Categories
crackpottery jordan "slappy" peterson YouTube

He drinks a cider drink: Huge weirdo Jordan Peterson says a glass of apple cider kept him awake for a month

Jordan Peterson gets knocked down, and lies there terrified, unsleeping, for a month

By David Futrelle

In addition to being terrible, Canadian fussbudget paleothinker Jordan Peterson is just plain fucking weird, especially when it comes to his diet. You’ve probably heard about his all-meat diet ( The Atlantic goes into great detail about it here).

But have you heard what happens when he drinks apple cider? In the video below, he tells Joe Rogan that when he drank apple cider after going on his all-meat diet it “produced an overwhelming sense of impending doom” and kept him awake for 25 days.

As in, literally no sleep for a month. Which is literally impossible. While one young Frenchman with a rare disorder managed to survive on only a few minutes of sleep a night for several months, no one has ever gone completely without sleep for 25 days in the history of our species; that’s more than twice the world record. Which you’d think that Peterson, as a professor of psychology, would know.

Anyway, the video (below) is only a minute and a half, and it will CHANGE YOUR LIFE.

Subscribe
Notify of
guest

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

172 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
kupo
kupo
2 years ago

@Valya
Yeah, the thread goes into why that’s bad, especially when trying to use it as a model for medical treatment, but even just for advancing science. If we pretend this wide range of differences that affects more than 1 out of every 50 people is all one category, we’re closing a lot of doors.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Kupo,

I love how that thread arose because Chuck Tingle said there were infinite sexes across infinite timelines and Laci Green came sweeping in with TERF dogwhistles to lecture about how that was wrong.

What a bizarre hill to die on.

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

TERF:s know about intersex people, they usually say the intersex don’t really prove anything since they’re a small minority. Sex is a binary with a few abnormal exeptions to it, that’s what they say. Just like “humans are a two-legged species” isn’t disproven by the fact that some people have one or no legs.

Ugh I’m in a discussion with academic TERF:s right now on Facebook. It’s so hard, because… You know how there are those seemingly polite and rational people arguing about immigration, different cultures etc, in a way that support racism. I think the vast majority of people I know in philosophy see such crap for what it is. But there’s an exact analogy among transphobes, people who use feminist premises and argue in a very polite and reasonable-sounding way that of course we shouldn’t be mean to trans women and they even deserve compassion because they often have it rough, but let’s not lose sight of the fact that they’re actually men who remake their bodies because they’re unhappy about the male gender role, not actual women, and yada yada yada, and you’re free to disagree of course but let’s have a rational discussion about this without resorting to name-calling like using the dreaded “TERF”. And I see so many otherwise smart people in my profession who completely fall for this crap.

So I feel like I have a duty to take these discussions, and also sound as calm and reasonable to an outsider looking in as the TERFs I argue aganist because otherwise I’m just gonna fucking lose the discussion and fail to convince anyone! We can lament the fact that that’s the way it works, but that’s still the way it works, and it’s important that I do manage to convince colleagues reading the discussion on this one!

But at the same time, I’m literally sick to my stomach from this discussion because it’s my friends on the line! It’s not just some academic disagreement!

Ugh.

kupo
kupo
2 years ago

@wwth
Yeah, I saw that. Even Chuck was getting frustrated with it and the man beams rainbows of positivity.

Valentin - Emigrantski Ragamuffin
Valentin - Emigrantski Ragamuffin
2 years ago

It is ironic – I think I will struggle to sleep tonight because I made myself feel too afraid reading about Fatal Familial Insomnia…😬

Bakunin
Bakunin
2 years ago

@Dvärghundspossen
Gee, that sounds so fun /s. I’d probably just start swearing at everything.

Also, way off topic, but I swear the spironolactone pills they gave me smell like mint. Seriously, it’s like opening an altoids tin. Is it just me, or what?

