We already said what the term “mansplaining” means in the other thread and explained why it isn’t a big bad dogwhistle. Why come to this thread to ask about it?
proudfootz
7 years ago
kupo
If someone had a valid criticism, they might be able to figure out a way to do it without a bunch of unsubstantial name calling.
‘Atheistbro’ for example – what possible relevance does either atheism or my sex have to whether the CIA is a trustworthy source?
It’s no more relevant than whether someone is right or left handed, fat or thin, tall or short. I sure didn’t bring that dimwitted nonsense into the conversation.
proudfootz
7 years ago
weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
You’ll have to ask Scildfreja to ‘splain why she brought it up in this thread.
Or why she brought up the CIA thread in this thread.
You’re barking up the wrong tree.
Imaginary Petal
7 years ago
“Atheistbro” is not really a comment on your atheism or your gender, specifically. It refers to a certain behavioral pattern displayed by a certain group of people. You can be an atheist and a man without being an atheistbro. It’s not even difficult (you fucking moron).
kupo
7 years ago
@proudfootz
Are you really going to pretend not to know what the slymepit is or how that’s relevant to the way you’re acting and treating others in here?
For the lurkers, since you’re the only ones I’m replying for anyway, There’s this subsection of atheism that believes that feminism and human rights have no place in atheism. They have a tendency to go to religious blogs and harass religious people simply for their beliefs and they get really upset when other atheists point out that some of the sexist and racist stuff taught by religion shouldn’t be part of the atheist movement. They believe that lack of God is the only important message atheism should spread and that SJWs are horrible people polluting their movement. These people were driven off Free Thought Blogs and now dwell in the slymepit, a name they proudly give their Internet home. When people talk about brotheists/atheistbros, that’s the type of people they’re referring to.
Ooglyboggles
7 years ago
@wokefootz
And you just decided to try to emotionally manipulate Scild into being on your side. You’re a piece of shit.
I’m familiar with your writing; you’ve been around before. As such, I’m a little disappointed in the way you’ve behaved here, because I know you’re capable of better. Please consider what your end goal is, and how you intend to get there.
Saying things like that to Axe or M, regardless of how funny they are or how true you feel they are, is not going to result in an end-state in which everyone agree with you and is your friend.
If your end goal is to “win” the argument in some sense, please consider how meaningless the concept of “winning” an internet argument is, and how seldom it genuinely happens. Having the last word, or being unpleasant enough to someone else to drive them off doesn’t exactly advance the sum total of human happiness.
If your end goal is to be regain esteem in the eyes of the community, then a good step would be to stop posting for a moment, wait until the moment has passed, then reexamine what you’ve written and consider whether you really want to be That Guy.
On a personal note, if your end goal does not involve having me be very disappointed in you, you will apologise to Scildfreja for that. She’s a wonderful person, and if we end up being assholes to her because of her kindness, then that sends a signal to her to not be kind, which makes the world a worse place. Making the world a worse place is something I object to.
It might be worth mentioning that “Elevatorgate” was one of the biggest driving forces behind the formation of the Slymepit.
In case anyone is unaware of it, here’s the summary of it. Rebecca Watson was asked to give a talk at an atheist conference about why women are underrepresented in movement atheism and how it can made more welcoming to women. One of the things she talked about was how women who attend atheist conventions are overwhelmed by the number of men hitting on them, sometimes to the point of harassment. A lot of atheist men treat atheist women, not as humans who attended a conference to meet people with similar interests, hear speakers, etc. but as things just there to provide sexual entertainment to the male attendees.
After the talk and after having some drinks and mingling with people, she goes to the elevator to go up to her room and to bed and some guy corners her to invite her for coffee. She turned him down and then later brought it up, I think in a vlog. She didn’t dox him. She didn’t talk shit about him. She just suggested that men not do things like that at 4 in the morning, particularly when she’s just expressed a desire to not be hit on.
This caused the atheistbro subset of atheism to have a complete meltdown. It was sort of the precursor to Gamergate. She got harassed over this for years. She’s probably still being harassed. Other well known female atheists who stood up for her got harassed too. The manosphere caught wind of it and sided with the harassers.
