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Daily Stormer: Girlfriends are for sissies! Real Neo-Nazis only use women for sex and/or babies

Not quite sure it works like this in real life

By David Futrelle

Andrew Anglin of the Daily Stormer isn’t just some dude who spews out seemingly dozens of posts a day for his rancid neo-Nazi website; he also fancies himself a bit of a self-help guru, regularly offering his male readers (and they’re almost all male) advice on how to live their best lives.

Yesterday, Anglin dropped a lengthy post filled with advice on how his readers could be, as he put it,  good men. Many of his specific suggestions were surprisingly anodyne — eat healthy food, don;t dress like a slob, keep your word — though some of the seemingly uncontroversial assertions reflected something of a Machiavellian spirit. In a section urging men to “Be Generous,” for example, he declared that

[p]aying for people’s meals is a demonstration of power, and it is something that is respected. Being stingy is a sign of weakness, and is viewed as pathetic.

And then there’s his advice on women. Let’s just say he’s not much of a romantic. In one section of the piece, he tells his readers they should “Not Ever Believe That Any Woman is Above You.” After all, he says,

Biology has determined that all men are superior to all women. You should never view a woman as above you. You are better than she is because you are a man, and men are superior to women. …

Do not ever believe that you need any woman. …

Women exist only to serve men. They have no other purpose. 

Worst. Tinder. Bio. Ever.

In another section, Anglin offers advice on dating: don’t. As he sees it, men have no need for girlfriends, and should view women only as portable sex holes … or as white baby factories. (It goes without saying that he doesn’t want his readers getting involved in any way with women who aren’t white.)

In Anglin’s view,

“Romantic love” is a hormonal function of young teenagers. Grown men engaging in this behavior is on the same level as grown men playing with toy trucks. …

You do not need a woman to be your friend and roommate, as is generally the modern concept of a “girlfriend.” This is pathetic.

It’s far better, in Anglin’s mind, for men to see women not as partners or friends but as biological resources to be exploited. As he sees it, the only time it’s appropriate for men to interact with women is when they are either

  1. Trying to have sex with her with as little energy expenditure as possible
  2. Interviewing her as a potential mother of your children

I’m not quite sure how Anglin handles, say, talking with his mom, or asking a question of Siri, or what he does when he has to mail a package at the post office and the clerk happens to be a woman. I can only wonder: would he turn down life-saving emergency surgery if the only doctor available to treat him was a woman he didn’t want to bang?

Somehow I suspect Anglin hasn’t thought this one through all the way.

But he has given a bit more thought to the issue of what to do about dudes who are already living with women — at least if it looks like they’ll ultimately marry.

I understand that part of the modern social paradigm is that a woman becomes your girlfriend and then may potentially become your wife. I obviously do not approve of this, and would prefer a traditional framework wherein a father gives you his virgin daughter for marriage, but I am not so silly as to believe such a thing is possible.

So then, if you do the live-in girlfriend thing as part of the process of working toward marriage, as is now the custom, there is no shame in this. But you should only do this in situations where you genuinely believe that there is a high chance that this relationship will result in marriage and children.

Not that marriage is without its perils. In an aside, Anglin urges his fans to take whatever steps they need to in order to protect themselves financially and otherwise from evil golddiggers trying to seize their assets (and their children) in a divorce. This includes collecting what Anglin calls “kompromat” to blackmail any woman with the gall to file for divorce.

Yes, that’s right: don’t marry a woman unless you can blackmail her.

He then takes up the question of how exactly a non-dating man might be able to get his dick wet once in a while.

Satisfying basic sexual needs outside of marriage is best done through the use of prostitutes, although I understand that this is illegal in all feminist countries.

I’ve rarely seen a Madonna/Whore complex expressed quite this literally.

Anglin ends with a bit of advice for any of his readers who might somehow manage to convince non-prostitutes/non-future-wives to have sex with them.

