By David Futrelle
On the Incels.me forums, a bunch of the regulars recently had a little debate over slavery. Not whether or not the enslavement of women (or blacks, or whoever) is morally wrong; they didn’t care. No, the main question on the table was why men haven’t already enslaved women, given what a great idea it is.
Someone called lesbianwalrus — but who presumably was neither — started off the “debate” with this lovely post:
I’m not sure if that bit at the end was a reference to abolishing women’s basic human rights, or an outright call for genocide — it’s so hard to tell with these guys! — but the other incels who replied stuck with the issue of slavery. All but one thought that enslaving women would be great for guys like them, though there were a few different explanations as to why men haven’t just gone ahead and done it yet.
According to longtime Incels.me member Newbite the problem is that “soyboys are too powerful.” Mentalcel lamented that “western civilization chose cuckery and political correctness.” Imbored21 declared that “men are pathetic betas” and that “[w]omen have us by the balls.”
But not everyone blamed men — or even soyboys — as a whole. ElliotRodgerHere, reminding us once again that bigotries flock together, pointed his finger of blame at a familiar target: The Jews, — or, as he put it, that “small parasitic tribe” that runs the world and “decides these things for us.”
Damn those evil Jews for preventing us from enslaving women! Is there no end to their depravity?
A few commenters conjectured that re-enslaving black men would help incels like them by cockblocking the “Tyrones” — the black equivalents to the evil white Chads who allegedly steal all the women who would otherwise be forced to date incels.
But the creepiest post of the bunch came from someone ominously named The End, who suggested that incels might not have to wait for all women to be enslaved to have a sex slave of their own.
Well doesn’t that just make your skin crawl? And The End isn’t just some drive-by troll. He’s made nearly 2000 posts to Incels.me since joining in April. Evidently he’s found a welcoming home on Incels..me, which is nearly as sickening a thought as his comments about capturing himself a “plaything.”
Depends if you classify mass shootings by intent of the perpetrator or by death toll. Nasim Najafi Aghdam definitely intended to kill, but she only wounded three people before committing suicide.
Similarly, I’m not sure if John Allen Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo count as “mass shooters”, given their modus operandi.
And I’m not sure which of the theee groups (Nazi, misogynist, Nazi-misogynist) you’d put Syed Rizwan Farook and Tashfeen Malik, either.
To clarify my previous comment, those three examples were off the top of my head, made memorable mostly because they didn’t involve Pissed-Off White Male du Jour.
You could also add Omar Mateen to the list, though given his targets he may have been a misogynist. Not quite sure what the motivations of James Eagan Holmes were.
@ ChimericMind:
I don’t know if this is true, but I heard there was a bondage subplot a few books into the series, and it drew more fanmail than anything else he’d written about, so his publishers encouraged him to run with it.
For the slaves it would be better, according to this logic (obviously not in reality, though). However, it wouldn’t be better for the Greeks, who would still have to keep feeding and housing their slaves and not getting anything in return because the robots are doing it all anyway. And since the Greeks wouldn’t get benefit out of it, it only makes sense to kick the barbarians to the curb. Perfectly logically consistent, if morally repugnant.
Well, there was the guy who shot at some Rethug congressvermin playing baseball.
Not sure if that counts, given that he didn’t actually kill anyone – thankfully – but he sure as hell tried….
OT, but I found this on GamerGhazi: https://theconversation.com/schools-must-equip-students-to-navigate-alt-right-websites-that-push-fake-news-97166
It had me harkening back to my days of schooling, where Google was a brand new thing and my first source for information was Encarta. The typical library lesson about internet searching seemed woefully out of date even by the time I was in high school as an internet-savvy teenager. But holy hell, how badly are they falling down on the job when kids think that Taki’s is a reliable source for information?! According to the article (emphasis mine):
To quote Guardian Bob: “This is bad. Very bad!”
The fuck is this, research by confirmation bias? Whatever happened to an aggregate of information? If I’m getting two conflicting pieces of information, only one of them is right and which is it more likely to be? The one that’s gone through several authors and editors or the one slapped together by some pubic-bearded Nazi between 3AM wank sessions? I mean, what’s going through these kids’ heads if they’re choosing the latter? Is it gullibility, the desire to be edgy, laziness, some combination of the three?
This state of affairs can’t continue. It’s no wonder it feels like living in two different worlds if half of students have the basic recognition of reliable information and probably have interpersonal relationships with racial and sexual minorities, and half the students are falling for Davis Aurini rejects.
“…therefore I should be the god of it.”
I mean, he’s all a-tingle at his realization that modern society has chucked dogma right out the window, and (supposedly) morality along with it. But he’s proposing to replace them with the exact same goddamn thing. Instead of a priest, he wants to be the untouchable dude in charge ordering everyone else around.
(Hee, “untouchable”…)
Enslaving women “because nobody can stop me” doesn’t represent an advancement from the traditional “only God can stop me” high church paradigm. In fact, it’s even worse. At least most religious traditions have some form of the Golden Rule to encourage altruistic behavior. This guy is just free-floating in a moral void, with no brakes to stop him from committing any atrocity he feels like.
Which is exactly what makes the Republican Party so scary.
@Surplus…..blight…..etc
Re that article, incognito mode in Chrome worked for me.
