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MRAs met with Education secretary Betsy DeVos, because this is the world we live in

Betsy DeVos: Have you ever REALLY looked at your hands?

The Summer 2017 WHTM pledge drive is on! Donate generously to enable our continuing coverage of dudes who consider themselves oppressed by women! Thanks! 

By David Futrelle

UPDATE: DeVos met with MRAs Thursday; here’s what she told reporters afterwards.

The Trump administration has given a lot of fringe political weirdos a certain not-quite-legitimacy. We’ve seen “alt-lite” conspiracy slinger and bobblehead salesman Mike Cernovich given White House press credentials; meanwhile, Twitterbanned right-wing pseudo-journalist Chuck Johnson seems to have become entangled in one of the developing Trump/Russia collusion scandals, working at the behest of a longtime Republican donor (now deceased) who was apparently willing to drop big bucks to help Trump by somehow uncovering Hillary Clinton’s deleted emails.

Now a notorious Men’s Rights group — the National Coalition For Men — will be meeting with Education secretary Betsy DeVos to discuss the campus rape epidemic that MRAs claim doesn’t exist. DeVos will also be talking with rape survivors and college officials, but the fact that the NCFM will be part of the discussion is appalling, even by Trump administration standards.

Despite its long pedigree (it’s been around since 1977) and almost respectable-sounding name, the NCFM has, I would estimate, roughly as much legitimacy as a civil rights group as the Men’s Rights hate site A Voice for Men or the Men Going Their Own Way subreddit. Which is to say none.

Indeed, the NCFM site clutters its sidebars with videos from the likes of AVFM founder Paul Elam and antifeminist gadfly Girl Writes What, while the main page touts articles accusing feminism of destroying the family, suggesting campus “safe spaces” are “havens of misandry” and asking “is feminism killing young boys,” with the last article written by a regular contributor to AVFM.

The group has also won a certain notoriety in feminist circles for posting pictures of alleged “false accusers” on its website. I also ran across this lovely picture and caption on the NCFM site last year, illustrating a press release on Senator Patrick Leahy and the Violence Against Women Act.

From the National Coalition For Men website.

As I noted at the time, “the Joker is [apparently] supposed to represent Leahy’s supposed feminist puppetmasters; regardless, it is a jarring image depicting violence against an elected official as somehow humorous.” If you can’t quote believe that a supposed civil rights group would run such a thing, well, make a quick visit to the group’s website; the picture is still up. (I’ve archived it here just in case.)

This is hardly the only time the NCFM or its officials have offered, well let’s just call them disconcerting takes on the issue of violence.

In an interview with Pacific Standard’s Ted Scheinman a couple of years ago, NCFM president Harry Crouch offered this take on Ray Rice, the (former) football player who knocked his then fiancée out cold with a punch famously caught on video.

I’m not saying he’s a good guy. But if she hadn’t aggravated him, she wouldn’t have been hit. They would say that’s blaming the victim. But I don’t buy it. And anyway football is always happy to put on pink suits to celebrate women. Why can’t they have a week, or just one day, where they celebrate men?

It’s no wonder that  Jess Davidson of the group End Rape On Campus, told the HuffPost that she considers the NCFM a “hate group.”

“They have viciously and very intentionally harassed rape survivors online by exposing their identities and posting pictures of them,” Davidson told the HuffPost. “From our perspective, they really have no place in a conversation about civil rights.”

DeVos will also be meeting with representatives of the group Stop Abusive and Violent Environments (SAVE), a group the Southern Poverty Law Center once described as devoted to “roll[ing] back services for victims of domestic abuse and penalties for their tormentors, while working to return the focus to the ‘true victims of abuse’ — the falsely accused.”

SAVE has long worked hand-in-hand with hate site AVFM to fight for men they believe have been “falsely accused.”

The meeting is scheduled to take place July 13th.

It is not known if any bears or their representatives will be attending the meeting.

H/T — Thanks to everyone who sent me links on this story

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Big D
4 years ago

I don’t expect my comment to be accepted given the nature of this site. But I felt compelled to express support for this gal. I was initially critical of her. Thought she was standard GOPe. Then I found out she donated to FIRE (Foundation for Individual Rights in Education). Now this! She seems like a quality female. Her husband, Dick DeVos, not only has a great name and great wealth but also seems to have found a woman worth marrying. Play on playa.

