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Trump Open Thread: June 2017 End of the World Edition

Say hello to a soggier world!

With Trump pulling the US out of the Paris Climate Agreement like the huge idiot he is, today seems like a good time for another Trump open thread.

Have at it! No trolls or Trump fans.

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Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

I’m passive aggressive, but yet the people that I’m “passive aggressive” towards (POM) told me that I should start a business and go back to school when it shouldn”t be unreasonable to assume that I can’t due to finances/responsibilies.

I have literally never said you should do this/should have to do this on your own resources. Try again.

It’s no wonder this conversation has gone the way it has, when you aren’t reading what other people say and are responding to what you imagine people are saying.

mrex
mrex
3 years ago

@WWTH

Well, that’s part of what she said to me. Now read the rest from my POV, based on what I’ve said in the rest of the thread. In particular the part I actually criticized her for.

Question, how could I have criticized her statement, without criticizing her ? I think many wonderful things about POM, (and you BTW, and even SFHC to the extent if I push aside all her bullshit), but if I had mentioned them, it would have just seemed dishonest. So basically, never criticize anything she says no matter whether it’s hurtful or problematic?

I guess sorta like how I’m supposed to allow myself get attacked without attacking back.

@SFHC I see we’re back full circle to Hillary. Did you get to vote last November? Because it seems to really burn your ass that I am a woman,.and I got to vote for Hillary, AND I can still hate her along with with all the other pompous male politicians.

See, that’s the difference between opinions and facts. Opinions can differ. Even over the worth of a female politician. You can think she’s the greatest thing since sliced bread, and I can think she’s two-faced along with all the other Democrats, male and female, who want to thumb noses at “Economic Anxiety”.

Can’t say the article was all bad, though.

But Hillary’s voters, like Obama’s, are angry—and remain so. Injustice tends to make many of us furious.”

Yes, I AM boiling with rage. And it’s been building for 20 years, even when I was quiet, pliant, and smiling because I was part of the “good team.”

“Still, we can’t express ours, [anger] either. When we do, we still, even now, get shut down by trolls online, fight with neighbors and friends and family, are sometimes even harassed by strangers.”

Gee, that is EXACTLY. HOW. I. FEEL.

“They weren’t fooled by Trump’s fascism disguised as “populism.” They recognize misogyny when they see it, having lived with it all their lives. Who talks to them? Who listens?”

The correct answer is no-one.

mrex
mrex
3 years ago

@POM

“I have literally never said you should do this/should have to do this on your own resources. Try again.”

Yes, you said that I should use resources that aren’t there for me. Because you really want them there for me. Wanting resources to be there for me, is apparently the same thing as having them there for me.

Are you reading anything I say?

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Yes, you said that I should use resources that aren’t there for me.

Where?

Quote it.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

“Deaf people are not incapable of understanding things like whether a candidate is working against their best interest as this statement implies.”

Holy fucking shit that is grasping. I’ll give you that it was angry, and shitty, but do you rack your brain over every single one of my posts, just to look for the worst possible way to interpert it, just so you can pat your back about what a monster I am?

This is not fucking grasping. It’s literally what you said, that you may be stupid but you’re not deaf. Like being deaf makes you incapable of understanding that concept.

I’m going to assume you’re completely unaware of the history of oppression of deaf people, and explain a few things to you. First, it was assumed up until very recently that deaf people were incapable of complex thought as they couldn’t use spoken language. They were treated like they had an intellectual impairment because hearing people couldn’t be bothered to learn how to communicate with them.

The ableism against the deaf is even evident in our language. Look at the word “dumb” for example. Look at the etymology of it. We literally use the inability to use spoken language as a synonym for a lack of intellectual capability.

Before you try to claim it doesn’t mean that anymore and deaf people are treated just fine today, I’m only hard of hearing and it only ever comes up every few months, but boy when I can’t hear someone they attack me and treat me like shit for it.

Look, when someone points out that you’re being an asshole to a group of people your response shouldn’t be to assume they’re looking for ways to attack you. Especially not around here. We don’t throw around terms like ableist as a weapon, we use them to educate. Stop using “deaf” as a fucking insult. You’re actively hurting D/deaf people when you do that.

PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
3 years ago

I thought this thread was supposed to be a no-troll thread.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

@PeeVee
We brought it up with David before but he doesn’t feel mrex is a troll.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

Yes, you said that I should use resources that aren’t there for me.