Casual sexual encounters with non-prostitutes should not involve any more emotion than is involved with a sexual encounter with a prostitute.

In other words: keep yourself from developing any human feelings towards women you sleep with by thinking of them as basically less than human. (These guys hate literal prostitutes even more than they hate the sexually active women they so regularly call “whores.”)

Anglin’s post is just another example of why, despite the fact that this country is filled with racist white women, the alt-right has a devil of a time actually recruiting any of them.

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Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
Weird (and tired of trumplings) Eddie
2 years ago

In other news, if you come from a hispanic majority country, and you lie on your immigration application, you get the boot:

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/07/doj-pushes-denaturalization-of-florida-woman-over-old-crime.html

If you come from a white European country and you lie on your immigration application, you get to live in the white house

https://www.ndn.org/blog/2016/11/ap-story-confirms-melania-lied-broke-immigration-laws

who’d have known….

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

I think we had a sex work discussion here quite recently. My own two cents is that legislation should be heavily informed by actual effects that different laws have had in different countries. All sides agree, for instance, that trafficking is bad – ok, let’s see which kind of legislation makes it easier to combat trafficking?
You can’t just say “listen to the sex workers” though, since there are different sex worker organizations with different agendas. I’ve heard people say that organizations who argue for the Nordic model aren’t trustworthy, but simply stating that seems a little question-begging.

I do think sex work is different from other jobs in an important respect, which is that being coerced into having sex seems worse than being coerced into doing many other activities. Like, if I take a job as a cleaning lady and doesn’t like it because I’m desperately poor, I’ll likely be less traumatized than if I take a job as a sex worker and doesn’t like it because I’m desperately poor…? If someone directly forces me to clean floors, I’ll probably be less traumatized than if someone has me raped over and over again by different men.
Also, all jobs come with a certain amount of coercion built in – I became a philosophy professor of my own free will, but once I’m in, I have to do lectures etc even if I’m really tired one day or have a headache and really don’t feel like it. It seems worse, however, to lie down and be banged by someone when you really really don’t feel like it.

But when all this is said and done, I still don’t think any particular deduction about which kind of legislation is best/least bad follows.

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

re Nazis the situation in Sweden now is SUPER SCARY. There’s this week at the island of Gotland each year where the topmost politicians of the country and other organizations hold meetings and speeches and mingle with the general public. Last year the police granted permission to a big Nazi organization to hold meetings and demonstrations too, and predictably they harassed and abused people a lot. This year the same thing happened, only way worse than last year. The police were super passive whilst the Nazis basically did as they pleased; the police “explained” that they had to judge in every instance whether doing something about the Nazis might have the effect of making them even more violent, and therefore, doing nothing when Nazis disturb meetings, break up demonstrations, threaten and scare people or even attack people is often the best option. I SHIT YOU NOT! These are official statements from the police force.

A few days ago someone hung a big Nazi banner at the moose fence by the freeway near our house. Husband went out to remove it, but someone already did, so at least it didn’t sit there long. But they’re getting more and more bold ALL THE TIME.

Also, about 20 % of voters say they’ll support the Sweden Democrats in the upcoming election, a populist party that grew out of a Nazi organization IN THE NINETIES. Yeah. Their top politicians were out and proud Nazis only TWENTY YEARS AGO; then they cleaned up their image a little bit, although not much. Basically, they don’t wear swastikas any longer, but many of their members, even people with actual seats in parliament already commit hate crimes and other crimes all the time.

Shit is fucking scary.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

And now in “Step 9” news, DHS is releasing documents containing not-very-subtly-embedded “1488” dogwhistles, basically letting violent neo-fascist militia organizations know “don’t worry, under Trump we’ve got your back”:

https://forward.com/culture/404371/are-14-and-88-nazi-dog-whistles-in-this-homeland-security-document-or-just/

The headline of the DHS document is not only 14 words long, it starts with the same exact first four words as the infamous Nazi slogan, and expresses a similar sentiment.

