In the wake of the Portland train stabbings that left two men dead and one seriously wounded after they tried to stop a white supremacist from harassing several women, Paul Elam — still probably the best-known Men’s Rights Activist online — posted a tweet that spoke volumes — not about the incident itself, but about the utter moral bankruptcy of the Men’s Rights movement.
https://twitter.com/anearformen/status/868917239143178240
When other Tweeters objected, Elam doubled down and began spewing insults — aimed not just at his critics but at the murdered men themselves.
https://twitter.com/anearformen/status/869066210964631552
https://twitter.com/anearformen/status/869068999577006080
In one tweet, he suggested that the victims themselves were the cause of the violence that left them dead.
https://twitter.com/anearformen/status/869064408252772354
In his capacity as a leader of what is essentially a hate movement, Elam has said many terrible things over the years — from his post suggesting that women who go home with men without wanting to have sex with them are “damn near demanding” to be raped” to a short story offering an apologia for — indeed, a glorification of — domestic abuse. These tweets, I think, rank up there with his most reprehensible writings, for two main reasons.
First, as many observers have noted, it was not “chivalry” that killed these men. It was an angry and hateful man with a knife who was harassing women on a train.
Elam thinks it unfair that the tenets of chivalry call upon men to protect women — why should men have to serve as unpaid bodyguards for women, he has often asked? What he doesn’t like to talk about is that these volunteer bodyguards aren’t protecting women from bears — there aren’t a lot of those in my neighborhood — but in the overwhelming majority of cases from other men.
There are a lot of problematic things about “white knights,” as Elam insists upon calling them, but the plain fact is that the “good men” that Elam castigates as terminally stupid would be out of a job if there weren’t so many bad men around harassing and abusing women.
Second, and perhaps more importantly, Elam is essentially declaring war on the very thing that sets us apart from brute nature — our ability to feel empathy for others, including people unlike ourselves. A man standing up for a woman who’s being harassed may or may not be engaging in an act of chivalry but it is certainly an act of altruism and basic human solidarity. It’s driven by the same empathetic and altruistic impulse that led so many non-Muslims here in the US to rush to their nearest airports to protest Trump’s Muslim ban.
This sort of cross-cultural solidarity is pretty much the only thing that can save our country from the hatred and meanness that is Trumpism. We need more empathy, not less.
Elam would rather we raise our sons not to feel this sort of empathy towards women. That’s bad enough. But he’s not the only MRA with an empathy problem. And it isn’t confined to his feelings about women.
It’s not just that MRAs are indifferent towards, if not actively hostile, towards women; they lack empathy towards boys and men as well. Indeed, in one notorious post (archived here; I wrote about it here), Elam literally told the “troubled men” who have turned to A Voice For Men for help to ““go fucking bother someone else with your problems” if they weren’t donating money to his site, which is to say him, as he keeps the donations for himself.
Even though he seems to have taken in literally hundreds of thousands of dollars in donations over the years, he’s never bothered to even try to set up, say, a hotline for men. Instead, he’s set himself up as a sort of ersatz internet therapist for men — he has no actual training as a therapist — literally charging the “troubled men” he claims to be an advocate for $90 an hour to talk to him on Skype.
But he’s not the only MRA who combines a hatred for women with an utter lack of interest in doing anything altruistic for their fellow men.
In the first few years of second wave feminism in the late 60s and early 70s, feminist activists set up shelters and women’s centers and countless other entities designed to benefit women in desperate need of help. In the seven years I’ve been covering the Men;s Rights movement, MRAs haven’t even set up a single hotline, much less a functional men’s shelter. The only notable MRA, er, victory? Being so obnoxious they’ve convinced numerous media sites to shut down their formerly MRA-infested comments sections.
It’s no wonder MRAs feel such hostility towards real heroes. They’re only heroes in their own minds.
Well, shit, the thread’s gone and blowed up some more. And Trollman is still around and still making (predictably shitty) excuses for a fucking Nazi who brought a knife on a train, LOOKING FOR PEOPLE TO RACIALLY HARASS AND/OR KILL.
Fuck you with all the Legos, Trollman.
And fuck that other troll too, the drive-by one who picked on WWTH yet again. I think he’s a repeat offender coming back under a new nym, and an obsessive one at that. Fuck you with a cactus, Fiuckra.
eleven pages of comments… eleven… PAGES…. Of comments….
wow… I trust we turned the trolls to stone!
@ Aluma Frendzar Dedd;
I’ve found it eerily fitting that the ‘gate scandal started as an online rant by someone who was jealous about someone else’s sex life (don’t know if it’s appropriate to name namz, most of you know the characters), then spiraled into a pile-on to that person, and then a pile-on to other people, all of whom are women… and it’s now the mantle du jour for ALL the MRAs….
ETA: TWELVE PAGES!!!