Viscaria
Viscaria
2 years ago

“So Jordy, how’s the new diet?” “Oh, it’s great, it’s great. Just fantastic, yeah. It does have the side effect of sometimes causing me to feel unbearable fear for a month. Just a ceaseless internal scream that cannot be silenced, a cold, terrifying mental siren that chases away the sweet release of sleep and leaves only waking nightmares. But yeah, other than that, I gotta say I’d recommend it to anyone.”

dust bunny
dust bunny
2 years ago

OK so about the month without sleep, I watched that clip and some of Peterson’s other stuff a while back and I think I have a pretty good idea of how his mind works. Heavily projecting some of my own least favourite character traits here of course, but to me this seems like a case of a bullshitter knowing a bullshitter when they see one.

At its most innocent (and least stupid), what he said about the apple cider could just have been similar to an involuntary thing I sometimes do when I’m having a stressful interaction and kind of zone out and just leave a hollow shell there to perform “normal human” to its best ability. I know what I’m going to say before I say it, but I don’t have the spoons to think of anything else to say quickly enough and disrupting the seeming normality and flow of the conversation absolutely isn’t an option, so I have to go with what my brain automatically generates as it is. In this mode I very, very often say things that aren’t true and I don’t believe myself and don’t expect others to believe, but that MEAN something that is true. In this case, he just wants to (and fails to normally) describe how strongly he feels about the wrongness of the apple cider, putting it in terms he thinks will convey the feeling. A part of this is not being able to stop yourself from automatically doubling down and often outright claiming you do mean it literally when challenged. I absolutely hate when I do this, it makes me feel like an idiot, and it very justifiably makes people think I’m weird. Thankfully I’m not a revered intellectual and public speaker presenting as a scientist and speaking with authority on consequential issues.

Peterson explicitly believes that stories have meaning that is true without being literal, in a way that goes much further than literary studies, so saying dumb shit like this is just perfectly consistent with his belief system. He seems to think that if something feels true or profound, then there’s truth in it, but only if it feels that way to him. That there is an objective reality and you can gain access to it through your mind and stories and symbols. He has that access. He knows which stories are ancient and true (everything conservative that props up hierarchies) and which are new, artificial and made up (anything that gives a voice to people who don’t deserve it based on their position in the ancient hierarchy). When others’ feelings and experiences don’t match his they obviously are doing it wrong. Like so many intellectual dudes, he’s a solipsist.

A lot of people are expressing surprise that he’s a professor with a seemingly legit PhD and a practicing clinical psychologist. Sadly it isn’t surprising at all. We give authority, respect and power to really incompetent and shitty people all the time.

TB Tabby
TB Tabby
2 years ago

The side effects of drinking apple cider were even worse than talking to Sam Harris?! *shudder*

Violet the Vile, Moonbat Screech Junky
Violet the Vile, Moonbat Screech Junky
2 years ago

@wwth

…so a speculative thought is “wrong”?

What a peculiar woman Laci Green is. Surely the whole point of imagination is that you can imagine ANYTHING. But I guess to TERFs even using your brain to imagine a possibility is verboten.

Anyway, aren’t physicists saying there are infinite realities containing every possible variation of everyone’s life now? I think that’s a thing. And if there are infinite possible realities then Chuck Tingle is, actually, definitively right and there will be infinite genders, a bit like Rick and Morty’s alternate pizza/people/phone/chairs realities:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=_pPzUo30Hq4

which, in an infinite universe, possibly actually also exist.

Also, I’m quite amused that Jordan Peterson made this biological blunder. Telling this obvious a lie destroys his credibility quite effectively. Well done, Jordie. A few more like that and we can hopefully start to consign you to history where you belong.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
2 years ago

@kupo

Reminds me of this old Facebook post:

comment image

Moggie
Moggie
2 years ago

I too feel an “overwhelming sense of impending doom”, because I read the news.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
2 years ago

@A. Noyd, @Viscaria: Guess who was a famous victim of night terrors? None other than everyone’s favourite (sic) racist horror writer, H.P. Lovecraft! Who knew that the Necronomicon was in fact a diet book subtitled Scream Yourself Thin? 😂

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
2 years ago

@kupo:

I love how that thread arose because Chuck Tingle said there were infinite sexes across infinite timelines and Laci Green came sweeping in with TERF dogwhistles to lecture about how that was wrong.

