Terrible news: An explosion outside an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester has left at least 19 dead and 50 injured, according to press reports at the time of this writing. There are apparently indications it was a suicide bomber, but details are still scarce at this point.
Discuss, share info here. No trolls, etc.
Oh. She a disgrace making holocaust jokes and antimuslim comments at the same time. She can really be arrest for this though?
Valentine, Hopkins is deadly serious. She’s unlikely to be arrested. She writes for the reliably vile Daily Mail, which confers a certain amount of freedom from consequences.
@Alan
I see the suspect has been arrested in Chorlton. That’s where my aunt lives. This is turning into a bit of a strange day, to put in mildly.
@Ohlmann:
Yeah, I feel this way too. I think it’s because of the lack of any motive other than pure sadism. Say what you will about terrorists, at least they think they’re fighting for a better future. Internet assholes, on the other hand, are just doing it for the joy of hurting others.
@ dan
Yeah. I keep looking at the Guardian cover, and the guys helping people out of the venue. But I keep thinking that half an hour before it would all have been so normal. Just another gig. Standard roadie stuff. Mild boredom, nice easy night. Getting ready for the load out etc. Then this. It’s that juxtaposition thing again.
As to the suspect thing, one thing that’s common to these sorts of things is that in the immediate aftermath all sorts of stuff happens that eventually goes nowhere. So I’m trying not to speculate about anything until the facts are actually established.
@moggie so if she serious then shes not like milo because he is simply attention seeking. She is serious and she wants muslims to face ‘final solution’ and she writes for news paper too? i have to go on sleep now but probably wont. In less 5 hours have to work agian too. These kids here will be damaged forever by this. People like Katie Hopkins have no soul.
I also woke up to the news of this. Looking for the positive, I am reminded of…
“Look for the people helping – there are always people helping”
Taxi drivers offering free transport. Hotels offering free rooms. People offering their homes and their cars. Not to mention our stunning emergency services.
Mancunians show how it is done. The good outnumber the bad millions to one. As long as we stand together and refuse to give into hate, they will never win.
Crying for the broken families.
It appears so-called Islamic State have claimed responsibility.
It’s not enough that the incels are saying the vilest possible things about the victims of the Manchester attack; they’re now celebrating because this is “Saint Elliot’s Day” (ie the anniversary of Rodgers’ murders).
I’m feeling really uncharitable towards them at the moment.
Just saw the news, has hit me very hard. I was born in Manchester, went to Manchester Uni, lived there for the best part of a decade. Now I live just outside it but go in weekly to see my mum, two sisters and two nephews who live there and have seen many shows at that very venue. Just feeling horrible right now, seeing the photo of the eight year old who was killed brought tears to my eyes. I thought the 1996 IRA bomb that blew a massive hole in the city centre would be as bad as it got, but no one died in that attack (amazingly).
What’s doubly sad is that Manchester has one of the most integrated and long established Muslim community in the whole country (I lived in the main one). I know that they’ll be as horrified by what’s happened as the rest of us and I really hope there are no “reprisal” attacks against them =/
The second named victim was eight years old. Really hard to take this.
Valentine, Kate Hopkins and Milo are not entirely alike. With Milo, it’s been observed that it’s hard to know what he really believes in, other than fame and money. Hopkins certainly wants those too, and courts notoriety, but she appears to be genuinely far-right.
While I’m not denying this, I’m aware that they’d claim responsibility for any terror attack they can, whether they did it or not.
Still, the police have said it’s very unlikely the perp acted completely alone.
I’ve lost all patience for anyone spewing hateful and/or far right sentiment. I will tell them exactly what they should hear. Their feelings become irrelevant when they choose to support vicious causes.
Apparently eight-year-old girls are “crusaders” now?
This is horrifying. I went to bed early when the news hit because I didn’t want to hear my family and family friends speculating about refugees and Muslims. which they inevitably would, knowing how racist they are (including the family friends, despite being young).
My dad and this dude were both repeating the “I saw a Facebook post that turned out not to be true so that means I can believe anything I want and pick the facts that make me feel good about my ideology” sentiment. you know “CNN is as bad as fox news” type stuff.
this dude has a little toddler and he’s gonna pass his views onto his kid. oh my god.
But I’m always worried in the wake of terrorist attacks that it’ll cause far right and Nazis to double down on things.