I’m MGTOW and don’t expect MRAs to achieve much since we still have the 19th amendment in effect. Maybe we’ve got a genuine NAWALT billionairess running the Department of Education…

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
4 years ago

@IP, you are da best. You deserve all the success with your new path, and I know you’ll work hard to get it! Also, really good interview!

@Eddie,

I’m reminded SO MUCH of the early-mid 1970’s, after the military draft ended, watching the white men who had been active in the anti-war movement diddy-bop off into middle-class-ness, forgetting any pretense of having common cause with non-white draft resisters, with poor people, with non-whites struggling for civil rights.

To a large degree I think that you’re reminded of them because they’re the same people. I mean, there’s certainly a huge swell of younger middle class white assholes involved, but the bulk of baby boomers and their fellow travelers can’t be forgiven.

As for Cruella DeVos and her minions up there, I mean, jeeby-creeby, what can you say about that. The only cogent response is to scream into a pillow.

Im’a go back to developing SkyNet. There’s no way it’ll do a worse job than these jerks.

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
4 years ago

@Diego,

http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0537/4221/products/drinkware-bleach-mug-1_600x.jpg

I read that graphic comment on David’s twitter feed, and, yeah. humans.

Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
4 years ago

@ all, apologies for earlier rant, I am NOT doing well….

On the bright side, I am taking a class at a nearby college. i haven’t taken any classes for a while due to co$$t, a 3-hour course at the local Uni is over $1000, and at the school I’m now accepted (yaaayyyyy) at, over $800…. However, I’ve learned that my advanced age allows me to audit courses for FREEEEEEE!!!! That being more affordable, this fall I’ll be in a night course, Cultural Anthropology, taught by a dear friend who is also the only intersectional feminist left in my circle.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

Nice on IP. Congrats and best wishes in your future endeavours.

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

@Petal
Congrats! Nothing wrong with getting started later. I’m 38 and just got my degree 2 years ago. I would not have done well in college in my 20’s, anyway.

@Weird Eddie
If you’re comfortable with online courses you can audit a ton of them for free at edx.org. I’ve done one and am currently doing a second.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

The Republican party has gone out of its way to be the party of anti-science and anti-intellectualism. It shouldn’t come as a surprise that people who are intellectuals for a living wouldn’t be terribly attracted to the GOP. People who believe in the bullshit the right peddles (global warming denialism, young earth creationism etc) in the first place aren’t qualified to be teaching at universities. Except those unaccredited religious schools like Bob Jones or Liberty.

Rhuu - apparently an illiterati
Rhuu - apparently an illiterati
4 years ago

@IP: That was a great call, you were super clear! Thanks for sharing. And CONGRATS on your acceptance!

@Still Fiqah: omg, what did I just read? That is something for sharing, because how would anyone deal with that by themselves?

But incels are all about self improvement, right? /s

@Weird Eddie: You are right, of course. Once something stops affecting people, people will often stop caring. Even though it’s still a thing that still affects others. Humans just suck, some times.

Katz
4 years ago

Late, but congratulations, IP!

History Nerd
History Nerd
4 years ago

Liberty University is accredited, so I’d guess the faculty secretly really wanted Bush or Kasich. You have to look at the unaccredited distance learning schools to find die-hard GOP and Trump supporters.

Lots of racist evo psych people voted for Clinton somewhat reluctantly because they couldn’t support Trump or the GOP (some voted for Gary Johnson as a protest or didn’t vote). For reference, Charles Murray (yes, The Bell Curve co-author) said he could never support Trump, in part because Trump denies global warming and he’s totally out of control and thin-skinned.

Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
4 years ago

@ Kupo;

If you’re comfortable with online courses you can audit a ton of them for free at edx.org. I’ve done one and am currently doing a second.

Thanx, and I have no prob with online courses, I’ve taken a bunch and that’s good for when I’m after the knowledge… but what I need now is the human contact, in a setting where progressive views are not prohibited!!

I’m concerned about the psychological toll* the trumpocalypse is taking on me…. I’m hoping a semester of “lefty” learnin’ will help me mentally.

*note, I’m not a member of any oppressed group, and I’m not denying in any way the privilege I have as a cis-het white man.

