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Why The Federalist’s attack on the so-called “Friend Zone” should creep you the hell out

Sweet Valley High is not so sweet when you’re trapped in the Friend Zone

To hear some tell it, there is no crueller torture a woman can inflict upon a man than to be his friend. Because, as the saddest sad men of the internet will happily explain to you at length, men and women can’t really be friends. Any woman who think she has male friends is fooling herself; all her supposed male friends have ulterior motives, if you know what I mean and I think you do.

They want to take her to the Bone Zone, in the parlance of our time, but she has put them in the Friend Zone instead, a hellish sexless purgatory that only the exquisitely charming and wholly fictional Jim Halpert on The Office has been able to escape. Such, at least, is the Friend Zone myth.

I’ve read a lot of silly things about the alleged evils of the alleged Friend Zone over the years, mostly in the form of terrible memes or scary rants on some misbegotten misogynist subreddit. But the silliest thing I’ve read on the subject for some time is a post that went up earlier this week on The Federalist, a right-wing media outlet with a heavy Christian bent.

In “Why Men and Women Can Never Be ‘Just Friends,'” Lutheran pastor and “comical video” maker Hans Fiene argues that we need to “tear down the Friend Zone” so American men and women can marry younger and “raise our sagging birth rates” so the world won’t run out of babies.

No, really.

All of us need to start having more babies or else the upcoming demographic tsunami will consume our nation, cripple our social programs, and leave us with a future so bleak that our only source of joy will be the moment we’re chosen to receive the sweet, fatal kiss of the Obamacare Death Panels, the Trumpcare Firing Squads, or the OprahCare Hemlock Squadrons.

Despite the achingly off-key “humor” at the end there — did I mention that Fiene makes “comical videos” on the side? — this argument, such as it is, is meant in all seriousness. As Fiene sees it, every day America’s hapless males waste in the Friend Zone is a day they could be making babies with a loving wife.

Being caught in the Friend Zone is an inarguable drag on fertility rates, as a man who spends several years pledging his heart to a woman who will never have his children is also a man who most likely won’t procreate with anyone else during that time of incarceration. Free him to find a woman who actually wants to marry him, however, and he’ll have several more years to sire children who will laugh, create, sing, fill the world with love and, most importantly, pay into Social Security.

Quite simply, for the sake of our future, the Friend Zone must be destroyed.

Fiene’s case against the Friend Zone is if anything even sillier than his demographic alarmism. He begins by sketching out the true horror of the purgatory that is the Friend Zone.

Every year, countless young men find themselves trapped in the Friend Zone, a prison where women place any man they deem worthy of their time but not their hearts, men they’d love to have dinner with but, for whatever reason, don’t want to kiss goodnight.

Fiene is apparently baffled and appalled by the notion that any woman might want to have dinner with a man without wanting — literally — to have his babies.

The women of America, he argues, need to accept two harsh truths: “you don’t have any guy friends and, in fact, you can’t have any guy friends” — because any dude who likes to spend time alone with a woman actually just wants to get with her.

Fiene has a rather hackneyed notion of what men are looking for in a friend — basically a dudely dude type

who shares his interest in activities such as watching movies where things explode, playing video games where things explode, or putting fireworks in things so they’ll explode.

And in Fiene’s mind, women just aren’t qualified for that position, which strikes me as a rather strange contention because, well, my best friend IS a woman, and we have spent many hours over many years “watching movies where things explode [and] playing video games where things explode.”

We’ve also spent many hours watching Project Runway, and gleefully mocking the worst dressed at the Academy Awards. Because we’re actual human beings whose interests don’t map directly onto hackneyed stereotypes of what men and women enjoy. (She does have a hard time convincing me to watch Jane Austen movies though.)  Oh, and we have no interest in sex or romance with each other; we enjoy those things with other people.

But I guess I’m delusional to think she and I are real friends, because everything she provides, friendship-wise, could apparently be provided much more efficiently by another dude. As Fiene sees it, “the average male coworker, male neighbor, or male Nepalese yak herder is better at producing masculine companionship” than women. Indeed, as Fiene (or his editor) declares in a big bold subhed, “There’s Only One Thing You Can Give His Man Friends Can’t.”