Laci Green tried to “well, actually” Chuck Tingle?? Truly, TERFs and MRAs are made for one another– indeed, if it didn’t constitute animal cruelty I’d have one of each trussed in a sack and left on the mesa for the coyotes and gila monsters.

Pie
Pie
2 years ago

@kupo

And it’s also an interesting read with lots of info that might be new to you even if you already know a lot about biological sex.

Kinda wish I’d had something this simple and succint a few years ago when I was working with a company involved in clinical trial work. Clinical trial specs are replete with requirements and restrictions involving ‘males’ and ‘females’, and I tried to politely point out that trying to ask a simple question to applicants about what sex they were could easily run in to all sorts of problems as soon as they met someone who didn’t fit neatly into the standard categories. It was mostly met with confusion and a small amount of embarassment, and eventually brushed off as it was considered too hard to handle properly and wasn’t a common enough occurrence to worry about.

Cohen the Librarian
Cohen the Librarian
2 years ago

You mean Jordan Peterson made a ridiculous claim? Well, I’m surprised!

No doubt somebody will be by shortly to once again explain that it’s wrong to take his claims literally, that this literalism is a symptom of our inability to navigate the depths of Peterson’s profound insights into the human condition, and so forth.

Cindy
Cindy
2 years ago

Isn’t Laci Green dating a literal Nazi? You know what they say, birds of a feather…

Mish of the Catlady Ascendancy

@Cat Mara,

Laci Green tried to “well, actually” Chuck Tingle??

She literally called him “my dude” and told him to “chill out.” 😀

@kupo, wwth, I’d seen the original ScienceVet thread (which is excellent) but I didn’t know the Chuck Tingle/Laci Green origin. I just spent half an hour reading back over that, so thank you!

@Valentin
That article about FFI is indeed very sad, but hopeful, too – possibilities of a treatment in the future! Also, I wouldn’t worry too much about it, unless you know of family members who’ve had the condition.

Reds R. Lion (formerly Dawn)
Reds R. Lion (formerly Dawn)
2 years ago

I’m assuming that Lobsterman actually was manic, or on drugs, or something to that effect. Since they are the most likely things to cause someone to go a month with little sleep and come out fine. (Yes he could be lying, but I won’t assume someone is lying until there is overwhelming proof of it.)

I get all kinda of weird neurological symptoms to foods with high sulfites (including migraines and panic attacks). I’m not aware of sulfites ever having kicked off a manic/mixed episode, but I wouldn’t be too surprised to find out that they could.

Red R. Lion (formerly Dawn)
Red R. Lion (formerly Dawn)
2 years ago

I’m assuming that Lobsterman actually was manic, or on drugs, or something to that effect. Since they are the most likely things to cause someone to go a month with little sleep and come out fine. (Yes he could be lying, but I won’t assume someone is lying until there is overwhelming proof of it.)

I get all kinda of weird neurological symptoms to foods with high sulfites (including migraines and panic attacks). I’m not aware of sulfites ever having kicked off a manic/mixed episode, but I wouldn’t be too surprised to find out that they could.

Gaebolga
Gaebolga
2 years ago

Not to give Lobsterdude any sort of cover at all, but I had an 8-month period of my life when I felt a constant – and constantly growing – sense of impending doom. It fucked my life up completely, and I did some really stupid and self-destructive things because of it. It’s a really bad feeling.

