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Watch mad clown Milo melt down during his Out Magazine photoshoot

Mad Milo mansplains feminism to Amanda Marcotte, in drag
Mad Milo mansplains feminism to Amanda Marcotte, in drag.

One of the many strange things about Breitbart’s alleged “tech editor” Milo Yiannopoulos is how much he cares about convincing people he doesn’t care.

The self-described “provocateur” even dressed up as a literal clown for his recent profile in Out Magazine.

You’ve no doubt heard about the Out piece already; it’s been a teensy bit controversial. But what you probably didn’t know is that Salon sent a camera crew to his photoshoot with photographer Jill Greenberg. And that along with the camera crew they sent writer (and friend of We Hunted the Mammoth) Amanda Marcotte.

“Perhaps I got a bit caught up in his self-mythologizing,” she writes in her account of what followed, “which is why I thought he would have some fun answering provocative questions while he was getting his picture taken.”

Turns out Milo did not have much fun with her questions:

I never did get good answers to my questions, though I did learn that Yiannopoulos likes to reduce feminism to “angry lesbians” supposedly tricking naive young women into getting too fat to get boyfriends.

But I did learn one important fact: Milo Yiannopoulos is not playing around. He is utterly sincere about his far right views.

He is sincere enough that he lectured me for about 15 minutes, and got so caught up in the moment that he seemingly forgot that he was half-naked while wearing a wig and make-up. He was sincere enough to get genuinely wound up during this time.

Ultimately, he was having so little fun with her questions that he — perhaps channeling his idol Donald Trump — threw a fit and demanded she leave the premises.

He was so sincere that, when the Salon team shut off the cameras in order to move into another vantage point, he demanded that I leave the room, refused to answer any more questions, and called me a “bitch.”

The best part of all this? You can watch some of these testy exchanges on video over on Salon. There are two different versions of the video posted there; the one at the top has more Milo in it.

Turns out Milo is not so much a sad clown as a mad clown.

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KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Policy

I forgot to write, a person can be envious about women (that they are women) without having to be trans at all. I don’t even know why I have to explain that. I thought it’s self evident!

@dlouwe, is this above answering your question?

Viscaria
Viscaria
4 years ago

Yeah, see, no, because that doesn’t work. You can’t draw a connection, based on absolutely nothing, between misogyny and femininity and then claim it only exists under certain circumstances, so it’s okay. You are connecting the two concepts. You are also:

1) Ignoring that trans women experience misogyny and have way less of a reason to perpetuate it than men do

2) Misgendering trans women by referring to them as men who “want to be women.” If you want to be a woman, then you are one, full stop.

3) Misgendering many gay men, who do not “want to be women” (ie are not trans women) just because they seem feminine to you

4) Making me really angry

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
4 years ago

@Mary
http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/nnnn.gif

@Ketchup No More (not that you should care, but fuckin with your name means I’ve decided you’re a complete shit)

don’t troll me

http://www.attendly.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/kanye-west-are-you-serious-gif.gif

It can’t be hard to comprehend that

comment image

And now bye bye. Troll others here

http://cdn.niketalk.com/b/b9/350x700px-LL-b93d524e_dwade-damn-sip-water_nr3ci8.gif
You do realize you said that last time, and we still beefin. Ain’t shit changed…

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

Only if you apply that all trans people are misogynists. (Which is nowhere to be true)

I never claimed (nor do I think) that feminine men want to be women.

I talk about feminine misogynists. I have come to believe this from personal encounters with such men. And over some literature I’ve been reading. I haven’t been mentioning the literature before, as my opinion is only losely based on that. But if you are interested, I have writen the name of the book in the post above.

You can keep doubling down until you are at 2 to the nth power, and that doesn’t make what you’re saying any less anti-trans.

I don’t misunderstand you, fool. I am calling you out as sliming trans women. Go ahead and repeat your slurs 10 more times, they won’t become any less anti-trans with repetition.

dlouwe
dlouwe
4 years ago

@KafkaNoMore

No, not really. You keep saying “women” but I feel like you mean “cis women” and you haven’t clarified that at all.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Viscaria

It is my fault as I have expressed it wrongly in my opening post.

I don’t believe that they are trans (femmy misogynists).

But they experience envy towards women and this is why they have to devalue them.

And please finaly learn, please that I don’t talk about femmy gay men. OK???

I talk about femmy misogynists! Can we get over this please…

weirwoodtreehugger: communist bonobo

Kafkanomore,

Given that trans women are often called men who want women or men who want to dress up like women, it’s really fucking problematic to speculate that a man wants to be woman. Especially if the reason for that speculation is because he’s an asshole.

Has Milo ever said that he wants to be a woman? No? Then shut the fuck up. Whether you intend to cause splash damage or not, you are.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

Dlouwe,

Why is it important if it is cis-women?

