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are these guys 12 years old? creepy icky girls men who should not ever be with women ever MGTOW misogyny

MGTOW creepos wonder: Does feminism promote bestiality?

Well I never!

By David Futrelle

We may have all overdosed on the hideously depressing incel coverage over the last week, so I thought today we could take a break and drop in on an ever-so-slightly less toxic misogynistic subculture, namely our old friends the MGTOWs, or Men Going Their Own Way So Completely That All They Do Is Bitch About Women.

Let’s just pop in on a discussion I found — don’t ask me how, I don’t even remember  — over on MGTOW.com. The subject: “Does feminism promote bestiality?”

Take it away, young MGTOW:

I’m rather young, so i can’t really say if it’s been increasing or not, but i suspect so.

When i was 17, i was hugely obsessed with statistics, and i one day ran into a survey done asking female dog owners if they had ever had sexual intercourse with their dog. 1 in 10 stated that they had.

I haven’t been able to find it back as since then google’s search algorithms have been completely feminized so i can no longer find dick all on the net 

Ah, yes, it couldn’t be that you misremembered the study, must have been a “feminized” search engine.

Anyway, after an admittedly halfassed attempt at Googling I couldn’t find it either and the most recent widely cited study I did find (from way back in 1974) suggested that a) the percentage of women who had sex with animals was less than two percent (1.9%) and that b) the percentage of men who’d done the same was more than twice that (4.9%). So I’m guessing the study our young MGTOW “remembers” is either imaginary or completely unscientific bullshit.

Also, ewwww.

So anywho, that got me thinking, about why so many girls had dogs as pets and not the cute fluffy cats 

To protect them from creepy weirdos like you?

Why they would always have a male dog, and never a female dog – wouldn’t you expect them to get a female dog?

[citation needed]

I came to the conclusion that women were just extremely f~~~ed up and disgusting when it came to their sexual desires.

Of course you did.

NOW! 5 years later!

I was on a movie set a few days ago, doing some gay ass artsy film lol… and the assistant director had a male dog… which she slept with.

This dog whined when ever he was away from her for more than 5 seconds!!!

So, it got me thinking, i mean, she sleeps with the dog every night, how on earth is she not f~~~ing it?

Um, WHAT

WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU ASSUME THAT

Sometimes my cats sleep on my bed. I DON’T HAVE SEX WITH THEM.

I mean, who sleeps with their dog!

Uh, half of all dog owners?

She actually literally cuddled with the dog… probably giving it more affection than any man she’s ever known… lol.

Just got me thinking, pretty entertaining thing to think of.

Since i was 17, i have noticed both a serious increase in feminism and female relations \w dogs… but i can’t really say if the two are linked or even if the latter has been increasing of if its just my increased awareness.

So… Thoughts?

Have you ever caught any women doing weird stuff with their dogs? LOL.

Fun topic eh? 

Naturally, a number of other MGTOWs had their own equally thoughtful opinions on the subject:

Gross. You want to know what’s really sick is when I see male and female dog owners. When a male dog owner sees his dog humping something, he gets stern and p~~~ed off and yanks him away. When a female sees it, she’s all “omg lol so cute”. They think it’s adorable but if you walk up to her and just say something she thinks it’s rape. There was a study about women getting aroused by seeing bonobo monkeys f~~~ing. It was all over the place. Girls gone wild for monkeys.

Well that was an interesting exercise in free association.

One MGTOW had some thoughts about “old ladies.”

why do  you think those old ladies and women over 40 own a small dog?

they pour that freaking peanut butter all over their

Ok, I’m just going to stop him right there because I think we all know where that’s going.

Some of the commenters aren’t quite as bothered by the whole sex-with-dogs thing as Mr. OP. As one puts it:

I don’t frankly give a f~~~. As long as the dog wasn’t forced to [CENSORED BY DF BECAUSE IT’S DOG SEX], then I’m fine with it. There was an incident wherein a dog tried to hump me. I was a kid, and it never occurred to me that I was raping him. Listen, if the woman bends over and the dog starts humping her then I consider that to be conscentual. She offered, and he took her up on the that. Let them f~~~ dogs. If anything I find it amusing, but in all sincerity I have no moral qualms with what you call “beastiality”. I wouldn’t do it with a dog, or goat, or horse, but if the animal is willing, and you’re into that, then be my guest. I hear it’s illegal though, so you might want to keep it to yourself.

Well, that’s enough MGTOWs for one day I think.