And, no, that isn’t “vagina.” It’s “vagina in the context of a loving marriage,” though Fiene doesn’t put it quite that baldly.

Addressing his female readers directly, Fiene tells them that when a man signs you up as a friend,

It’s not because he wants your friendship. It’s because he wants to convince you to open up the supply chain of a romantic relationship to him, and he foolishly believes he can do so by being a loyal friendship customer. “Pay my dues in the Friend Zone,” he thinks, “and one day she’ll promote me to boyfriend.”

Fiene assures the ladies that

Just because men don’t want to be your friend, however, doesn’t mean they don’t enjoy your company. They most certainly do. They love discovering how you see the world, what you think about life, the universe, and everything. They love your kindness, thoughtfulness, sensitivity, support, and your nurturing heart. They love being in your presence when you display the wonders of the feminine virtues.

At least when those “feminine virtues” come as part of a package deal with vagina — though, again, Fiene puts it a bit more delicately.

[B]ecause God designed these [feminine] virtues to entice men into marriage, the average man will never be content to receive those gifts in a form of companionship that doesn’t lead to marriage. Quite simply, men can’t be at peace being just friends. And there’s nothing you can do to change that. Platonic chilling won’t stop your inner (and outer) beauty from pulling a man towards romantic love.

So what is to be done? The women of America need to clear out their Friend Zones — kicking the guys they don’t find attractive to the curb and marrying up those guys who at least sort of stir their loins a little.

First, he informs the female reader, she needs to address those Friend-Zoned men who don’t

fill you with the biological desire to repopulate the earth? If not, then do your “friend” a solid and let him go. Call him up and tell him, “It’s not my fault that your facial symmetry grosses out my ovaries, but it was my fault that I got your hopes up by putting you in the Friend Zone. As restitution, please accept the phone numbers of five girls I know who find you attractive. Stop wasting your time with me and go hang out with a girl who might one day bear your children.”

Apparently Fiene thinks human beings talk to each other like that.

“Conversely,” Fiene continues,

if you find your guy friend attractive, and if you see him as a man of character and heart, then call him right now and tell him that he was placed in the Friend Zone due to a clerical error. Say to him, “You make me laugh and would be a great husband and father. Clearly, you need to be on the express track to the Marriage Zone.”

How … romantic?

Fiene concludes his strange little anti-Friend Zone manifesto with a stirring paean to the transcendent glories of … increased baby production.

So get brave. Get married. Get pregnant a bunch of times and give birth to a bunch of beautiful little future taxpayers. The time has come to fight for our future. The time has come to rebuild America’s demographic glory atop the rubble of the fertility-killing Friend Zone.

I think I’ll pass, thanks!

So who exactly is this manifesto supposed to inspire? Nothing in it bears much resemblance to the world I live in. Fiene’s resolutely heteronormative, baby-centric utopia offers nothing to the gay, bi, or trans folk I know, nor is it going to appeal to those with no interest in traditional marriage and/or children. Hell, its visions of masculinity and femininity are so constricted they don’t even fit most of the straight, cis people I know.

I certainly wouldn’t want to be trapped in the Fiene Zone, that’s for sure.

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Faerie Bard
Faerie Bard
7 years ago

I never could and probably never will understand the huge amount of pressure for women to make babies, as if that is one of the few things we are good for, supposedly. I don’t have anything against children or mothers, but I have never had a desire to have kids myself, so what about women who are childless by choice? What about women who want but can’t have kids? What about gay and lesbian couples, or transgender women, or asexual people? How do bisexuals fit into this equation, am I not allowed any friends at all? And what about overpopulation, it’s not like there is a shortage of people being born (yeah, I know, this asshole is only interested in the WHITE babies being born.)

I’m willing to bet this guy is the type who turns squeamish about kids the minute he’s expected to change a poopy diaper or wake up in the middle of the night to help feed the baby, or even pay taxes to help feed the children living in poverty.