I never did figure out the source of it (although it sure as hell wasn’t cider), and it went away eventually, which left me in the very weird position of looking back on my actions and simultaneously wondering what the hell I was thinking and knowing exactly what I was thinking but no longer feeling the emotions that drove that thinking and made my stupid choices seem like the least worst ones available.

That said – what with the whole “25 days without sleep” thing – I’m pretty sure JP is full of shit, both figuratively and literally.

A. Noyd
A. Noyd
2 years ago

Cat Mara says:

Guess who was a famous victim of night terrors? None other than everyone’s favourite (sic) racist horror writer, H.P. Lovecraft!

At least he had the sense not to believe in his own fictions.

~*~*~*~*~*~

Gaebolga says:

Not to give Lobsterdude any sort of cover at all, but I had an 8-month period of my life when I felt a constant – and constantly growing – sense of impending doom.

It’s actually pretty common to go through things like that, especially if you have depression or anxiety, so I don’t doubt that part of it at all. In fact, because it’s so common, it irks me that Peterson seems to think his experience was extra special.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
2 years ago

Some Trump fans here wanted to make a point about Sadiq Khan giving a permit for that Trump baby balloon to be flown in London. So they crowd funded a Khan balloon and applied for permission to fly it, with “Lets see what he says about free speech now”.

But he granted the permit.

comment image

“If people want to spend their Saturday looking at me in a yellow bikini they’re welcome to do so. I don’t really think yellow’s my colour though.”

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
2 years ago

@Mish of the Catlady Ascendancy

She literally called him “my dude” and told him to “chill out.” 😀

OMG

DerangedDan
DerangedDan
2 years ago

Yeah, Peterson is coy about it now, since The Rationals make up so much of his audience, but he is absolutely religious. (Hilariously, the first thing I found looking for what he’s said on the subject was a lobsterian explaining that the fact that Peterson has called himself a Christian and “deeply religious” doesn’t mean that he’s a deeply religious Christian).

He’s got some unusual mystical beliefs on top of that too, mostly based on his extremely literal belief in the Jungian Collective Unconscious. He’s claimed that his wife has prophetic dreams, and that various spiral patterns in ancient cultures are literal representations of DNA, somehow pulled out of the collective unconscious by people who could not possibly know what a molecular structure even is.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
2 years ago

@Alan

… Aside from the transphobia, what bugs me the most about that balloon is that it looks absolutely nothing like Khan. Are we sure they didn’t repurpose a balloon of Professor Oak?

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@A. Noyd:

Night terrors were one of the fun side-effects of one of the drugs on my childhood’s psych-med-go-round. The same one also caused me to sleep up to 18 hours some days. I think it might even have been the same damned Haldol that caused that generalized dysphoria thing.

@Gaebolga:

I had an 8-month period of my life when I felt a constant – and constantly growing – sense of impending doom.

I think the clinical term for that is “the 2016 election campaign”. 🙂

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@Cat Mara

That cat gif is adorable.

kupo
kupo
2 years ago

Part of the Chuck Tingle/Laci Green argument, for those interested.
https://twitter.com/ChuckTingle/status/1035193550466473984?s=19

Jesalin: Clit-o-centric Lesbian Goddess
Jesalin: Clit-o-centric Lesbian Goddess
2 years ago

@Bakunin

Also, way off topic, but I swear the spironolactone pills they gave me smell like mint. Seriously, it’s like opening an altoids tin. Is it just me, or what?

Yep, Spiro is minty.

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
2 years ago

Jordan Peterson: Dire Consequences of an All-Seagull Diet

Monzach
Monzach
2 years ago

@Cat Mara

Now, now, let’s not sell good ol’ HPL short here. He wasn’t [i]just[/i] a racist horror writer. He was also a racist [i]fantasy[/i] and [i]science fiction[/i] writer. To be honest, of course, all three genres were still under the umbrella of Weird Fiction at the time when he died, in 1937. 🙂

I’m such a big fan of Lovecraft’s more palatable writings that I own his collected fiction in both book and audio form. 😀

Monzach
Monzach
2 years ago

For whatever reason I don’t get an edit window on my posts right now, so apologies for the botched HTML tags in my previous post. Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa. 🙁

Pie
Pie
2 years ago

@Scented Fucking Hard Chairs

… Aside from the transphobia, what bugs me the most about that balloon is that it looks absolutely nothing like Khan. Are we sure they didn’t repurpose a balloon of Professor Oak?