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
4 years ago

Speaking of education issues and the GOP, our current POTUS just informed people that France is one of our oldest allies because he thinks “many people don’t know that.”

Falconer
Falconer
4 years ago

Congrats, IP, and good luck, Weird Eddie!

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Victorious Parasol,

I hate to say it, but Trump had a point there. During the run up to the Iraq war, when France was not on board with it, so many Republicans pulled the whole “French people would be speaking German if we didn’t save them from the Nazis” schtick all the time. Whenever somebody said that to me I would come back with “we might still be a British colony if weren’t for the French” and that would always end the argument right there. Never underestimate how ignorant people are.

I’m not giving Trump too much credit though. He was probably only all excited about that bit of trivia because one of his advisers just told him about it during his prep for this meeting.

Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
4 years ago

@wwth;

remember “freedom fries”…??

@kupo;

I would not have done well in college in my 20’s,

I started college straight outa high school… my GPA my first year started with a “0”….

Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Agent of the FemiNest Collective; Keeper of a Hell Toupee, and all-around Intergalactic Meanie
Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Agent of the FemiNest Collective; Keeper of a Hell Toupee, and all-around Intergalactic Meanie
4 years ago

First off, congratulations IP for the new career!

Second, a distraction from the horrors Still Fiqah stumbled across: Evidently the National Parks Service has a project called All Americans’ Stories, documenting the histories of assorted ethnic groups. They have African American, Latino, Asian, Native American, European, LGBTQ, and Women categories up. Seems to be pretty through, too. Sports, art, health, the whole shebang.

https://www.nps.gov/subjects/tellingallamericansstories/whoweare.htm

Might be worth a look-thru, if only as a distraction from Twitter horror.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
4 years ago

I was about to mention ‘freedom fries’ myself before refreshing and seeing it had mentioned it already.

Of course, another thing people forget is that the French Revolution happened not long after the American Revolution, and the overextension by the French monarchy while supporting the Americans (in order to give the British a black eye) was a significant part of the reason…

Katz
4 years ago

Hey, did you guys know that changing “frankfurters” to “hot dogs” was the World War I version of “freedom fries?”

Sheila Crosby
4 years ago

Congratulations @IP!

I couldn’t help giggling at Milo’s book sales. My self-published, local interest book (a guide to the local astronomical observatory) has sold over 1,000 copies and I’m doing it all alone and clueless about marketing.

Brain bleach for the incel thing:
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History Nerd
History Nerd
4 years ago

So, in recent news, Harvard says it will take disciplinary action against students who join private gender-exclusive clubs or organizations like fraternities or sororities (they probably need to ban sororities also to avoid getting sued). Private gender-exclusive clubs were already “blacklisted” in the sense that members couldn’t hold student union office or receive certain scholarships.

It’s probably a positive change because fraternity culture is so toxic that all the attempts to reform it have failed, including requiring fraternities to practice co-ed membership.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
4 years ago

@Katz:
That doesn’t at all surprise me. The city of Berlin, Ontario got its name changed during World War I for similar reasons. It became Kitchener, Ontario to show our solidarity with the British.

(The University of Waterloo has a microfilm newspaper archive that tracks the Waterloo Region Record back to the Kitchener-Waterloo Record, the Kitchener Daily Record, all the way back to when it was still the Berlin Daily Record.)

dslucia
dslucia
4 years ago

@Big Troll:

Even beyond the laughability present in the content of your actual comment, I just have to ask, why do you guys always need to make everything about your boners? Nobody cares about your “d”.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
4 years ago

Thanks everyone!

I’m celebrating with ice cream. 🙂

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
4 years ago

@Big Disappointment

I don’t expect my comment to be accepted given the nature of this site

Just the latest in the extensive list of things you’re wrong about!

Her husband, Dick DeVos, not only has a great name

It’s like the world’s saddest penis learned to type…

and great wealth

😒

Play on playa

You… don’t know what that means, huh?

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Big D is giving me seagull eater/MRAL vibes for sure.

Anyway, that tweet. It reminds me of the body horror movie Contracted. A man has sex with a corpse and becomes a carrier for some sort of disease that’s like a cross between zombism and leprosy. Then he rapes the main character at a party while she’s half passed out drunk. She gets this disease and her body starts falling apart. In the sequel, the disease starts spreading all over LA.

