By David Futrelle
Today’s MGTOW of the Day, fresh from the Men Going Their Own Way subreddit, has a rather unique perspective on the relative values of men and women. As he sees it, women are vastly inferior creatures whose only value stems from the fact that they can er, carry seed.
Men, by contrast, are … buses.
I’m not sure MGTOWs have quite mastered the fine art of the metaphor yet.
@Alan
If by main you mean one of the most hated contributors ever, yes he was. He left over a month ago and still gets brought up mockingly. People like gambler often get accused of being fake-cels, i.e. being too attractive to actually be incel and only posting in order to get attention. Now, inceldom isn’t literally real in the first place so that doesn’t really make sense but I’d still say they’re closer to MGTOWers than the regular incels.
So you’re saying he’s not actually from Scotland?
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/Incels/comments/66zl91/just_lol_you_copecels_calling_the_gambler_chad_ft/
He’s cleary a controversial figure on there, but I’m afraid I’d have to dispute your assertion he’s not representative or some sort of outlier. He has a significant amount of support.
The other thing, our parties do have “party platforms” that they pretend to follow, but specific members are generally free to claim whatever they like about various issues, so there’s hardly ever a “Republican position” that holds for all Republicans. Frequently the position will change. (Same with Democrats, etc.)
There were 5 different choices for type of Republican on their recent “2017 Congressional District Census” party fundraising mailing.
I get them because I voted in the Republican primary primarily to vote against Trump. Felt that ANY Democrat would be better than Trump, and it’s not illegal yet to pretend affiliation, and I can switch primary voting party yearly if not sooner. I do hate our primary system. That plus “first past the post” election equals “two major parties, rest are mostly meaningless”.
Still with the Brad Pitt! Dude is 53, guys. Move on.
Katz, the old ways must be continued.
@Alan
I can’t point to any specific examples right now because of the sub going private but people really hated him for spamming the sub with whiny rants (I know, I know) and pictures of himself. Even in that quote you posted the guy is telling everybody to stop picking on Gambler because believe me, people picked on him like crazy. He wasn’t well-liked or supported.
Anyway, I still think there’s a difference between the irrationality of r/incels and the irrationality of MGTOW. MGTOW always came across as the least self-aware segment of the Manosphere to me. I think it’s inherent in their belief that they’re some kind of social movement of men consciously making the decision to forgo women and disengage with our “gynocentric” society. It is almost breathtakingly far removed from reality.
Also, I was going to point out Gambler was Greek, not Scottish, before I realized you were referring to the no true scotsman fallacy. I’m dumb.
Poor DThrillard.
Before Brad Pitt’s marriage blew up in Brad’s face, DThrillard really, really tried to keep a woman happy. A woman, some woman, any woman. The woman next to him in line at McDonald’s, for instance. He refrained from calling her a bitch even though she looked evil.
No. If Brad can keep Angie happy, I can keep a woman happy.
But now that Angelina Jolie has ditched Brad fucking Pitt (their marriage was all that DThrillard had going for him), DThrillard isn’t even going to try.
I hope that Angelina Jolie is happy right about now.
What kind of world are we living in where “literally stupid, irrational, inferior human beings” aka seed carriers are allowed to congregate at bus stops and just let these shiny motorised exemplars of public transport go by, without a care?
@PeeVee, for some reason your comment reminded me of the ending of Thelma & Louise (I know, bit of a stretch). Did you ever see French & Saunders’ parody of that scene?
Also, no, you will not throw yourself under the mgtoe. We will go catch a train xxx
Poor DThrillard.
Before Brad Pitt’s marriage blew up in Brad’s face, DThrillard really, really tried to keep a woman happy. A woman, some woman, any woman. The woman next to him in line at McDonald’s, for instance. He refrained from calling her a bitch even though she looked evil.
No. If Brad can keep Angie happy, I can keep a woman happy.
But now that Angelina Jolie has ditched Brad fucking Pitt, DThrillard isn’t even going to try.
I hope that Angelina Jolie is happy right about now.
@afro
dude, you seem nice but it’s like telling us “oh these misogynists aren’t like THESE misogynist.” How is that totes cool in your book?
Like, why are you here to defend the incel community? You aren’t gonna sway us. Like, hang out and contribute! But don’t bring that ole story here.
I didn’t bring it up! Someone else asked me and I answered. Besides, I tried to bring it back to the topic of MGTOW. I get that my introduction to this community wasn’t the best but I’m just trying to stay on topic.
No one is ever going to convince me that a community that thinks men with small wrist circumferences can’t get laid is in any way rational and self aware. Even setting aside all the misogyny and entitlement in incel, that alone kills all credibility.
TW: eating disorders and also TMI of the gross variety
Even when I was in the worst stage of my ed, I knew that weighing myself before and after taking a laxative shit so I could get my true bloat free weight was just absolutely ridiculous and not at all sane. These guys seem deadly serious about the wrist size thing.