Yes, please do quote where I said you should use resources that aren’t there. As opposed to saying it would be more helpful to wish the resources were there, and maybe work toward that becoming a reality, rather than wishing that more shit-paying factory jobs were there instead. “I wish there were more shit-paying factory jobs” seems to be all you have to offer.

Christ almighty, you are just determined to be up on that cross, aren’t you?

BTW, it turns out that “economic anxiety” is bullshit and not the reason people voted for Trump, because 2/3rds of Trump voters aren’t economically anxious.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/06/05/its-time-to-bust-the-myth-most-trump-voters-were-not-working-class/

PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
3 years ago

@Kupo, I see.

I guess being disingenuous and misrepresenting people isn’t necessarily limited to trolls.

Ah, it doesn’t matter.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

@PeeVee
This is a no Trump supporter thread and she’s arguing a lot about how Trump was so much better at speaking to the factory workers, though…

PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
3 years ago

@Kupo,

I live in the rust belt.

He didn’t even come up to where the rusting hulks of the mills and the refineries are.

Clinton did, though.

Fuck Trump and his lying fucking bullshit about how he resonated with these workers that he didn’t even bother to visit, because again, Democrat enclave. He didn’t do dick for them, and he won’t.

Remember the boats I was talking about earlier? Trump had one, too. In Gary. One of the hardest hit cities in the nation. That he didn’t bother to visit. Because he cares SO much about factories and mill jobs. Right.

I’m so done with this shit.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

I agree with you. I’m saying mrex might have stepped over the line enough to warrant a ban. I’ve already tried in the past so I’m not going to bother, but you could contact David if she’s crossed the line for you.

PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
3 years ago

Kupo, gotcha.

PaganReader - Misandrist Spinster

C

[snip]we have to work to survive.

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/210/119/9b3.png
Wow! It must be my Democrat elitism that meant I didn’t pick up on the fact that we live in a capitalist hellstate that requires exploitation of the poor to function!

[snip] my POV

Your POV that you are the biggest victim ever and that we’re all big ole meanie pants who hate poor factory workers in general and you in particular? /Sarcasm

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

I wanna plug Louisville again here. 20,000 to 30,000 unfilled jobs in Metro, and more if you include the rest of the MSA. Relocating is not easy and not the answer for everyone, but if it can be the answer for you, definitely give it a thought.

(I’m sure mrex will read this and once again interpret it as me saying LET THEM EAT CAKE so I will preemptively state that I don’t care what mrex thinks of this suggestion.)

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

Also, as far as retraining goes there are free resources available, like Edx which offers many courses for free and others way cheaper than you’d find at even a community college. Now, time and energy are of course limited resources and it’s a lot harder to get hired without a degree even if you can demonstrate skill, but it’s something to consider if you’re interested in learning a new skill but can’t afford a degree.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
3 years ago

So, uh. Massive news: It’s just been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that the voting machines were hacked. Hillary won.

Trump’s already responded in the most dictatorial way possible by arresting the woman who proved it and siccing his fanbase’s rape-threatiest members* on her social media accounts, but I think the bigger issue is convincing the media to give a shit about any of this.

*Because they’re all dicks, you see.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

@SFHC
I was 95% sure of that when I saw the results pouring in on November 9th. Still angry, but not even a little surprised.

IgnoreSandra
IgnoreSandra
3 years ago

I already considered that to be the most likely reality, or even if the machines themselves hadn’t been hacked that the Russians influenced the election through hacking in active collusion with the Neo-Nazis.

Even without this, it is past time for time to be up for them.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
3 years ago

So… Now what? Impeachment isn’t enough anymore, since the presidency would just go to another cheating Republican loser; by all rights, the whole fucking election should be voided instead. But is that even constitutionally possible?

Francesca Torpedo, Femoid Special Forces Major
Francesca Torpedo, Femoid Special Forces Major
3 years ago

Fully Automated Luxury Gay Space Communist revolution?

Dalillama: Irate Social Engineer

@Fran
Sounds good to me.

Dalillama: Irate Social Engineer

Per Fran’s suggestion in another thread, I’ve taken the liberty of creating an unofficial WeHuntedTheMammoth Discord server:
https://discord.gg/FJ2seEc

Since David’s not going to be contactable through it any faster than by email, the primary purpose of this is a place to take discussions to specific subchannels when some folks want to keep them up and others want them to not happen here. Moderation will be erratic, since it’ll happen when I’m not busy with other things. Also, I’ve never used Discord before, so there may be a learning curve.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

What is Discord? Is it video chat? I clicked on the link and it seems to be an alternative to Skype but I didn’t register yet so idk.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
3 years ago

It seems to be just an ordinary chatroom thing, like AIM* back in the day… Either way, I’ve registered. I’m using one of my other offsite usernames for now since I don’t think it’d let me call myself “Fucking,” but correct me if I’m wrong! =P

*My age, I am showing it.