Scildfreja Unnyðnes
Scildfreja Unnyðnes
4 years ago

Oh hey, an MRA in the backlog. And they’ve got a website listed, let’s see what that’s about!

Youtube channel link, huh? Okay, that’s cool. Let’s see what’s in there. I – well, okay. The “New Videos” list starts with “Romance & Female Fantasy”, a Nazi caricature of a jewish person wearing a pink toque and feminist tattoo, a banana on strike, a rainbow nazi flag with Stars of David and pentacles, and a Virgin Mary statue demanding worship for giving birth.

… @Big D, honey, you aren’t really puttin’ your best argument first here! Here’s a hint for you: if the page is about women’s stuff, but all of the pictures are models and memes? Proooobably not an actual portrayal of women’s stuff.

Bonus points for the picture of the “10 things only Red Pill men know about women” video, though. Men are a single on-off switch, whereas women are a control panel with numerous variables. That’s a bit of a self-own, sir! I rather resent your portrayal of men – men are complex too! And they’re very worthy of being treated as fully complex beings instead of as simple on-off switches.

You also said words, but… ehh. You haven’t really said anything worth replying to. Do feel free to comment more, though. I’ve been filing my teeth.

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Hambeast, disorderly she-tornado and breaker of windows
Hambeast, disorderly she-tornado and breaker of windows
4 years ago

Congrats, IP!

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Still Fiqah – I’m so hoping that’s a Poe because, just…

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Virgin Mary
Virgin Mary
4 years ago

@big d

Hi Big D. Thanks for coming on here, it must be nerve wracking for you as an MRA to enter the lions den. Well done. Please stay civil and play nice tho won’t you?

A couple of questions. You seem to admire Mrs DeVos. That’s a start at least, no matter how confused politically she is, you have expressed admiration for a woman. Please don’t refer to her, or anybody else as a ‘female’ again, we aren’t Ferengi.

Now, Big D, assuming that women are actually human, and the same species as you are, can I ask you, if you woke up tomorrow as a woman, still being you, your same personality and mentality, how would you feel about people like your MRA friends? Would you be happy to be treated the way your role models suggest women should be treated? If they were talking about your mother or daughter, would you still agree with them?

I’m asking this because, I feel that MGTOW/MRA culture revels in its lack of empathy, in its ”othering” of those groups of human beings you have taken exception to. Is it possible for you to step outside yourselves for once and see how you really appear to others, and to the people you wish to own, subdue and control?

Thank you in advance for being rational and reasonable, and have a good evening, Big D. 🙂

Zatar
Zatar
4 years ago

How insecure do you have to be to make even your username be a reference to your dick?

Still Fiqah
Still Fiqah
4 years ago

@Mish: I sat there with my jaw hanging in disbelief. I kept waiting for it to turn Swiftian. It never turned Swiftian.

@kupo: I was trying so hard to keep it to myself, and be strong…nooooope.

@Falconer: When I tel you I desperately called on every listening God in the vicinity to kill that post with fire…

@dslucia: CONSTANTLY.

@Dan Hoan: This is a sold self-care plan.

@Diego: It makes one physically ill. Their self-loathing is breathtaking.

@Rhuu: I really did try to just wrestle with it alone. I failed.

@Hambeast: I’m afraid it really is just what it looks like.

Y’all, in future, I promise to follow terrible things like that with hours and hours of videos of puppies and kittens trying to climb into the same oversized Christmas stocking.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Bonus points for the picture of the “10 things only Red Pill men know about women” video, though. Men are a single on-off switch, whereas women are a control panel with numerous variables.

That’s a secret that only the exalted and wise red pill men know?

90% of sitcoms and stand up comedy are based on the stereotype that men are simple and up front creatures who only know and care about sports, beer, red meat and sex while women are mysterious and emotional and do uptight and no fun things like expecting their husbands to remember their birthday or pull their own weight with the housework and child care.

Scildfreja Unnýðnes
Scildfreja Unnýðnes
4 years ago

@WWTH, a great sign of the Dunning-Kruger effect in action is repeating something blatantly obvious as if it were some sort of profound truth.

JS
JS
4 years ago

@Big D, “She seems like a quality female.”

