By David Futrelle
Donald Trump will blithely threaten nuclear war in hair-raising off-the-cuff remarks. But his milquetoast statement on Charlottesville today — referring vaguely to violence “on many sides” — was clearly carefully scripted, seemingly to avoid offending the white supremacists who have been some of his most fervent supporters.
Whatever his intent, White supremacists are cheering his evasive non-response as a sign that “he loves us all.”
it worked pic.twitter.com/ekSZnw6FCK
— Ashley Feinberg (ashleyfeinberg.bsky.social) (@ashleyfeinberg) August 12, 2017
Trump's remarks today were deliberately vague to send a wink and nod to white supremacists, and the alt-right is aware and clearly thrilled. pic.twitter.com/TbQGpdxVed
— The Darkest Timeline Numbersmuncher (@NumbersMuncher) August 12, 2017
White supremacists cheer Trump’s response to Charlottesville violence https://t.co/0G4Wnqw2Rx pic.twitter.com/umc1fJQyzD
— Judd Legum (@JuddLegum) August 12, 2017
by condemning hatred "on many sides," the president of the United States just handed an immensely valuable gift to David Duke
— John Harwood (@JohnJHarwood) August 12, 2017
And to Richard Spencer, and “Baked Alaska,” and all the other Nazis and quasi-Nazis and “oh-no-I’m-not-a-Nazi”s who marched in Charlottesville.
The closest Trump came to condemning the terrorism was this bizarre tweet, posted late in the day.
Condolences to the family of the young woman killed today, and best regards to all of those injured, in Charlottesville, Virginia. So sad!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) August 12, 2017
BEST FUCKING REGARDS!?
Not that any of this should be a shock at this point, given that during his campaign Trump deliberately and repeatedly incited his supporters to attack those protesting him.
On the campaign trail Trump reminisced about "the old days" where protestors would be "carried out on a stretcher."
— Jared Yates Sexton (@JYSexton) August 12, 2017
Trump is the one who made it okay to "Beat the crap out of 'em."
— Stephen King (@StephenKing) August 12, 2017
And he’s not the only one to encourage violence. One commenter reminded us that right-wing columnist and University of Tennessee law professor Glenn Reynolds literally urged drivers to plow into Black Lives Matter protesters in a tweet last year
https://twitter.com/bax_books/status/896443189669666816
None of this bodes well for the future.
Make no mistake. When Donald Trump loses election or is impeached he will incite these most fanatic supporters to violence. https://t.co/dr0fjzkgj9
— Richard Schiff (@Richard_Schiff) August 12, 2017
Sadly, I think this is almost certainly true.
@Weird (thumper of trumpanzees) Eddie
“The ongoing temper tantrum that whites have been throwing since the civil war is/has come to a head. The militant white population has been stumping for a fight for years, ever since the civil rights, women’s rights, gay rights movements of the 50’sand 60’s.”
I think a key turning point that is often forgotten is Nixon giving the southern White Supremacists a new political party “home” in the Republican Party during the early 1970s.
Despite the persistence of white supremacist ideology in the late 1960s early 1970s, institutionally the South *had* changed by the early 1970s. John Dittmer discusses this in his Local People: The Struggle for Civil Rights in Mississippi (Champagne-Urbanna: University of Illinois Press, 1995) — for example the extremely high proportion of local government elected offices held by African-Americans by 1975 (I think it was a majority). Mass Black suffrage from the enforcement of the Voting Rights act, the results of mass local activism and the dismantling of the *outward* manifestations of Jim Crow like segregation did make for a “new” Mississippi, or a Mississippi that looked outwardly at LOT different from what it was just fifteen years before — but of course the white supremacist constituency was still there and angry, but after the reuninification of state Democratic parties in the early 1970s, they needed a place to go, institutionally, in terms of the two-party system.
Nixon gave them that with the Republican Party.
I… well, … I see a (very short) treatise, “Capitalism in post-Moorish Spain”. yeah…
re: family. I was raised on Pete Seeger, “Rainbow Quest”, social conscience and pinko politics… communist, prolly, but in the squishy American Communist Party sense. My family is all gone, but my dad left me with a mandate… “Shoot Back!”