@ afroway
What criticism there is though is personal. It’s based on him being too attractive. It’s a gatekeeping objection.
However his assertion that women are illogical/irrational, unlike men, was of course received favourably.
I’d suggest that’s not unsurprising as that’s a common tenet of that incel community. Certainly that’s what I’ve seen when I’ve delved in there anyway. And whilst I accept I haven’t made an in depth study, I’d argue the sample size of posts I have seen is large enough to infer it’s reasonable to extrapolate from that.
Sorry about the double post.
It seems that nowadays when I delete a post or edit it, the original remains.
David F., do you want to look into this issue?
@ Tosca
Nope! Not these guys though. The whole ‘feeeeemales are only seed-carriers’ argument stands for them until they are given sex robots and artificial wombs – our supposed downfall. Then we’re all official useless in their eyes because to them, we can’t do anything positive, productive or innovative.
Oh! Oh! I know this one:
Bloody men are like bloody buses –
You wait for about a year
And as soon as one approaches your stop
Two or three others appear.
You look at them flashing their indicators,
Offering you a ride.
You’re trying to read the destination,
You haven’t much time to decide.
If you make a mistake, there is no turning back.
Jump off, and you’ll stand there and gaze
While the cars and the taxis and lorries go by
And the minutes, the hours, the days.
Wendy Cope, ‘Bloody Men’
I really think we should get off the whole incel topic because it just makes it seem like I’m trying to make things about me again.
I do want to say though, imagine if you went to pro-ed forums back then. Is it conceivable that you would indulge in that insanity, even if just for a little bit? Because that’s how I see r/incels. Now, there’s a huge difference between an unhealthy forum for people with eating disorders and one for people with the kind of issues you see on r/incels. One mainly hurts themselves while the other also hurts women and plays into a larger culture of misogyny. But I believe the mechanics are the same. Take that wrist size thing for example. I don’t think I ever commented on that while on r/incels but I do in fact feel insecure about my wrist and hand size. Do I know it’s ridiculous? Yes, I do. But the insecurity is still there. In the right context I can definitely see myself bring it up unironically. As a way of indulging in that insecurity, instead of the combatting I usually do.
And @Alan, I’ll grant you that a lot of the criticism of Gambler was also personal but as someone who has posted over on r/incels a lot I can honestly say that the MGTOW refrain of “women are all irrational/illogical unlike men” wasn’t heard all that often. Partly because incels have a pretty hostile attitude towards non-incel men as well.
To bring it back to the topic of MGTOW, I guess it could be that the people posting there are as aware of the illogical nature of their ravings as I was/am. Maybe we’re just seeing them when they’re indulging in every irrational thing they might feel. But they’ve created such a detailed fiction about male superiority and this oppressive gynocratic society that self-awareness almost seems unfathomable. Add to that just how obvious the projection and contradictions are. I mean, that comment by DThrillard seems like pure concentrated sour grapes.
@Allan
Why… do they do this… to themselves.
@viscaria
I do this to myself. I know its not good. Its terrible and I have to fight it a lot especially when I’m lonely. I can’t imagine doing this in a forum, or to another person.
I’m imagining in 50 years they’ve got his skeleton in a chair like Kryten in that one episode of Red Dwarf.
http://reddwarfquotes.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/crashed-ship-crew-red-dwarf.jpg
Thanks, Alan! It is SUPER exciting!
@Katz
Congratulations on that book!
@afro
Yeah I can’t ignore how you defend a misogynistic community.
@weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
Same here.
OT:
Does anyone know a program or addon for Mozilla Firefox that blocks youtube videos? The old one no longer works on youtube and I can’t seem to find an addon like Video Blocker anywhere.
You don’t have to talk about anything you don’t want to talk about, but I find it creepy that you were defending a community that’s full of misogyny in one thread and then coming into another thread as if that never happened and you’re just another commenter.
If you insist on posting here on topic, I’m going to continue bringing up that you’re an r/incel member because the idea of you trying to worm your way into this community makes me a bit uncomfortable.
I don’t know if other people feel that way. I only speak for myself.
@Mish,
Noooooo, I haven’t seen that, and I can’t find it on YouTube, either! ?
French and Saunders were brilliant, though. So, so funny.
Don’t worry, I wouldn’t throw myself under a bus for anyone, actually. Though a train adventure with you sounds fun!
@Katz, I wonder if in 50 years they’ll have finally gotten over their obsession with Brad Pitt as the Ultimate Alpha Fuckmeister?
I didn’t intend to defend the incel community but I can’t blame either of you for your reaction to me being here. I guess it can’t be helped. All I can say is that I’m not trying to worm my way into this community nor do I have sinister ulterior motives. I’ll contribute when I think I have something to contribute to the topic on hand. All I can hope for is that my contributions speak for themselves and that they never make anyone feel uncomfortable.