing the death of people in a fire”. This is quite different from “setting fire to an escape room”.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

The CIA is who in the US government bombs people. That’s news to me. The incels have so much to teach me!

Ariblester
Ariblester
2 years ago

@wwth

The rest of that incel’s argument is nonsense, but CIA personnel do indeed carry out drone strikes. In fact, the first Hellfire-armed Predator drone was delivered to the CIA, not the USAF.

juan
juan
2 years ago

Incels, their celibacy is actually volunatary
Why are they so vehemently wanted to be hopeless celibate?

hofeizai
hofeizai
2 years ago

I teach high school students, and none speak English as a first language. Yesterday, one asked me about the phrase “a fate worse than death,” as it was in some old video clip she had watched. I never answer questions like that until they guess, and they thought it probably referred to torture. They were surprised to find it meant rape (usually) and were pretty much unanimous in saying death is worse than rape. We didn’t spend a long time on this, since we have exams coming, and this is not on it, but they talked about it for a few minutes No one, boy or girl, had trouble expressing that rape is a traumatic event which would require a healing process (they did not use those words, but conveyed their meaning fairly well)
They are not an exceptionally good group of people. I mean, I like them, and they have moments of greatness, but they are basically normal teens, not a bunch of saints. Just normal kids.
So a group of teens who sometimes struggle with English can grasp that rape is bad, and would probably understand why the question “Why is rape supposed to be so bad?” is a jaw-droppingly stupid thing to say.
TL:DR Incels are dumb and should be laughed at

Ooglyboggles
Ooglyboggles
2 years ago

I can feel my reproduction organs attempting to slide away from this incel nonsense.

Jane Done
Jane Done
2 years ago

@16 Cats and Counting:

most of whom find it almost impossible to believe any [straight white cis men] could be quite so repugnant

FTFY.

The usual response I get is that these posters must be an exception or mentally ill

That, and the unspoken (or if you’re the president, the very much spoken) counterpoint regarding minorities, is the greatest, most successful lie in all of western society.

epitome of incomprehensibility

“cure for brown skin” – the internalized racism in that post 🙁

Welp, now I’m feeling sorry for incels.

nothing makes me stiffer than watching a female suffering.

…Never mind.

Bina
2 years ago

When I was just a naïve young thing, I used to think that rape was the worst thing that could happen to me, short of a terrible, painful death. Then I read these incel-forum headlines, and changed my mind. That date-rape thing that happened to me in my early 20s? For that matter, every one of the hundreds of sexual harassments/assaults I’ve ever endured in my 50+ years? A total fucking cakewalk compared to wading through this mental sludge pit that they call their safe space.

This is why you’re incels, incels. Not your wrong-slanted eyelids or your too-small wrists or any of those other obsessed-over physical traits that aren’t actually defects. THIS, you motherfuckers. THIS is what’s wrong with all of you.

epronovost
epronovost
2 years ago

The “girls’ ass” question seems very strange and stupid. All the other ones are very expected from a forum populated by sentient human feces, but to me this one takes the cake. What sort of answer do you expect? It’s an ass not some sort of rare magic jello. Grab yours and you’ll get a good idea of how it feels. The hatred and self-pitty of Incels doesn’t surprise me anymore, but I have yet to be completly jaded to their incredible stupidity and their sheer strangeness.

Rabid Rabbit
Rabid Rabbit
2 years ago

Dear incels,

1) Virgins can be raped too, and women are not magically born having already had sex.

2) Not all blowjob-givers (male or female) are into deep-throating, so the number who have actually choked is probably much lower than you think.

@Jane Doe

That, and the unspoken (or if you’re the president, the very much spoken) counterpoint regarding minorities, is the greatest, most successful lie in all of western society.

I dunno, I still think the idea that conservatives are automatically better at money and keeping countries out of debt/deficit is the 20th century’s greatest con.

Jane Done
Jane Done
2 years ago

@Rabid Rabbit

Hmm, yeah, that’s a tough call. Though it could potentially be considered a by-product of “cishet white men are more human than everyone else”.

reggie, the neighbour's cat and rare mutant
reggie, the neighbour's cat and rare mutant
2 years ago

Had a read of the anti-incels one. One girl was maybe mean to him when he asked her out when he was 15, therefore all women are evil. Also, it isn’t possible to get along with a person of another gender and not want to have sex with them. Friendship is a lie.

Well, I’m convinced now.

ellesar
ellesar
2 years ago

“Why is rape supposed to be so bad?”

I had a conversation with my mother where she agreed with this view. My mother is an intelligent woman, not a feminist, but generally not loaded with poisonous views. I tend to assume that she was minimising because she had been raped, but she has not told me that.