This puts the clock at one minute to midnight, IMO. Those militias could launch an American Kristallnacht tomorrow if this makes them feel sufficiently emboldened with certainty they would get away with it.

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
2 years ago

@Surplus

“Newsflash: supporting women’s bodily autonomy in one specific aspect has positive correlation with more-feminist policy in general, film at 11”. Yet somehow this would come as a complete shock to Nazis.

I agree with that statement, yet I don’t see it applying in Latin America, which is a conservative hellhole.

I mean, we have laws against cat-calling in Peru and we have criminalized femicide, but we still remain the second Latin American country with most violence towards women.

Bina
2 years ago

Welp, now we know how Andrew Anglin lost his virginity. It was with a knothole…and inside, there was a hornet’s nest.

I feel sorry for the hornets, though.

Ricardo Bánffy
Ricardo Bánffy
2 years ago

One can only hope they never reproduce.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

I kind of feel like brain bleach is needed today.

Anyone care for a sack of Jack Russell terrier puppies?

comment image

An adorably gangly and awkward baby giraffe?

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An early Halloween treat?

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Ohlmann
Ohlmann
2 years ago

Thoses pictures are so cute !

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

@Dvärghundspossen

Good points, very good points! No doubt there is a certain intimacy to sex that sets it apart from other activities you might do with your hands, yet I do think at least some of that has to do with the stigma attached to sex work. There are a lot of exploitative jobs that take place both in developed nations and underdeveloped nations that are extremely hazardous and can result in severe injury or trauma to the body for far poorer wages than a sex worker can make in one hour. Of course, sex workers have to contend with a greater risk of murder and bodily harm from their clients, trans sex workers even more so.

You are right on the aspect of coercion wherein we all need to do at least some work that we don’t want to do at any given time. I think that’s why I contend for at the very least a decriminalization of sex work in concert with broader workers protections. If miners and steelworkers can unionize and push for rights, sex workers should be able too.

Awww, Halloween kitty is adorbs!

Paradoxical Intention - Resident Cheeseburger Slut

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee | July 9, 2018 at 8:24 pm

No one is concerned about being nice to Daily Stormer people. It’s about not doing splash damage to working class people who are not Nazis.

Yeah, like me. Or like my family. Or my friends. But I suppose it’s all well and good as long as we’re targeting nazis right? I mean, fuck the splash damage it does if it’s towards an approved target, amirite?

Seriously, knock that shit off. I didn’t choose to be poor working class, and I have zero control over that. And yet I manage to not be a nazi just fucking fine.

Mocking people for shit they have no control over is gross and it’s sinking to Anglin’s level. There’s plenty of ways to be anti-Nazi without making some of our allies feel like shit too. Like, I don’t know…pointing out the fact that they are fucking nazis.

But I guess I’m just being “too nice to nazis” because I won’t attack their social class, which would only give them ammunition against us. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Plus, white supremacy is hardly a thing that only poor whites are into. Wealthy white supremacists are just a bit more genteel about it. When we blame only working class white people for white supremacy we give cover to the genteel racists who actually have more power to do real damage.

This. There’s plenty of white dudebros in silicone valley that make six figures and are still MAGA-jerks. Giving them cover isn’t okay, and it points out the illegitimacy of that bullshit “economic fear” bullshit that people said got Trump elected in the first place.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation | July 9, 2018 at 11:14 pm

Grown men play with toy trucks all the time. It’s just these ones cost $60,000 instead of $60.

Shit, I can get 60 Hot Wheel trucks for that price. I can have a whole damn fleet of ’em.

Are Tonka trucks still a thing? I used to have quite a few of those when I was a kid. Big, fuck-off construction dump trucks and the like, all made of metal and I played in the gravel with ’em.