I don’t mean trans-women (I know that trans-women are also women).

But I rather mean the bilogical functions associated with femininity (bearing children) would be one aspect, breastfeeding, etc.

@Policy

There is no need for such rudeness. I have never referred to trans-woman or femmy gay men.

I since the beginning only and only referre to feminine misogynists.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@wierwood

I agree with you (as I have written above, I have expressed it wrongly in the opening post).

Instead of “wanting to be women” I should’ve written envious of women because of the bilogical functions assosiated with women.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

There is no need for such rudeness.

Yeah, there is. There is nothing civil about anti-trans bullshit, so don’t pretend you are being polite. When someone pull shit out of their ass like yours, rudeness is the correct response.

Lady Mondegreen
Lady Mondegreen
4 years ago

Yeah, see, no, because that doesn’t work. You can’t draw a connection, based on absolutely nothing, between misogyny and femininity and then claim it only exists under certain circumstances, so it’s okay. You are connecting the two concepts.

He didn’t say misogyny and femininity are connected. He said feminine men who are misogynists may envy women.

“I have seen some blue cats who wear purple but hate purple cats. I suspect they may secretly envy them.” In what sense have I “connected” purple and hatred? I have not suggested one is an inherent aspect of the other.

Some racist white men may envy black men. Envy may sometimes be a part of hatred. And nobody is exempt from envy.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Policy

I am not pulling shit out of my as. There is literature written about it.

I have never referred to trans-women.

I have referred to femmy misogynists that are envious of women (without having to be trans, or having the desire to be trans).

But I have expressed that wrongly in the opening post. I hope that this is clear now.

If not just don’t address me anymore, because I don’t discuss with people that take everything as a insult

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

If not just don’t address me anymore, because I don’t discuss with people that take everything as a insult

LOL like you get to tell me what to do.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Lady Morgan

Thank you, that is what I tried to say.

I agree that I have expressed it wrongly in my opening post, but I have corrected it by now.

Still I don’t see how people can drag it out of context so such extreme degrees like some individuals here.

And, I am a woman btw, but it doesn’t matter 🙂

Viscaria
Viscaria
4 years ago

I talk about femmy misogynists! Can we get over this please…

Like, no. No we cannot. What if I were to say “complete assholes who mention Kafka in their screen names are definitely assholes because of the Kafka thing. That’s definitely what makes them assholes, no question. But other people with Kafka in their screen names, that’s a whole different story.” Would you feel that the connection I’m drawing between Kafka and assholishness doesn’t apply in your particular case? That there isn’t splash damage there? And, if you ever did take a step wrong, do you think I’m going to attribute that to your screen name?

Distinguishing between Bad Gays and Good Gays doesn’t help anyone, because Good Gays are standing on a knife edge. Bad Gay is just one mistake away.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Policy,

Whatever, if you can’t discuss with me without being extra rude, than I won’t reply to you anymore.

Bye, bye, bye

weirwoodtreehugger: communist bonobo

Instead of “wanting to be women” I should’ve written envious of women because of the bilogical functions assosiated with women.

The bigger issue is that

1. You doubled down rather than apologizing. Especially because a number of the people who objected are LGBTQ.

2. This isn’t actually that much better because you’re equating being a woman with bearing children. Lot’s of women can’t, won’t or don’t want to do that. They’re still women.

3. It’s still keyboard diagnosing and it’s still pathologizing gayness (even if it’s just the bad ones) in a way that’s uncomfortably similar to the way so called “penis envy” was used against women (but just the bad ones. Don’t worry!) and kind of still is.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

Whatever, if you can’t discuss with me without being extra rude, than I won’t reply to you anymore.

No problem, troll. Keep doubling-down, it will definitely convince me and everyone that you are well-meaning and not a troll at all. That’s certainly not a thing trolls ever do.

weirwoodtreehugger: communist bonobo

I am not pulling shit out of my as. There is literature written about it.

If a book was written about it, it must be true!
comment image

http://www.slate.com/content/dam/slate/archive/2003/07/1_123125_123050_2076385_2085182_030724_treason_bookcover.jpg.CROP.original-original.jpg
comment image

Oh, wait.

I’ll never not find the oppressive feeemale butt theory funny.

Scildfreja Unnýðnes
Scildfreja Unnýðnes
4 years ago

@All, I’m still thinking about this conversation. There’s a misfire going on here, of that I have no doubt. There’s some sort of mathematical wrongness here, a causal slip that’s fueling this argument. Still thinking about it.