My ex partner is a Muslim, our son is biracial, and they both believe in antifascist ideals. I don’t have any advice for those whose family members are fascist apologists (or worse), I have hugs if you want them, tho! There are several trumpanzees at my workplace, but I’ve spoken up enough that they no longer include me in their rants. Best of luck to us all.
@Pavlov;
re: noxin and the new repubs party, absolutely! That gave the Strom Thurmond/Jesse Helms southern Dixiecrats their own home that they didn’t have to share with non-whites
Her name was Heather Heyer.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://heavy.com/news/2017/08/heather-heyer-victim-who-died-charlottesville-rally-car-crash-photos-age-bio/amp/&ved=0ahUKEwjVgfz5sdTVAhXIqlQKHeQ5A00QFgh7MBs&usg=AFQjCNHdIcmInVVT5cplS6yMBmcUDSO7ng&cf=1
John McCain had a good response to the attack:
pOTUS will probably reiterate his preference for people who weren’t captured….
the dumpster-fire-in-chief may get his “out”, with all the rebellion and animus, he may be able to “quit with honor”, saving his reputation with his base for upcoming “trumpTV” show
Why the fuck are we jumping McCain, Cruz, Hatch, or Navarro for half-assed self-serving statements in thr face of the rising fascism they’ve spent decades bringing to the US? Have any of them apologized for their part in it? Have they taken an steps to repudiate their erstwhile allies, or to repair the damage they’ve done? I already know the answer: of course they haven’t, because they’re still fascists, they just prefer uniformed racist murderers. When they apologize, resign repudiate the Republican party entirely, endorse the farthest left candidate running to replace them and devote the rest of their lives to Habitat for Humanity, then there would be grounds to praise them.
@Weird (thumper of trumpanzees) Eddie
Yeah, it kind of went like this.
Me: “Well, sixteenth-century Spain wasn’t really capitalist. Nobody was in Europe yet, although there was the beginnings of a much more expanded commercial economy. But this is really the period in which government economic policy is dominated by mercantilist (or what we’d later call “mercantilist”) ideas.”
Him: “I have my own definition of capitalism that I’m using. I see capitalism as something where respect for private property is at work.” [additional screed on Obama the evil socialist today, blah bah.]
Me: “The doesn’t make sense. Also, this is a history class so you need to stick to the course material in your discussion contributions.”
Him: “But private property is at the heart of capitalism.”
Me: “No. Capital is at the heart of capitalism. Nobody is Spain really amassed capital. Yes, they got a bunch of precious metal from the New World. That was like money. But they didn’t spend it on producing new things in Spain. It mostly didn’t stay in Spain. They just pumped it on up the Spanish road to pay their armies fighting in the Netherlands, continually, for decades.”
Him: “I see capitalism as something where respect for private property is at work.”
Me: “You aren’t doing the reading. You also need to go back and get a basic European History undergraduate survey textbook and read it. [not out loud: “how to did you get admitted to this program?]”
Yeah, I’m all for positive reinforcement to get people to change their behavior. It’s what works best. But we should only be praising them for taking actual real steps to change their ways and change the party. Condemning a Nazi terrorist is setting the bar so low that the bar is a mile under the earth’s crust. No one gets praise from me for clearing the bar because it is the bare minimum of what we should expect.
…Hey, guys.
If I were to hypothetically attend a rally (I can’t get to many places on my own, being 17 and having no permit, but there might be something on-campus), what should I keep on my person and in my mind in regards to self-defense?
Don’t bring any ID. If you get arrested for some bullshit reason, they won’t be able to put anything on your record and they’ll have to let you go.
@Troubelle
Generally speaking, you’ll want a mask or some way of concealing your identity (being doxxed by Nazis is bad), a leather jacket or coat, preferably with somehthing thick underneath it (helps some if you’re being clubbed). Bring a bottle of water to stay hydrated. Some bandages, antiseptic cream, gauze pads, and medical tape might come in handy if it turns violent. Mount a sign on the sturdiest rod you can access, it’s a handy self defence implement.