Why did you think that was a good way to put that supposed compliment? If someone were to refer to you, and say, “He seems like a quality male.” are you seriously saying you think that’s a good thing to hear?

You’re implying that you think she might be a quality female, but might not be in the future. People NOTICE these kinds of compliments for what they are. They’re not compliments.

FIRE is a stealth conservative organization, part of the standard GOP trick of pretending to be neutral, while almost entirely championing conservative causes, and mostly ignoring liberals unless they further the conservative agenda. Finding out that DeVos donated to such an organization is not an indicator of being a good or bad person. Just means she donates to conservative causes that pretend to be neutral.

Makroth - wild west firecracker window-smashing soap-averse unionized cowboy Jacobin from Hell
Makroth - wild west firecracker window-smashing soap-averse unionized cowboy Jacobin from Hell
4 years ago

Big D is apparently youtuber Turd Flinging Monkey. I’m familiar with him. I wish i wasn’t. His name tells you everything you need to know.

Viscaria the Cheese Hog
Viscaria the Cheese Hog
4 years ago

@IP, congratulations and good luck!

@troll

She seems like a quality female.

If only a man would call me a “quality female” once in my life, I would die happy.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

I’m not a man, but if you want me to call you “quality female” I will!

Viscaria the Cheese Hog
Viscaria the Cheese Hog
4 years ago

Generous as always, but I’m afraid it’s just not quite the same! Haha.

dikdik
dikdik
4 years ago

TW/CW Rape/Sexual Assault/Trauma

One of my friends tweeted about her work as a sexual assault survivor advocate. I think most people have no idea what a survivor has to go through to even file a complaint.

https://twitter.com/rue_walker/status/885503292867977217

And if their experience is anything like mine, after the police treat you like a criminal and manipulate you, then you get to testify in a room full of strangers who then roll their eyes and call you a liar to your face. And then the judge implies you are making everything up & are a bad person ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I honestly cannot get over DeVos meeting with these people. How absolutely dare she. And how dare any one support her or Trump. But I’ve also been around long enough to know people don’t give a shit about survivors & would rather be as far away from them as possible.

Ivory Bill Woodpecker
Ivory Bill Woodpecker
4 years ago

Congratulations to Im. Petal! May the Ascended Madoka bless you!

I did not read that Twitter thread. It sounds like those of you who did read it could use this:

http://i.imgur.com/SSa9QpW.jpg

Big D
4 years ago

@JS

“If someone were to refer to you, and say, “He seems like a quality male.” are you seriously saying you think that’s a good thing to hear?”

Yes. We should all aspire to a higher standard. Part of my personal path in life is helping other men channel their dominance instinct into self-improvement and self-actualization. Western civilization used to value, respect, and reward quality. Unfortunately, we’ve now adopted a slave morality that punishes people of quality while exalting victimhood.

PeeVee the (Perpetually Ignored, Invisible but Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Perpetually Ignored, Invisible but Noice) Sarcastic
4 years ago

Very late to the party, but:

CONGRATULATIONS, IMAGINARY PETAL!!!!
🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Big D,

As someone who identifies as an MRA, do you want to help and support male victims of abuse or rape?

If so, can you please explain how cutting services to abuse victims and making it harder to report and making rape less likely to be investigated helps to achieve these goals.

Just to clarify here, the VAWA, despite having the word ‘women’ in the title doesn’t only fund woman exclusive organizations.

Viscaria the Cheese Hog
Viscaria the Cheese Hog
4 years ago

Unfortunately, we’ve now adopted a slave morality that punishes people of quality while exalting victimhood.

There is too much to unpack in this scant 15 words, especially for me as a white person, so I’m just going to point out that you’re associating slaves with poor morals. Not slavers. Not the institution of slavery. Slaves. I’m afraid that on those grounds I’m going to have to declare you to be a male of poor quality.

Laugher at Bigots, Low-T Inbetweener Weener

Unfortunately, we’ve now adopted a slave morality that punishes people of quality while exalting victimhood.

This is the standard conservative lament, dating back long before the “alt-right”. I’ll bet that Birchers said that in the same breath in which they said that the Civil Rights Movement was a Communist programme for revolution in America. But I wasn’t a conservative back then. I was a conservative from 2008 to 2014, and I’m familiar with this lament from complaints about “political correctness”, which is descended from “cultural Marxism”, which is a silly anti-Semitic conspiracy theory. It all comes back to bigotry, doesn’t it?