@Fran:
I’m really digging that Arkitech track, so I’d be very interested in more stuff like that.
I am loving all the music recs. Keep it up.
RE: Music
I honestly adore rock and roll the most, plus…ballads. Not joking. Literal, actual ballads. Updated for modern language, but still ballads.
As far as game soundtracks go, I adore the FTL soundtrack, and the Avorion one. Something about the techno thing really syncs with me in gameplay.
I also love the Red Alert 2 and 3 soundtracks unironically. Power rock, hell yeah.
And I have a soft spot for the Age of Empires series soundtracks. Reminds me of when things sucked less for me.
On star wars music…I’ve aged out of that. The orchestral score truly fits the film, but for me orchestral music is best when paired with something else. I used to hear Ride of the Valkyries, and other classical music in the old Army Men games and it was kinda awesome.
Probably the thing I’m listening to mostly right now is Joan Jett, because fuck yes her music is amazing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xlks46VyUJw
Is this a good song?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CxxS5F-9LQ
How about this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdjieDtkvLw
Or maybe this?
…This isn’t even half of the versions of this song made by the same guy.
re; music, I love it. Always political music, all my life. I was raised on Pete Seeger’s Rainbow Quest, listening to stuff from the folk music revival of the late ’50’s/early ’60’s.
When my kid was growing up, he turned me on to political hip-hop, Public Enemy (nation of Millions, Black Planet, Apocalypse… yeah…)
Returned to mostly folk now, but still political. My playlist has mostly songs about something… either about oppression or about solution, about history, about science, geography, geology, geometry, even… something I can google to keep my addled brain cranking.
Heard a tune some years back, “Sisters of the Road”, Casey Neill and the Norway Rats, googled the story, and found a community cafe in Portland that serves the undercurrent. When I was in Eugene in the late ’70’s/early ’80’s, some friends from U of O were going to Portland after graduation to help in a newly opened community cafe. Don’t remember the name of the place, but I’ve wondered….
Re: the misspelling issue, I concur, that’s something we need to be aware of, as it can be ableist. I’ve got a mild cognitive impairment, and I misspell quite a bit, as well as simply use the wrong word, it’s very embarrassing at work. I work with a very young group, and they have no concept of not being able to remember, not being able to recognize the error.
ETA: @ Ignore Sandra
If you like ballads, check out Pandora’s “Americana” channel, then tune it to your liking!!
@Weird Eddie: Twelve pages is nothing. We used to get up to twenty pages or more fairly easily. Those threads, you had to cross your fingers going in, because someone was going to quit the site, and it was either going to be a troll or many regulars, depending on what sort of argument was to be had.
It’s calmed down a lot in the last three years, and I for one am relieved.
@ Falconer;
I got here from a Gamergate piece on either Everyday Feminism of Feministing (I think…) right after the thing started. It was three, maybe four years ago. I don’t think I’ve seen one longer than 7 pages, and only maybe one or two of those. This is nice, cuz the thread becomes an interactional conversation, and just kinda rambles, then when one of the trolls comes around, it’s *BAM* *POW* *BIFF*… “ok, now, what were we talking about…?”
@ IgnoreSandra:
I understand!! For a long time, I referred to the 1960’s music as “music from back when there was still hope”…. I’d stopped doing that UNTIL trump CAME ALONG….
@Falconer
@Eddie
I came here about a year ago, got swallowed up by further adventures in depression and self-harm, and then returned.
Thanks again all for the welcomes 🙂
I forgot to say too that I like to read all the comments about history, it’s a fave reading topic of mine (studied tech things).
Have a merry meet from me as well, Z&T.
@ Francesca;
Yeah, I spent some decades (seriously) there, I understand. Welcome back, hugs if you want them. And, as I say in my self-help fellowship, “STAY HERE!!”
ETA: Z&T, welcome! If you like history, there’s some heavy hitters here, ScildFreja, Dalilama O_o, many others.
@Weird
And the gamergate scandal keeps going! Which excludes the argument “We just want corruption in the gaming world to end and for the gaming world to go back to normal” It’s been years and they still won’t let it go.
And yes, 12 pages huh? I tried going through the older posts to see when was the last time there were so many comments and it’s hard to find one.
I’ve been here since GripleeGorb too and there have been a few posts which get up to this level of comments or higher, but they’ve been pretty few and far between. Usually it is instigated by an influx of trolls.
Thanks Francesca!
You seem like a wonderful, original, and creative person to me!
🙁 For the self harm, in the past I take it, and you do seem like a very positive person to me 🙂 You should be, you sound pretty rad!
ETA – And everyone else too 🙂
Many interesting people here, very glad to have found this site 🙂
warning, sardonic/sarcastic post ahead…
Gamergate’s not about ethics in gaming, it’s about dicks in gaming… about people who ARE dicks wanting to make gaming a place where only people who HAVE dicks are welcome.
