Richard Spencer came up with the term “alt-right” some years ago in an attempt to provide a cool-sounding euphemism to describe a bunch of people who might otherwise have been labeled “f*cking Nazis.”
This past weekend, Spencer and roughly 200 other “alt-rightists” put on suits to attend the annual conference organized by Spencer’s innocuous-sounding National Policy Institute and held in the Ronald Reagan Building in Washington, D.C. And Spencer apparently forgot the number one rule of alt-right club, which is: Don’t talk about Adolf Hitler, at least not anywhere where non-alt-rightists can hear you.
Spencer didn’t literally bring up Hitler by name, but his evocation of the old man was not what you’d call subtle. After most journalists had left the premises, Spencer gave a speech the Atlantic describes as “dripping with anti-Semitism” and blatant racism, declaring the United States a “a white country” that rightfully “belongs to us.”
“Hail Trump, hail our people, hail victory,” Spencer called out, raising his right arm in what looked more than a little bit like a Nazi salute. Many in the audience responded with Nazi salutes of their own, no ambiguity about them.
Here’s video of the whole embarrassing spectacle, courtesy of The Atlantic.
I think the avoidance of comparing people to Hitler is a good thing. I think not calling everyone a Nazi just for being a bit disagreeable / conservative is also a good thing. I think, however, there comes a time when people are behaving like Nazis or are behaving like Hitler, then making the comparison is a good thing. But it’s a little bit ‘boy who cried wolf’ now…
I think some people also think that comparing Trump to Hitler means that Jewish people are specifically and immediately at risk. I do not believe that. I think Jewish people as a group are not immediately at risk in the US, because there are other targets first and Jewish folk are 3 or 4 on the list – and that is what is different here. Some in the alt-right/nationalist movement may prioritise them higher – say number 2 – but Muslims are target number 1 and no doubt about it.
It doesn’t really matter who the tyrant targets. Pol Pot didn’t go after any Jews (as far as there were any in Cambodia) but that doesn’t make him not a genocidal demagogue . Idi Amin didn’t particularly expel Jews from Uganda, but that didn’t make him not in the mould of Hitler and not a raving anti-Semite (see Entebbe). Trump has a Jewish daughter and son-in-law but that hasn’t stopped him from making prejudiced statements about Jews (though usually in the faux-positive vein, like they’re good with money) or retweeting actual anti-Semitic statements.
@Terrabeau,
I love those boys 😀
@Steampunked
As a woman irl that can unfortunately only actually get turned on by M/M porn or fanfiction(straight or F/F stuff literally does nothing for me)…… I guess according to that director, I super duper don’t exist. I’m imaginary. I think a lot of other women out there must also be imaginary too. I never got why it’s totally understandable to a lot of people that a straight guy would like lesbians… but straight women could never like gay men! It just doesn’t make sense… and actually really just irritates me… :/
I’m with Rugbyyogi on the Hitler language.
I suspect that in 50 years (when I’m not around to be proven wrong) Trump will have become the Hitler-like icon of a bad head of state, Hitler himself will be flattened to a line like “somewhere to the right of Ghengiz Khan”, and some smart guy will have come up with the new equivalent of Godwin’s law, about Trump.
The point that Sinclair Lewis made in It Can’t Happen Here was that American populism/fascism, if and when it happened, would have a uniquely American nature and would come about through all-American processes and enthusiasms. Windrip, his Trump character, expressly mocks some Nazi symbols.
I guess what I’m saying is that I think we are now off the beaten track, with Trump. Assuming Eco is right (I do) gives us useful advice and warnings, but Trump is not a Hitler clone, and his followers are not Hitler’s followers, despite a few of them using Nazi symbols. Point-by-point comparisons might yield some useful strategic ideas. But as border markers (“You can’t go there! That’s what Hitler said!”) nazism and Hitler aren’t working.
@Guts the Black Swordsman: I know, right?
@Kobun37
It’s super weird to me how they seem to worship Trump, to the point where I see posts from businesses on Facebook where they simply state that people of all religions and ethnicities are welcome and this gets a flood of rabid Trump supporters attacking them in the comments talking about how horrible they think Hillary is. It’s extremely telling how they assume any statement of peace and tolerance is inherently anti-Trump, but it’s also super weird and hero-worshipy that they defend every little thing he does.
Anyone else having flashbacks to Jesus Camp where the kids were led in praying to a cardboard cutout of Dubya?
Being a cowboy is very hard work, and being a Viking these days will get you arrested and put in jail for a long time.
Why? If it walks like a duck…. No The Cheeto is “not Hitler”. Hitler is dead. Hitler also had much better persuasion skills than The Cheeto. Hitler also had a hateful ideology which pitted a relatively small, easily identifiable “us” against a large group of “others” (hmmm…) Some of these “others” were easily identifiable, like Jews… or Muslims, or Hispanics (hmmmm…), and some were hard to point out, but had characteristics which could be easily transferred to people which you want to say are “others”, like Communists… or liberals, or globalists (hmmmm…). Hitler had a following of vocal supporters who would be willing to publicly abuse, intimidate and even assault anyone who spoke up. This was the Sturmabteilung… or alt-right, or the growing number of goons who are in the streets, abusing, intimidating and assaulting anyone who fits the “other” (yeah, hmmmmmmm…)
I don’t know why you want to powder-puff the discussion of what is clearly a fascist, and clearly a fascist’s followers (and if I’m misunderstanding what you are saying, you have my most sincere apologies, and I don’t mean that sarcastically), but this bunch clearly walks, quacks and acts like a duck.
