Men’s Rights Activists and other warriors against cultural misandry often complain that women accuse them of being creepy, not because they’re genuinely creepy but just because they’re men, men guilty of no crime other than not looking like Brad Pitt.
One of these fellows took to the Men’s Rights subreddit recently with a sad tale of being unfairly profiled as a creeper just because he was lurking in a truck in the parking lot of a pharmacy until after the store closed, hoping he could chat up one of the store employees while she was walking to her car.
I know, totally unfair!
Here’s his sad tale, in his own words:
I was in a small town in NJ, spending the night in my truck waiting for a job in the morning. I park at corner pharmacy lot. I go in once and buy my items. Checkout girl is cute, make up a reason to go back in. We chat for a few seconds at most. I go back to my truck to browse the ol Reddit. Place closes at 10. I’m kinda hoping the checkout girl comes out so we can chat some more.
Yeah, yeah, I know, some of you gals have already decided he’s a creep. Isn’t a guy allowed to buy something from a cute checkout girl, to leave the store to go back to his truck, then return to the store on a pretext to chat with the cute checkout girl, then go back to his truck and just, you know, lurk there until the store closes reading his smart phone? Seriously, who could possibly find any of that suspicious?
At 10:05 pm 3 cops surround my vehicle and demand identification, claiming the employees of pharmacy we’re afraid to go to their vehicles because of a suspicious work truck with a big scary man in it.
GOSH HOW COULD ANYONE BE SUSPICIOUS OF HIM. Clearly there is some big time misandering going on here.
Obviously they want to delay me so the employees can get safely out. That is somewhat understandable, but God damn, I go out of my way to not be creepy around women, as I am a very big person.
And what an amazing job he did this time not being creepy!
What is it like to be a woman? Are you constantly afraid of being raped everywhere you go? Kidnapped? Murdered? I exchanged maybe a dozen words and a friendly smile with a cute cashier and I immediately got the cops called on me. Fuck.
Yeah, it’s not as if you WENT BACK INTO THE STORE ON FALSE PRETENSES SO YOU COULD TRY TO CHAT HER UP and then got into your truck and DIDN’T LEAVE. AT NIGHT. WHEN THE STORE WAS CLOSING.
The cops have been here for 30 minutes parked right next to me as I type this. It seems like all men are guilty until proven innocent…
CREEP RIGHTS NOW!
I can’t help but think of this scene from Tucker and Dale vs Evil.
In Dale’s defense [Spoiler alert!] he doesn’t immediately run to the Men’s Rights subreddit to whine about misandry, and despite taking the bad advice of his friend here he does turn out to be a genuinely good dude who honestly doesn’t want to creep anyone out.
He’s also got a little bit more self-awareness than our friend in the truck. Can Reddit truck dude even be real, or is this actually some kind of masterful trolling?
Most of the Men’s Rights redditors commenting on the story actually do tell him he was acting creepy as hell, so I’ll give them a few points for that.
I have huge shoulders for a cis woman, too, despite being only 5’4 (I have an oddly broad skeleton, with man-sized hands and feet). I found a lovely burgundy velvet blazer by St. Laurent Rive Gauche at Ragstock a few years ago, and every time I wore it, it made me very happy. Then I started my current job, and my shoulders just hulked out so much that I can’t wear it any more. I can only wear stretchy shirts now.
Fran I totally believe sex is for having fun with so why not fetish a bit. I am also attracted to butch women with big hands. Or small hands.
@Misophistry
Nothing wrong with that either. I put considerable effort into it myself.
I guarantee it’s the former. People are still right shits.
*RAGE*
Honestly mostly given up on that one 😛 My voice is quite deep indeed, and tends kinda gravelly.
Also depends on what specific mix of hormones you’re on; I’m taking estradiol instead of progesterone, along with a t blocker.
@Sunnysombera
I’ll go with concerning.
@Fran
Can confirm
Same here
Are you sure you’re not me?
I’m not yest satisfied with my body, but I have high hopes that my breasts will keep growing for a good while longer.
Be warned though, there’s some right fuckin creepers who start out in that vein as well.
Right there with you; I find that as self-conscious as I am about them, nobody else appears to actually notice, except when the clerk at the shoe store was commiserating about the lack of cute shoes in our sizes.
@WWTH
Marissa Alexander is out of prison now, at least.
I am enjoying watching the cultural seperation between male and man, and female and woman in language and expression.
Is gender dysphoria more about connections between consciousness and self-as-object or society-as-object? There is some fighting involving the comparison between gender associations and race associations over PZ’s Pharyngula blog and determining the relationship is a useful thing when not done in a bad way. I see Dolezal’s identification as more like my own furry identification myself (otherkin are in the same bag in a different way, feelings are rooted in anatomy but this is more logically indirect with respect to how the feeling is attached to objects. How precisely is what could be useful to know).