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Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
2 years ago

To be a bit flippant, if the peanut butter trick actually worked to a satisfactory result, wouldn’t women use it with men too? No need to communicate with words, let alone educate him.

Bina
2 years ago

@Buttercup:

These guys are astoundingly jealous that animals get to sleep in womens’ beds, but not them. Cucked by cute, fluffy, adorable, affectionate pets. It isn’t fair! Women MUST be doing immoral sexthings with them. Women have no other purpose than sex, and also it makes the universe balance out if the mean meanies who dare to reject these upstanding prizes among men secretly practice bestiality.

Sounds about right. And then, the shit icing on top of the moldy cake is that they’ll whine something like “Why aren’t they doing that with ME? I’m a Nice Guy™!”

Migtoes are incels who don’t realize it, while incels are migtoes who really do need to GTOW. Preferably to a desert island. (Honestly, I’m having trouble telling the two apart, beyond what their forums are called.)

Knitting Cat Lady
Knitting Cat Lady
2 years ago

What do they care what sex a companion animal is?

As long as I’m not the one scheduling the spay/neuter procedure with the vet I don’t care!

And their leap from living being sharing bed to sex is simply astounding.

My parents practised co-sleeping with me, as all of us got more sleep that way, especially since I categorically refused any food aside breast milk from my mum’s breasts until I was one year old.

Plenty of parents do that!

I’ve also shared beds with class mates and cousins of various genders on school trips and the like.

Worst by far was the night time train trip to Venice. The destination coach was not a sleeper coach. But you could push the benches together and create a 2×2.5 m flatish surface to sleep on. It’s six to such a compartment. I was lucky. I spent the night wedged between classmate Stefan and the outside wall, beneath the window…

Seriously.

Even people in relationships spend way more time sharing the bed sleeping than fucking.

Good grief. What is wrong with those people?!

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
2 years ago

I came here for a read because my colleague is talking loudly on the phone and I can’t concentrate on the contract I’m supposed to be drafting.

Huge mistake. Now I need brain bleach, and I barely skimmed this shit. My subconscious has started a mutiny and keeps on screaming “why would you assume that? Why???” in high pitch tones and I can’t make it quiet down.

Seriously, what the actual fuck is wrong with these people?

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

(Aside: This comment was posted, then vanished. Gonna try reposting.)

*sigh* Welp, now we know which of these creepazoids is the audience for Dog Fucker.

comment image

OT, but it’s been on my mind: The Star’s running profiles on the Toronto Van Attack victims and… I dunno, something bothers me about ’em. I get that these are statements from loved ones at funerals and only good memories will be shared, and yet… I suppose I’m a little cynical of the same words being used to describe the victims of untimely death: “bubbly,” “kind,” “cheerful,” “loving” and probably the one that bothers me the most “lived life to the fullest.”

Can’t help but notice that these are always applied to female victims, particularly when they aren’t married or have kids. Because if they were, that’s always the lens that they get focused through. “Loving parent of 3 children and beloved wife of Joe Schmo.”

Having been only 24 hours removed from that exact spot, it gets me wondering what people would say about me if Minassian was able to get his van a day earlier and I was one of the victims. “Had dull cubicle job, drew naked animal people, occasionally photographed old buildings. Thrived on routine.” I’m sure my family would be more eloquent than that and describe me as quiet yet eager for knowledge of local history, yet there’s always that intimation that if you’re not doing all those things that the dead person did, you’re not living life to the fullest. Unless you’re climbing mountains in your off time or building houses for orphans, yer just not doin’ life right like this dead person did!

Sorry, some of us have had an energy-sapping liver ailment since childhood and can barely make it through the day. Some of us are uncomfortable around crowds. Some of us find the world around us more interesting than themselves and thus abhor selfies and avoid the camera eye.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s great that Anne Marie D’Amico volunteered overseas and was the life of the party or whatever, but come on, are the same handful of pithy, cliched platitudes all we have to describe each other? Are we that pedestrian, that predictable and boring? Man, if that’s the case, I might actually request full blow-up colour prints of my naked animal people be displayed next to my coffin. That’d actually be memorable.

Cuz we’re not all bubbly, kind, neighbourly people that play sportsball or go to church picnics or whatever. Some of us live online more than we do outside. More and more of us do. And plenty of us have unusual aspects about ourselves, and apparently none of us meet with any kind of misfortune because I’ve never seen a profile of a murder or accident victim relate their avid cosplaying hobby or fascination with old street signs or life as a professional dominatrix or LARPer or anything like that.

