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The Federalist channels incel logic with its latest hot take suggesting that watching porn is adultery

Apparently we’re all having affairs with Stormy Daniels

By David Futrelle

The Federalist has once again delivered a hot take so blazingly bad that the entire internet, it seems, has risen up to point and laugh at it.

The conservative site, a veritable factory of extremely bad takes on subjects ranging from The Mueller investigation to feminism, posted a piece by writer John Sweeney yesterday informing us all that “You’re Not Allowed To Knock Trump For Stormy Daniels If You Watch Porn.” According to Sweeney, you see, watching porn is basically adultery, so watching Stormy Daniels have sex is basically the same as having an affair with her.

Now, there are any number of things wrong with this, er, argument — not the least the fact that the real issue with Trump and Stormy Daniels isn’t the sex; it’s the hush money payments, which pretty clearly violated campaign finance laws, making Trump himself the unindicted co-conspirator in a felony case that’s already sent his former top lawyer to jail.

But let’s focus on the even dumber argument at the heart of the piece, the idea that watching porn is the same as committing adultery — at least if you’re a married dude.  (In Sweeney’s world, everyone is straight and only men watch porn.)

“Culturally we may not believe it,” Sweeney asserts,

but each time a married man watches pornography, he commits an act of adultery. … We don’t wait for our wives to leave the house to watch baseball.

Sweeney restates his basic premise perhaps a half-dozen times, but never actually presents a straightforward argument that would justify his conclusion.

Instead, he focuses on a slightly different scenario — a situation in which a husband engages in virtual sex with a woman online:

[I]magine that a woman returns home from work only to find her husband on a video chat, engaging in virtual sex with a woman he met online. … Direct physical contact is sufficient, but not necessary to commit adultery. …

[H]iding behind a computer screen is nothing more than a technicality, providing neither excuse nor justification. It is easy to see, then, that watching pornography is not substantively different or uniquely innocent.

Perhaps realizing that he hasn’t quite managed to convincingly argue that last bit — his equation of virtual sex and porn — Sweeney presents a different hypothetical scenario: a husband watching a live cam show. “His behavior here is no different than the previous hypothetical,” Sweeney asserts.

If a man can commit adultery through a computer connection, does it really matter who is on the other end?

Well, yeah, it does. There’s a difference between an intimate, interactive sexual encounter between two people — even if it’s virtual — and watching a show put on for dozens or hundreds of viewers.

Notice, then, how similar this is to watching pornography.  The only real difference is that a typical pornographic video is pre-recorded. 

This is like saying that talking to someone — in person or on the phone — is the same as reading a book by them. In the first case you are interacting with a specific person; in the second you are part of an audience and have no personal connection with the author.

The only scenario out of the three that could be considered “cheating” is the virtual sex scenario, because it involves a personal connection of sorts with another human being. Private cam sessions might also be considered cheating — emphasis on the “might.”

Are any of these things exactly the same as having an affair or having sex with a sex worker? No. And it’s up to individual couples to define what does and does not count as infidelity in their relationships.

Some might consider virtual sex with an almost-stranger to be much less of a big deal than, say, a partner publicly flirting with a neighbor, even if there is virtually no chance that this flirtation will lead to any kind of sex. Moreover, nonmonogamy has rules as much as monogamy does. Someone in an open relationship might be fine with their partner having sex with multiple other people on a regular basis — but forbid their partner from seeing a sex worker or getting a lap dance.

Different people draw boundaries in radically different ways. And that’s their business. Wantonly expanding the definition of adultery to encompass everything even vaguely sexual — including porn watching — is neither honest nor helpful.

Sweeney’s porn=adultery argument is strikingly similar to one I’ve run across again and again from NoFappers and incels and assorted others in the manosphere — the notion that those who watch porn are cuckolds, in that they are watching women having sex instead of having sex with them.

“All the porn you watch is basically Cuckold Porn.,” a NoFap Redditor calling himself keysomea declared in a post a year ago.

Why? Here is the explanation: You are basically watching another guy fuck the women that you would want to fuck and taking pleasure in that by masturbating to that.