As for his argument, it is ridiculous and insulting to both men and women to imply that all men want from us is sex, and that that is all we are good for, basically. Friendship and sex are not mutually exclusive, either. My SO is ALSO my best friend, and we were “just friends” for a while before the relationship turned romantic, and we are still friends now. I have several other guys that I consider to be friends of mine, as well.

dust bunny
dust bunny
7 years ago

@ LindsayIrene

Just another guy who doesn’t believe in what he’s never seen.

I have only one thing to say to that.

SAD!

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
7 years ago

@Numerobis : I am not an asian american, neither part fit.

If it can make you feel better, I may have ate more asiatic food than some asian americans, so there’s that.

(but then, it’s mostly indian curry, so eh)

Makroth - Agent of the Great Degeneracy
Makroth - Agent of the Great Degeneracy
7 years ago
Fabe
Fabe
7 years ago

@EJ : the biggest problem is more sending explosives into a spiral staircase. Doubly so if they are explosives + EMP. Generally speaking, doing so set the GM framerate to about one round per 8 hours of gameplay because of all the calculations, which is harmful to the rythm of the game.

(and sorry if Shadowrun was simplified enough that explosives in spiral staircases isn’t a geometric nightmare anymore :p)

Sounds like another game slowed down by the “Chunky salsa” rules .

Schnookums Von Fancypants, GloboThermoNuclearHomo
Schnookums Von Fancypants, GloboThermoNuclearHomo
7 years ago

@Moggie

Wait, you’re all different people??

YES WE ARE ALL SEPARATE PEOPLE PERSONS AND NOT PART OF A SINISTER HIVEMIND OF PSYCHIC FERRETS. NOW PLEASE RELAX AS WE IN NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM BRAINWASH YOU INTO BRINGING US SHINY TRINKETS BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE WRONG AND ONLY SOMETHING PSYCHIC FERRETS COULD DO, WHICH WE ARE CLEARLY NOT.

Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
7 years ago

@Schnookums

I thought it was agreed that I’d be assigned a psychic dormouse. I paid my dues in the Ferret Zone ages ago !

At this rate, I’ll never get to japanese dwarf flying squirrel.

http://i.imgur.com/K9knrDb.jpg

EJ (Marxist Jazz Weasel)

At this rate, I’ll never get to japanese dwarf flying squirrel.

…can has?

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
7 years ago

@Sinkable John

But they’re totally different! :p

Pie
Pie
7 years ago

@abars1

the cost of raising three children, and thus attaining that sacred cow of 2.1 children per woman, would be $750,000 dollars. Now, this may come as a surprise to you, but the average person, certainly not the average 18 – 30 year old, doesn’t possess a spare $750,000 dollars.

The cost of having more children doesn’t scale linearly like that; the second is noticably cheaper than the first, because you already have a lot of stuff and you know how everything works. The third (and presumably subsequent) children are cheaper still, partially because the hand-me-downs get handed down further and partially because you’ve given up all hope of ever having or doing anything nice ever again and so your outgoings are not as high as they might otherwise be.

(also, and at the risk of stating the obvious; that money is amortized over ~18 years or so, so at the average US salary of ~$44k/year you can get that $750k over the course of 18 years so long as you can live on about $6 a day yourself, and if you cared about the future of your race that’s exactly what you’d be doing, right?)

Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
7 years ago

@EJ

Careful now. Such power should not be used lightly, lest it consume you.

Seriously, I’ve been staring at it since I posted it and now I can’t focus on any of the stuff I gotta get done.

@IP

My brain doesn’t process how particular cats look. It just wants to point at them and say “CAT.” repeatedly. Also maybe flail the other arm about, but everything else is irrelevant.

Because CAT.

Ooglyboggles
Ooglyboggles
7 years ago

@A. Noyd
Honestly I messed that one up. I was kind of upset so by the time I realized “wait, why didn’t I type ningen” post limit was up.
@numerobis
Eh it ain’t the first time I ever heard of someone confusing my username. Usually I pick something generic like “housefan30570.”
@moggie
Wait, none of you are actually advanced chatbots and sockpuppets? 4chan lied to me.
@Makroth
“Three democrats.” Who are the three that though that a person who is anti person was exactly the judge they’re looking for?