Those are the things that tend to be our not-so-hidden passions, the real legacies of who we are. Those are the things that I’m interested in, not their freakin’ fitness routines!

Sorry, rant over. Guess I’m still feeling a little of that “there but by the grace of God go I” stuff about the events of 4/23. Nothing existential, just disappointed in how shallow we get in tragedy’s shadow. There’s more to all of us and we should remember that.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
2 years ago

@Bina Honestly, I think incels are worse. They’re MGTOWs with an extra heaping helping of entitlement and “Woe is me, everyone else’s struggles pale in comparison to mine”. MGTOWs mostly bitch and complain, but incels actively advocate for harming women.

Instead of redistributing sex, maybe the world should focus on redistributing empathy and basic human interaction skills.

Shadowplay
2 years ago

@katamount

Eulogies are like funerals. They’re for the benefit of the living, not the dead.

“Lived life to the fullest” is just another denial that a life was cut short too soon by the people most affected by the loss.

Hambeast
Hambeast
2 years ago

Z&T said

Small dogs. What if you have a small home? I don’t think a Great Dane would really work in, or be comfortable in, smaller spaces. You know what, fuck it, I’m getting a racehorse. And a couple of Manatees, they can live in a kiddie pool in the basement.

I want a hippopotamus for Christmas! There’s lots of room for him in our two-car garage
I’d feed him there and wash him there and give him his massage!

(This is a song, for those who don’t know. Don’t google it; it’s also an earworm. You have been warned.)

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

@Shadowplay

Eulogies are like funerals. They’re for the benefit of the living, not the dead.

I can see friends and family in need of comfort finding the platitude thing reassuring. But then, do I really need to read about it in my morning newspaper? And I think that’s where my hangup is: the interaction between private funeral reminiscence that should be consoling to those grieving and mass media trying to grab attention. I see the same thing on that Forensic Files show I watch and it gets irksome having to hear every female murder victim under 30 described as “bubbly.” Who wants to be remembered as “bubbly?” I wouldn’t.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
2 years ago

After the London tube bombings, my mum’s main concern was that I get an up to date “nice” photo in case I was ever blown up and she needed something for the newspapers.

Shadowplay
2 years ago

@Katamount

Sure, it can be irritating (especially the bubbly bit – I too detest that word applied to people).
It’s the converse of what a couple of us were talking about on another thread – personalising the victims to people who otherwise have their own problems to worry on. Don’t think it does the dead many favors, to be honest. Better to remember all of them – not just the highlights.

@Alan

Ha! My mom keeps the bits of shrapnel they dig out of me from time to time. She’s a strange one at times.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
2 years ago

“Had dull cubicle job, drew naked animal people, occasionally photographed old buildings. Thrived on routine.”

I guess my family would be technically accurate to say that I “lived my life to the fullest”, even though I only do it occasionally, try to avoid non-consenting viewers and never tell anyone.

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

@Shadowplay

Don’t think it does the dead many favors, to be honest. Better to remember all of them – not just the highlights.

Agreed. That said… sometimes certain skeletons should remain unremarked upon in funerals. I’m thinking of my stepfather’s mother, who he described in private as a woefully neglectful parent who carried on several affairs with other married churchgoers (she belonged to a fundamentalist congregation) and cared about them more than her own children. Probably not the best eulogy material.

Steven Dutch
Steven Dutch
2 years ago

Hambeast: Too late. Just the mere mention did it! Beware the wrath of the earworm haters!

Alan Robertshaw. Also, make sure you have nice underwear!

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
2 years ago

@katamount

there’s always that intimation that if you’re not doing all those things that the dead person did, you’re not living life to the fullest. Unless you’re climbing mountains in your off time or building houses for orphans, yer just not doin’ life right like this dead person did!

Well said, it’s as if the people who write these things explicitly praise extroverts for doing what extroverts do. Personally I find capitalism to be the problem: not only can you afford to do these things if you have the resources to do it (both time and money), which most of us don’t; but also, there’s this subtle marketing BS of building this highly idealized version of what a “complete human being is”, which at the same time de-humanizes those that do not adhere to these arbitrary standards.

Our current society does not value nor cater to people who do not fit these molds, which incidentally are the ones who maximize production (whether as workers or as consumers).