The alt-reich have consistently shown themselves to be devoid of talent or originality. It is practically a dogwhistle, now… “anyone who doesn’t think that this is funny or clever is one of them“.

Valentin - Emigrantski Ragamuffin
Valentin - Emigrantski Ragamuffin
2 years ago

Also, I wouldn’t worry too much about it, unless you know of family members who’ve had the condition.

Mish, it’s not really that I am afraid I will have it, that will be very unlucky. I am not sure exactly but its more because it is just so horrible to read about. Its like watching a horror movie, but real. And I will think about it for a long time now because that’s just my nature 🙃

it’s similar to how I felt after I read VDR transcript from El Faro, a vessel which sank in hurricane. I felt afraid for a long time after and I read the transcript many times (it’s 510 pages long!). I knew that I was not on that vessel and I didn’t know the people and hopefully I will never be on a vessel in that situation but I still felt afraid about it.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
2 years ago

@Monzach: Oh, don’t get me wrong, I love me some HPL (ain’t no prose purpler! 😉), it’s just the racism tends to undermine his whole thesis. I mean, when your whole pose is that we are all mere specks in a universe so malevolently indifferent to us and our petty concerns that the merest inkling of its immensity would drive us stark gibbering mad– mad! I tell you!— breaking off from this to pass an unkind remark about your fellow human specks’ physiognomy tends to ruin the effect somewhat, from an artistic perspective as well as being a colossal dick move.

Obligatory link to The Toast

kupo
kupo
2 years ago

@Monzach

For whatever reason I don’t get an edit window on my posts right now, so apologies for the botched HTML tags in my previous post. Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa. 🙁

It’s not just you. Lots of people have been reporting issues with posts getting swallowed, not showing up right away, and not showing the edit link or showing up after the edit window is over.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

I’m hearing all these fond remembrances of John McCain all week that note his huge and scary temper but also note how wonderful he was in spite of that.

Yet when Maxine Waters has some fiery words for the Trump administration separating asylum seekers from their children and putting them all in concentration camps, she gets death threats and the media complains about how uncivil she is.

Gee. I wonder what that double standard could be about. I’m stumped here. Can anyone help me out?

A. Noyd
A. Noyd
2 years ago

Surplus to Requirements says:

I think it might even have been the same damned Haldol that caused that generalized dysphoria thing.

I haven’t had the…um…pleasure of making Haldol’s acquaintance. But that’s only because I made sure to look up the English for the prescription I got from this one jackass of a psychiatrist before I took it.

I was at the guy’s clinic because of anxiety and panic attacks, which I’ve had my entire life. So I’m familiar with the “psych-med-go-round” (nice term) and what works and what doesn’t. His prescribing me that, combined with his immeasurable condescension, ensured I never visited him again. I found out later he’s got a reputation for prescribing Haldol for everything and anything.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@kupo: And this has been going on for a couple of months now, with no technical resolution in sight. Why are the maintenance engineers apparently sitting on their hands when there’s a significant and unresolved technical problem for them to fix? There hasn’t even been any official word promising a fix “eventually”!

@A. Noyd:

Could be the guy is getting kickbacks from some pharma company to do that. There’s lots of ways of corrupting doctors that pharma sales reps employ, with wining and dining and free fancy vacations yachting and the like being the usual ones (as a straight up transfer of dollars between bank accounts would be noticed, I guess).

http://www.westernherald.com/opinion/article_d89a1086-c8c9-11e4-968c-7f8595357bca.html

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/bruce-e-levine/just-how-corrupted-has-am_b_157145.html

Sheila Crosby
2 years ago

@kupo thanks for that twitter thread. I’ve been saying for a while that I don’t know what sex or gender is, but it was probably much more complicated than the two traditional boxes.