Maybe she thinks that somehow it would be easy to dissociate during the assault and therefore not be so badly affected? Anyway, all pretty fucked up.

I have known a lot of women who have been raped and they were all pretty badly affected – especially as most women are raped by someone they know and have trusted. This is what happened to me, and I have forgotten the actual act, which was many years ago, but what I haven’t forgotten is the fear I felt, being told what was going to happen to me, knowing that that was a fantasy for him.

So many years later I would still happily stand by if he were in the street dying. There is no one I hate as much as him.

ellesar
ellesar
2 years ago

That Indian man is as fucked up as they come, but even worse seems to be oblivious to the fact that there are many more men than women in some parts of India.

India’s preference for sons over daughters has led to the birth of millions of “unwanted” girls, according to a new report by the Indian government.

Couples’ tendency to keep trying until a boy is born has led to the birth of as many as 21 million girls who are “notionally… unwanted,” the Economic Survey 2017-18 states.
The preference for boys and the availability of sex-selective operations, although illegal in India, means there’s a gender gap of as many as 63 million girls, classified in the report as “missing.”
As a result, India has one of the most skewed sex ratios in the world. For every 107 males born in India, there are 100 females. According to the World Health Organization the natural sex ratio at birth is 105 males for every 100 females.

Alexis Filth
Alexis Filth
2 years ago

I actually spent about 45 minutes on my podcast explaining what incels were to my guest. She was simultaneously repulsed and incredulous.

Shadowplay
2 years ago

Alexis – wouldn’t mind a listen to that. Any chance of linking it? (You’re blog hasn’t got it yet)

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@Rabid Rabbit:

@Jane Doe

That, and the unspoken (or if you’re the president, the very much spoken) counterpoint regarding minorities, is the greatest, most successful lie in all of western society.

I dunno, I still think the idea that conservatives are automatically better at money and keeping countries out of debt/deficit is the 20th century’s greatest con.

Nah, capitalism is the 20th century’s greatest con. Dependent on unending exponential growth, when everything we know about physics says our long term expansion will be limited to grow as the cube of elapsed time, it’s the world’s biggest Ponzi scheme, so huge it makes Bernie Madoff look like a piker.

@ellesar:

As a result, India has one of the most skewed sex ratios in the world. For every 107 males born in India, there are 100 females.

That’s a recipe for significant future social unrest … in a country that possesses atomic weapons. Much fun will be had by all, I am sure.

Kevin
Kevin
2 years ago

Re : The Indian guy with a problem about being dark skinned, that is really messed up. The structure of Indian society is going to be an aggravating factor for him too, since ‘higher’ caste Indians are usually paler.

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
2 years ago

I don’t understand why rape is considered one of the worst things that could possibly happen to someone. Sure it probably sucks in the moment but as if they can’t just move past it? If I was a woman and I got raped I don’t see why it would be so hard to just move past it. They’ve all had sex before so why is rape apparently so traumatizing?

So true! Rape is no big deal.

Involuntary celibacy? Now that’s a big effin’ deal, and the guys on incels.is will tell you all about it.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
2 years ago

It is funny (which is to say: not funny at all) how rape alone of all crimes is downplayed by this demographic in this way. They nearly all skew right politically, they’re nearly all law ‘n’ order types who reckon society is going to hell in a handbasket because we’re too soft on lawbreakers dammit, and whose wet-dream fantasies all involve some kind of grotesque Stand Your Ground scenario where they get to shoot and kill someone who trespasses on their sacrosanct private property and get a pat on the back for it. But a woman has her bodily integrity violated? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ What’s the big deal?

bluecat
bluecat
2 years ago

They were surprised to find it meant rape (usually) and were pretty much unanimous in saying death is worse than rape.

Hofezai – your students are sensible people.

I was brought up with the belief that rape was not worse than death, but that it invariably MEANT death to the victim.

It took escaping from some guys who tried to drag me into a van one night for me to finally think that one through – and to realise how it implied that anyone raped but still alive afterwards was not really raped at all, according to the standards I was raised with.

As it happens I got away (a lucky kick and a bit of good hiding skills – they looked for me but gave up after a bit) but I needed to think through the survivability, had I not escaped. And assuming, of course, that they did not in fact decide to kill me too: such things happen.

Later, teaching women students in the Arabian peninsular, I ran into that assumption again, though framed as courage (“if you rape me you’d better murder me too, or I’m coming after you” kind of thing).

Ariblester
Ariblester
2 years ago

@Cat Mara

But a woman has her bodily integrity violated? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ What’s the big deal?