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

http://www.achewood.com/comic.php?date=08032005

(click link if image doesn’t show up)

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@Katamount:

You are right on the aspect of coercion wherein we all need to do at least some work that we don’t want to do at any given time.

As I am sure you are already aware, that is a capitalism problem, not a sex worker problem.

(And if you want a good comparison with a more mainstream job, what about nursing? Majority female, you get all kinds of patients, you have to deal with their bodily fluids and not always voluntarily or at a moment you were expecting to, exposed to infectious disease risks, and as with any majority-female job there’s a high frequency of harassment both from males above you and from male customers…)

@Paradoxical Intention: you had toys made of metal?

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

As I am sure you are already aware, that is a capitalism problem, not a sex worker problem.

Even if we didn’t live in a capitalist world, even in a socialist utopia, it would still be the case that I’d sometimes have to give lectures even when I was really tired or for some other reason really didn’t feel like it. Even if people in socialist utopia are much freer in their choice of jobs, once you’re in a job, there’s an element of coercion. Even if you didn’t have an employer above you, you’d still be accountable to some kind of collective for doing your share day in and day out even when you don’t feel like it.

And I think that’s a bigger problem for sex than for other activities.

I have this friend, for instance, who talked about how they for quite some time tried to get pregnant with their partner. And because they were aiming so hard at getting pregnant, sex became a chore rather than something you did because you were horny. So they had a lot of sex at times when they didn’t really feel like it. And they said that for quite some time, this fucked up their sex life, and made it difficult for them to actually enjoy sex. This is not a rare story but pretty typical; non-sex workers who for some reason end up having sex regularly when they don’t actually feel like it often develop various issues because of this (just don’t enjoying it or more serious stuff like vestibulitis) – which you don’t seem to do from, say, lecturing regularly even on occasions where you don’t feel like it.

I really think this is something that makes sex different from most other activities, like lecturing. Yeah, even different from nursing (which I worked in for quite some time).

As I said, this is not an argument for one kind of legislation or another. For all that I said above, it might very well be the case that complete legalization is the best route to go. But it’s an argument for the thesis that sex work is importantly different in certain respects from most jobs.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

I’d like to think a socialist utopia would allow one to take an occasional sick day and maybe make up for it later, but maybe that’s just me. 🙂

Freemage
Freemage
2 years ago

I’m mostly a pro-Nordic Model type, but I was finally able to pin down pro-sex-work take on it that wasn’t just attacks on the fact that religious organizations often advocate for it.

The chief issue that struck home with me was how the Nordic model interacts with police enforcement.

An element of the Nordic model is a prohibition against running a house of prostitution or brothel (which is a good thing, IMNSHO). Unfortunately, police in Nordic model countries often go after the owner of ANY rental property where prostitutes live. So, while a sex worker who makes enough to own her own home is relatively secure, one who works out of her apartment faces being evicted as a preemptive defensive action by the landlord.

And streetwalkers who try to band together for mutual support and safety (no pimp, just communal living and so forth) become more visible, resulting in the cops targeting their landlord, in particular.

Race also comes into play, here–in Scandinavia, the lowest echelon of sex work is heavily skewed towards women of color, and thus, the cops often focus enforcement on immigrant populations. (Oh, and note that homelessness can be grounds for losing immigration status, causing these women to be deported.)

*********

All that said? It’s also demonstrably true that decriminalization schemes increase trafficking. The mechanism is quite simple:

Under decriminalization, people (mostly men) who wish to procure the services of a prostitute but choose not to for fear of arrest, are now free to do so. Similarly, people (mostly women) who wish to provide prostitution services (even just out of economic necessity) but did not do so for fear of arrest, are also now free to do so.

However, those two groups are not remotely equivalent. This is why sex tourism is a thing–men travel to locations where prostitution is legal, specifically to avoid laws against it. But there’s not a huge influx of women seeking to become prostitutes to these same jurisdictions.

