Last week: Outraged by Kathy Griffin. Today: Wants London mayor impaled on a pike

@Viscaria

You’re trying to take this somewhere it wasn’t going, but sure, let’s try it. Perhaps the white person is a not an easily offended person and instead of insults says “oh? how is that racist? what would you suggest?” There would still need to be an explanation of some sort between the two. The attitude is bad in both of those imaginary people.

This is like my friend vs. other commuters on the metro.

Him: “That woman was oblivious to her surroundings and blocking foot traffic, so I asked her to move, but she didn’t hear, so I moved her out of the way, and she went off on me about how dare I lay my man mitts on her, blah blah blah… doesn’t she realize that civility is the only thing that is stopping me from punching her?!”

Me: “Look, she was oblivious and rude. But you’re a guy. And a lot of women are apprehensive of guys. They react as if the default of you is dangerous, especially if you touch them without their prior notice, even just to gently move them aside. From her perspective, you’re the one being rude.”

Him: “But her perspective was wrong. And her actions made me more dangerous to her by making me angry!”

Me: “Everyone one the metro is the victim of overcrowding and the system, please don’t take it out on each other. You all just need dinner so you’re not so aggravated.”

Him: “I guess so. But her attitude was the opposite of good for that situation.”

Me: “So was yours.”

Him: “I guess I am hungry.”

This happens all the time in every imaginable context. I have trouble seeing what is wrong with trying to talk about the mechanism of it when the source of disagreement is perceived racism.

Perhaps the white person is a not an easily offended person and instead of insults says “oh? how is that racist? what would you suggest?” There would still need to be an explanation of some sort between the two.

Why does the unintentionally racist person need an explanation in this scenario?

@Axecalibur, regarding the colonization map:
And, of course, the situation is even more messy than that map could say. (I grew up on Vancouver Island, which was part of a four-way fight for a while between Russia, Spain, Britain, and the nascent U.S.A. Britain may have eventually won, but there are still a number of Spanish names in the area. The area between Vancouver Island and the mainland is the Strait of Georgia on the east side, and the Strait of Juan de Fuca on the south and west sides. Though apparently Juan de Fuca was actually Greek, even if he was sailing on a Spanish ship…)

Though apparently Juan de Fuca was actually Greek, even if he was sailing on a Spanish ship…)

Huh. I’ve been through those waters many times and always assumed he was Spanish. There are some interesting historical sites on San Juan Island (probably on the others too, but that’s the one I’ve explored) if you’re interested in reading plaques about the battles and want to come stateside to see them. 🙂

@kupo

Because he just asked for the explanation. I imagine if racism is not intentional, then the person who did it really doesn’t understand why what they did is insulting and needs it pointed out to them and given some alternative wholesome way of expressing his welcome of the foreign footballers to his nation.

Granted, the hypothetical black person doing the pointing out is not obligated to offer alternatives, but an explanation (if asked for in a genuine fashion) seems okay.

When people ask me, even sarcastically, “oh, don’t all Russian people drink vodka and wear furry hats” I usually inform them that no, not at all. Half the time they even know that they are now being an ass, but they have like no other stereotype to fall back on to cosplay Ivan. But anyway, I’m actually being facetious now. If someone says “oh, don’t all black people live in trees and eat bananas,” that should be a cue to stop talking to them forever. It is now clear evidence that they are a racist smartass.

@SFHC

Obviously I meant future racism. Perhaps I should have said “future racism along those lines potentially diminished” to be crystal clear.

But if you want to try and patiently educate someone, go ahead. There’s nothing inherently wrong with doing that. There are even certain contexts in which it might work. Although I think it’s actually pretty rare. Usually when people are asked politely to cut out a racist behavior, they’ll just whine about political correctness or how pointing out racism is the real racism. But remember, that you have a lot of privilege as someone who is not the target of the racism. Educate away if you like, but don’t ask other people to do it, particularly not people of color.

I complain before to Axe about my dad but he probably only person who ever listen to me when i tell him his joke racist and change his behaviour. He little bit losing his mind now because he older so i worry that he now saying things he was able to think inside before and always was racist asshole. But i think i already seen change in his attitude since i talk with him last time i meet him. I hoping soon i can talk about his homophobia with him and also his obsession with grand children from me and my girlfriend. But it gave me hope. He old guy and he still learning and listening. And to me! I wierd one of our family )))

@Valentine

My parents are both having problems with their memory along with other age related issues, much like your father, and it’s a fucking nightmare.

It’s like being in fucking Groundhog Day: The movie.

Someone here complained about how I repeat myself a lot and it is an acquired nervous tic I picked up from having to repeat shit to my parents every time about everything.

I genuinely feel like I’m losing my already tenuous grip on reality.

Sometimes I just want to drive away and buy a plane ticket to somewhere outside of the states and never speak to either of them again, ever, but my mother would physically die because I am her caregiver.

I am basically my father’s caregiver as well but he pretends he’s independent.

@Valentine

Thank you. Admittedly, I used to have a normal life a long time ago before this happened.

People in the US hate it when you take care of your parents, too, which makes things worse. The average fuckwit around here would ask me why I didn’t join the army, get dem military paychecks, and just put both of my parents in a retirement community, or sell all of my fucking belongings, or become a sex worker or something equally grim just so that I don’t have to be a caregiver.

Plus, they’d shit on me and say I deserve to have to do this because I’m not a degreed professional.

So I’m stuck in this awful circumstance. New York recently made college free, though, so perhaps I can eventually become a degreed professional and have enough money to hire an in home nurse or something to take over from me.

I have basically forgotten how to be normal and have normal conversations.

People in real life that I speak to remark about my tendency to repeat myself as well.

It is intensely weird here. I have to do all kinds of odd routines or my parents get upset. It’s stressful. There is nothing normal about my behavior around them.

And I have to stifle my real personality and pretend to be cisgendered and heterosexual to avoid shitstorms.

I know how to cook and clean and housekeep because that’s part of my role as a caregiver.

I am afraid I’m gonna give myself fucking disaasociation by doing this. I am also sexually frustrated because this scenario doesn’t really allow me to be by myself and have relationships with others.

Basically everything is terrible and I am having a terrible time.

I don’t like to complain about this because I feel like my circumstances ain’t that bad, you know? It’s not like I’m in a warzone in Syria getting my butt shot off – then I’d actually have something to cry about.

I like their logic and consistency, accusing all islam of being medieval and barbaric, not just a part of it, dunno wahabism or various other caveats, then advocating medieval and barbaric torture and punishment.
Also calling for indistincted persecution of people on ethnic base, deeming all of them evil and guilty by association, in this case, all muslims, despite evidence of the contrary, is more or less what Isis calls for western people, indistincted hate.
Plus let alone Trump policies of foraging and arming the very people who spreaded the extremist message across the world, Saudis (by financing confessional schools, sending wahabi imams), and isolating Iran and now even Qatar scapegoating them as the real terrorist supporter, is quite orwellian, while pretending Saudis are those actually invested in fighting it O_o.
Sorry if I repeated myself on this.

Fuck what happen to my last comment?

The Blockquote Mammoth ate it. That’s okay. It just means you are truly one of us. Gabba, gabba we accept you.

Fran, I hope you will take care of yourself. Sacrificing yourself for a parent shouldn’t be a Thing. Even though a mighty empress such as yourself would be a hellaciously powerful gift for any altar. Okay?

As someone recently mentioned, they didn’t expect Trump to help their case by testifying via Twitter, but… thanks anyway!

Re: Caregiver burnout. I just hope the Secret Service has a good rotation schedule for the Agents that have to secure the President. Poor guys/gals must need time off frequently with this one.