CNN reported today that a poll showed 47% of people polled saying they feel The Cheeto will do “a good job”. First, I gotta wonder if this is the same percentage of people who, during the “campaign”, kept saying The Cheeto “didn’t really mean the things he was saying”, second, I gotta wonder what they mean by “a good job”….
I really don’t give a rat’s ass if we call these nazis “Nazis” or not, either way, I still hear them saying EXACTLY the same things.
@rugbyyogi: Agreed completely. There are lots of authoritarian strongmen throughout history, focusing on History’s Greatest Monster makes authoritarian rule seem less likely than it really is.
It’s possible that Trump’s Jewish extended family will become the scapegoat for the massive corruption we’re going to see, and an excuse for the hardliners to bring in someone more ideologically committed to explicit fascism and/or ethnic cleansing than Trump.
Folks, don’t forget — in Hitler’s Germany, actual facts about who is Jewish and who isn’t wasn’t always based on any shred of truth. If Hitler or Göring wanted to declare that someone is not Jewish (for whatever purpose), then they weren’t.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honorary_Aryan
“Another example is Erhard Milch, who was in charge of aircraft procurement for the Luftwaffe and reported directly to Hermann Göring. In 1935, Milch’s ethnicity came into question because his father, Anton Milch, was alleged to be a Jew. This prompted an investigation by the Gestapo that Göring suppressed by producing an affidavit signed by Milch’s mother stating that Anton was not really the father of Erhard and his six siblings, and naming their true father as Karl Brauer, her deceased uncle. These events and Milch’s subsequently being issued, at Göring’s urging, a German Blood Certificate by Adolf Hitler, prompted Göring to say famously “Wer Jude ist, bestimme ich” (“I decide who is a Jew.”).”
And
“Owing to Finland’s substantial military contribution on the northern flank of the Eastern Front of World War II, Hitler decreed in November 1942 that “from now on Finland and the Finnish people be treated and designated as a Nordic state and a Nordic people”, which he considered one of the highest compliments that the Nazi government could bestow upon another country.”
Here’s another video that might make you feel a little better. It’s embeded in an article at the link. Good article, too.
Anti-Fascists Storm Alt-Reich Dinner
I certainly don’t endorse violence, and I don’t think I’ve ever actually read a Superman comic, but didn’t that dude once fly so fast that time went backwards for a bit? I only ask because, honestly, there’s always time to punch a Nazi.
It’s worth noting, also, that the infamous phrase “sieg heil” translated to English is “hail victory”.
Just in case the whole thing wasn’t already transparent enough.
@ skiriki
A similar tale is told about Fritz Lang (admittedly, by Fritz Lang) of when he met Goebbels. Upon being invited to head up the Reich film industry, Lang informed Goebbels that he was Jewish (because of his mother) and Goebbels supposedly also gave the “I decide who’s Jewish” response.
There has been some debate about the validity of that tale; but a quick Google suggests that it’s now accepted that the basic facts are indeed true.
http://publishing.cdlib.org/ucpressebooks/view?docId=ft5h4nb36j&chunk.id=d0e11855&toc.id=d0e11855&brand=ucpress
Can we call them Alt-Reich now? Since apparently their feelings get hurt when we call them neo-nazis.
Not that they aren’t neo-nazis. I mean, come on. The way he sniggered at his comment about referring to the ‘lying press’ in ‘the original German’, and then being utterly unable to not bottle the nazi urge any more – the sheer glee he expressed while saying ‘lugenpresse’.
These shits have been bottling this for decades, and now that they see the opportunity to be open about it, it’s all starting to overflow. This ain’t gonna be pretty. Ain’t gonna be able to get the cork back on this.
@Scildfreja
With respect, they’re Nazis. That is all they are, and using neo, or Alt-Right, or whatever is just a way for them to hide the fact. Call them what they are, they do not deserve the courtesy of being euphemised for polite society.
Alt-Reich made me smile though.
Agreed! Though, well, the difference between a nazi and a neo-nazi to be is the year on the calendar and nothing more. Completely correct, though, they need to be called out for what they are.
@Rhuu and Steampunked Ah, yes, the halcion days of my m/m fanfic writing ‘career’. *snicker*
Were either of you around during ‘Survey Fail‘? Two neuroscience graduates were trying to get people in slash fandom to do a survey for a book entitled ‘Rule 34: What Netporn Teaches Us About The Brain’. (Click on the link to read about the entire saga, including false claims of affiliation with Boston University, leading questions on surveys and changing the questions after data had already been collected, among other shenanigans.)
Relevant bit: apparently in these two ‘researcher’s’ minds, straight women liking m/m porn is the same as straight men liking … transsexual porn. Cue intense mocking by the fen. 🙂
Unrelated to the Nazis, I have to share this picture. This bug is the prettiest princess.
The card game ‘Illuminati: New World Order’ had as one of its power group cards ‘The Religious Reich’. They’re hardly the only one to use that term, but ‘Religious Reich’ to describe Falwell et al has been in the lexicon for at least a couple of decades now.
Nice orchid mantis. 🙂
I do have an unrelated question, since I am new to the comments here:
There is, according to the Recent Comments sidebar, some necrothread shit going on. Is that a common event or can it be safely ignored?
@Shadowplay
Yes 🙂
It happens semi regularly, but it’s rarely of any import. Check it out if you’re curious, but it’s fine to ignore
Thanks 🙂 . Everywhere is slightly different, it’s always best to ask.
@Scildfreja
That’s a bug?! I thought it was a flower! Definitely the belle of the ball (or beau).