While it makes a certain sense for someone trying to avoid masturbating to porn — the primary goal of the NoFap movement — to cast aspersions on the act of masturbating to porn, this argument is set forth even more energetically by incels.

“Watching porn makes you a cuck,” someone called Heightframeface declared on the Incels.is forums earlier this year.

How can people, especially incels, watch a Chad fuck a girl who’s making tens of thousands of dollars by being a digital prostitute? This is the ultimate form of cuckoldry.  …

WATCHING PORN MAKES YOU LIKE ANY OTHER SOY-INFESTED LIBERAL CUCK OUT THERE 

“Porn Fappers are cucks,” agreed another commenter in yet another thread on the Incels.is forums.

You Who watch Tyrone or Chad plow Stacy on the regular are cucks stuck in jewish agenda.

You enjoy seeing a superior man have sex With The girl you wish to screw daily and enjoy that.

And this isn’t the only way in which incels have broadened the definition of “cuck.” As I noted in a recent post,

incels have expanded the definition of “cuckold” to include every man who has sex with a girl or a woman who isn’t a virgin. In other words, if a woman has ever had sex with a man other than the one she’s currently with, she’s basically cucking her current man as much as if she were to have sex with another man right in her boyfriend or husband’s bed while he watches, humiliated.

Many incels become fixated on this idea. When they see a woman they find attractive, all many incels can think about is all the other guys that (they imagine) she’s been with.

And somehow this always leads their brains to thoughts of semen. “Can you talk to a girl knowing that her mouth has been filled with semen?” asked one Incels.is commenter. It’s something that these guys think about on a daily basis — causing them to feel worse about themselves and to hate women even more.

Incels aren’t the only woman-hating woman-wanters to make this argument, which is also fairly common amongst MGTOWs — those similarly womanless men who, unlike the incels, claim that their womanlessness is the result of their own deliberate choices. “How cucked do you need to be,” one MGTOW recently declared in a Reddit rant, “to put a ring on someone who took it up the ass and swallowed when she was younger?”

It’s easy enough to see why NoFappers, incels, and MGTOWs have adopted such a ludicrously capacious notion of cuckoldry. NoFappers define porn use as cuckoldry because they’re trying to stop using porn. Incels adopt the same definition not because they’ve given up porn — most seemingly haven’t — but because, somewhat paradoxically, it enables them both to play the “cucked” victim of porn and to look down on “normies” who also use porn.

Similarly, incels and MGTOWs are happy to castigate men who have sex with non-virginal women as “cucks” because it makes them feel better about their own celibacy (whether they consider it “involuntary” or their own choice). And it gives them yet another excuse to slut-shame any woman who have any sort of sex life at all.

So are there similarly political motives behind Sweeney’s weird expansion of the notion of adultery to include watching porn?

At the outset, Sweeney insists he’s not making the argument in his article’s title — that people who use porn have no right to criticize Trump’s affair with Stormy Daniels — in an attempt to absolve Trump of his sins. “This [argument] by no means justifies President Trump’s behavior,” Sweeny declares.

He slept with another woman while his wife was home caring for their son, and he deserves every second of criticism from his affair with Daniels.

Well, perhaps, but it seems pretty clear that by equating literal adultery — something that most people consider a Very Bad Thing — with something that most people indulge in and that very few people now see as a big deal, you are by definition minimizing the significance of Trump’s adultery, no matter how you try to deny it.

Beyond that, Sweeney’s main goal seems to be to use porn to attack the sexual revolution that began in the 1960s.

“If anything can be attributed to the sexual revolution, it is the widespread popularization of pornography,” he asserts.

It is the crowning achievement of a culture that treats sex flippantly, stripping it of its beauty and purpose, leaving only the bodily function. We have reduced sex to transactional entertainment and created a generation of pornography-addicted consumers, hiding behind the anonymity of a computer screen. 

Whatever your feelings about porn, to portray its current popularity as the “crowning achievement” of the sexual revolution is, I think, profoundly dishonest. The sexual revolution was about many things, but at its essence it was about sexual freedom, enabling those who lived through it or who grew up in its wake to approach sex with less stigma and needless guilt.