Humanity has become instrumental to a system which was supposedly adopted to better the human condition.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Tangentially related, I hate how extroverted personality types are what gets called “relateable.” Yes. Relateable to fellow extroverts, but not to introverts. This came up on America’s Next Top Model a lot. The quirky, weird, shy, awkward and reserved models would get criticized for not being someone girls and women would relate to and I’m always like, “wait a second, I can relate to them.” Why wouldn’t people with all those traits want celebrities they can identify with too? Why do only friendly and outgoing people deserve that? There’s clearly an appetite for it. Daria, Darlene Conner, Enid from Ghost World, Wednesday Adams, Emily the Strange, Lizbeth Salander and more I’m forgetting are all very popular with young women for a reason. Because they relate to them.

Rabid Rabbit
Rabid Rabbit
2 years ago

@Katamount

Part of the problem, I think, is that these deaths were recent and unexpected, and so the people writing the profiles are having to run to family and friends who are still in shock and want to say the nicest things they can. And so they’re using all the cliches – just like how in obituaries, everyone always fought against cancer, and never against any other disease. (When I’m Emperor of the World, I will be banning all variations on that phrasing forever.)

It’s a difference you notice between the obituaries of “ordinary” people and those of people who were in the news once. The press has files on the latter, had time to do the research, prepare them well in advance of the deaths, and so on, which is why Sandra Martin’s “Working the Dead Beat” is such a fun read. (For those who don’t know, it’s a collection of about 50 obituaries of notable Canadians.) The “ordinary” obituaries are prepared by the family, and that’s essentially what those profiles in the Star are.

And seconding @Diego Duarte about the fact that praise is extrovert-centered in these things.

ETA: @WWTH, definitely agree. Extroverts make me seize up before scuttling back behind the ficus like a cat with claws out and fur bristling. Pretty sure that doesn’t count as relating to them.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
2 years ago

Of course it was Nobel’s premature obituary (which slated him as a death dealer) that prompted him to set up the Nobel Prizes.

Moon_custafer
Moon_custafer
2 years ago

@Katamount:

I suppose I’m a little cynical of the same words being used to describe the victims of untimely death: “bubbly,” “kind,” “cheerful,” “loving” and probably the one that bothers me the most “lived life to the fullest.”

Dorothy L. Sayers, via characters in the mystery novel Murder Must Advertise, commented on how the newspapers always describe murder victims as “well-dressed and popular” if men, “bright and home-loving” if women.

Ledasmom
Ledasmom
2 years ago

I used to have a cat who would spoon me. I did not have sex with him. He, despite being neutered, did his best to have sex with teddy bears. This was not arousing to onlookers; mainly it led to a firm resolve to make sure the kids’ soft toys were not left alone with him.
I am currently sharing my bed with approximately thirty books, which I am also not having sex with.
I work at a vet clinic. Most of my coworkers are female. Our usual response to humping behavior is not “How cute!” but “We have an opening next Monday for his neuter”.

ashent
ashent
2 years ago

Prabhupada was definitely a bigoted jerk of the first water. I’m not sure why Hinduism, or that variant of it, should get any more slack than a fundamentalist Christian expressing similar opinions would get.

Jaygee
Jaygee
2 years ago

I see the conversation has moved on from the topic in the OP, but I just wanted to mention my initial reaction on seeing the headline and picture: my mind went an article I read shared on Facebook of a couple in Colorado where the husband forced his wife to have sex with their male Husky. There was also other accounts of domestic violence, and she had called the police about it before, but unfortunately nothing was done. Now both people in the couple are facing charges of bestiality. I also read comments that the dog would likely be put down since the abuse it suffered would severely affect how it would interact with other humans. (Which made me think of the mghow above who mentioned a coworker with a dog she sleeps with is not having sex with her because it would act way more differently.)

I also wonder if these mgtows are actually ignorant or just being obtuse on how feminists stand on bestiality. I thought feminists were known for consent and that children and animals are not able to give consent. Knowing that, bestiality goes against known feminist thought.

On the current topic of people being relatable or noteworthy if they’re extroverts: I feel like teachers are expected to be extroverted. I’m reserved, especially when I first get to know people. So it’s hard to be the super warm and enthusiastic teacher people envision when they think of good teachers. I’ve also had to explain to people why I don’t impose myself onto children and instead leave myself open for them to aproach me, such as how different people have different boundaries and it takes time to learn what’s comfortable for each individual.