If any of that was insensitive I would like to know.
@Dali
I like to think my deep voice lends to my cuteness, myself.
Very true! It’s annoying, because they muddy the waters. I’ve found that there are nice people who really go for women with big dicks, and then there’s those chasers.
Apparently I’m your trans-woman-of-color sister from another family, it seems.
Once I start my ‘mones and grow breasts and stop being so goddamned androgynous, we should get together, put on super-tight string bikinis, and show off our huge ladydick bulges (in a safe place. If I ever get a house with a pool, y’all can do that at my place).
Sandra is invited as well if she’d like, and any other Bad Girl Mammotheers who also have big, strong girlcocks.
@Fran
Can I just mention that I think it’s bullshit that trans women have to make a point of saying this while cis women aren’t asked to do the same thing? I’m very feminine in my presentation and I like it that way, but no one ever accuses me of fetishizing womanhood or having an idealized image of what being a woman is or whatever. You shouldn’t have to throw a disclaimer on your personal feelings about your own body.
@Viscaria
Really glad you said this.
Yes, I want to be the sexy girl with big breasts, a narrow waist, thick thighs, long, sultry legs, pouty lips, and fluffy eyelashes.
I’m not trying to ‘play at being a woman’ or ‘exaggerate femininity’ either by doing this; that’s just what my internal image of myself is like.
As this article by David has proven, being erotic in your presentation increases your chances of getting sexually harassed, so…according to the purists, I want to ‘play at being a woman’ so badly that I’m okay with getting raped, beaten up, beaten up then raped, or raped and then have my skin flayed off my body in some dude’s basement.
Yep. That’s how badly I want to ‘play at being a woman”.
[rolls eyes eternally (not at you, but at the purists)]
@Francesca
I’m not comfortable being nude or semi-nude in front of people. I still wanna break most mirrors, and stuff. Which is weird, because I perform in the Rocky Horror picture show. So…I dunno. Y’all sound awesome, but I just don’t know.
My voice:
It’s not deep and gravelly, but it is unmistakably masculine when I speak up. Maybe I’ll see a speech therapist later.
On genitalia:
In an ideal world, I’d be reborn in an unquestionably feminine body. I have no idea what I’d even want as far as genitals go. I’d probably be just fine with any combination.
I’m taking estradiol and a T blocker too. Can confirm the thing still functions.
@Dalillama
No one notices hand/foot size? I approve. It’s right difficult to find heels in my size, and I’d rather be worrying about nothing.
Yeah. I’m not satisfied either. At all. Not even slightly. And I need to put more effort into passing, because it does make me feel better. It’s hard with depression siphoning my energy and other things. Ideally, I’d want plastic surgery on my face at least, but that’s expensive and I’ll probably never be able to afford it, so I should let that dream go.
@Fran
So many thoughts in my head and so few words coming to mind.
I guess I’m the exact other (far) end of the spectrum. My bottom surgery can’t come fast enough and if it wasn’t for the fact that I’d still like to be able to enjoy some form of sex, I would have removed it myself by now, and just deal with the nerve damage.
I’m transitioning kinda late, I started at 38 and will be 42 in August. I’ve been on HRT for a little over 3 years now. I doubt I’ll ever look remotely femme, and looking andro just doesn’t cut it for me (although I doubt I look very andro either).
If not for the fact that I have no money, I would have had everything on the menu, so to speak. Laser/electro, Facial Feminization, waist contouring, augmentation (I’m only a AA-cup and I fucking hate it!!!), trach shave. Every. Freaking. Thing. The only reason I can get bottom surgery is because it’s covered by my province (it’s the only thing the cover for MtF). It’s not a question of want, it’s pure need.
Four years in and I still mourn for the childhood/childhood experiences I should have had, the body I should have had (I loathe the one I ended up with), etc. I can’t go outside/or even look outside without being reminded of what I’ve been denied.
I actually envy those who are happy with just a social transition and/or just hormones. I can’t afford to get anything done, and with the way that eats at me day-in and day-out it’s quite likely to kill me. In all actuality I’m rather surprised that I’ve made it this far.
Another thanks to all of our trans ladies for a lot of interesting information. I have always been fascinated by people who aren’t like (cis/het/white/female presenting) me. My nym used to end with “fan of diversity” and I really mean that!
I’m pretty hetero, but there are androgynous people who I find to be teh hawt. I also have discovered that I have a thing for male transvestites (is that redundant or insulting in any way?) A ways back, someone posted or linked to a Ladybaby video and I was completely smitten with Ladybeard! I’ve been a long time fan of Eddie Izzard, too and find him way more yummy in makeup than without.
Gah. Another page appeared while I was typing and I’ve missed the edit window by reading.
