It was a busy day on the Incels subreddit yesterday. While some subreddit regulars celebrated the third anniversary of “incel killer” Elliot Rodger’s murderous rampage — they call it “Saint Elliot’s Day” — others lashed out at the victims of a fresh tragedy: the terrorist bombing of the Ariana Grande concert that left nearly two dozen dead, many of them teenage girls.
In a thread ironically titled “A moment of silence for the victims in the UK,” dozens of Reddit’s self-described “Involuntary Celibates” mocked those who died in the explosion, dismissing most of them as “Stacies” or “future Stacies,” using the standard Incel slang for hot “normie” girls who only date alphas.
![throwawaylookism 8 points 22 hours ago I feel sorry for the kids but i have no empathy towards all the stacies that were there. They got what they deserved. permalinkembedsavereportgive goldreply [+][deleted] 10 hours ago (2 children) [–]ASS_F??♂️THOT PATROL?♂️? 2 points 11 hours ago Those little girls were gonna be Stacies in the future anyway](https://i0.wp.com/www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/in2.png?ssl=1)
Some lashed out at Ariana Grande as well.
![pashminascarf❤❤❤❤❤ 19 points 1 day ago All of Ariana Grande's songs are about getting dicked by Chad. permalinkembedsavereportgive goldreply [–]CheesyFedoraHeightcel. Currycel. Dickcel. Total failure. 14 points 1 day ago Yeah seriously. Like her song Side to Side. Fuck that shit. I don't give a fuck about any of the whores who got blown up while listening to that filth.](https://i0.wp.com/www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/inc5.png?ssl=1)
Those who bothered to try to justify their hatred did so on the grounds that “Stacies” — and women in general — hate incels and would be happy to see them suffer or die.
Yes, that’s right. His first response to this horrific tragedy was to feel sorry … for himself. And he wasn’t the only one.
![acenosk 8 points 1 day ago Women would genocide incels if they could. permalinkembedsaveparentreportgive goldreply [–]Beer_GrillsIncel Philosopher 3 points 1 day ago Middle class women were some of the largest supporters of the Nazi party in Germany during the 1930s.](https://i0.wp.com/www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/inc9.png?ssl=1)
A purer example of projection can scarcely be imagined.
Indeed, elsewhere in the same thread, a fellow incel echoed Nazi language in an attempt to explain why the victims in Manchester had it coming to them.
Some of the regulars took out their anger on the Redditor who started the thread in the first place, taking aim at his highly controversial opinion that no one deserves to be blown up in a terrorist act, “not even stacies. We need more love in this world not less.”
As the regulars saw it, this was a pathetic bit of “virtue signaling” from a man hoping that expressing bare sympathy for female victims of terrorism would “get his dick wet.”
(You can click on that last one to see a larger version.)
I can only repeat what I said in my post yesterday about “Saint Elliot’s Day,” that the Incels subreddit may be the scariest place on Reddit. It’s astonishing to me that the people who run Reddit feel it is in their own, or anyone else’s, best interest to provide a forum for such twisted hate speech — a forum that glorifies suicide and self-hatred and encourages the same misogynistic obsessions that led Elliot Rodger to commit his murderous rampage.
It’s not healthy to think that murder is funny, and any ideology that promotes such thinking is deeply destructive to everyone it touches.
Get help, guys, for your sake and the sake of everyone around you.
@piece of shit
I’d like to add some comments to this. I am a woman, and I am (or so I have been told) conventionally “hot”. (or I was, until I got everything pierced and shaved half my hair off).
I was a virgin till I was 27. While I’ve had sex now, and several partners, I still haven’t had a relationship that lasted longer than a few weeks, and I still haven’t had any good sex, although I am by now (sort of) aware of what that entails. The sex, in general, has been pretty – bad. Still, we are working on this.
I’m 40 now, so I’ve had a lot of time to reflect on this, and the problem is me. There was a combination of circumstances – a one-off sex abuse incident when I was eight, bullying at school, the suicide of a boy I had a crush on when I was 17 – which set me up to believe love is pain. I also had, oh yes I did, the incel sense of entitlement. Guys (and girls) asked me out, but they weren’t enough of a status symbol, so I turned them down. I spent my life getting painful crushes on completely unattainable people; mostly because that way I didn’t have to deal with what I thought was their inevitable rejection of me because I was so stupid, weird, and ugly.
I wasted years. Decades, even. Before I started therapy and began to understand myself.
