Tiki Nazis march against white genocide, mosquitoes: Today in Tweets Early Edition

@Axe

Hey, how are you? Sorry I never got back to you before when I said it’s on white people that more don’t work on their internalized racism; I was writing fast and I think I actually meant to say “implicit racism”. It’s on white people that more don’t work on their implicit racism. Or giving this thread, their completely explicit fucking asshole racism.

“THE ANSWER IS, OF COURSE, YES, BUT THE AMOUNT OF SHIT WE SHOULD GIVE IS MASSIVELY DISPROPORTIONATE TO THE AMOUNT OF SHIT WE ARE ASKED TO GIVE.”

I could get behind that.

“The problem I, and everyone else, has with ‘economic anxiety’ is that it’s intentionally a distractionary tactic.”

Sometimes it is a distractionary tactic. Sometimes it’s a dogwhistle. Sometimes it’s a relevant and legitimate discussion of a relevant problem.

“STOP TELLING ME I NEED TO DEVOTE MY SYMPATHIES TO CLETUS’ IMPENDING FORECLOSURE WHEN DESHAWN CAN’T LEAVE THE FUCKIN HOUSE WITHOUT BEING IN DANGER OF DEATH BY COP”

If I had to devote my sympathies to either Deshawn OR Cletus, of course I would devote my sympathies towards Deshawn, since Deshawn’s well being is in more immediate danger. In much the same way that I would devote my sympathies towards Deshawn even when Emily can’t get a promotion at the computer repair shop. Not getting a promotion doesn’t endanger Emily in the same way that death endangers Deshawn. Deshawn is the most pressing problem, by far.

I just don’t understand why we can’t devote our energies towards Cetus AND Deshawn in the same way that we devote our energies towards Emily AND Deshawn. I guess most of our arguments can be boiled down to just that.

And which brings me back to this point; why are we letting Nazis co-opt this issue?

@Oogly

“If I smoked for 50 years, and did it to spite anyone who asked me to stop, even knowing that my smoking is harming others far more than it does me, and even enjoying the fact that others are harmed by my second hand smoke, and then developed Lung Cancer, I don’t think I’d have anyone else to blame but myself.”

Blame blame blame.

I guess the doctors won’t treat my lung cancer, or the lung cancer of my family members. My family shares a genetic background with me after all.

@mrex,

Sometimes it is a distractionary tactic. Sometimes it’s a dogwhistle. Sometimes it’s a relevant and legitimate discussion of a relevant problem.

Which is it in the case of a discussion about Nazis taking over America?

(Answer: it’s a distraction from the topic, to cover for their coup)

And what’s the purpose of an argument about ~economic anxiety~ in the middle of a discussion about those Nazis taking over America?

(Answer: it’s a fucking diversion from the topic, covering for their coup)

Is there a discussion to be had about the economic troubles in the Rust Belt and the South, specifically on poor white people? Sure. Should we sit down in our recliners and have that discussion while the Fascists march on Charlottesville? Fuck no.

As for why we can’t care for both Cletus and Deshawn – Cletus is the one beating Deshawn on the ground with sticks in Charlottesville. You no longer have the luxury of caring for both. Pick one.

Deandre “Dre” Harris.

That’s who I care for, right now.

Know who I don’t give a flying fuck about? Dan Borden and the other two white fucks that split his head open. Fuck their “economic anxiety”.

The only thing I want to hear is all three of them being denied bail, like that asshole Field was.

How fucking dare they.

In the run up to the election I might have given some credence to the economic anxiety argument. Then Jeremy Paxman did his documentary.

He went to a rust belt town. There was a family who’d been made bankrupt and now both wife and husband had two low paying jobs each to make ends meet.

Paxman went to the small steel works where the guy worked and asked him and his co-worker friends why they were voting for Trump.

“Gays have got marriage now but they still want more”

“You cant say some words any more”

Honestly, that was it. Someone with better net skills than me can probably find the relevant clip.

@Scild

“And what’s the purpose of an argument about ~economic anxiety~ in the middle of a discussion about those Nazis taking over America?”

To be fair, I didn’t bring it up. Although I certainly bear the responsibility of keeping it going from Axe and EJ and kupo.