If it’s uniformed fascists you’re worried about, they always start with tear gas. Get some swimming or lab goggles and a filter mask of some kind; hardware stores usually have some, or a surgical mask or even a handkerchief over mouth and nose (in the latter cases it helps to soak in in vinegar). Carry Maalox or another liquid antacid to irrigate the eyes of less prepared victims.
So that means leave state ID and campus ID at home. This could be an issue, as I need my campus ID to access my dorm. That’s a little bullshit…
http://i.imgur.com/eBtzdB5.jpg
@ troubelle
(This is based on animal rights stuff, but it should be applicable)
Running shoes. Seriously. If it kicks off just get out of there. Unless you know what you’re doing in a violent confrontation you’re just going to get yourself hurt and hinder the people who do.
Some form of recording device can be useful in case you get into confrontations with the police. But not your regular phone. It can be temporarily confiscated and then they have all your details and those of your contacts. Checking social media is a common tactic and that can be used against you (“We see you’re a regular on that site that promotes punching Nazis” etc)
Take some money hidden in your waistband or somewhere. That way if you’re released from a police station at four in the morning you can use a payphone or flag down a taxi.
Have the contact details of a sympathetic lawyer handy. Ideally memorise them. Have a few alternatives for when the police claim they’re not answering.
As for ID, it’s complicated (see below). Best comprise is to not take any with you, but have a mechanism for proving your identity quickly should the need arise. For example, someone who can email a scan of the relevant documents if you call them (ideally from a burner phone and email)
https://www.flexyourrights.org/faqs/when-can-police-ask-for-id/
As to the self defence thing, as mentioned above, unless you know what you’re doing you’re better off without. But if you do feel the need, don’t take anything that’s obviously a weapon. You can do a lot of damage with improvised weapons if you know how. Pens can be as lethal as knives if used correctly. Rucksacks are good shields against both thrown objects and in a melee situation.
Good eye protection is very handy. You can pick up ballistic sunglasses on eBay for a few tens of dollars.
The best advice though is just to be aware of your surroundings. The alt-right lot are, unfortunately, quite good at close quarter tactics so it’s advisable to learn that too so you can anticipate how things are developing and move to a safer position if necessary. You don’t want to get trapped.
Hope this helps a bit.
You may also want to bring something like baby shampoo and water in case pepper spray gets involved. You need something that will break down oils. Baby shampoo isn’t truly “no tears” but it’s more gentle. You could use dawn if you don’t have baby shampoo. Here’s more pepper spray info:
http://home.howstuffworks.com/home-improvement/household-safety/security/pepper-spray4.htm
May this spate of new, Republican denouncers of Trump and the racism and fascism he bolsters change their party affiliation and vote to impeach now or forever hold their peace
Seattle area events today:
Seattle: Denny Park 1pm (Corner of Denny Ave & Dexter St)
Tacoma: Chinese Expulsion Memorial Park Time TBA
There is also a Kitsap County event, I don’t have details.
No, and they aren’t going to. Even if they do see their part in it (debatable, I doubt if most of them even see that it exists), they’re not going to punt their privileged position in order to take a stand against it. No one in power is.
You cannot make basic changes in the distribution of power in a society by using the tools of change which the power structure has put in place. Whites are not going to vote themselves out of their privileges and they’re not going to allow anyone else to.
What we saw Friday is more than bigots attacking their chosen targets, even tho I doubt the bigots understand it. This is bigotry attacking a perceived effort to change the hierarchy of social acceptability.
There has been a lot of effort to make fundamental changes in this society in the last 150 years, and I don’t want to discount the successes we have had, e.g. voting rights, anti-discrimination laws, civil rights laws and more. However, I see these as changes of QUANTITY, not of QUALITY. The power dynamic has not changed, white, xian, hetero males are still front and center in every debate, and enforcement of ALL of those gains goes through those men, or (more often) does not happen at all.
McCain, Cruz, et. al. are not going to make common cause with Black Lives Matter in order to “save the republic” they so dearly love. When push comes to shove, they, along with everyone else who values their privilege, will make common cause with Andrew Anglin (and Steve Bannon) first.