If I could tell my younger self anything, it would be these things:
1) perfection is death. Once something is perfect, there’s no room for change or improvement. It’s static, frozen, done. Please do not look for perfection in yourself or others, because it is not a goal which will make you happy. “Progress, not perfection,” as they say in AA.
2) you need love, not sex. Once I had lost my virginity, I spent years hunting down different sexual experiences and they were all awful, and then I figured out that the emotional connection was needed for it to be good (well, not everyone does, but I do). What I wanted wasn’t what I needed.
3) Bitterness and anger won’t help a thing. I can – and did – sit there and say: “These sex problems are the fault of my abuser, why should I fix them myself?” And that’s fine, you can say that all you want, but the end result is – the problems don’t get fixed. It’s like if someone broke into your house and smashed everything. You can say “It’s not my fault, why should I clean it up?” – but if you want a clean house, you have to. There is no-one else to do it. You either clean it up yourself or you live with your broken possessions. I mean, you can do that, you’re the only person who has to live there, but it’s not great, is it? So I got therapy and fixed my shit, because no-one else was going to.
4) You are the person who chooses how you live your life. You are choosing to be miserable. You only get one shot at this. Do you really want to be unhappy? There’s so much great stuff in the world, and so many cool people. There’s art, and music, and science. You can build a fucking great life without sex.
5) you know what sex feels like? pretty much exactly like when you are wanking, only with another person there. When I did finally lose my virginity, I’d built it up so much and I was literally like: “Oh. Was that it?”
I’m still working on the whole sex and relationship thing. I don’t know if I’ll ever meet anyone again. It’d be nice, but actually that’s okay. You don’t have to be in a relationship. You don’t have to have sex. It’s only ever been a very minor part of my extremely rich and fun-filled life.
Please. Stop making this one, tiny thing into the Ultimate. Go to a festival, ingest some substances, and see how much you care about being incel when you are dancing in a stone circle wearing a neon tutu next to a naked guy playing the bongos (ok maybe that’s a little specific. Glastonbury 2010 was…eventful for me)
Anyway. Slight digression there. But I hope that helped.
Hbomberguy did a very good video on the topic, for those interested (and for a bit of distraction from this awful bullshit).
@Violet the Vile,
Fantastic post!
Anecdote: I was at a conference on sexuality way back in the late ’90s, and one of the presenters asked everyone to complete a questionnaire about their sexual history, experience, etc. One of the first questions was “At what age did you lose your virginity?”
The woman sitting next to me asked him to clarify. He was a bit flummoxed, so she said, “I’ve had sex with 20+ people but they were all women. Am I a virgin?” 🙂
The first time I had PIV sex it did feel like a big deal. I was 14 and lucky enough that he was a good guy and knew what was what.
Sex can be bloody fantastic. I have to disagree with Violet slightly: for me, sex with other people is not quite the same as wanking (not better, just different). But she’s absolutely right overall: it’s just a part of the whole grand tapestry.
I guess Katies went and collectively hit the wall, but leave it to the skeevy MGTOW/Incel/MRAs to have moved on to the younger sister Stacies.
Like Barbie and ‘teen skipper’only with proportions commonly found in nature, no waiting on product development for legs that bend at the knees, less whining about nobody wanting to touch his boner from Barbie’s man-friend(Ken’s smooth plastic ‘crotchtal region’ kind of makes such whining pretty pointless).
If anyone should ‘get what they deserve’* it’s the ones who think children being killed on grounds that they wouldn’t touch your penis anyway is something to celebrate. News flash, incels who commemorate the anniversary of Elliot Rodgers’ murder spree, but you’re the reason why nobody wants to touch your boners.
*To wake up and discover that they’ve been visited by a team of Mattel product developers in the night who have restored them to the standard ‘Ken crotchtal region’ specifications. And then have to walk barefoot on miles of broken legos (pointy parts facing up).
@Violet the Vile, thanks for your post, you single-handedly redeemed humanity in my mind after the horrors of David’s OP (which is no small feat). I’m so glad you exist (this extends to a lot of other commenters too)!
@Mish
Haha that’s what I mean when I said I haven’t got a lot of experience! That’s simply what have found so far.
I’m still evolving 🙂 so I’m hopeful one day I’ll get to find out what all the fuss is about!
A few times I have thought that the manosphere could not sink any lower. Until they do.