“(Answer: it’s a fucking diversion from the topic, covering for their coup)”

No, it’s a way to weaken white support for civil rights and to split the left.

If we force Cletus to believe he has to choose between protesting Deshawn’s murder and eating/supporting his children, the moral thing might be to sacrifice himself and his kid’s wellbeing for Deshawn’s life, but it’s not the human thing to do.

Point is; the whole thing is a false dichotomy anyway.

“Cletus is the one beating Deshawn on the ground with sticks in Charlottesville. You no longer have the luxury of caring for both. Pick one.”

If you are going to use Cletus as a metaphor of an economically anxious white then it’s not fair to have him beating Deshawn in Charlottsville. Most economically anxious whites aren’t active Nazis. And even if you boil all economically anxious whites down into racist Nazi Cletus, Emily in that case is also most likely a racist Nazi. I’m not going to stop fighting sexism, and most likely, neither are you.

@WWTH
“it is a completely dishonest to claim that the Democrats or the progressives don’t talk about economic issues.”

We could have a discussion about how effective Democrats have been in that regard, but that’s neither here nor there.

” They both seem to think that if we’re not discussing their particular pet issues 24/7 that we must not care about economic justice”

That’s not it. It’s the hostility I see toward’s Cletus’s economic issues that’s really the issue.

Missing the cutoff…

@Alan

“In the run up to the election I might have given some credence to the economic anxiety argument. Then Jeremy Paxman did his documentary.”

Problem is that it’s not just race/gender/sexual orientation but race/gender/sexual orientation AND economic anxiety. Read the article I linked to Valentine.

Look, I’m queer, AND a woman, AND a single parent on the dole. These people probably would love to string me up to a fence and leave me to die. I wish I could just reduct it all down to “Nazi”, but I can’t.

@Axe

“It’s not about what we can do. Again, it’s what we’re being asked to do. Reusing a rhetorical device,”

“Economic anxiety” was a thing long before this shit all went down. “States rights” and “ethics in game journalism” were not.

“I don’t know what the fuck you think you’re doing, but you can have a seat. As many seats as you can stretch yourself across.”

Fine.

Let me restate what I said to Axe.

“Economic anxiety” was an issue long before Nazi’s co-opted it for their own use. “States rights” and “ethics in game journalism” never were real issues to begin with.

That’s the difference between co-opting something legitimate to weaken your political opponents and between just inventing some complete bullshit just to dog whistle to your fellow Nazis.

We could have a discussion about how effective Democrats have been in that regard, but that’s neither here nor there.

Lets see. When they discuss the facts and the numbers, they’re “pointy headed intellectuals” that “Nascar dads and Joe the Plumbers” don’t want to have a beer with.

When they use emotional language and attack the Republicans, they’re soooo meeaaaan. Even though it’s okay when Republicans do it. Because reasons.

When they go Republican-lite in an effort to not scare away the bigoted traditional family values vote, they vote R anyway because why vote for the fake Republican when they get the real thing. The one who’s dead serious about bigotry family values.

When they say “forget the angry white guy and Evangelical vote” and try to build a coalition of everyone else instead, then it’s horrible because the poor, poor white menz and the bigoted economic anxiety voter aren’t being catered to. So they vote R. That’ll show us for being so mean.

It’s almost like the media and political establishment have an interest in protecting the status quo and are going to sell the narrative that progressives are hateful and out of touch with “real” Americans no matter what we do.

Since you seem to have found the way out of this knot and know how to attract the “economic anxiety” conservatives without completely throwing every marginalized group under the bus in the process, do tell. What would be effective? Don’t just tell us. Tell the DNC and DCCC too! I’m sure they’d love to hear the one neat trick to healing the nation!

Seriously though. What’s it going to take before people who vote for the leopards eating your face party actually are held accountable for the fact that they don’t have a face? How many times are they going to vote for the rich white guy who doesn’t make their lives any better, but does make the lives of marginalized people worse before they have a light bulb moment and realize that maybe they should make a different choice?

I’m pretty fucking sick of being blamed for other people’s choosing to be useful idiots again and again and again and again. They’ll either change or they won’t .