Francesca said
That’s what I don’t get; how can people think being trans is some hobby or passing fancy? Trans people give up SO FUCKING MUCH just to try to be who they are!
FWIW, I hope that all of our trans sisters everywhere find peace and happiness however you want to present. I think you’re all brave and beautiful. Catbeast is rubbing my legs right now, so I think that means he agrees!
Jesalin I think I understand your pain. I have also mourned for a lost childhood. But beyond that I emphasize with your regret. I came so close to giving up. I hope you find resolution in the transition however belated.
Kilroy Silk (90s talk show guy) saved me with an special on transsexuals. At age ten I had a name for what I had always secretly known about myself. But not the strength to do anything about it for another 9 years. Age 19 I drank a fuckton too much booze whenever possible and eventually got so paralytic I nearly died. The next day I talked myself into facing what it was that troubled me. What looked back at me from within was a woman with my face, asking me why is it do you think that you always imagine yourself as woman in your fantasies? Could it be that your deepest darkest fantasy is your reality?
And so I found myself in the surreal position of explaining myself to my doctor and my family. It could have all died there and then and I would probably be dead of cirrhosis of the liver by now. But it didn’t because I am lucky I guess. They helped me and so here I am now.
I never thought I would be good looking. I was muscular and hairy. I thought I had size ten feet (turned out to be a 7 when I actually measured them). I was so afraid that I had left it too late (I know that sounds daft, but 19yr olds are daft) and would forever be cursed with maleness. But as it turns out much of my ‘male look’ was just protective camouflage.
It feels good to type about this. Refreshing after 15yrs to bring it up and examine it now its all ancient history. I’d always wanted to write about it. Glad you are finding it interesting hambeast!
@Fran
Axe agrees, and so does hubby, so I’m starting to come around 🙂
I’m in!
@Viscaria
Thank you.
@Sandra
Come ’round anyway. There’s plenty of less scanty poolwear to be had.
@Jesalin
*hugs* offered.
Creeper is totally a creeper and probably knows he’s a creeper… As for the whole trans passing is the only way… They can rightly piss off. I was lucky, my trans mentor was a hardcore feminist genderqueer lesbian, back in the 90s. The only reason I delayed transition for so long was because of Montana.. and then my health. But now I’m only a week or two away from hormones. My watchword is that biology isn’t destiny. And every trans experience is individual and valid. I’ve definitely gotten some heat for it… But then I just drop knowledge bombs. The best trans person is a happy trans person. There is no one way to be who you are, for me Im going to do the full kit and caboodle, and I’m lucky enough to eventually able to pay for it all. We all have these ideas in our head of what we should be, and I hate people who don’t respect our individualism. We are at a point where it’s much easier to get the results we want, and not whatever some gatekeeper wants. I’m always glad to see trans people who are mostly happy with their body parts, because the most important thing isn’t what everyone else wants us to be.. it’s our happiness. And living our truth.
@Dali
Yep! And your voice isn’t gravelly. It’s an adorably sexy, bedroom growl. I’m telling you, Lauren Bacall and Scarlet Johansson with a cute to death PNW accent <3
@misophistry
I also knew around age 10, but I was way more stubborn. Long story short, I repressed it until I was 38, and the only reason I didn’t try repressing it again was the overwhelming feeling that if I did, I’d be dead in short order.
There is one thing about it though that I find remarkable, and that is how even repressed things find a way out (without being noticed). I can look back at so many things now and wonder how the hell did I not clue in sooner!
@Dali
*hugs gratefully accepted*
@Jesalin
Solidarity. I know that story, although I got there a few years ahead of you; I was 34 when I started coming out, started hormones a year later.
I know this feel. *hugs*
@Sandra
Haha, don’t worry, I just didn’t want to leave you out because we’re all part of the same gang now. You can sit next to the pool and take pictures of us showing off if you like.
I hope that one day you become fully in-tune with your body and want to display it as much as Dali and I seem to do. You deserve to be happy.
Same. If it were possible to rapidly reconfigure one’s body, like in the science-fiction books and animes, I’d immediately take on an astonishingly feminine body that inflames people’s desire when they see me.
I know just what I’d want between my legs – primarily, a long, thick, strong cock. It should be at least 10 inches long. I want people’s jaws to drop when they see the veiny serpent I’ve got in my panties – that is, if they could tear their eyes away from my pert breasts and buttocks..
I’d also like large, round, smooth balls, and a tight, muscular vagina that would make all the guys and girls prematurely blow their load when they enter me.
Yes, I’ve thought about this a lot.
Splendid! I’m glad your girlcock is as energetic as ever, even if you’re not really into wielding it.
@Jesalin
I agree entirely with this.
If I won the lottery tomorrow, I’d be unrecognizable to anyone who knows me right now. They would be very confused.