Sorry if this all old news to absolutely everyone but since it was 5 years ago I thought maybe there could be younger or new to social justice commenters or lurkers who aren’t aware.
So yeah, there’s pretty good reason for people, especially secular women to be very weary of men who are unbearably smug, treat oppression that doesn’t affect straight white men as NBD, and identifies as atheist.
Imaginary Petal
7 years ago
Elevatorgate is now actually close to 6 years in the past. Richard Dawkins really made the whole thing explode by getting making a typically clueless comment early on. These events caused me to distance myself from movement atheism.
Oh wow, that’s gorgeous. The texture of the cross stitch works very well with the black background to create an insectile shimmying-colour look.
Policy of Madness
7 years ago
Thanks, all! I am following a pattern, of course, so I can’t take credit for the beauty of the design. It is only about 60% done; that straight line along the left is the edge of pages in the pattern.
Imaginary Petal
7 years ago
@SFHC
What is swap breeding? A Sun/Moon thing?
I got both Sun and Moon for Christmas and birthday gifts this year, but I haven’t really started playing yet. :p
Grace of Spades
7 years ago
I haven’t commented in ages, though I still lurk steadily. This comment thread has made me want to catch up on reading all comments, given me even more respect for how trolls are dealt with here (especially the ones who walk so close to the “maybe not a troll, just doesn’t get it” line as proudfootz did at first), and get back into fiber crafting.
We Hunted The Mammoth
We already said what the term “mansplaining” means in the other thread and explained why it isn’t a big bad dogwhistle. Why come to this thread to ask about it?
kupo
If someone had a valid criticism, they might be able to figure out a way to do it without a bunch of unsubstantial name calling.
‘Atheistbro’ for example – what possible relevance does either atheism or my sex have to whether the CIA is a trustworthy source?
It’s no more relevant than whether someone is right or left handed, fat or thin, tall or short. I sure didn’t bring that dimwitted nonsense into the conversation.
weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
You’ll have to ask Scildfreja to ‘splain why she brought it up in this thread.
Or why she brought up the CIA thread in this thread.
You’re barking up the wrong tree.
“Atheistbro” is not really a comment on your atheism or your gender, specifically. It refers to a certain behavioral pattern displayed by a certain group of people. You can be an atheist and a man without being an atheistbro. It’s not even difficult (you fucking moron).
@proudfootz
Are you really going to pretend not to know what the slymepit is or how that’s relevant to the way you’re acting and treating others in here?
For the lurkers, since you’re the only ones I’m replying for anyway, There’s this subsection of atheism that believes that feminism and human rights have no place in atheism. They have a tendency to go to religious blogs and harass religious people simply for their beliefs and they get really upset when other atheists point out that some of the sexist and racist stuff taught by religion shouldn’t be part of the atheist movement. They believe that lack of God is the only important message atheism should spread and that SJWs are horrible people polluting their movement. These people were driven off Free Thought Blogs and now dwell in the slymepit, a name they proudly give their Internet home. When people talk about brotheists/atheistbros, that’s the type of people they’re referring to.
@wokefootz
And you just decided to try to emotionally manipulate Scild into being on your side. You’re a piece of shit.
Hi proudfootz.
I’m familiar with your writing; you’ve been around before. As such, I’m a little disappointed in the way you’ve behaved here, because I know you’re capable of better. Please consider what your end goal is, and how you intend to get there.
Saying things like that to Axe or M, regardless of how funny they are or how true you feel they are, is not going to result in an end-state in which everyone agree with you and is your friend.
If your end goal is to “win” the argument in some sense, please consider how meaningless the concept of “winning” an internet argument is, and how seldom it genuinely happens. Having the last word, or being unpleasant enough to someone else to drive them off doesn’t exactly advance the sum total of human happiness.
If your end goal is to be regain esteem in the eyes of the community, then a good step would be to stop posting for a moment, wait until the moment has passed, then reexamine what you’ve written and consider whether you really want to be That Guy.