So broader legalization increases demand much, much more than it increases supply. When that happens, black markets form and grow–and in the case of prostitution, that means trafficking. Clients seeking the services of a prostitute rarely have any of the knowledge needed to actually figure out if their particular encounter involves trafficking or not–they just know they got to have sex for money.

*********

Furthermore, legalization + regulation (such as licensing, with fees and mandatory medical screening and so on) often locks the lowest echelon of voluntary prostitutes (the ones arguably who need relief the most) out of the scheme, just because they lack the ‘entry cost’.

In the end? It’s fucking complicated, and anyone–Nordic model enthusiasts, prohibitionists, or sex-positive glibertarians–who tells you they have a ‘simple solution’ is trying to sell you something.

sylvia bath
sylvia bath
2 years ago

Re: the discussion about Trump supporters and classism

Classism is definitely a factor in the way the liberal and centrist punditry chooses to portray Trump voters. This imagery about despairing factory workers in the rust belt and sad dudes living in their mom’s basement is in part a narrative constructed by the Trump movement that the media just ran with. I think it’s designed to simultaneously elicit sympathy for Trumpists and stroke the egos of certain liberals/centrists.

It’s always so weird to hear the Trump phenomenon discussed this way because my mom is a tenured professor on the west coast and a hardcore Trump supporter for no reason other than racism.

Catalpa
Catalpa
2 years ago

The chief issue that struck home with me was how the Nordic model interacts with police enforcement.

Yeah, basically. On top of what you’ve already spoken about, there’s the fact that, since purchasing sex work is illegal, sex workers will be required to work far away from any kind of oversight to have any customers, putting them at risk. Sex workers who escape from abusive/dangerous situations can (theoretically, depending on how hostile law enforcement is towards them regardless of what the law actually says) go to the police, but there are unfortunately plenty of sex workers who don’t get the chance to escape from people seeking to prey on the vulnerable.

I’m generally still in favour of the Nordic model over others that I’ve come across, but I do recognize that I’m by no means an expert on any aspect of sex work and my opinion is not as informed as it could be. It doesn’t seem to be an issue with easy answers.

Diptych
Diptych
2 years ago

Seeing as socialist utopias have been brought up, sure, let’s work within that hypothetical. Now, I’d say that a proper socialist utopia would have a universal income or some similar system to ensure that everyone’s basic needs are met, regardless of the nature of their work.

Naturally, the sick and injured will still need prompt medical care, to keep them from getting sicker or dying, so nurses will still have to fill their shifts. And students will want to be taught everything promised to them in the lesson plan, so the professor has to give a certain number of lectures.

But, I don’t think customers are actually going to die if they don’t receive sexual services on demand. Nor are they likely to fail their sex exams if they don’t receive the full complement of sex lectures with enough time in between to complete the required reading and homework. So there’s less inherent pressure for a sex worker to do sex work.

Dalillama
Dalillama
2 years ago

@Dvarhundspossen
Most sex workers who choose (caveats about choice in capitalism aside) the work are freelancers or contractors, except in places (e.g. Nevada) where brothels are the only legal outlets for sex work. On days when they really don’t feel like it, they don’t take any clients. That’s actually a large part of the appeal for many.

Paradoxical Intention - Resident Cheeseburger Slut

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation | July 10, 2018 at 4:45 pm
@Paradoxical Intention: you had toys made of metal?

Hell yeah I did. Tonka trucks in particular were known to take a real beating (because they were mostly toys made for boys, and boys were supposed to play rough and in dirt and muck), and they lasted a long ass time. My grandma would find them at yard sales and flea markets for pennies on the dollar too and we’d play with them for years.

I still had some toys made out of plastic though. Like my little tykes Flintstone-style car, known as the “cozy coupe”:
comment image

(Not my exact one, but almost exactly the same. They still make them today but the newer models have eyeballs on them for…some reason.)

