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White supremacists encouraged by Trump’s “many sides” comments on #Charlottesville terror

Trump commenting on Charlottesville earlier today

By David Futrelle

Donald Trump will blithely threaten nuclear war in hair-raising off-the-cuff remarks. But his milquetoast statement on Charlottesville today — referring vaguely to violence “on many sides” — was clearly carefully scripted, seemingly to avoid offending the white supremacists who have been some of his most fervent supporters.

Whatever his intent, White supremacists are cheering his evasive non-response as a sign that “he loves us all.”

And to Richard Spencer, and “Baked Alaska,” and all the other Nazis and quasi-Nazis and “oh-no-I’m-not-a-Nazi”s who marched in Charlottesville.

The closest Trump came to condemning the terrorism was this bizarre tweet, posted late in the day.

BEST FUCKING REGARDS!?

Not that any of this should be a shock at this point, given that during his campaign Trump deliberately and repeatedly incited his supporters to attack those protesting him.

And he’s not the only one to encourage violence. One commenter reminded us that right-wing columnist and University of Tennessee law professor Glenn Reynolds literally urged drivers to plow into Black Lives Matter protesters in a tweet last year

https://twitter.com/bax_books/status/896443189669666816

None of this bodes well for the future.

Sadly, I think this is almost certainly true.

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Nequam
Nequam
3 years ago

personalpest
personalpest
3 years ago

When Donald Trump loses election or is impeached he will incite these most fanatic supporters to violence.

Probably, but Trump can’t be allowed to stay in power. Besides, Charlottesville proves that there will be violence either way.

Ray of Rays
Ray of Rays
3 years ago

Falconer
Falconer
3 years ago

I hope UT students are making Glenn Reynolds’ life difficult with protests and sit-ins. Heh. Indeed.

Fishy Goat
Fishy Goat
3 years ago

@personalpest Exactly.

Croquembouche, poorly-dressed vandal
Croquembouche, poorly-dressed vandal
3 years ago

According to Australian ABC,

The white supremacist Daily Stormer website said Mr Trump’s comments were “good”.

“He didn’t attack us. He just said the nation should come together. Nothing specific against us … No condemnation at all. When asked to condemn, he just walked out of the room. Really, really good. God bless him,” the website read.

My sympathies, all.

Paradoxical Intention - Leader of the Deathclaw Damsels

CNN has an occasional guest comment on these things, a republican by the name of Ana Navarro.

She called Trump “mealy-mouthed” over this speech, and I’m inclined to fucking agree. She tore him a new one over not denouncing these fuckers and instead jumping to “both sides are bad!” bullshit that gives his “fans” a free fucking pass.

And of course, there was one white dude who had to be the “devil’s advocate” and say that “No u guis, Trump did denounce them! He’s not bad! Stop dividing us! You’re just attacking him because he’s Trump!”

Like…please fuck off. If any other president was as fucking wishy washy as Trump is when bringing up neo-nazis, we’d have torn them a new one too.

History Nerd
History Nerd
3 years ago

It’s hard to say exactly how many people in the US secretly have explicitly fascist or Nazi beliefs (i.e., those people who’d self identify as fascist if you gave them truth serum, I’m not addressing the issue of whether it’s fair to call everyone who voted for Trump a “fascist” by their actions). Most probably hide those beliefs, because they’d become unemployable if people knew what they really believed. There’s probably a few million people with those beliefs in the US, but that’s enough to flip a few swing states if you can appeal to them without losing votes.

People who say they’re fascists in pre-2016 election studies say they’re not satisfied with either party, and many don’t vote. Some voted Republican reluctantly and some supported Ron Paul because they thought he would weaken the federal government, making it easier to have a violent revolution and set up an authoritarian government at least in local areas. They mostly like Trump because he has always been consistently anti-immigration (since the 1980’s, even when he was a Democrat), he goes out of his way to not offend them, and he’s making the federal government less effective.