No one thinks an ‘incel’ is disgusting until he starts abusing girls/ women and saying we deserve to be murdered. How is it not possible for them to see that their attitude is what makes them disgusting, and that until that changes they will not get a girlfriend.
Of course if they DID get a gf it would not make them better people. They are determined to see the worst in women, so would make her life a misery, and when she dumps him would harass her or take some kind of revenge.
Lack of sex is NOT your problem scummy boys.
From a male perspective I also have to disagree with Violet that, at least for me, sex is like wanking just with another person, but that’s a pretty minor thing to pull out of a great overall post.
OT:
@Mish:
I just recently reread Steins;Gate because I picked up Steins;Gate 0 on my PS4. Still loved it every bit as much as the first time I read it and watched the anime. I’m only mentioning this because Mayuri reminded me that I hadn’t seen you much lately around here.
It’s gotten to the point that none of their ghoulishness really surprises me anymore. What I do find endlessly fascinating is the way this fragile view of human relationship dynamics has to be constantly reinforced by the group.
It’s like a big game of Jenga these guys have built in their minds. They’ll build each other up brick by brick, but anybody else looking at it just has to breathe on it and it’ll fall over:
— Their desire to get laid is so consuming that they’ve congregated under the incel identity, yet many of them haven’t taken the risk of actually talking to woman
— They claim they are desperate for a woman, yet will routinely reject women that don’t conform to quote-unquote “conventional” beauty standards.
— Therefore, they want a woman who conforms to the physical description of the “Stacey,” yet are so full of seething for such a woman that they’re willing to express approval for the murder of children merely so that they don’t grow up to “become Staceys.”
— Then to pile irony upon irony, if indeed they are looking for a woman who meets conventional beauty standards merely for sex and not necessarily a relationship, the very women who they claim are so promiscuous should be exactly what they’re looking for, Chads be damned!
The only conclusion one can draw from this Gordian Knot of awful (the conclusion we’ve all figured out well before now) is that they want the approval they believe they will be granted by their peers simply by having a conventionally attractive woman to flaunt or boast about. After all, if it’s sex they’re after, escort services do exist and are simply a phone call away, yet that never seems to be an option for these guys. Plus I’d never wish any of these guys on a sex worker.
If ever somebody asks me what toxic masculinity looks like, I’m linking this article….
@Mish, @dslucia
Point taken!
I am coming from the perspective of someone inexperienced who has not found sex to be everything it was advertised to be – I am well aware this is largely because I had some pretty bizarre and self destructive ideas about it, I have had sex with some people who maybe weren’t the best choices, and I am working with an abusive personal history.
But, like I said – progress, not perfection.
I’m smarter now about sex than I was even a year ago, and compared to where I was a decade ago…I would never have believed I could be here. So I’m still evolving, and hopeful that one day I’ll have a better experience with someone. I know that’s possible, and I also know that if I don’t ever have that, life is still great (one word: macarons. You cannot believe life is shit while eating a really good macaron. Before, yes. Immediately after, yes. But not during. It’s not possible)
I don’t think you’re being unfair at all. His post just proved my point that incels make everything about their own pain and feel aggrieved if everyone else doesn’t want to make everything about them either.
They don’t understand that relationships, whether they’re romantic, platonic or a blog’s commenting community involve give and take. Sure, if you care about someone you listen to their problems and help when you can. But they do the same for you. They don’t realize or care that others have pain too.
Like I said earlier, incels are good at soliciting sympathy at first but if this one turns out not to be a drive-by, I can guarantee he won’t be at grateful to anyone who was being charitable. He’ll just want more and sympathy and won’t ever acknowledge anyone else’s pain.
I have yet to see a sad boner troll admit that he’s not the gold medalist in the oppression Olympics.
The term “virtue signalling” also annoys me to no end, because it’s one of those terms that had a half-decent definition and use case before the Pepe brigade got its grubby fingers on it. Much like “fake news” or “regressive left”, it was meant to have a very narrow definition that applied to specific cases where an individual would pay lip service to virtuous cause, but never follow up on the topic outside of the current news cycle or zeitgeist, but now it’s just another snarl term to take the place of “cuck.”
Hbomberguy’s video on the term is bang-on. Deploying the term in the way these guys do is just another example of their lack of belief in altruism. To them, everybody is just as cynical and craven as they are. Nobody is sincere in what they say, so they must be espousing opinion simply for the adulation of peers. That’s especially ironic given how sites like 4chan and Reddit operate.