In the meantime, @Kafkanomore is referencing womb envy, a feminist extension of Freudian thought suggesting that misogyny results from envy of female sexuality and the functions of the womb and/or vagina. I’d point out that there’s almost no actual empirical evidence on this, much the same as the “penis envy” nonsense. It’s baseless, much like most Freudian-esque theories. The Wikipedia article links to the theory and its critiques, for those interested.

(I do wish all the Freudian nonsense would evaporate, but it has some real cultural weight to it. It feels *good* to say “you’re rotten ’cause you’re just jealous!”, but it really, really doesn’t work that way)

Im’a think about it a bit more. In the meantime, please, don’t be too angry with one another? 🙂

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

Viscaria,

I can’t really understand your analogy there.

But if assholes that have Kafka in their screen name devalue/hate other people that are not assholes but have Kafka in their screen name, because of the word Kafka, we can than conclude that there maybe a correlation with the word Kafka, with the first and second group

It sound’s silly, but this is how I would construct that analogy

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
4 years ago

@Kazakhstan

There is no need for such rudeness

Tone policing
http://65.media.tumblr.com/6b17c491fc614d94a45c56a652fa5dfb/tumblr_inline_njf9rvkM2f1t10bt3.gif

And, I am a woman btw, but it doesn’t matter

Not even a little bit

@Mondegreen
1)Purple wearing cats don’t hafta deal with people claiming they aren’t really purple, and blue cats don’t hafta deal with being called purple for not living up to the norms of blueness
2)clothing is neither gender nor orientation

Logically, you’re right. But only logically…

Viscaria
Viscaria
4 years ago

@Lady Mondegreen

“I have seen some blue cats who wear purple but hate purple cats. I suspect they may secretly envy them.” In what sense have I “connected” purple and hatred? I have not suggested one is an inherent aspect of the other.

In your example, the wearing of purple is shown as evidence that the cats wish to be purple. That, in turn, is given as the reason for the hatred. Wearing purple -> wanting purple -> hatred.

There is important context missing from your example, also. Specifically: 1) People believe trans women are inherently bad. Anything negative that they do is attributed to their transness. 2) Trans women are thought to be an extra-gay category of gay men, not real women. 3) We also think gay men who are insufficiently “manly” are inherently bad.

Schnookums Von Fancypants, Social Justice Wario
Schnookums Von Fancypants, Social Justice Wario
4 years ago

Hey, if you disagree with KafkaNoMore, just state that it’s your opinion! That magically absolves you from having to actually any proof or evidence of any sort!

Here, I’ll give it a try: I believe that people who choose screen names like KafkaNoMore are secretly Manatees that have managed to get internet access. If you disagree, well that’s just my opinion, which means not only do I not have to prove it, but it also somehow is just as valid as any other opinion!

Steampunked
Steampunked
4 years ago

Unconnected…rambling, but. Milo reminds me, a little, of an ex-boss of mine back when I was in the hellish salt mines of magazine work. This guy was NOWHERE near as bad as Milo, but we were doing a sort of hip inner city guide, and one article was on bras and where to buy nice ones. There were only two women in the office, there was my boss and his boyfriend, and some other dudes.

Boss thought it was an AWESOME idea to refer to bras with slang instead of using the word bra, you know, like women do. Tit slings, bitch covers, over the shoulder boulder holder, boob bondage. Not even the cute terms, just generally objectifying and gross ones.

The women, all two of us, were: Errrhhh, no, that feels weird and bad.

It got kind of weirder after that. The straight office guys thought it was awesome, the gay office guys informed them this was how Cool Women talked in secret – by definition, since we didn’t like it, we weren’t cool. The other woman in the office was queer too, but her view was worth less than his when it came to fashion, because queer dudes were coded fashionable and queer women unfashionable.

In the end we got marked as having no sense of humour, and the men all bonded over it. A real outlier for me, but it was my first introduction to a thankfully rare phenomenon.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

Boss thought it was an AWESOME idea to refer to bras with slang instead of using the word bra, you know, like women do. Tit slings, bitch covers, over the shoulder boulder holder, boob bondage. Not even the cute terms, just generally objectifying and gross ones.

LOL. Nothing says hip to me like euphemisms that wouldn’t be out of place on an elementary school playground.

How did it go over with the readership, do you know?

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Wirewood

I don’t equate being a women with bearing children. But if you like it or not, most women do bear cildren.

Penis envy must manifest itself somehow, but it doesn’t, so there is no proof for it’s existence.

@Scildfreja and also @wirewood, the control over women’s wombs (envy) manifests itself throughout history and still today across the globe.

And feminine misogynists are a perfect example of that, people that devalue the feminine assiciations in women, but not in themselves.