EJ (the Scheming Liberal Race-Traitor)

Before you use it, be aware that Discord is reputed to make its money by harvesting your internet usage data – including that from any browser windows you have open while it’s running – and selling it to social-media companies.

Discord themselves have responded to this rumour by putting out an elegantly-worded statement which doesn’t actually deny that they do this.

YMMV.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
3 years ago

No Fallout smutfics while it’s open, then. Got it.

I haven’t been able to sleep for three bloody days and it’s starting to screw with my head, help me.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

Seems a lot like #slack. Anyway, I’ve signed up. 🙂

EJ (the Scheming Liberal Race-Traitor)

@SFHC, do you need a friend? I can be available in about an hour when I get home from work.

PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
3 years ago

SFHC, I am so sorry; I know what that is like.

All of my sympathy.

kupo
kupo
3 years ago

@SFHC
I missed that earlier. All my sympathy, that’s never fun. Can you see a doctor? When my insomnia got bad a doctor helped me a lot.

Grace of Spades
Grace of Spades
3 years ago

@SFHC

I hope you can sleep better. Most of that is the massive online crush I’ve had since I first started reading this blog (your troll shutdowns are epic), but a good portion is sympathy for a fellow insomniac.

numerobis
numerobis
3 years ago

SFHC:

So, uh. Massive news: It’s just been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that the voting machines were hacked. Hillary won.

It’s been shown that the NSA believes that there were hacking attempts.

It hasn’t been shown that they succeeded, and even if they did, it’s not clear vote tallies were changed, and even if they were, it’s not clear the election result changed.

The opposite hasn’t been proved either.

Lissa
Lissa
3 years ago

@ weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

“People are making the assumption it’s still the case and will be forever when technology is advancing so far and fast that workers being replaced by machines now is a legit worry. But people are really in denial about it.”

The public is also in denial about the impact that environmental change will have on the whole world, and an aging population in most of the developed world. Frankly, I’m terrified of the future. I’m 30, I’ve got a lot of years left to live, but I know that things will get ugly in the future.

Hilaryforpres
3 years ago

So you idiots dont want to acknowledge that this so called treaty will cost our country and have such a minor effect on the environment. That is according to the data that the paris treaty was handing out. of course ,people like havent been relevant for 20 years giraldo Rivera are complaining about having to swim to the deli. And stuttering, confused sounded Governer Jerry brown is proclaiming the end of the world. stupid liberal sheep.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
3 years ago

stupid liberal sheep.

Hilaryforpres

Hmmm.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

The troll’s name links to Yahoo. That just says it all.

Ooglyboggles
Ooglyboggles
3 years ago

@Hilaryforpres
Yahoo? Ya no.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
3 years ago

There was another recent troll who put Yahoo as his homepage – one of Mark’s socks, maybe? – but unfortunately it’s not something I can Google. David, can you check that or not?

PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
PeeVee the (Timber-Rattling Booger Slut, But Noice) Sarcastic
3 years ago

Hey, dumbfuck Hil? If you don’t know the difference between a “treaty” and an “accord”, maybe you should learn before flapping your gums about things you don’t have any knowledge of.

Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time.

Governer. LMFAO

mrex
mrex
3 years ago

Alright, took a break to clear my head.

@POM

“Christ almighty, you are just determined to be up on that cross, aren’t you?”

Not really. Believe it or not, I actually consider myself fairly blessed. But I’m not going to pretend that the shitty shit in my life isn’t shitty, and I hope no-one wants me to.

And yes, the reaction to me was pushback. I was (I AM) angry, my anger bled through, and people reacted to that, as they should have. I felt attacked and attacked back. When angry I will assume the worst, and no, I’m not justifying it. I should know when to shut my mouth and when I should go take a breather.

I may not have intended to call you a classist, but my angry attitude did. I may not have intended to talk down to people, but my angry attitude did.

Intention isn’t shit.

“Yes, please do quote where I said you should use resources that aren’t there.”