It’s given women sexual autonomy they never had before, and helped to enable LGBTQ folks to fight for and win basic rights previously denied them. It’s revolutionized the way our society thinks about sexual consent, helping to  reduce rapes and to render unacceptable the sort of sexual harassment that used to be rampant in the workplace.

We still have a long way to go on all these issues, but there’s no question that the sexual revolution has helped us to make progress on all of them.

Sweeney tries to present himself as a sort of white night for married women victimized by their husband’s “virtual adultery” in the form of porn use. But his real agenda seems to be to push back against a sexual revolution that has benefitted women in countless ways.

His piece isn’t simply a bad take; it’s an insidious one. He’s doing no favors for the women he pretends to be defending.

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Saint_Somnia
Saint_Somnia
6 years ago

What exactly is their objection to someone having had semen in their mouth? I mean, humans put all sorts of things in their mouths.

They probably think it’s gay.

bluecat
bluecat
6 years ago

@ Wetherby

The writer Alan Bennett shares the same birthday with his brother, born a few years earlier, and they worked out that they must both have been conceived during an August Bank Holiday weekend.

I worked out that the four of us who got born must have been conceived during half term / school holidays.

Can you guess what my dad’s profession was?

There was a fashion for naming celebrity’s kids after the place they were conceived. In my elder bro’s case that would be Old Ship Hotel, Brighton – on their honeymoon, during school holidays.

It’s said the fashion died out after Liam Gallagher realised his daughter had been conceived in Malaga.

Katamount
6 years ago

@Surplus

Odd, innit? This is an example of the “free market” operating as these chowderheads believe is optimal, and they’re abhorred not by child slave labour and sweatshop conditions, but by the existence of Pornhub.

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

Bluecat, I’ve read that that is why Florence Nightingale was named Florence.

Regarding the OP, some of these people have such issues with being biological organisms I’m surprised they’re not transhumanists.

Maybe that’s why the sexbot idea is so popular.

mothkiller
mothkiller
6 years ago

It is the crowning achievement of a culture that treats sex flippantly, stripping it of its beauty and purpose, leaving only the bodily function. We have reduced sex to transactional entertainment and created a generation of pornography-addicted consumers, hiding behind the anonymity of a computer screen.

You know, I am sick of people describing sex as needing to be beautiful, or transcendent or super meaningful. It’s supposed to be fun. I also helps me be closer to my spouse, especially when we are full cuddling. But putting too much pressure on it to be profound seems to take the fun out which is the point.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
6 years ago

Ugh, tangentially related to my earlier post: the actor who played the Marquis de Sade in Quills, Geoffrey Rush, has been accused of gross behaviour by actor Yael Stone (who plays the character of Lorna on Orange Is The New Black). Rush has responded with the usual not-pology: “Clearly Yael has been upset on occasion by the spirited enthusiasm I generally bring to my work. I sincerely and deeply regret if I have caused her any distress. This, most certainly, has never been my intention.” ?

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
6 years ago

@ Cat Mara:

this is appropriate here….

First Aid Kit

I am so sick and tired of this world
All these women with their dreams shattered
From some man’s sweaty, desperate touch
God damn it, I’ve had enough
When did you come to think refusal was sexy?
Can’t you see the tears in her eyes?
How did you ever think you had the right to
Put your entitled hands up her thighs?

[Chorus]
You are the problem here
You are the problem here
No one made you do anything
You are the problem here
You are the problem here
No one made you do anything

[Post-Chorus]
And I
And I hope you fucking suffer

Do you really expect anyone to feel sorry
That you ruined your own life?
You did it when you thought you had the right to
Put your entitled hands up her thighs
And we don’t need to be diminished
To sisters or daughters or mothers
I am a human being, that is how you relate to me
[Chorus]
You are the problem here
You are the problem here
No one made you do anything
That’s not how liquor works
You are the problem here
You are the problem here
No one made you do anything

[Post-Chorus]
And I
And I
And I
And I
And I
And I hope you fucking suffer

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
6 years ago

@Weird Eddie: ?