@ sunnysombrera
There are certain formulae of words that ISIS use depending on whether an attack was directly planned by them, merely inspired/encouraged by them, or just one they want to take credit for regardless. There are also other clues in information they release (if it’s an actual ISIS planned operation they include certain details).
Here they’re using the ‘soldier of the Caliphate’ tag. That’s normally reserved for people they don’t know but who they assume supports them (they use ‘nom de guerres’ for their own people). They’ve also quoted a few details we now know to be wrong but that were mentioned in early news reports.
Of course it’s dangerous to speculate, but at this stage my thinking is that this is just a self radicalised perpetrator, of whom ISIS had no pre-knowledge; and who knows why he may have done what he did?
@Varalys,
I hope you are okay and that everyone you know in Manchester is okay. My lot are originally from down the road near Buxton, and Manchester’s where, for instance, my gran goes for her hospital appointments. This will add another layer of worry for her when she goes (it’s already a pretty crap taxi/public transport journey of a couple of hours each way); though to be fair, she survived three separate V1 attacks in the 1940s, so she’s pretty hardcore.
Katie Hopkins can, respectfully, do one. She knew what she was doing when she said ‘final solution’, and she knew what she was doing when she deleted it. Hopefully, one day, when someone asks, as Valentine did, ‘Who’s Katie Hopkins?’, the only answer anyone will be able to give is ‘fucked if I know’. A terrible human being, and she’s getting no more of my attention today.
@DanHolme I hope you guys stay safe.
My heart goes out to Manchester.
All my bile, however, goes to everyone trying to gain something from this horrible act. I wish I could concentrate on grieving the loss of lives in what was a celebration of music and fun, but every time something like this happens my anger swells for every pundit and politician who gleefully push their god-awful rhetoric.
If there is a God, may She damn them.
@DanHolme: Thanks, I phoned my sister just to be doubly sure and everyone is fine, just very shocked. I was due to visit them today, but rescheduled to to another day before this happened. Apparently this was a wise decision. The Arndale Centre were I was going to pop in to do some shopping was evacuated and the police are advising everyone try and keep out of the city centre still as investigations continue.
I usually leave my computer for the day at suppertime and this was what was on my news shows. An expert on terrorism said that Daesh and Al-Quida usually won’t claim responsibility for things like this until they know the perpetrator/s are dead. She didn’t say so, but I got the impression that was so they won’t be able to contradict the terrorist’s narrative.
This is awful. I wish for best outcomes for everyone affected and mourn the lives lost and the damage to the rest.
@Victoria
Thank you. Re your comment about ‘doubling down’, I worry about the same thing, but hopefully the reaction of the community, which has been well publicised, will go some way to stopping that from happening too much. Unless trolls like KH try and cause trouble for their own gain, of course. There’s an article about how people responded here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40011977
@Varalys
I’m glad to hear that your family are okay. It’s going to be a tough couple of weeks for everyone, I imagine. Related to what I wrote above, I see that prize berk Piers Morgan tried to demonise the Muslim community in an interview with some Corrie stars, who put him right pretty sharply.
And now a Telegraph journo is calling for concentration camps
wat.
@Kat
Damned good point. Whenever one of these terrorist attacks go off in a quote-unquote “Western” country (the ones that occur in the Middle East are universally ignored), the tendency to read it as a “clash of civilizations” means that the context of the target is ignored in lieu of “Western values”. Charlie Hebdo was fairly obviously an attack against journalists and political cartoonists who antagonized Islam. But the context of other incidents like the November Paris attack seem to get lost in the nomenclature that forms: the “Paris attack,” as if it was meant as an assault on France’s capital itself. Remember, that one also started at a concert. It’s more than just a crowded venue, they’re striking at these targets deliberately, as the article indicates, to disrupt the daily lives of people. To make them think twice about to that next concert or sports game. Even better, alienate fellow citizens who happen to share a faith with the perpetrators, pushing them in the direction of the extremists.
That article also reminds us that the very sexism and misogyny that drives the religious fundamentalists of Daesh is rife in “Western” society as well. It just happens to be subtler than an IED. Enough cat-calls and online bullying will keep a young woman or girl from wearing the outfits she likes the same as any terrorist act, so it’s worth keeping that in mind before we become righteously indignant at the “Moose Lambs” (many of whom listen to Ariana Grande as well).
*sigh* The bloodshed is bad enough, but I just wish we didn’t have to go through the same song and dance where the usual suspects blame the whole religion, demanding Muslims justify their very existence again and again and again. It’s meant to tire the rest of us, but it does a good job of it…..