Well, it was my interpretation of what you said. Which was…

” As opposed to saying it would be more helpful to wish the resources were there, and maybe work toward that becoming a reality,”

If we are wishing for, and working towards, resources being there, then it seems reasonable to assume that they’re not universally here today. So, what is happening to the people who are unemployed today, and whom are currently falling through the cracks today? (I’m honestly asking here. I really would like to hear your thoughts. Honestly.)

The thing about shit-paying factory jobs is that it seems like something can be done about them TODAY. Or, at least we can stop, or slow down, their disappearance TODAY. Fixing our social safety nets, and changing the economy and jobs, are long term goals, in that they don’t seem like problems that can be solved TODAY, especially not as this country reddens.

It only takes hitting the ground once for “rely on X social safety net” to become an absolutely terrifying phrase. In the end, I think WWTH was right; Americans hate capitalism in practice. Problem is that right now many in the working and middle classes have lost faith that the social safety net will catch them*, and when you combine this with the racism that already runs deep throughout this country, well the results are terrible.

“(I’m sure mrex will read this and once again interpret it as me saying LET THEM EAT CAKE…”

Not at all, because you said that not everyone could do it. My problem with the other statement was that it seemed like a blanket statement that everyone needs to just get new jobs, and that’s that. That’s not possible for everyone.

Louisville does sound lovely.

“BTW, it turns out that “economic anxiety”; is bullshit and not the reason people voted for Trump, because 2/3rds of Trump voters aren’t economically anxious.

Ok, for the sake of argument, let’s say that most Trump voters did not vote for Trump because they were economically anxious. (And we can agree that being economically anxious certainly doesn’t excuse voting for Trump, anyway.) “Trump voters are not economically anxious” means that “economic anxiety” is bullshit…how?

“Economic anxiety” is a thing for anyone living with economic insecurity, which in our wonderful country, is just about everyone, Democrat and Republican alike.

@Kupo

“I’m going to assume you’re completely unaware of the history of oppression of deaf people, and explain a few things to you.”

I was unaware that deaf people were ever considered unable to form complex thought. Honestly, it doesn’t even make sense that people would assume that. People (me) are assholes.

I’m glad that you took the time to explain the history to me, because I certainly see where you’re coming from, and I certainly am an asshole.

I am in the wrong. Full stop.

“I’m only hard of hearing and it only ever comes up every few months, but boy when I can’t hear someone they attack me and treat me like shit for it.”

Holy fuck that’s terrible.

“Also, as far as retraining goes there are free resources available, like Edx which offers many courses for free and others way cheaper than you’d find at even a community college.”

Never heard of it. That was a really helpful post. Thank you.

“she’s arguing a lot about how Trump was so much better at speaking to the factory workers, though…”

I’m not a Trump fan. Literally the only good thing I could say about Trump is that he understood how desperate many in the working and the middle class feel. HOWEVER, he’s never bringing back, or keeping, jobs. He’s never helping us, because it’s not beneficial to the rich to help us. If the Democrats could just stop shooting themselves in the foot, we would be golden.

@Everyone

You guys said that you took into consideration the economic pain that changing an economy to be more environmentally friendly brings, and I believe you all. However, I have a few concerns/questions. I hope I can move past my (hopefully past) assholeishness and have a productive conversation. I look forward to reading everyone’s replies! 🙂

1. Global warming is real, and will (and does) cause deaths. That is 100% a problem. However, slowing global warming in a way that causes job loss is not bloodless. Unemployment causes tens of thousands of suicides a year. This is a proven statistic. It causes thousands more deaths due to things like loss of health insurance, and an increase in alcoholism, among other things. This is also not considering things such as deaths from water pollution from fracking, and other unintended consequences from moving away from coal.

So in what way can we minimize deaths, from any cause?

2. General observation; I’m always a bit weird out when we focus on coal when most of our carbon emissions come from cars. Seems like maybe we can slow the loss of jobs and still cut carbon emissions by focusing on American car culture. (Yes, even in rural areas).

3. The US has an enormous problem with outsourcing it’s pollution. The US has the the means to have some of the cleanest manufacturing and energy production on the planet. The places that we outsource to often don’t. American outsourcing alone has caused some of the increase in global warming and other forms of pollution.

As I said before, NIMBY. Who cares about the smog in other countries as long as the air in Pittsburgh is relatively clear? The only way to stop this worldwide is to stop consuming. Maybe thus is a worthy goal, but it’s not one that I’m holding my breath for.

*Republican’s fault.

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