A slightly more upbeat (in its way) article: Eliza Dushku’s take-no-prisoners account of her sexual harassment at CBS. Bear in mind that this was all under wraps thanks to lawyers and NDAs, that none of this would have come out if her abusers had been able to keep their entitled traps shut but, no, that was just beyond them: they just had to ‘splain, dammit! It was locker room talk! She had a “humour deficit”! ? These guys were so oblivious to their own shitgoblinry that they handed over footage of their harassment to Dushku’s legal representatives in the blithe belief it would somehow exonerate them (I can only imagine said representatives did that thing in cartoons where their eyes revolved like slot machines before dollar signs popped up, before they turned to their CBS counterparts and asked sweetly how many zeroes they wanted their initial offer to contain)!

Oh, and the guy who said that Dushku was somehow complicit in her harassment because she’d once appeared in Maxim magazine? Not enough Lego in the world for that asshole to step on.

Talonknife
Talonknife
6 years ago

I actually know people who share porn with their partners. They’ll find a video/image/whatever that they like and send it to their partner either because they know it caters to their partner’s fetishes or because they want to try it out in the bedroom, or sometimes both.

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
6 years ago

@ Cat Mara:

Oh, SHIT…

I apologize, I only made it to the part where they called her “legs.” I don’t have the iron gut I once had.

But I do have to wonder… WHERE THE FUCK DO THEY GET THE IDEA THAT’S “OK”?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Somebody, hurry, please tell me again how there is no such thing as “rape culture”… I need ta hear it…..

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Catmara,

Good for Eliza. She’s really made Weatherly and everyone complicit in his fuckwaddery look like the asswaffles they are.

comment image

Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
6 years ago

@ Cat Mara;

… okay, finished it

by the grim grey ghosts of watergate, I wish those tapes could be made public.

The response of CBS (though they do have to think of the bottom line) seemed to be, “we do what we want, because we can… here’s money, go away, there’s other victims we can torment.”

Chris Oakley
Chris Oakley
6 years ago

Off-topic, but the Washington Post just announced that James Mattis is retiring as Secretary of Defense in February.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
6 years ago

@Weird Eddie:

I apologize, I only made it to the part where they called her “legs.” I don’t have the iron gut I once had.

IMO, that “rape van” “joke” was much, much worse, because Dushku has spoken openly of being molested as a teenager when she was working on the film True Lies… but, hey, it was just her being “humour deficient” amirite (rolls eyes clean out of skull)

@weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee:

Good for Eliza. She’s really made Weatherly and everyone complicit in his fuckwaddery look like the asswaffles they are.

Yep, and the thing was, it was all really a sideshow in the main event: to unseat shitbag-in-chief Les Moonves without the ignominy of having to pay him that $120m (!) golden parachute. If Weatherly had had a microgram of common sense, he could have kept his fool mouth shut and sat behind the NDA those CBS lawyers had so considerately erected around him, and no-one would have been any the wiser about what a douche he was. But he just couldn’t. White Man Privilege: it’s a hell of a drug.

PS Love that image! ✊

bruno sardine
bruno sardine
6 years ago

Certain men can slut shame and abuse women and still getting laid just fine, but you get to be a good boy and fight the evils of sexual repression and misogyny for a resentful handjob once a month. You get to be held to a higher standard. Stormy appreciates your hard work.

fat balding male feminist who worships ‘mature and experienced’ women in exchange for le sexy times=ultimate stud

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

PS Love that image!

I appreciate Faith more with each rewatch of Buffy and Angel. She had the best character most interesting arc across both series out of almost any other character in that universe. It’s unfortunately not often that female characters get a villain to hero redemption arc story.

Moggie
Moggie
6 years ago

@Chris Oakley:

Off-topic, but the Washington Post just announced that James Mattis is retiring as Secretary of Defense in February.

So… war with Iran by June?

C4t
C4t
6 years ago

Point order: the average porn star is paid shit considering what they do, the health and professional risks, especially compared to what mainstream actors are paid to just get naked.