On a personal note, if your end goal does not involve having me be very disappointed in you, you will apologise to Scildfreja for that. She’s a wonderful person, and if we end up being assholes to her because of her kindness, then that sends a signal to her to not be kind, which makes the world a worse place. Making the world a worse place is something I object to.
(“Be regain esteem”. When I rewrite things over and over, I leave artifacts behind that I don’t spot until after editing. Grrrr.)
It might be worth mentioning that “Elevatorgate” was one of the biggest driving forces behind the formation of the Slymepit.
In case anyone is unaware of it, here’s the summary of it. Rebecca Watson was asked to give a talk at an atheist conference about why women are underrepresented in movement atheism and how it can made more welcoming to women. One of the things she talked about was how women who attend atheist conventions are overwhelmed by the number of men hitting on them, sometimes to the point of harassment. A lot of atheist men treat atheist women, not as humans who attended a conference to meet people with similar interests, hear speakers, etc. but as things just there to provide sexual entertainment to the male attendees.
After the talk and after having some drinks and mingling with people, she goes to the elevator to go up to her room and to bed and some guy corners her to invite her for coffee. She turned him down and then later brought it up, I think in a vlog. She didn’t dox him. She didn’t talk shit about him. She just suggested that men not do things like that at 4 in the morning, particularly when she’s just expressed a desire to not be hit on.
This caused the atheistbro subset of atheism to have a complete meltdown. It was sort of the precursor to Gamergate. She got harassed over this for years. She’s probably still being harassed. Other well known female atheists who stood up for her got harassed too. The manosphere caught wind of it and sided with the harassers.
Sorry if this all old news to absolutely everyone but since it was 5 years ago I thought maybe there could be younger or new to social justice commenters or lurkers who aren’t aware.
So yeah, there’s pretty good reason for people, especially secular women to be very weary of men who are unbearably smug, treat oppression that doesn’t affect straight white men as NBD, and identifies as atheist.
Elevatorgate is now actually close to 6 years in the past. Richard Dawkins really made the whole thing explode by getting making a typically clueless comment early on. These events caused me to distance myself from movement atheism.
Speaking of accurate, pithy descriptions of behaviour wokefootz has been indulging in here, has anyone broken out sealioning yet?
http://wondermark.com/c/2014-09-19-1062sea.png
I knew this thread was missing something; it was missing proudfootz’ proud footz smell all over it. Glad to see that has been rectified.
In non-shitweasel news, I just hatched two flawless shiny Pokemon within ten minutes of eachother. This swap breeding thing is a revelation.
EDIT: And WP is eating links to images again. U2hgWit.png on Imgur.
Congrats, SFHC!
Does anyone remember back when I was cross-stitching? I picked that back up again. I’ll post a pic of my progress later tonight.
@PoM
I look forward to seeing your photo. 🙂 I’ve been toying with the idea of picking crochet back up or learning to knit.
For kupo or anyone:
http://imgur.com/u1tW6e6.jpg
I have a goal to have this done by the end of the year. Any bets on whether I will succeed?
Ooh, nice!
@PoM: Holy cats, I can’t even with that! Good luck!
Wow, PoM, that’s gorgeous!!
Beautiful work, PoM. Thanks for sharing.
That is turning out to be one stunning piece of work.
Oh wow, that’s gorgeous. The texture of the cross stitch works very well with the black background to create an insectile shimmying-colour look.
Thanks, all! I am following a pattern, of course, so I can’t take credit for the beauty of the design. It is only about 60% done; that straight line along the left is the edge of pages in the pattern.
@SFHC
What is swap breeding? A Sun/Moon thing?
I got both Sun and Moon for Christmas and birthday gifts this year, but I haven’t really started playing yet. :p
I haven’t commented in ages, though I still lurk steadily. This comment thread has made me want to catch up on reading all comments, given me even more respect for how trolls are dealt with here (especially the ones who walk so close to the “maybe not a troll, just doesn’t get it” line as proudfootz did at first), and get back into fiber crafting.