The line

They’ve all had sex before so why is rape apparently so traumatizing?

is telling. It means that in their minds, women behave/dress/etc. in a manner that signals that they give blanket consent to anyone to have sex with them. They’d probably liken it to leaving your front door unlocked and open at night (though I don’t think that doing so invalidates Stand Your Ground in the event that someone does trespass into your house, so logical consistency is not in play here).

Yutolia the Green Hash Thing
Yutolia the Green Hash Thing
2 years ago

@Ariblester: logical consistency is rarely in play when dealing with incels, MRAs, or even many conservatives.

Talonknife
Talonknife
2 years ago

I’m sitting in the classroom for the first day of my Research Methods in Social Sciences class, waiting for my professor to begin the course, and now I’m wondering if I could somehow find a way to work incels into a research project this semester. Surely they’ll make for a fascinating subject for either this or my Criminology class.

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

“Why is rape supposed to be so bad?”

One thing that I think is worth pointing out is how these guys compartmentalize their care for bodily autonomy. On occasion, I’ve been dragged into a Twitter argument about affirmative consent and without fail, the CHUD on the other side thinks that initiation or lack of resistance == consent, and rather than getting bogged down in their imaginary hypothetical where both partners are equally drunk and “aren’t they raping each other by your logic?”, I turn it around and say “Okay, so if your initiation is consent, then I’m sure you’d be totally cool if your partner started pegging you without lube, wouldn’t you?” The conversation ends pretty quickly after that.

Because these are the same douchebags that will whine that feminists don’t care about prison rape. So clearly they have some concept of their own bodily autonomy (particularly related to penetration), they just don’t apply it to women. Because douchebags.

Dormousing_it
Dormousing_it
2 years ago

If everyone on earth was the same color, I have a feeling there would still be discrimination about other things.

I always thought “a fate worse than death” was one of those phrases meant as a superlative, that it wasn’t anything specific. Maybe, at one time it specifically meant rape. I’m no English teacher, tho’.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
2 years ago

[I]f there was a pill that could cut the melanin production of your entire body by 90%, LOADS of curry men could enter the ranks of normal humanity and maybe even be accepted by women.

waitaminnit, I thought ‘foids PREFERRED brown men to white men…???

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
2 years ago

I almost feel sorry for the Indian man considering internalized racism is a thing, and it also exists in developing countries. Key word being almost because India is notorious for its widespread misogyny, rampant sexual harassment/assault, and birth-selective abortion of girls (which is straight up genocide).

Kiwiwriter
Kiwiwriter
2 years ago

To “Durbis:” I wonder how he’d feel if his mother or sister (obviously he’ll never have a wife) got raped?

To “clip11:” I presume you were punched in the nose and then hauled off to the assistant principal’s office.

To “RREEEEE:” I’d like to read this theory, but only out of morbid curiosity.

To “starystulejarz:” Given that you haven’t been out of your mother’s basement in longer than that, I doubt anyone will notice for another month, when the neighbors complain about the odor to the police, and the local HAZMAT team descends into said basement, wearing their moon suits.

Covered in Cat Hair
Covered in Cat Hair
2 years ago

“a fate worse than death”

In my long readings about the Regency and Victorian English history, the phrase was used because it WAS “a fate worse than death”. If a woman survived rape she was “soiled”, she was “defiled”, mentally, emotionally, and physically.

She was no longer fit to be a wife and definitely not fit to raise children. She could no longer be fit to make moral judgements and thus was sure to fall into lying (at best) or general ill behaviour, thieving, and most probably sexual immorality.

Kindly people with the means would send her to live in exile in some small country cottage, with a “companion” to keep an eye on her behaviour. Sometimes she would be encouraged (or told) to take a new name and get out of the country to make her life in the Colonies.

Many, many families just announced she was a living shame to the family BECAUSE she didn’t resist to death, or kill herself afterwards. She would be disowned, and often out of no other choice, would end up as a prostitute, thus proving everyone right.

Valkyrine
Valkyrine
2 years ago

Back when I was in ninth grade (if I remember correctly), our class had a small assignment where we would have to rank bad deeds from worst to least bad in small groups (2 or 3). Me and three of my friends ranked rape worst, while the rest of the class thought killing someone (can’t remember if it was labeled as a murder or not) was worse. Still, I think everyone had put it at least as the second worst thing…

Knitting Cat Lady
Knitting Cat Lady
2 years ago

What happens when you grab someone’s ass?

Here are some reactions I’ve witnessed:

-Reflexive elbow to the nose or stomach
-Open handed or back handed (or both!) slap in the face
-A kick somewhere painful
-‘Ewe! I found a hand on my ass! Anyone know who it belongs to?!’

In general I’d suggest not grabbing asses uninvited. It usually doesn’t end well.