Hambeast (fan of diversity)
Hambeast (fan of diversity)
7 years ago

Ooglyboggles – I think these are the ones known as “blue dog” Democrats. Because “DINO” is too close to “RINO” and gives the game away.

Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
Weird (Encouraged by the RESISTANCE!!!!) Eddie
7 years ago

it’s a universal medical fact that as a general rule, human females are not capable of either experiencing physical orgasm at all — whether vaginal or clitoral

Wait, WHAT??? You mean porn’s not real?!?!?!?!???

aaiiEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!! >_<

opposablethumbs
opposablethumbs
7 years ago

Somebody smarter than I am has to post the Life of Brian “We’re all individuals!” chorus clip 🙂

Grogepi
Grogepi
7 years ago

These people are so weird.
They simultaneously want to increase birthrates and increase the stress and difficulty involved in pregnancy, by decreasing the availability of pre-natal care.
And they basically fabricate talking points out of Chris Rock performances. I guess that’s what passes for diversity in their curcles….

Austin Loomis
7 years ago

I found the best comment ever on the friend zone in this tumblr post about why Joss Whedon is basically the Fisher-Price My First Feminist Kit:

Dudes believe if they do the things other dudes tell them women want, they get rewarded. Dudes never think to ask the woman what she wants, because her own desires and wants must be mansplained to her by a dude.

Also, Shinzo Abe in the cockpit of a plane with 731 on the side? I think one can safely assume he was, at least, complicit in the message being sent, if not himself the sender of it. Either way, my respect for him just took a significant kick in the gonads.

Moggie
Moggie
7 years ago

Sinkable John:

My brain doesn’t process how particular cats look. It just wants to point at them and say “CAT.” repeatedly. Also maybe flail the other arm about, but everything else is irrelevant.

comment image

LindsayIrene
LindsayIrene
7 years ago

Today in Trump administration drama: Bannon refers to Kushner as a cuck.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
7 years ago

@LindsayIrene

Hahahahahahaha!

Rhuu
Rhuu
7 years ago

@Austin Loomis: That is a really great post! Thank you for sharing.

and @the person on tumblr who said that ‘didn’t Buffy have a large female fanbase?’: It certainly could have! There were also very few female led shows at the time, where the lady was competent. Just because something struck a chord in the 90s and early 00s doesn’t mean that it will *continue* to be as relevant, going forward.

I mean, people grow. Just because women can vote doesn’t mean that feminism is no longer needed.

Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
7 years ago
LindsayIrene
LindsayIrene
7 years ago

If Jared Kushner is literally a cuck, I think we know who cucked him.

http://www.vvox.it/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/ivanka-trudeau.jpg

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
7 years ago

@EJ:

My experience of Shadowrun is that it involves six-hour planning montages to come up with elaborate schemes, which are then abandoned as soon as anything unexpected happens.

That was what ended up killing the only Shadowrun campaign I was ever in. We started using 5th edition, went back to 4th because 5th was really poorly edited, and then the GM basically cancelled the game after we’d spent an entire session just arguing over how to approach the ‘hostile relocation’ mission. (Granted, that entire gaming group blew up some months later, with the GM in question being the main explosion. He’d never run a game for more than half a year before getting bored with it and ending it for some reason.)

Actually, our previous mission had gone perfectly well: we just had to swap two shipping containers by messing with the RFID tags, then pull up with a truck to pick up ‘our’ container and take it away to our employer. We’re pretty sure nobody at the target or the shipping company even noticed there was a problem until they opened up their container and found it didn’t contain the equipment they’d ordered.

@Austin Loomis:

Also, Shinzo Abe in the cockpit of a plane with 731 on the side? I think one can safely assume he was, at least, complicit in the message being sent, if not himself the sender of it.

Considering that Abe has consistently downplayed Japanese actions in WWII, and has previously denied that any coercion was involved with the ‘comfort women’ (read: captured women being used as sex slaves by the army)… really, I don’t expect he would disagree with that message at all. He is very much not popular in China or Korea due to his nationalism and active attempts at rewriting history.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
7 years ago

Yesterday at volunteer work, I proofread a Somali high school girl’s short lesbian love story. It’s almost as if this “Muslims hate gays” narrative is some sort of bullshit.