I have a friend who plays a MMRP online game (don’t know the name, but it has lots of wizards, trolls, dragons, etc), and he plays under two names, one is his nym, the other is a female identfied nym… he makes the exact same moves, and the reactions are polar fucking opposite.
The only game I was ever any good at was Donkey Kong, back when it was a stand-up arcade game you fed quarters to. If I’d used the quarters to invest in Nintendo instead of giving them to Nintendo, I’d OWN Nintendo ;(
Men are in a better position physically (on average) to stand up to other men. That aside, there’s nothing to say the victims were white knighting rather than just helping out other human beings in a way most of us would like to think we would if put in a similar situation.
Re music – going from the usual indie rock/electronic tastes typical of younger people, I got hit by the 70s soul/R&B/G-Funk obsession in my late 20s and ever since (although I couldn’t claim an encyclopedic knowledge).
@Weird Eddie
I’ve gamed less as I got older, but I’d say that my childhood experiences with a Dreamcast and a handful of emulators (plus an SNES emulator for the Dreamcast) are just as legitimate as any dude’s.
And your buddy’s tale just showcases the discrepancies here.
While we’re talking about Japanese Motorsports – another thing I was deeply interested in was the Bayshore Expressway Street Racing scene, which was fictionalized in movies like SHUTO KUSOKU TRIAL and manga like WANGAN MIDNIGHT.
This clip of the Bayshore Expressway has some pretty good J-trance in it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayshore_Route
Some more J-trance.
@Eddie
@Z&T
Thank you!
Honestly, since I discovered my true gender some of my depression has staved off somewhat. I am still riddled with tons of anxiety issues and am probably somewhere on the spectrum.
My parents, in their infinite wisdom, never had me psychoanalyzed as a child.
We have the best people, don’t we, folks? The best words. Bigly tremendous.
@Fran-heika,
I love my new title. It has made my day. Here is a fully grown Mei-Mei plant in return (she likes to curl up in this pot beside me and keep me company when I’m marking assignments).
hey, credits due to another mammotheer who suggested this either earlier in this thread, or in a previous thread…
with humble apologies to the Blues Brothers…
“Troll Man”
Comin’ to ya on on your favorite thread
Gonna misinterpret everything ya said
May seem like I’m really obtuse
But I’m fulla shit as a Christmas goose
I’m a troll man
I’m a troll man
I’m a troll man
I’m a troll man
What you say I never understand
I give insults and I make demands
I got no time to listen to you
But you better see MY point of view
I’m a troll man
I’m a troll… person
Make me leave!!
I’m a troll man
I’m a troll man
Listen
I’m just tryin’ t’ make you see the truth
It’s YOU makin’ ME act all uncouth
Y’know I went to the VERY BEST college
Whatev’ th’ topic, I’m the Book of Knowledge
I’m a troll man 4X
This discussion turns on MY command
Cause I’m WAY UP on my grandstand
What th’ Fuck? I’M being ban….
I… was… a troll man
I’m a troll man 4X
@Weird Eddie
*claps along*
(Heh. Got you picking up my slack…)
@Weird Eddie I so want that to be set to music for some reason. Preferably by Savant… or maybe it could be re-worked into the “Austrian Hymn” tune. (“Glorious Things Of Thee Are Spoken”, “Praise the Lord! Ye Heavens Adore Him”, and the main reason I want an ‘I’m a troll’ song set to it: “Deutschland Uber Alles”)
I do like the tune, Haydn sure could write music.
Do NOT choose any hymns with that tune for Holocaust Memorials.
Oh, good, the thread turned relatively happy after the assholes were banned or fell silent.
…and I have no idea how to participate. Pulled in too many different directions. Oh well, I’ll pick one and stick with it.
Been fairly addicted to the Pokemon Sun/Moon and Killer Instinct 2013 OSTs recently, and I’ve been obsessed with Daisuke Ishiwatari’s works (mainly Guilty Gear and Blazblue) since I first found those games.
@ Fran
Thanks for the music recommendations! I’ve added a bunch of those to my Watch Later list (which is admittedly 400 videos long, but music and shorter videos get watched first). Have to admit, I didn’t realize Happy Hardcore was its own thing; somewhere, I got the idea that it was just a synonym for Nightcore. -_-
Granted, I love Nightcore, and its managed to (re-)introduce me to acts I’d either missed or forgotten about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRp_Z5N0Erc
@ Cynical Optimist
I definitely have to start listening to Dark Souls’ OSTs on their own (the few tracks I’ve heard on Youtube were pretty nice), because the music left bizarrely no impression on me while I was actually playing them. I think it was because there didn’t seem to be many non-boss and non-cutscene BGMs, at least not in 1 or 2, so the silence become too overwhelming.
It was really disappointing, since I learned they were scored by Motoi Sakuraba, who I worship for his work on the Tales and Baten Kaitos series.