As usual, it’s all projection.
Response to the death of children as young as EIGHT is to complain that they wouldn’t have sex with them.
Think I just bust a cringing muscle.
The vile vile awful stuff written there makes me sick to my stomach.
But, since, as we’ve discussed/concluded before, toxic masculinity (of which incel is the flagship store) is very much about homosocial approval, I do get the feeling that there is a lot of PERFORMING FOR OTHER MEN going on. A who-can-say-the-nastiest thing competition.
When I was younger (and most of these guys are very very young I believe), cruel & evil things were, to me (woman) and many of my fellow teenagers (boys & girls), much more a concept, or even a joke, than actual real people, real feelings etc. The older I’m getting, and the more life & experiences I have under my belt, the more empathy and sensitivity I have developed (as have my peers).
I dó realise that incel breeds types like Elliot Rodgers, and it shoud be SHUT DOWN if only for that. But at the same time it seems much more (or just as much) like posturing-trough-being-the-evilest, than it is about the evil content per sé.
Any and all rebuttals welcome of course.
I think the problem is that posturing is basically affirming that saying/thinking/doing that sort of horrible stuff is OK. I don’t recall the specific quote but something done long enough, even as pretend, becomes a habit.
“Joke” (quotations specifically because nothing these channers and redditors say and do would be in the same galaxy as a real joke) about how women are inhuman, how minorities are monsters, etc. long enough and it becomes real in your mind. You stop faking it and you start making it.
So yeah, maybe most folks there are engaging in one-upmanship, but they’re swallowing little doses of poison each time. Soon enough will accumulate to (metaphorically) stop their hearts and shut their brains down.
I have observed for some time that men are not allowed to talk about their pain. In my opinion, that’s often correct.
to me that is the core of the incel guy’s comment, that he is not allowed.
I have almost zero interest in men except maybe as brothers on a case by case basis. Men seem alien to me and a lot of the time I don’t like them.
But I bet I would be allowed to talk about pain if I described why I have trouble seeing men in general as anything but testosterone units.
These guys are so repugnant in every way.
I want to get off this planet because no place on Earth is far enough away from them.
@ citizen rat
This one?
http://izquotes.com/quotes-pictures/quote-we-are-what-we-pretend-to-be-so-we-must-be-careful-about-what-we-pretend-to-be-kurt-vonnegut-275879.jpg
LGB,
It doesn’t matter if they are sincere. They are normalizing abuse and murder. That leads to more women being abused and murdered in a world where rape, abuse and murder of women and femmes by men is nightmarishly common.
@Violet:
In fairness, I completely understand how it could feel that way. Everyone experiences things differently, after all.
For me, even beyond the physical sensation being very different on my end, sex isn’t the same partly because a large part of the experience comes from making my partner feel good. To really get into TMI territory, I enjoy that even more than getting off myself.
@Lucrece
Good points over all, just a couple quibbles
TERF is not synonymous with radical feminism, and some of us most certainly are radical feminists.
Trans folk often have difficulty in finding partners at all, and androphilic non-men are statistically unlikely to get much sexual satisfaction from such random pickups. (Men: This is part of why you often have trouble finding same. Up your game, lads.)
@ citizen rat and @ alan
A recent version. Someone who fucks goats ironically is still a goatfucker
(Can’t recall where I saw this.)
@Dalillama
Especially if trans folk take their safety into account. The “Trans panic” defense, despite amounting to an admission of guilt by any logical, rational, or reasonable interpretation, nonetheless allows cold-blooded murderers to go free as long as their victim was transgender…and the prosecution can’t prove the murderer knew the victim was trans.
And yes, to my knowledge, all of those murderers are cis men, and most of the victims are trans women. (Men: This is another aspect as to why you have trouble finding partners. Excise this bullshit, along with your other problems with committing violence against women.)
A potential man partner automatically starts at “Probable threat” as far as I’m concerned.
As to the article:
MGTOWs continue to show that they wastes of flesh, oxygen, and food. “Do not murder or celebrate murder” is not a radical concept. So is “Don’t clearly fucking fantasize about 8 year olds you bastards.”
@ Alan and @ Muddy Creaky
Those are the ones! Thank you!
@Alan
‘globalist cuck fest’
Forgot they subscribe to the alt-right.. They’re all becoming one festering blob of hate that only wishes for everyone to as miserable as they are.