@Viscaria:
Anyway, I didn’t even catch the slave thing. I was focused on the dog-whistle “people of quality”, probably meaning “white people, particularly middle-to-upper-class cishet Protestant white men and ‘their’ (also middle-to-upper-class cishet Protestant white) women”. And for catching what I missed, I (for all my opinion matters) confer upon you, Viscaria, the title of “quality female”.

Viscaria the Cheese Hog
Viscaria the Cheese Hog
4 years ago

http://m.quickmeme.com/img/27/273fe8631cf4f18e104ba9d066caa11bac641cedbd5656d5f14a51796c3e352e.jpg

The most flattering compliment a woman can hope to receive!

@Big D: 1) The fact that your name and a colon together make a dismayed face is very appropriate 2) I feel I should clarify, in case you are a very literal person, that we’re being sarcastic. Nobody wants to be called a quality female. It’s dehumanizing and gross and reveals your misogyny.

Big D
4 years ago

@Viscaria

Race has nothing to do with it. See ‘On the Genealogy of Morals’ by Friedrich Nietzsche. Also explained here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhaaVeYmWM4

Racism and others forms of tribalism are used to divide men against each other and preserve gynocentrism. MGTOW isn’t about race. Futrelle does a poor job of accurately representing MGTOW on this site. His focus on the MGTOW subreddit, as opposed to high quality MGTOW content creators such as Human http://bit.ly/2vjeIGp or Marcus http://bit.ly/2uXS7jh , may be good for cheap laughs but he’d serve his readers (and more importantly himself) better by engaging with more than just the low hanging fruit.

Ooglyboggles
Ooglyboggles
4 years ago

@Big Disappointment

Racism and others forms of tribalism are used to divide men against each other and preserve gynocentrism.

Hey dirtbag, I’m Chinese Vietnamese, don’t you fucking tell me what is and isn’t racism.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Nietzsche

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Why, why, why does every misogynist, racist and classist libertarian douchebag have to hide behind Nietzsche? It’s sooooo boring. Do try to be more original.

Also, I clicked on the links and what do you know? It’s all argumentum ad YouTube.

comment image

No one is going to waste hours of their life listening to YouTube bloviations. MGTOW and MRA know this. It’s like a contemporary version of the Gish gallop. They won’t cite real studies or link to essays, articles or blog posts we can skim through to get to the meat of the argument. They link to hours and hours of endless rambling boring videos instead. We can’t refute what we haven’t engaged with. They can say they won because we’ve very reasonably refused to play.

Laugher at Bigots, Full Blown Future Heretical Frankist Whistleblower Neo-Hippie Resurgent

I am returned! Behold my new form, O bigots, and weep!!

@Viscaria: Glad to be of assistance. (:

@Big D-bag (because nobody will name himself after his opinion of his penis who’s not a douchebag): I hope you are aware that we’re not here to debate you. We’re here to mock you. Some here will debate you out of the goodness of their hearts (or because they’re bored). At this point, I’m not among them. I’ll not click on a bald YouTube link, especially not without private browsing. I don’t care to read Nietzsche right now. You are free therefore to retire to your little hole in the ground and add another to your tally of ~FLAWLESS VICTORIES~ and ~FEMINIST CRINGE COMPILATION~ and ~FLAWLESS VICTORIES OVER CRINGEY FEMINISTS~. Neither I nor anyone else here care. (If any of you does in fact care, speak now or for ever hold your peace.) Please do, and leave us alone.

Viscaria the Cheese Hog
Viscaria the Cheese Hog
4 years ago

@Big D

Race has nothing to do with it. See ‘On the Genealogy of Morals’ by Friedrich Nietzsche.

You know, Sparky, I don’t actually believe anyone can evoke the concept of slavery in 2017 without bringing racial baggage with it, and I don’t believe I’m the best person to navigate that baggage. But jsyk, associating poor morals with slaves would be shitty regardless of racial context. If People X have all the control over People Y and you think to yourself: “Gee, I bet it’s because People Y are morally inferior,” that is bad.