I feel like the reason extroverts are held as an ideal is that they are often the ones speaking up more or just making themselves more visible (but also the capitalistic factors mentioned above).

epitome of incomprehensibility

OT to this thread, but the local paper is reporting that an online-famous Nazi dude (Zeiger, a writer for The Daily Stormer) was traced to Montreal: link to story. Ugh. And he lives in Rosemont-La Petite-Patrie, a place that has (and/or is near to) large immigrant and Jewish communities.

He also hosted neo-Nazi groups; the paper notes: “Only men were allowed to attend their official meetings, but they opened up some events to women and “normies” — a term they use to describe people outside the movement.”

“Normies” is what the incels say too, isn’t it? Ugh and ugh again.

Lukas Xavier
Lukas Xavier
2 years ago

Our usual response to humping behavior is not “How cute!” but “We have an opening next Monday for his neuter”.

And, suddenly, the entire manosphere involuntarily shuddered, but didn’t know why.

Zenobia Augusta
Zenobia Augusta
2 years ago

Regarding Extroverts Vs. Introverts and marketability, I am reminded of a time several years ago when I met with an agent. She told me I had a “quirky, urban vibe” and that there was a part out there for me somewhere, she just didn’t know what it was. I asked her wouldn’t she rather have me on file, for whenever such a role came up, and she explained that she wouldn’t take me on, because I just wouldn’t make her any money. She then went on to list some things I could do to improve myself, most of them way too expensive for me, to make myself more marketable. I spent hours crying about it, but I can’t really blame her.

kupo
kupo
2 years ago

@ashent
That particular commenter has been making their feelings on certain cultures very obvious. They also don’t engage in the discussion, just drop a bunch of copy/paste. It would be different if someone said, “that reminds me of a thing I read…” and went on to explain, or if the commenter didn’t have a history of slandering certain cultures constantly.

Binjabreel
Binjabreel
2 years ago

Okay so I just noticed this now, but how are these incels so wrong about everything even down to peanut butter?

He said “pours peanut butter”.

WHO THE FUCK POURS PEANUT BUTTER? WHAT SHITTY PEANUT BUTTER IS THIN ENOUGH TO BE POURED?

Zenobia Augusta
Zenobia Augusta
2 years ago

Maybe he pours all the oil off the top of natural peanut butter instead of stirring it in?

Binjabreel
Binjabreel
2 years ago

The thought of that makes me irrationally angry.

Moggie
Moggie
2 years ago

Binjabreel:

WHO THE FUCK POURS PEANUT BUTTER? WHAT SHITTY PEANUT BUTTER IS THIN ENOUGH TO BE POURED?

I’m told that Reese’s make a pourable peanut butter.

WHAT THE FUCK, AMERICA? Stop getting food wrong!

Tovius
Tovius
2 years ago

@Moggie

And here I thought cheese in a can was our low point.

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
2 years ago

So, it got me thinking, i mean, she sleeps with the dog every night, how on earth is she not f~~~ing it?

Someone’s never been invited to a sleepover. I mean, if this dude was the same at 12 as now at 22, I wouldn’t be surprised…

Rabid Rabbit
Rabid Rabbit
2 years ago

@Axecalibur

Pretty sure he assumed all sleepovers were actually orgies and got pissed that he wasn’t invited, thus marking the start of his incel career.

Shadowplay
2 years ago

@wwth

Off topic.

Omg. Omg.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/feds-tapped-trump-lawyer-michael-cohen-s-phones-n871011

NBC has issued a correction.

(Daily Beast link – specifying because someone said they weren’t going there any more.)

Bina
2 years ago

@Jaygee:

I also wonder if these mgtows are actually ignorant or just being obtuse on how feminists stand on bestiality. I thought feminists were known for consent and that children and animals are not able to give consent. Knowing that, bestiality goes against known feminist thought.

Ignorant, obtuse…and projecting. Because you just know that these bozos would hump a dog if they had one. Or, even more awful, force it to hump a woman if they had one. And that, frankly, is why they should have neither dogs nor women in their lives.

BritterSweet
2 years ago

At first I found it shocking, disgusting and pathetic that these guys are really sexualizing affection for pets. But then, it became less shocking, but still just as disgusting and pathetic, when I remembered that these guys have also expressed sexual envy toward a statue. Remember that article?

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

@Alan:

Of course it was Nobel’s premature obituary (which slated him as a death dealer) that prompted him to set up the Nobel Prizes.

Wasn’t that also Tony Stark’s character arc?

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
2 years ago

Tony Stark had a character arc?