Most people will agree “it is bad that people engage in unjustifiably violent acts.” But if someone is violent because he believes that whole classes of people, grouped based on traits that they can’t choose or control, shouldn’t be allowed to exist or shouldn’t have the same basic rights as other people, it’s a totally different story. That’s violence directed at the entire group as a whole. And yes, using “all acts of violence are bad” as a moral equivalency argument enables those abusers and perpetrators and harms victims further.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
3 years ago

@ croquembouche

Oh it gets worse, they’re now claiming it was an express condemnation of anti fascists. Mind you, it might as well have been.

The Stormer guys seem to have fallen out with the police though.

we were ambushed by terrorist cops who were working hand-in-glove with the communist terrorists.

Which has provoked this charming article:

Same Evil Cops Who Attacked Us Can’t Fly a Fucking Helicopter – 2 Dead in Crash

What is wrong with these ret*ards?

(asterisk not in original)

Mels
Mels
3 years ago

Steven Bannon was behind the wheel.Seb Gorka was behind the wheel.Stephen Miller was behind the wheel.Donald Trump was behind the wheel.— Justin Hendrix (@justinhendrix) August 12, 2017

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
3 years ago

The Stormer is engaging in some classic doublethink about the car attack itself.

If it was one of our guys that crashed that car, they would have announced it by now.

The Governor, Mayor and Police Chief held a press conference, said the guy was in custody and did not give his name. There is no way in hell they would have done that if it was someone from our side.

But also

Charlottesville: Car Rams Into Counter-Protesters in Self-Defense

Croquembouche, poorly-dressed vandal
Croquembouche, poorly-dressed vandal
3 years ago

Guy has been named.
And confirmed a registered Republican.
And placed with alt-right

https://mobile.twitter.com/LorenzoMeow/status/896561497110978561?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

SinisterPigeon: Sombrero Golem
SinisterPigeon: Sombrero Golem
3 years ago

Ugh only second degree murder. I really hope they do due diligence and check his history, computer and records to see if there was any aforethought because I don’t think they can put him away for long with that.

JS
JS
3 years ago

Second degree murder, multiple malicious injury, and hit-and-run. Could be 3 felonies depending on state law.

JS
JS
3 years ago

Also, I’m coming to the feeling that we really need to just call them all Nazis, or neonazi, not alt-right. Godwin’s law no longer applies.

Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Agent of the FemiNest Collective; Keeper of a Hell Toupee, and all-around Intergalactic Meanie
Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Agent of the FemiNest Collective; Keeper of a Hell Toupee, and all-around Intergalactic Meanie
3 years ago

What Trump couldn’t bring himself to say, Virginia Governor Terry McAuliffe could:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mediaite.com/online/virginia-governor-terry-mcauliffe-calls-out-white-nationalists-shame-on-you/amp/

Money quote from the article:

You are not wanted in this great commonwealth. Shame on you. You pretend that you are patriots, but you are anything but a patriot. You want to talk about patriots, talk about Thomas Jefferson and George Washington, who brought our country together. Think about the patriots today, the young men and women, who with wearing the cloth of our country. Somewhere around the globe they are putting their life in danger. They are patriots. You are not. You came here today to hurt people. And you did hurt people. My message is clear, we are stronger than you. You have made our commonwealth stronger. You will not succeed. There is no place for you here. There is no place for you in America.

History Nerd
History Nerd
3 years ago

Possibly felony murder, which is (more or less) first degree in some states. Then the prosecutor doesn’t need to show premeditation or planning, only that he’s guilty of second degree murder and it was a hit-and-run (usually a felony by itself).

JS
JS
3 years ago

Terry McAuliffe’s party affiliation? Democrat.
Suprised? Nope.