Kiwiwriter
Kiwiwriter
2 years ago

Well put…in my day, it could also be the girl delivering the punch in the nose…New York girls can be pretty tough.

Robert
Robert
2 years ago

I somehow feel utterly convinced that any of these men would react quite emphatically to being raped themselves.

Covered in Cat Hair – excellent observation. Living in a society in which incel-type attitudes towards women’s sexuality were normative, rather than aberrant, would definitely affect a woman’s experience.

epitome of incomprehensibility

What happens when you grab someone’s ass?

@Knitting Cat Lady – Story time! In the summer after 10th grade, I was lucky enough to go on an optional school trip to Italy. Before I left, some people told me, kind of jokingly, to watch out because Italian men were prone to grabbing girls’ butts (as if this were a cultural and/or fun thing, but OK).

Well, a group of my classmates were waiting at a bus station. We were near another group of English-speaking teens, all boys. They’d apparently heard of the Italian ass-grabbing stereotype and decided to emulate it, because one went up to a classmate of mine and grabbed her butt. And their group started laughing when she gave him an angry look.

You could tell she was embarrassed and upset, so the rest of us tried to make her feel better. E., the tallest guy, decided the thing to do was to “avenge her honour” with the ancient law of A Butt For A Butt: he snuck up to the unsuspecting offender and grabbed his ass. Cue his surprise, our group’s laughter.

Now, this isn’t necessarily a great idea, nor were we free of problematics (e.g. we also decided that the rude dudes must be American, while we as Canadians were automatically superior), but it was pretty satisfying at the time. 🙂

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
2 years ago

I don’t understand why rape is considered — when it is considered at all — one of the worst things that could possibly happen to a guy. Sure, it probably sucks in the moment, but why can’t a man just move past it? If I were a guy and I got raped by another guy, I don’t see why it would be so hard to just move past it. Men, old and young, have all had sex before (wink, wink — amirite, fellas!), so why is rape apparently so traumatizing?

tim gueguen
2 years ago

@Dormousing_it an example of what you’re talking about would be Japan’s Burakumin. They’re physically indistinguishable from other Japanese, but even today face discrimination, despite their outcast status being legally abolished in 1871.

tohka
tohka
2 years ago

I’m curious if incels.is forums are watched by some agencies monitoring for potential violent criminals. Sexually satifiying yourself to actual footage (he specified no films or fake action) of assault, rape and suffering is a fucking hugeass red flag

ellesar
ellesar
2 years ago

Sexually satifiying yourself to actual footage (he specified no films or fake action) of assault, rape and suffering is a fucking hugeass red flag

I think that it is probably far too common though. Standard hetero porn often includes women being slapped and choked, so the average porn watcher is watching that and possibly internalising it as ‘normal’ sex. Only then a small leap for the damaged and sadistic individuals/

A
A
2 years ago

“I don’t understand why getting kicked in the balls is considered one of the worst things that could possibly happen to someone. Sure it probably sucks in the moment but as if they can’t just move past it? If I was a man and I got kicked in the balls I don’t see why it would be so hard to just move past it. They’ve all had their balls touched before so why is getting kicked there apparently so traumatizing?”

These guys have severe empathy deficits.

Kiwiwriter
Kiwiwriter
2 years ago

That’s cold, kiddo.

Wetherby
Wetherby
2 years ago

waitaminnit, I thought ‘foids PREFERRED brown men to white men…???

Black men specifically, I believe, mainly because they invariably have gigantic penises, which of course makes them utterly irresistible to all women (most likely including lesbians, who either don’t exist or can easily be persuaded to turn by the sight of a particularly impressive organ).

Kiwiwriter
Kiwiwriter
2 years ago

Y’know, what always was ridiculous about the white male fear and trope that black men were coming for their women was this dichotomy:

Black men are supposed to be dangerous, stupid, rapacious, menaces.

So why would white women be attracted to them?

Meanwhile, you never hear from those same white men seeking to protect their “race” about white men chasing black women, which is equally “race-diluting.”

Ariblester
Ariblester
2 years ago

@Kiwiwriter

So why would white women be attracted to them?

Because, according to BIOTRUTHS, women have evolved to favor brute strength over intelligence (see: Chad and Tyrone).

Meanwhile, you never hear from those same white men seeking to protect their “race” about white men chasing black women, which is equally “race-diluting.”

You actually do see that happening, though? Perhaps not “those same men”, but it is a definite thing in the white supremacist circles.

Podkayne Lives
Podkayne Lives
2 years ago

It’s an ass not some sort of rare magic jello. Grab yours and you’ll get a good idea of how it feels

I assumed the result in question was how the girl reacted, or if the incel got in trouble, rather than some physical effect of ass-grabbing.