I’m begining to wonder whether lobsterman might be ill. I’m woefully unqualified to diagnose even if I met him in person, but he seems to me to be drifting away from reality in an unusual way. On top of being an authoritarian asshole, that is. Being ill and being an asshole are two different things, of course, but they sometimes occur together.

Full Metal Ox
2 years ago

@Cat Mara:

Guess who was a famous victim of night terrors? None other than everyone’s favourite (sic) racist horror writer, H.P. Lovecraft! Who knew that the Necronomicon was in fact a diet book subtitled Scream Yourself Thin? 😂

In fact (as you may well be aware), Lovecraft wrote a poem about night terrors specifically brought on dietary choices(1); this may well have had roots in his own experience. (2)

(1) http://www.hplovecraft.com/writings/texts/poetry/p085.aspx

(2) http://www.hplovecraft.com/life/interest/foods.aspx

@ A. Noyd:

– “Low blood sugar is associated with both pediatric and adult night terrors.”
– “[Adult] night terrors can occur each night if the sufferer does not eat a proper diet….”

As a sufferer from Type II diabetes and sleep apnea, I can personally attest a link between blood sugar and night terrors–although mine occur during hyperglycemic spells, and often follow the Old Hag archetype. (The most terrifying episode–and I realize that this risks sounding like a Bloom County strip–had Sarah Palin, in a perky yellow suit, squatting astride my chest.)

Full Metal Ox
2 years ago

@Cat Mara:

Guess who was a famous victim of night terrors? None other than everyone’s favourite (sic) racist horror writer, H.P. Lovecraft! Who knew that the Necronomicon was in fact a diet book subtitled Scream Yourself Thin? 😂

In fact (as you may well be aware), Lovecraft wrote a poem about night terrors specifically brought on dietary choices(1); this may well have had roots in his own experience. (2)

(1) http://www.hplovecraft.com/writings/texts/poetry/p085.aspx

(2) http://www.hplovecraft.com/life/interest/foods.aspx

@ A. Noyd:

– “Low blood sugar is associated with both pediatric and adult night terrors.”
– “[Adult] night terrors can occur each night if the sufferer does not eat a proper diet….”

As a sufferer from Type II diabetes and sleep apnea, I can personally attest a link between blood sugar and night terrors–although mine occur during hyperglycemic spells, and often follow the Old Hag archetype. (The most terrifying episode–and I realize that this risks sounding like a Bloom County strip–had Sarah Palin, in a perky yellow suit, squatting astride my chest.)

Valentin - Emigrantski Ragamuffin
Valentin - Emigrantski Ragamuffin
2 years ago

@kupo: And this has been going on for a couple of months now, with no technical resolution in sight. Why are the maintenance engineers apparently sitting on their hands when there’s a significant and unresolved technical problem for them to fix? There hasn’t even been any official word promising a fix “eventually”!

surplus, why do you adress this to kupo specifically? she’s not the engineer for this website, she can’t do anything about it. and we all know it is like this for months. there is nothing anyone here can do about it, so we just have to tolerate it. that’s just life sometimes. if you don’t like it so much then maybe you just have to stop using until it is fixed. or at least send your complaints to the correct channel, not to other commenters who also don’t enjoy this situation and also can’t do anything to fix it🙃

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@Katamount, any other Ontarians here:

How do I renew my Ontario Electricity Support Program WITHOUT going through the entire rigmarole that one has to do to sign up the first time?

I want to just click “renew”, click “no, nothing has changed”, and have done with it. How the fuck do I do that? I have lost patience with this bureaucratic bullshit. I already did all of the labor demanded of me a year ago for this, and now I just want it working and staying working.