Senator Ted Cruz surprised me today, by calling for an investigation into this domestic terrorism, and clearly denouncing white supremacists, KKK, and Nazis. He still wants to repeal and replace, but at least he spoke out against these hate groups. Not that that’s enough for me to let him off the hook, or ever vote for him.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

My dad read on some website that the dude plowed into the crowd because he felt frightened, and my dad believed this uncritically because he’s white supremacist and thinks being anti-fascist is an ultra-left position.

I have no hope for my family.

SinisterPigeon: Sombrero Golem
SinisterPigeon: Sombrero Golem
3 years ago

I was honestly surprised they weren’t charging it as Felony Murder rule myself in combination with terrorism. I just hope he gets the time he deserved but…. he was afraid so he went into a crowd at 40 mph from across the street?

Micharion
Micharion
3 years ago

Most likely only some of the less stable of Trump’s supporters will try and riot. The rest are too chickenshit, I can say that right? But to get back to normalcy we might have to do something a little drastic when this blows over. Nazi’s have gotten into their little heads that what they do is okay, the only way I see that stopping is if one shares the fate of their forebears. Not Operation Paperclip but the ones that were executed for crimes against humanity. The rest of this administration could rot in jail and let the chips fall where they may with them, as long as the cannot escape.

Anisky
Anisky
3 years ago

@Policy of Madness

My dad is kind of the opposite, he’s totally sure that they’ll end up charging this guy with domestic terrorism, because he refuses to see white privilege, and so doesn’t see any reason this guy wouldn’t be charged with terrorism.

I admit, an easier mindset to deal with than your father’s; but still, siiiigh.

Ooglyboggles
Ooglyboggles
3 years ago

@JS

Not that that’s enough for me to let him off the hook, or ever vote for him.

Still though, Gold Star for him saying that white supremecists & nazis are evil and saying he wants something done about it.

@Policy of Madness
Hugs.

@SinisterPigeon: Sombrero Golem
Idc whatever they nail him for, just that he goes away for a long, long time. Still peeved that a Nazi can injure 19 people and murder a person and STILL won’t get charged for terrorism.

@Micharion
Nothing scares a bully more than fear of consequence.

@Anisky
yeah, siighh, at least his heart is in the right place

I don’t talk politics with family, especially with my Fox News addled dad. Last time that I did tech support for him I saw him getting emails about “TrumpCoins.” I don’t really think I want to hear his take on this situation.

JS
JS
3 years ago

Gold Star for Cruz, yes. Unfortunately he’s got all these “Red X” stickers he still hasn’t done anything about. Still bleating on about “Repeal and Re… no, we got nothing”. I’ve never got any response from him on any issue I’m interested in.

Valentine
Valentine
3 years ago

PoM 💙💚💛💜 i am sorry you have that situation. I understand with people like him, nothing you will say can change his mind. Hating Nazis is radical now? Maybe remind him all about brave American heros who fight hilter – because they are also anti-fascist….

Ooglyboggles
Ooglyboggles
3 years ago

@JS
Can’t say I’m faring any better getting to Ed Royce. His phone line will stay silent for 15 minutes straight before just turning off.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

@Valentine

In my dad’s eyes, nothing is worse than being “left” and his opinion of “left” now includes anyone who is opposed to literal fascists. This has been a problem a long time coming, though. He thinks of me as being the reddest of red communists because I don’t think capitalism was handed down personally by Jesus. He lives in a post-fact world. My mom is worse.

We’ve had screaming matches in the past and I’ve gotten them to stop talking the worst of their shit directly in front of me, and that’s really all I have the power to do.

A God of Darkness
A God of Darkness
3 years ago

This is terrible. It’s unfortunate that you Americans have to put up with that. I don’t know what I’d do if that happened here. Trump just needs to stop.

Valentine
Valentine
3 years ago

PoM,

He thinks of me as being the reddest of red communists because I don’t think capitalism was handed down personally by Jesus.