And then I’d go realize my dream and become a hot, popular transgirl model like Laverne Cox.
I’d make sure to give myself a comedic name like hers that alludes to my girlcock, too. (Cocks = Cox, get it?)
Dixie Normous, perhaps?
One of you might suggest,
Good call.
I realized my question contains a false dichotomy. It could be about self-as-object and society-as-object.
Strangely I don’t actually care how the words drift with respect to myself, I’m more interested on people getting to use them with respect to themselves without interference. But then my language issue is one of intense urge-based social expression independant of sex (unless nurture gets involved). Back to lurk mode.
@Brony
I’m afraid that I can’t really parse your question in a fashion that would lead to a useful answer. I’m honestly not sure it’s a useful kind of question. OTOH, I have some odd ideas about the distinctions (or lack thereof) between self and society, which may be part if it.
@Fran
That sounds like my ideal body. And/or partner, really.
I swear there’s a Sister* here in town by that name.
*Of Perpetual Indulgence. Bearded drag queens who dress as glamour nuns.
Um. When I was 16 years old, I drove to Crown Point, Indiana to meet a guy friend who didn’t drive yet. We went to the movies, and I must have bought the super-sized drink because boy howdy, it came back to me on the 45 minute drive home. I had to piss like a race horse, and being a teenage girl I couldn’t just stop at midnight and take a whiz in the cornfield. So I stopped in a mini-mall to see if the old SuperX was open. Within seconds, I was surrounded by 4 of Crown Point’s finest, who had a report of a “suspicious car driving around aimlessly” or some such made-up shit. Did I mention that at the time I was all of 130 pounds? And that I had made the attempt to chat up/stalk exactly O people?
Jesus H Christ on a cracker, what an entitled Man-Baby.
@Dalillama
I can be bad at questions. Self-other issues are implicitly part of this for me. The Tourette’s Syndrome involves a shift in self-other mind processes. I don’t reject other people’s thoughts on the self and the other. I don’t necessairly act based on them but I do listen and think about it. It’s a general personality and habits thing.
@Brony
Honestly, I’m not ignoring you, just so you know. I’m just caught up in my fantasy of being a tremendously hung, sexy girl.
And then hanging out with Dali and Sandra, who are also massively hung, sex-bomb girls in this hypothetical.
Also, I am not properly equipped to answer your question entirely.
I really hope someone can figure this out for you.
@Dali
As usual, we’re on the same page.
I like to imagine that in this hypothetical we’re entertaining, we would both be in some sort of fashion or modeling agency and we would both know each other, and perhaps people would feature us togethr in stuff.
@Re: Everyone, regarding being trans
When I was a teenager and a kid in the 1990s-2000s, I thought being trans was some really weird shit, thanks to all the movies and TV shows depicting them as being weird, so I never really connected the dots to myself.
Of course, I am now a weird transgirl even by transgirl standards, so there’s that.
But I digress. I thought you had to get a vagina (to an extent people still push this dichotomy upon others), do the most girly shit imaginable (like, stereotypically girl shit like knitting and quilting and not going anywhere; in all actuality, I think real women would find it insulting if transgirls did stuff like that and claimed it was the pinnacle of womanhood), and that you couldn’t be yourself.
Of course, I probably had a warped view of womanhood in general back then, being too young to understand the totality of what being a woman was.
I also thought for some reason you were not allowed to be attracted to girls if you were a girl, which highlights how messed up and immature I was.
Flash forward to now: I’m an entrancing girl, but I’m also the kind of girl who likes shooting guns, driving fast cars, motorsports, wargames, FPS videogames, and such.
@Francesca
Thanks for thinking of me <3 That'd probably suit me a lot better.
I don’t think I’d ever think of someone else’s desires or potential desires. I don’t really care how other people see me. I’d just move things around until I was happy, and that’d wind up being unquestionably feminine. For the other thing, I’d probably be just fine flipping a fucking coin.
This is basically my headcanon for Dungeons and Dragons related universes – that with such a vast amount of sources of gender and body changing magic, people no longer experience dysphoria. Or it’s shitty, exclusionary writing.
If I had money, I’d probably get most of what’s available. After making arrangements to get out on my own.
It sounds like a great body, and a very attractive partner.
So, my mom introduced me by my right name today. In front of me, but…progess is progress.
Also, it’s too late for me to edit, but by “real” in my last post I obviously meant cis.
As you can probably tell, I’m still trying to free myself from the false equivalency of cispeople being Real, Actual gendered people.
The transpeople who insist people like me aren’t real merely compounds my insecurity about this matter.
Couple that with my parents still insistently misgendering me and it’s difficult for me to shake this off.
I’ve been trying to accept that I am actually just a real, ordinary person, though.