Not that those were any less durable. I took a head-first tumble in the coupe one time, and just rolled right back onto the wheels because it’s vaguely round enough to do that. It also had a little compartment in the back where I could put my Capri sun and snacks while I bedrocked it up and down the cul-de-sac. And it had working doors too.

I also had a battery-powered tiny car that we got second hand, but I had the Bigfoot Monster Truck model instead of the Barbie jeep, which was the only other option at the time.
comment image

(I think mine looked like this?)

The only reason we had to get rid of mine was that the battery leaked acid one time and I burned my feet on it, and my mom had to whisk me off to the bathtub to wash my feet because she heard me hollering from the house and then she threw it out.

Kids these days got a whole damn car dealership. I’m so jelly. ; n;

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

I’d like to think a socialist utopia would allow one to take an occasional sick day and maybe make up for it later, but maybe that’s just me. 🙂

Obviously you should be allowed to take the occasional sick day and even stay home for a long period of time if you’re sick for long. I’m talking about just don’t feeling like doing your work today for whatever reason; you have other things going on in your life that puts you in a bad mood, you slept badly and would like to stay home and sleep, you have a random headache (but not like migraine level or anything), stuff like that. I’m pretty sure that regardless of economic system, you can’t have people staying home for every such thing. You need a certain reliability in various organizations for society to function.

And yeah, there’s an important difference between freelance vs working on a brothel, of course… Still, it can happen to people that for various reasons your sex drive stays quiet for a month or two (for instance, you have so much other stuff going in in your life at the moment that it temporarily kills your sex drive and you really don’t feel like doing that), but if sex work is what pays your rent you better put out anyway.

Other differences between having sex and an activity like nursing: You can nurse your children or parents, but you can’t have sex with them. There are heterosexual and homosexual people, but no such thing as a heteronursial or homonursial person.

Arguments for legalizing sex work has to be of the kind that “look at these and these statistics, legislation means far less violence against sex workers and a better chance to combat trafficking” and yeah, also “adults should be able to choose which profession they like as long as they don’t harm anyone else (even taking into account that having sex when you really don’t feel like it can cause particular problems, because it should be up to the individual to decide whether to risk that)”.
But “Once you get past your prejudices sex isn’t really different from other activities you do with your body, like nursing people or giving them massages” isn’t a good argument because it’s just false.

(And just to be super obvious, none of what I say relies on the idea that sex should only be done within a loving relationship; I’ve had sex with people I literally met for the first time a couple of hours before the sexy times began, so that’s not what I’m talking about. But that was still sex because I really wanted to have sex, not sex as a chore.)

Gatecrasher
Gatecrasher
2 years ago

As a health care professional I have plenty of experience dealing with people’s shit (both figuratively and literally). I have also had “sex” under coercion. The “sex” was worse.

Mish of the Catlady Ascendancy
Mish of the Catlady Ascendancy
2 years ago

@Otrame,
@Catalpa,
@Knitting Cat Lady,

Right then: founding members are we! Otrame for chair?

solecism
solecism
2 years ago

@Paradoxical Intention – Resident Cheeseburger Slut:

Are Tonka trucks still a thing? I used to have quite a few of those when I was a kid. Big, fuck-off construction dump trucks and the like, all made of metal and I played in the gravel with ’em.

Heh. My brother got the dump truck and fire engine when we were both little. I loved the dump truck! Played with it all the time. Got scolded by my dad (and probably my uncles) for playing with toys that were intended for boys only. Didn’t care. Went from obliviously defying gender norms to actively resisting and resenting them throughout my childhood.

@others

I really appreciate you digging into the details of what’s involved in consideration of sex work. I have definitely wanted to be better educated on the issue, but no spoons to do my own homework.

Luxbelitx
2 years ago

But “Once you get past your prejudices sex isn’t really different from other activities you do with your body, like nursing people or giving them massages” isn’t a good argument because it’s just false.