This made me smile 😁 but really it is not funny at all when your parents behave this way. It is good they don’t talk in front of you – but probably just not for argue. My dad also making some not good comments – when i tell him he also does this, not talking but still thinking.

abars01
abars01
3 years ago

So the alt-right has hosted one protest where a few hundred people attended. During Trump’s inauguration, on the other hand, there were 673 protests where 5 million people attended. And this is proof that the majority of people support the alt-right, and that the alt-right is on the verge of winning, and that the alt-right would win in a fight between these two sides, because…?

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

My dad also making some not good comments – when i tell him he also does this, not talking but still thinking.

Yeah, you can’t change someone’s mind unless they are at least slightly open to change, and some residual of folks just aren’t. They are lost causes. But it used to be the case that my dad would prod me purposefully by directly asking me what I thought of his latest conspiracy theory. I don’t know what he thought his game was, because I take no shit and he knows it, and I have the power today to completely cut contact with them if they anger me too much. He’s figured it out, I guess, because he doesn’t do that anymore.

I’m sorry you also have a questionable dad. Solidarity!

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
3 years ago

@abars

Because they hold all three branches of government, the police force, the military, the mainstream media and every major social media site.

EJ (the Scheming Liberal Race-Traitor)

Hugs, Ooglyboggles and Policy of Madness. My mother (and much of her family) are like that, too. I choose not to talk to them any more.

My (paternal) grandfather was a boundless believer in America. No matter how bad things got in South Africa, he would always draw hope from the example that America set for us. If a free, thriving, multiethnic society could be built there then we could build one too.

In a way, I’m glad he died before he could see this happen.

I wonder which country young South Africans will look to now?

Gipsz Jakab
Gipsz Jakab
3 years ago

@JS:

I like David’s term, “Nazoid”. It points out the fascist tendencies and Nazi sympathies while encompassing more than just the literal, full-fledged neo-Nazis.

Valentine
Valentine
3 years ago

✊ solidarity! Yes my dad doesn’t do like yours though – he thinks he is telling something funny but then i need to explain him. Your dad’s game is what my oldest brother does with me – fucking annoying 😞

Deathtothefilth
Deathtothefilth
3 years ago

There’s a reason I got my carry permit after the election.
When Trump gets impeached these fucus will riot,and begin insurgent terrorism.

mildlymagnificent
mildlymagnificent
3 years ago

If any other president was as fucking wishy washy as Trump is when bringing up neo-nazis, we’d have torn them a new one too.

One bright spot for me is seeing a lot of “old-fashioned”, dyed-in-the-wool, lifetime, conservative not radical, Republicans come out swinging on this stuff. Just watch Richard Painter in this AM Joy panel go all out (and this was before anyone was killed).
http://www.msnbc.com/am-joy If the link has changed from Richard Painter: ‘This is the face of Fascism in the U.S.’ just put that in your search engine – and watch!

Dreamer
Dreamer
3 years ago

Ray of Rays, thank you for the music. I needed it tonight.

AngryWarthogBreath
AngryWarthogBreath
3 years ago

It probably says something about what politics is like today. “Ted Cruz came out and said that violent Nazis are bad! I had to reassess my whole view of his courage!”

…And yet, I had to reassess my whole view of his courage.

Gijoel
Gijoel
3 years ago

This guy makes an interesting point about how the media should handle the alt-right. TL:DR Stop treating both sides as having a valid point.

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/08/thats-just-not-reality-sociologist-says-liberals-and-conservatives-are-far-from-equally-violent/

Gijoel
Gijoel
3 years ago
LLama
LLama
3 years ago

I, too have a dad who´s drifting to the right – especially since reaching the point where he´s getting viewed as an old man and doesn´t get taken as seriously as he once was. He seems to feel like all those people who aren´t just like him are taking the world away from him, instead of wondering why he thought the world was his in the first place. And it makes me so horribly sad because we only see each other a couple of times a year and I don´t want to spend that time arguing. But I definitely even more don´t want to give him a chance to pretend his ideas are normal and above reproach by not calling him out. Because then I´d end up losing my childhood hero.