But their stupid website doesn’t seem to know the difference between “renew” and “new application”, and treats me as if I were a completely new applicant. Including eventually demanding that I print something out, which of course I can’t do because NOBODY USES PRINTERS ANYMORE, WE USE PHONES AND COMPUTERS TO DO EVERYTHING. Printers are expensive, useless boondoggles that constantly break down, especially if they AREN’T used frequently. If these idiots want me to print something out once a year they basically want me to spend $200 on a new printer every year just to print stuff for them, and no way no how that ain’t fucking happening.

They already have all of my information, and none of it has changed. They already have a consent form on file from me from last year. There IS NO NEED for all of this bullshit.

I just want to click a few things and be done! Or for them to have done the smart thing and it doesn’t NEED any kind of stupid “renewal” any more than my ODSP does!

Now someone please tell me how to make this whole thing just go away without any further work on my part. I don’t even remember what I did to circumvent their demand that I print their stupid form out last year, and I don’t want to remember, but I bet it involved enough hoop jumping and physically traveling around that I absolutely refuse to do it redundantly multiple times when once was already one time more than should have been necessary in this day and age.

So, how do I make this thing have been renewed with zero additional effort beyond a handful of mouse clicks or, at most, a phone call? Anyone?

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@Valentin: It was in response to something she said, https://wehuntedthemammoth.com/2018/08/31/he-drinks-a-cider-drink-huge-weirdo-jordan-peterson-says-a-glass-of-apple-cider-kept-him-awake-for-a-month/comment-page-2/#comment-2199869

As for your comment, what “correct channel” would that be? I don’t know what company David hosts his website with, out of the thousands of webhost companies that exist on Earth, and as a non-customer I wouldn’t have any standing with them anyway — but he does. So the only channel we have is to/through him, and that’s right here, precisely where I posted my comment.

Cat Mara
Cat Mara
2 years ago

@Full Metal Ox

Fellow sleep apnoea sufferer here. I have a fairly mild case as of it as things go.

I haven’t read that poem before but I think I did read that list at some point about HPL’s favourite foods. Interesting that mince pies were still A Thing in the States in his day whereas they seem to have gone totally extinct nowadays. So much so that an American friend of mine who moved to the UK and developed a taste for them had to make some YouTube videos to show his relatives back home exactly what he was talking about and explain that no, despite the name, they don’t have ground meat in them…

(The most terrifying episode–and I realize that this risks sounding like a Bloom County strip–had Sarah Palin, in a perky yellow suit, squatting astride my chest.)

There’s night terrors and there’s night terrors. As the man himself wrote, “there is no language for such abysms of shrieking and immemorial lunacy, such eldritch contradictions of all matter, force, and cosmic order”. 😱

Robert
Robert
2 years ago

I’ve been thinking about the TERF phenomenon recently. My current conclusion is that it’s an example of a problem that has several expressions but one origin. That being – you have a model of how the world works in your mind. Occasionally, you are confronted by evidence that the world itself actually works differently. To avoid the pain and effort of modifying your model, you fault reality for refusing to conform to the model. It’s been described as living in the map instead of the territory, or eating the menu instead of the meal.

Chuck Tingle is a treasure, isn’t he?

As a teenager, I’d read all of the published fiction of both Poe and Lovecraft by the time I’d graduated high school. I’m a little embarrassed that I never noticed Lovecraft’s racism, but then, I never noticed Poe’s use of the unreliable narrator. Rereading Poe with that understanding was quite a revelation. Rereading Lovecraft was almost nauseating.

Full Metal Ox, thanks for sharing the link to that poem. I’d never read it before. He could certainly churn it out, couldn’t he?

Cat Mara – I grew up with mince pies as a holiday staple. My husband considers it an abomination on par with fruitcake; amusingly, our son shares my taste for both. When he was young enough for Santa Claus, we left out fruitcake and eggnog instead of milk and cookies. So, mince pie still has its adherents.