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Hippodameia,
comment image

ETA: Just noticed the misspelling, which makes the gif not as good. Oh well!

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
2 years ago

WWTH: Thank you! XD

solecism
solecism
2 years ago

The first guy I ever dated told a terrible and offensive “joke” involving a woman, her dog, peanut butter, and a surprise birthday party. I couldn’t understand why he would share such a thing and think it was funny. He had a hard time finishing because he started laughing. I should have taken it as a sign that this relationship was a bad idea. But I was young and so very inexperienced. It ended badly (for me).

Misogynists sure do seem to have some weird sexual fixations. Nudity = sex. Bed = sex. Affection = sex. Companionship = sex. Who knew life was so simple? Oh wait, it’s not, and most things in life really aren’t about sex. Who wouldn’t want to cuddle sweet, furry dogs (or cats). They’re so fluffy! And not at all handsy.

I haven’t been able to find it back as since then google’s search algorithms have been completely feminized so i can no longer find dick all on the net.

Assuming a straight bias, wouldn’t feminized search algorithms mean more male nudity on the interwebz? Or maybe the opposite–feminized search algorithms mean no more dick pics ever again? Looking at the demographics at Google, I am extremely dubious about the starting assumption.

Jen
Jen
2 years ago

Peanut butter is considered a liquid by TSA standards, so you can’t carry that jar on board. D; It’s just, I guess, a super viscous liquid?
Almond butter is definitely far more runny, though.

I so wish I had the option to like so many of these comments.

@Solecism, I learned about the “peanut butter thing” from Gaia Online. Someone would spam the forums with a “Ladies, you have to try this!” And I made the mistake of clicking out of curiosity. I died that day.

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

In Sweden beastiality became illegal pretty recently. It’s interesting to read the relevant authorities reasoning on the matter – basically, animals don’t like being raped so this is an issue of animal welfare, although the production of animal food requires forcibly inseminating cows and pigs which is hardly any fun for them, but that’s different because obviously we can’t stop having animal food, so it’s fine and dandy to keep raping pigs and cows for that purpose, but not because you’re a pervert. Yeah I shit you not, that’s the explicit reasoning for legally allowing vets to shove their entire arms up cows whilst forbidding pervert farmers from putting their dicks in there. (You might have guessed I’m a vegan.)

Then there are tons of people who haven’t read jack shit about how this law came about but are 100 % convinced that there’s no other reason for forbidding beastiality than feelings of “ugh”, and loudly object every chance they get against having ugh-based legislation.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
2 years ago

AFAIK in Finland bestiality is only illegal if it can be construed as general animal cruelty. I guess that’s more consistent with the idea that animals don’t have a right to bodily autonomy as such.

I’ve read that historically bestiality was very much illegal in Sweden (then including Finland), based on a biblical “ugh” sentiment. Like, in 18th century there was a bestiality-related moral panic resembling witch hunts, resulting in a number of death penalties for both people and livestock. I imagine that was invoked in the recent discussion?

Dvärghundspossen
Dvärghundspossen
2 years ago

Yeah it was illegal way back, but back then it wasn’t part of an animal welfare legislation but part of “vice” legislation. Then it became legal, very recently it became illegal again. And the arguments for making it illegal again were primarily brought forth by vets, who argued that we know that animals generally suffer when their owners have sex with them, but it’s often hard to prove suffering in the individual case. And that’s why it’s better to have a blanket ban. (Except when we gotta rape cows to get that sweet milk and beef of course! )
It’s also illegal to force a dog to have sex with another dog for breeding purposes, also for animal welfare reasons.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
2 years ago

I know that animal welfare wasn’t much of an issue in 18th century.

I’ve also read (in comments by Finish farm vets) that prosecuting animal rape is difficult, and not generally something authorities care about.

Moggie
Moggie
2 years ago

Death penalties for livestock? Aren’t they permanently under a death penalty already?

numerobis
numerobis
2 years ago

I love how unique each cat’s markings are

My dad on his recent visit finally figured out how to tell my two apart (they’re twins) — and he used a *new* variation that I’d never noticed despite sleeping with these cats for years in an entirely non-sexual kind of way.

(Although sometimes a cat will lie on the bed while my partner and I are getting it on — and finding the cat distracting — I don’t think it counts.)

JS
JS
2 years ago

A followup to cats “not being handsy”, I met one that would grab my wrist with both paws, and happily lick the inside of my wrist until I got tired of it, or the cat got carried away and bit. #NotAllCats Turkish Vans are strange.