Robert Kelly
Robert Kelly
3 years ago

Not coming out and denouncing these Nazoids is probably a high-water mark for Trump, one which a lot of establishment conservatives aren’t willing to tolerate any more.

Ted Cruz denounced Trump for this because this was the one thing that he couldn’t let slide, like everything else Trump did from emoluments to the Muslim ban on down.

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
3 years ago

PoM and Oogly, my sympathies. And to all of us who have close relatives who endorse Trump and the scum who cling to him (for me it’s a sibling, but at least they live a long way away and we’re not in touch much).

Huggbees
Huggbees
3 years ago

Gotta give kudos to those GOP senators urging Trump to call this evil for what it is It won’t be enough to get me to vote for them but it’s good to know that they’re not all bad. It’s one thing to have conservatiuve views on some issues but I draw the line at nazism and white supremacy. Adolf Hitler was evil personfied and anyone who things he did anything good for this world is irredeemable in my eyes.

Wolverine's granddad (formerly Kevin)
Wolverine's granddad (formerly Kevin)
3 years ago

Looks like a lot of the alt – right turned up bearing clubs and shields. That does not imply peaceful intent in a civilian context. No wonder the police were less than impressed. My sympathies go out to the injured and the families of those who died, including the crew of the police helicopter that crashed. The only positive I can see in this whole sorry mess is the way American conservatives seem to be waking up to the risk of the dangerous cult Donald Trump is enabling.

Weird (thumper of trumpanzees) Eddie
Weird (thumper of trumpanzees) Eddie
3 years ago

This is what trump was elected for. Please don’t think I’m being dramatic or trivializing the situation when I say this, because I’m not. This is how the revolution begins.

The ongoing temper tantrum that whites have been throwing since the civil war is/has come to a head. The militant white population has been stumping for a fight for years, ever since the civil rights, women’s rights, gay rights movements of the 50’sand 60’s. The bigots believe they and their wants should be centered over everyone else’s. trump’s tacit approval of white fascism has given them reason to believe they are publicly acceptable, and they’re going to exploit that approval. I do not expect any help from the federal DoJ, nor from most of the states or localities.

Oh, fuck, oh, fuck, oh, fuck

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

All those Republicans who are speaking out now, spoke out during primary season and still decided to eventually support Trump even though they knew damn well what he is. Given the high likelihood that once this blows over, they’ll be back to deferring to Trump, I’m holding off on giving them cookies of any kind.

Pavlovs House
Pavlovs House
3 years ago

@Policy of Madness and Ooglyboggles

I’m sorry for the difficulties you face with your family members.

I’ve not had to deal, fortunately, with family members quite in that extreme a situation, but some a few years ago had to deal with some who are conservative and in conversation at family gatherings would like talk about politics and in the course start telling me all about American history, “intent of the Founding Fathers”, etc. etc. — getting their information Sarah Palin and Glenn Beck. I would correct them, citing various primary sources — noting that I had taught an upper-level undergraduate American Revolution class several times, and of course lots of eighteenth-century military history. The best reaction I would get was a kind of sullen stare.

It’s worse when I get the “well, I can tell ya what causes ALL wars. It’s simple. See…”

@PoM

“He thinks of me as being the reddest of red communists because I don’t think capitalism was handed down personally by Jesus.”

Ugh. Aghhh!!! I *hate* having to deal with the conservative anachronistic “holy capitalism” canard. Worse was in teaching a graduate military history class that had a bad tendency to draw in conservative “culture warrior” types, who had thought that by seeking out military history they could find a corner of academia that had not been “taken over by the librul agenduh.” So much of the course was defending the low grade I would give them for writing ill-founded arguments that flew in the face of the basis of historical evidence (and the reading assignments, which they just ignored.)

One guy was stuck on this notion that capitalism and Western powers’ military success were supposedly always linked.

He tried to apply that to sixteenth-century Spain.

Grade was not good.

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