I do not have a positive outlook.
https://harpers.org/archive/1941/08/who-goes-nazi/
This is an ancient article from not long after WW2 started… give it a quick read… and look at your coworkers, neighbors, the person who sacks groceries at the market….
@ Troubelle;
Respect. You are a good person. From one who is from another era, when we marched, we sang! Take a song with you, too.
@ weird eddie
I enjoyed (if that’s the right word) that article. On that note I wonder if any Mammotheers can help me with something?
I’m trying to track down a quote about how fascists don’t always look like the stereotypical depiction. It’s something along the lines of “they may even have a comical moustache”.
I’m sure I haven’t imagined it, so does anyone have any clues?
Hey Axe, I seem to recall you’re less than enamoured with Glenn Greenwald. You might want to take some deep breaths before clicking on this.
https://theintercept.com/2017/08/13/the-misguided-attacks-on-aclu-for-defending-neo-nazis-free-speech-rights-in-charlottesville/
How does one change the systems in place? I myself am cis and white and male but at the same time I don’t want to be a bad person. I just also don’t want to use violence or even self-defense (not saying you can’t but I don’t want to). To me the worst part about violence is that it works, and I really feel like it shouldn’t. I refuse to take part in anything violent and if I might have to to make things better I’d rather just die, instead. I’ve always believed that people have the power to change things via the system. If that’s not the case, then well I just don’t know what to do. Perhaps I could move to another country?
Cruz in particular is a totally cynical doucheweasel — he’s trying to stake a position on the far right but anti-Nazi, because people will go for White Supremacist ideas as long as nobody points out that they are basically Nazi beliefs. Nazis still have a bad enough odor that a lot of White Nationalists recoil from them.
This is an excellent statement of the fundamental belief that the right-wing propaganda machine has been working for decades to nurture. Change is inevitable, and change can require some degree of not painless adaptation, and nostalgia for the (mostly imaginary) simpler past — where minorities and women “knew their place” — can be strong. The genius of the Right-Wing propaganda machine is to blame all the unsettling change on Those People.
This is the belief that was promoted by the Right during the Cold War. The Right has always claimed that they were the true patriots — and believed it. The Left has often been unwilling to subscribe to “My Country Right or Wrong” — we’d like it to stop being wrong. The Right has tried to delegitimize the Left by characterizing any criticism of the US as disloyal (except, of course, when a certain black man and a certain woman were in charge).
Between Portland and this I’m going to arm myself. We are fighting a group that doesn’t see us as human and is absolute evil incarnate. Nonviolent resistance will not work with them (see also white rose). So I’m seriously on the verge of going to pick up some firearms and going through the process to get a cpl. Debating what tactic to use when the assailant doesn’t have a firearm but there are a number of nongun options.
I worry that a civil war is all but inevitable for this count ry (my extensive reading on Poli sci and history tells me that when two or more groups cannot agree on the nature of reality, war always ensues), and worse it’s likely to be a guerrilla war (or even when it’s over, it’s not over).
Damn 79,000 in 3 states caused this, a different result wouldnt have been good but it would’ve depowered the death cult.
@Alan
Into fuckin space!
Breathing after, rage now!!!
Got thru a few paragraphs before I had to eject. The condescending whitedudery was causing me pain. 2800 words, and I guarantee at least 800 of em are just him being smarmy. Also, fuck him, he’s wrong
Look, I’ve given some money to the ACLU. I don’t regret doing so in the slightest. Their work on the Muslim ban, frex, has been invaluable. But they can choose their fuckin cases. And they’ve chosen wrong sometimes. Most recently to murderous results. And that deserves all the criticism, and loss of donations, they’re getting. And for Glenn fuckin Greenwald to say otherwise with an article practically written in the font of ‘leftist superiority complex’ is hideous
Also wanna point out to anyone who’d argue they can’t choose their cases or else muh civil liberties that the SCLC rejected plenty of bus protesters before settling on Rosa Parks. And the civil rights movement was better for it. Own your shit ACLU
?
@ David F
I’m not sure if this is in line with the comments policy, so if not please delete. But someone’s set up a twitter thing to ID the Nazis at Charlottesville so people can let their employers, schools etc know.
https://mobile.twitter.com/yesyoureracist/status/896502810971426818