I suspect that the core argument is “we should worry about ~economic anxiety~ because calling them racists and bigots just shuts down the conversation.”

People with economic anxiety come in all colours and stripes. I’ve had good conversations about it. One of them has turned out to be an increasingly virulent alt-right supporter. Nothing I say to him about economic issues has or will budge him on racism or sexism. Listening to him get angry about how high his taxes are (they aren’t) or how he isn’t paid what he should be won’t fix this. Agreeing with him that our economy’s screwed up beyond belief doesn’t change the fact that he thinks we should stop accepting immigrants, and should let the Syrians die in their own country. Or that he thinks the problem is due to “political correctness” and “hiring quotas”.

I’ve shown him studies that show that immigration improves economies, and the economic standings of those communities with immigration. How immigrants reduce relative crime rates. How lowering taxes doesn’t fix economic issues outside of specific scenarios.This isn’t an abstract problem that he can be reasoned out of. They’ve seen those arguments, and they’ve already discounted them as being products of “liberal science”.

I don’t know how to tell him that he should have empathy for other human beings. But I do know that no amount of sympathy for his economic anxiety will make him change his tune. I tried that. It doesn’t work.

It’s damage control time. Protect people getting run over, getting beaten, getting shot. Make sure everyone’s safe and aware.

Also, @mrex, best of luck to you, too. I know what being a single parent is like – my sister’s in a very similar scenario and she’s had some really rough times.

Please consider that the fact that your anxiety about money could be colouring your perspective on why they’re acting like they are! That’s a primacy effect that brains have, similar to the “projection” phenomenon. Your brain projects your feeling onto others. It’s a function of how the brain works. Please consider that this may be happening to you!

Also @Axe, thank you for your comments over the past few weeks. I feel like I’ve woken up a bit over this while, and your comments are in no small part responsible. Thank you.

?

@WWTH

“Since you seem to have found the way out of this knot and know how to attract the “economic anxiety” conservatives”

You say they’re “conservative” like every last one of them is not just following whatever tide benefits them most. Surely you’ve noticed how inconsistent their beliefs are. Many are opportunists, not philosophers.

“do tell. What would be effective? Don’t just tell us. Tell the DNC and DCCC too! I’m sure they’d love to hear the one neat trick to healing the nation!”

Sure!

Stop jumping into bed with the face eaters, and stop demanding cookies for not being Nazis.

Because the Republican’s aren’t the largest face eaters, the banks and coorporations behind them are. Just because the republican’s do far more damage doesn’t absolve the Dems of who their friends are.

@Valentine

Go and watch 5 seconds of conservative TV and it’s all about how Democrats are wolves. Watch liberal TV, and it’s all about how conservatives are wolves. Everyone’s convinced that they’re the sheep, and the other side is all wolves.

And meanwhile the real wolves dine from the shadows.

[Edit]

@Schild

“Please consider that the fact that your anxiety about money could be colouring your perspective on why they’re acting like they are! That’s a primacy effect that brains have, similar to the “projection” phenomenon. Your brain projects your feeling onto others. It’s a function of how the brain works. Please consider that this may be happening to you!”

Hey. Point taken.

And meanwhile the real wolves dine from the shadows.

Oi fuck – it is not about liberal and democrat. I didn’t write that. Read again what i wrote – they make you scared of those things, or maybe already you scared and then racist politicians who already exist are solution to this things.

There are no wolves in the shadows. This is nonsense, something like i would say when i am 13years old and think there is ‘secret government’ – there is no. Government just shit and corrupted and full with greedy people.

It is obvious how they make you scared. No one scare of democrats – and i didn’t say that. No one votes for republican or trump because they scared of democrats​. You misunderstood me.

Missed the cutoff

“Also, @mrex, best of luck to you, too. I know what being a single parent is like – my sister’s in a very similar scenario and she’s had some really rough times.”

Thanks. 🙂

Things are actually going well enough for me right now financially, well I certainly feel better than a few months ago. Lot’s of people aren’t so lucky though, and lets see if I can still say that 6 months from now. 🙂

Also, I’m in therapy again thanks to you and POM. Thanks to you both for holding my feet to the fire. Actually, I should thank literally everyone here just for having to put up with me.

But enough about me. 🙂