It’s one of the many problems in a predatory industry where a shit ton of money is being made, it’s just not reaching the actors. Not having a guild is part of the issue no doubt.

I don’t have a problem with porn. Exploitation of workers otoh….

C4t
C4t
6 years ago

and the “tut-tutting” about anything that deviates from Handmaid’s Tale-style missionary was verrrrry skull-boy.

McArthur libelez!

Fishy Goat
Fishy Goat
6 years ago

*imagines Weatherly being Gibbs-slapped forever with a sledgehammer*

C4t
C4t
6 years ago

@Cat Mara
I skimmed 101 Days of Sodom.
Everything you said.

Cheerful Warthog
Cheerful Warthog
6 years ago

But if you’re watching, say, Stacy and Becky getting it on without Chad, where’s the cuckolder?

From what I’ve seen from the little I’m able to tolerate of reading these people, the cuckolder is the porn producer, who – it is VERY IMPORTANT THAT YOU KNOW – is Jewish. All of them. Jewish. This is very important.

I have a strong problem with peas. (I’m going somewhere with this.) Can’t take ’em. Can’t eat ’em. Difficulty eating things next to ’em. Takes a hell of an effort to touch ’em. It’s a psychological thing, not a physical thing.

My family has a subscription to one of those meal-delivery services, and it puts peas in EVERYTHING. (Happily, when we prepare one of these meals, we make at least one plate without the legumious nightmare.) I get bothered by it even though intellectually I know it doesn’t affect me. “Oh, that’s nice, I do always enjoy a Thai-style curry and THEY PUT PEAS IN IT AGAIN! WHY DO THEY ALWAYS HAVE TO PUT PEAS IN IT?”

It might be clear how I’m bringing this around to the beginning now, since originally I saw the “NoFap” thing as a positive movement. “Oh, that’s nice, they’ve got a thing going that they’re being stupid about but that doesn’t harm other people and THEY PUT ANTI-SEMITISM IN IT AGAIN! WHY DO THEY ALWAYS HAVE TO PUT RAGING BIGOTRY IN IT?”

Jane Done
Jane Done
6 years ago

incels have expanded the definition of “cuckold” to include every man who has sex with a girl or a woman who isn’t a virgin

That is quite literally what pretty much all hardcore christians teach. It’s nothing new.

Divorce is adultery, making out is adultery, masturbation is adultery, and, as someone else pointed out, being attracted to someone is adultery. Everything is adultery. Even if you’re single, it’s adultery to your future wife/husband.

I mean yeah, I’m all for encouraging men to not fucking lean off the edge of a railing to announce to the whole world that you’re leering at a woman walking down the street minding their own business (guy at work did that, REALLY wanted to *redacted*), but for some strange reason, christians always blame women for being stared at.

WWTH:

Conservatives think feminists and/or progressive women are man hating harpies who you can’t have a pleasant relationship with

Yet feminists are also simeltaneously forcing women to embrace an oversexualized, “degrading” self image where every woman wears a thong and pasties and lap dances on random men’s laps constantly.

It’s like a weird, sexualized extension of the fascist ideology of both strong and weak.

@mothkiller:
Well the point is that sex is a gift from god, so people should only be allowed to do it as an act of servitude to cishet white men god.
Namely, for making babies. Anything else is adultery.

@Weird Eddie:
As has been stated many times by many authors, “The cruelty is the point”.
Or in simpler, less fuzzy-wuzzy terms, some people are just evil. Not as in an immutable trait but the embracing of a lifestyle of constantly choosing to perform sadistic, barbaric acts for no good reason.

Jane Done
Jane Done
6 years ago

@Cheerful Warthog:

comment image

tim gueguen
6 years ago

Life imitates art, or art imitates life? Michael Weatherly played Tony DiNozzo on NCIS for 13 seasons, and Tony was a horndog who would hit on any woman he could. Weatherly said of Tony “It’s kind of fun to play a total dinosaur in terms of sexual politics…The shallow end of the philosophical pool is obviously where Tony paddles around.” But how far of a reach was it for him to play the character?