Thank you for saying this. I feel profoundly uncomfortable when such arguments are made because I feel they put down all the suffering of victims of sexual abuse that is not “violent” enough. Having sex solely because your partner insisted, is not an irksome chore, it’s abuse.

It also denies the many testimonies of women who entred prostitution voluntarily only to find out -always when it was too late- that constantly having sex without desiring it eats you from the inside.

Finally, I simply can’t buy the “sex is like anything else” from feminism, because then we’re denying that patriarchy operates through sexual stereotypes and sexual violence.

In Argentina we have a law decriminalizing prostitution since 1921 (before that there was a disastrous attempt to regulate it), but only today (like, a few hours ago) we finally got a law passed in the Province of Buenos Aires to derogate an article of the offences code that penalized the offering of prostitution with jail. There are still simmilar articles in other provinces’ codes, even though they are both iligal and inconstitutional. So decriminalizing is sometimes easier said than done.

We have a pretty decent sex trafficking law, but it’s really hard to get the State to follow through with the reinsertion of victims into education, work and society in general once they are rescued. Many end up going back to prostitution because they lack other choices and have families to support. Not to mention trans women, who are sistematically excluded and pushed into prostitution as well.

And then we have a “sex workers union” which is mostly a half assed cover for exploiters and traffickers. They claim they are being criminalized for excercizing autonomous sex work. They blatantly lie. They came up with this “cooperative” system, which sometimes is real but often it’s -again- just a cover for the fact that there’s one person controlling all the work and money. Usually that person belongs to the “union”.

So I’m usually extremely wary of both the “sex work” discourse and “sex work” organizations.

We had a really big trial we had by the end of 2015, in which for the first time a victim sued both the exploiters and the State, and won. She told how she herself was taught the “sex work” discourse by her pimps, and how believing in it prevented her from recognizing herself s a victim. In fact, when she was rescued she refused to leave and claimed she was a woker. It took her years and therapy to process everything that happened to her, and to understand the link between her symptoms of PTSD and the years she spent in prostitution.

She turned out to also be a TERF, so I distanced myself after working with her for a few months. Still, her insights of the sex industry remain invaluable to many of us.

I’ve been working with sex exploitation victims and women in protitution for a few years now and I find it very hard to believe that anything good can come out of normalizing prostitution. Although I do not oppose regulation per se, I have yet to come across a proposal that garantees rights for sex workes AND victims of trafficking AND potential victims of trafficking.

To support the idea of prostitution being a job while at the same time preventing women, teenagers and kids from being sucked into the sx industry seems impracticable to me, from my experience.

I’m open to being proved wrong, of course. I swear I tried many times. I read every bill presented in the National and Provincial congresses by the “union”. I interviewed lawyers and lawmekers from different parts of the world. But there’s always the chance I’m overlooking something.

Diptych
Diptych
2 years ago

but if sex work is what pays your rent you better put out anyway.

Woah, woah, woah, I thought we were talking about a socialist utopia here. Why the hell are we still charging rent?

@Luxbelitx: If the unions are corrupt, surely that’s an argument for cleaning up the unions, rather than prohibiting the industry? There’s corruption in a lot of industries – on the sides of capital and labour alike, sadly – but sex work seems to be the only one where the go-to response seems to be “burn the whole thing to the ground and imprison or impoverish everyone involved”.

Luxbelitx
2 years ago

@Diptych

I have never spoken about prohibiting, in fact I even mentioned today we made a big step for decriminalization, which took a lot of hard work.

If what you get of what I said is “burn the whole thing to the ground and imprison or impoverish everyone involved”, I really don’t know what to say.

I didn’t mean that *at all*. And I kindly apologize if it came off that way.

Diptych
Diptych
2 years ago

I do beg your pardon; I was thinking abstractly, and didn’t realise I appeared to be accusing you in specific. I apologise; I should have thought more carefully about how I communicated.

Luxbelitx
2 years ago

No need to apologize! Interneting correctly is hard. 😀