There seems to be a subsect who think that they are all geniuses and capable of changing the world etc, but for the fact that women are all evil bitches!
I think that a man that far gone into that way of thinking does actually believe that. You have to remember that they live in a fantasy world, usually fuelled by violent porn and other domination of women fantasies – in the fantasies the women love it.
And if a real woman doesn’t have the reactions of a fictional woman, then the real woman is “wrong.” Kinda like how the early human anatomy textbooks (drawn with a basis in ideology, not empirical evidence) were always “right,” and any deviation from the book meant that the corpse was “wrong.”
Ah – but so does ordinary chrome. There is just the heading and a video. Perhaps you don’t have the appropriate plugin for the video.
This is the URL of the embedded video – it is on facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/senatorsanders/videos/10157111586057908/
@Surplus…
https://www.facebook.com/senatorsanders/videos/10157111586057908/
Damnit the post mammoth is eating my posts again.
You really see something similar happening during the 1830s-1850s. Bleeding Kansas, of course, anti-abolitionist riots and attacks, attacks on free black communities and immigrants.
Of course, John Brown and a few others were doing their level best to make sure it wasn’t all one-sided.
The difference is that a single man in the mid-nineteenth century didn’t have nearly as much firepower at his disposal.
Wasn’t it John Ruskin who never consummated his marriage (they annulled after a few years), because he was so alarmed by the discovery that women not made out of marble had body hair?
Yeah, that was Ruskin. Poor Effie Gray.
Yet another good argument in favor of fact-based sex education.
@ Victorious Parasol:
And still another: http://gehayi.tumblr.com/post/133454492906/profeminist-myfeministawakening-i-was-inspired
@ Weirwood TreeHugger:
Every time there’s a mass shooting you can bet it’s either a Nazi, a misogynist, or both. Has there ever been an exception to this?
There’s Brenda Spencer of “I Don’t Like Mondays” infamy; she had a colossally messed-up home life including probable sexual abuse, a history of misbehavior with firearms, and–according to school authorities–had been flying more red flags than the Beijing Olympics, but does not seem to have been motivated by any particular ideology.
Here’s an account of Spencer’s 2014 parole hearing, wherein she portrays her rampage as an attempted suicide-by-cop: https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-first-modern-school-shooter-feels-responsible-for-the-rest
When I was in Jr. High (Middle School for you US young’uns), a male friend of mine discovered the Gor novels and I read a few that he loaned me. We had a laugh over them and I forgot about them until recently* when folks here started talking about them again.
One thing that no one mentions is that the conceit for the planet Gor being unknown to all but a vanishing few Earthlings was that it was directly opposite Earth on the other side of the Sun. As if science couldn’t predict the presence of another Earth-like planet from our orbit!
Another thing is that Norman/Lange wrote a horrible how-to book on BDSM called “Imaginative Sex” that apparently my (now deceased) FIL owned. I sold it on ebay over ten years ago for over $100; it was my first ebay sale. I am not proud of this.
*after I sold the BDSM book, obvs
The idea of a second planet sharing our orbit, a ‘counter earth’ used to be a somewhat common SF trope, at least through the Sixties. I know it was used in Classic Doctor Who.
Re: John Norman
One comment I remember about Gor came from Lorna Toolis, who was at the time the head librarian of the Merril Collection of Science Fiction, Speculation and Fantasy, which went something like:
I really do need to head back in and renew my membership to the ‘Friends of the Merril Collection’ at some point.
The thing that always astonishes me is that they expect to be able to easily kidnap women as sex slaves, and those women will also be happy to cook and clean for them, and that’s all just going to work fine.
Speaking personally, any guy who kidnapped me, raped me, gave me access to cleaning chemicals, and then told me to make him a sandwich….that guy is going to regret eating that sandwich. For the rest of his (extremely short and intensely painful) life. I would consider that to come under self-defence. Yet this very simple flaw in the idea never seems to occur.
He’d also be giving you access to the ingredients needed to make chlorine gas. Just so you know. 🙂
@Hambeast, pitshade:
Not only could science predict it, but there’s absolutely zero chance that it would remain exactly opposite Earth in our orbit. We can measure the slight changes in orbital velocity of the Earth caused by gravitational effects from the other planets (primarily Jupter, Venus, and Mars, in that order) and those changes would be different between Earth and counter-Earth, resulting it shifting measurably in its orbit. Now add the minor changes up over billions of years…
The only way to have a stable Earth and counter-Earth in the solar system is to have counter-duplicates of all the planets so all the little nudges and tweaks would be the same on both sides. And we can see that there aren’t counter-duplicates of any other planets.
Well, sorry, I suppose that’s not the only way, but it is the only natural way; you could instead require the counter-Earth be fitted with drives so it could do station-keeping and keep itself hidden behind the sun. At that point, though, you’ve got a somewhat different story…
@Surplus to Requirements:
I think I’ve noted before that one of Spider Robinson’s books involved a death trap that had ammonia in the toilet bowl and chlorine bleach in the tank, to generate chloramine gas when the toilet was flushed. Specifically, it was a death trap that could only possibly catch somebody with no sense of smell. Yes, this was a plot point.
@Jenora Feuer
These are excellent points and probably why the trope is dead. I was only trying to put the Gor idea in context with its times.