Jane Done
Jane Done
2 years ago

@Dvärghundspossen:

I feel like I have a duty to take these discussions, and also sound as calm and reasonable to an outsider looking in as the TERFs I argue aganist because otherwise I’m just gonna fucking lose the discussion

Here’s a story of myself, a (former) outsider looking in:

I used to have an alt-right nazi sympathiser friend once, before I even knew what the alt-right was, before news of the resurgent nazi movement in the USA hit our country and my social circles and before I had been exposed to any kind of counter-discussion by level-headed normal non-nazi humans. But back to my alt-right (ex)friend. He was good at it, and I mean good. He had the charisma and smug demeanor to usurp every conversation in the direction he determined (when he wasn’t the instigator of the entire conversation itself) and make the most apalling things seem totally logical (like making the charlottesville murderer seem like self defense, white supremacy seem like champions of human rights, etc). He had me and everyone else in my friend circle hooked on his snake-oil sermons.

You know what the greatest weakness of bigots is? Fact.

I had a ‘heart-to-heart’ with the guy and a few other of his closest friends, alone in his rental. He started talking about a topic that I actually knew about, and I knew he was totally spouting bullshit, so I jokingly inserted a factoid that basically severed the foundation of his entire rambling speech.

These were his exact words (spoken jokingly with a smile):

“Oh I hate it when people know about things!”

Everyone there laughed it off like someone had just leg-hooked a martial arts master. The topic switched faster than the blink of an eye and his power over all conversation never waned for a second. He knew he had to distract attention from the facts as fast as possible, and he succeeded. But the seed of doubt never left me, and eventually, after starting to put a more critical eye to every downward-punching joke and unnecessarily hostile rant (and watching a couple factual documentaries), I ditched his neonazi ass and everyone else in that toxic circle of friends.

If you want to convince people who don’t know anything and are being manipulated by hateful propagandists, don’t let anyone say a single word without proving it. There is nothing hysterical about crushing peoples’ flimsy, emotionally charged nonsense with the burden of truth and opposing citations, nor is there anything “polite” about blathering on about pseudoscientific hate propaganda. They might claim otherwise, but anyone who openly spouts “facts don’t matter” or similar platitudes is self-delegitimising, and anyone who could be persuaded by that kind of speech is a lost cause anyway. You can’t make people “believe in their heart that facts are real”, they have to deal with that shortcoming themselves, all you can do is reveal hacks for what they are.

So, someone says “we shouldn’t lose sight of the fact that trans* people are not what they say and perform needless surgeries”? Is there peer-reviewed evidence that trans people are not what they say they are? Is there any peer-reviewed evidence that surgeries are not beneficial? If a) and b) are both false why should we “not lose sight” of this non-fact?

Keep the pressure on their weak spot (facts) and don’t let up until they discredit themselves. Cite facts, demand facts, quote their own words exactly (avoid paraphrasing, it lets them hijack the conversation) and do not ever let anyone forget that they have refused to even answer that one question way back at the beginning of the conversation. I’ve had people openly admit they “find facts boring” and are “too lazy to look up sources” because they can’t prove a single word they say.

Jane Done
Jane Done
2 years ago

@Robert

I’ve been thinking about the TERF phenomenon recently. My current conclusion is that it’s an example of a problem that has several expressions but one origin. That being – you have a model of how the world works in your mind. Occasionally, you are confronted by evidence that the world itself actually works differently. To avoid the pain and effort of modifying your model, you fault reality for refusing to conform to the model. It’s been described as living in the map instead of the territory, or eating the menu instead of the meal.

Yup, and european christian colonial straight white male conquerors/barbarians felt exactly the same way, and left a gaping hole in our understanding of human history by burning, destroying or censoring any artefacts that didn’t align with their ‘model’ of reality.