Scildfreja Unnýðnes
Scildfreja Unnýðnes
4 years ago

@Steampunked, oh god, I sympathize so much. I am basically considered The Wet Blanket With No Humour by half of my social circles because I don’t make terrible jokes about minorities and get grumpy when they tell sexist jokes. “Lol, guys, lookit this meme! It’s got a ‘#justgirlythings’ poster on the top, and then some military doods bein’ awesome on the bottom! Womz are so girly and foolish, right? lawl, why don’t they like serious awesome things like guns and tanks and stuff instead of their stupid frou-frou cocktails and walks on the beach?” Makes my eyes cross!

(The sexist jokes are usually followed by self-bashing pity parties about how they can’t keep girlfriends, so that’s a thing.)

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

Instead of “wanting to be women” I should’ve written envious of women because of the bilogical functions assosiated with women.

I don’t equate being a women with bearing children.

Jesus Christ, how do you type both of these sentences and not realize how not-compatible they are?

weirwoodtreehugger: communist bonobo

secretly Manatees

I do an image search for that. Because why not?

This is what I found

comment image

I’m very confused.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Schnookums, of course we discuss personal beliefs here, that are based on some literature and personal experience.

That is not proof. But guess what, neither is the literature posted above by wirewood proof to the contrary.

What a silly reason that you attack me.

Lady Mondegreen
Lady Mondegreen
4 years ago

But only logically

Right. I’m out. I value good epistemology–and openness to honest disagreement–over whatever is going on here.

See you on another thread.

Scildfreja Unnýðnes
Scildfreja Unnýðnes
4 years ago

@Kafkanomore,

the control over women’s wombs (envy) manifests itself throughout history and still today across the globe.

And feminine misogynists are a perfect example of that, people that devalue the feminine assiciations in women, but not in themselves.

That’s the theory, yes! I’m looking through the literature, though, and it seems like the actual evidence for it is very sparse. Kinda like Freud’s penis envy, there’s not much evidence that people actually work in the way that the womb envy theory describes. White paper searches are pulling up more hits about the behaviour of bees than they are about anything else. (Okay, a touch of hyperbole there, but still! Not far from!)

I don’t generally work with these sorts of psychosexual theories, my work’s more on cognition and knowledge than this area of psychology, but I know enough to get a bad taste in my mouth while reading this stuff over. It feels wrong, it feels like a just-so story in the same way Freud’s theories were. They imply unconscious behaviours without actually proving that those unconscious motivations exist – they assume far too much without providing justification for those assumptions. It feels like bad science.

Again, still reading. Maybe I’ll find something! I’ll point out that the current champion of the theory, Brian Luke, was formerly an assistant professor of philosophy (not psychology, gender studies, or something related to womb envy theory), and is currently a student at Trinity Lutheran Seminary, according to this “Brutal” book you’ve linked. I’m not sure if I’d consider him to be a stellar source. But again, we’ll see!

EDIT for correctness: Mr Luke is not a Doctor.

PocketNerd
PocketNerd
4 years ago
Reply to  Nequam

Thus Spake ZaraNequam:

Aside to PocketNerd: tags use angle brackets here.

I’m aware, but thank you. I just got my forum and blog wires crossed. (^_^);;

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Policy

Don’t troll me

Different people have different definitions of what a woman is and does. The Feminist/Queer theory differs a lot from the conservative one. There is no global conensus on that.

So (I personaly don’t equate women with bearing children) but others do, and others may be envious on that specific function.

Or they could be envious on cis-women, not for bearing children, but for getting the men they want to have etc. etc.

Or they could be envious that men they want to have rather choose a cis-woman because she can give birth to offspring.

With they I mean feminine misogynists

Don’t troll me and don’t take things out of context

Bye bye now, I will not be replying on your trolling

Ktoryx
Ktoryx
4 years ago

If I hide behind the lettuce, no one will know I’m a manatee…”

Schnookums Von Fancypants, Social Justice Wario
Schnookums Von Fancypants, Social Justice Wario
4 years ago

What a silly reason that you attack me.

I believe it to be a perfectly good reason to attack you, since you want to just hand-wave proving your “belief”.

But I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree.

dlouwe
dlouwe
4 years ago

@KafkaNoMore

Why is it important if it is cis-women?

Because saying “women” when you mean “cis women” is trans erasure, so cut it out.

(Like, on top of that you’re wrong, but others are doing well enough addressing that part)

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Scilfreja

We agree to disagree then. Not everything that Freud wrote about is bullcrap and not everything that the womb envy theory suggests can be discarded.

But psychology is like that, it is not something that can be easily proven or disproven.

Good luck with your research, no matter what kind of conclusions you arrive at the end.

PocketNerd
PocketNerd
4 years ago

KafkaNoMore, may I humbly suggest you stop digging?

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
4 years ago

Don’t troll me

Yeah, I’m definitely the troll here. I’m sure.

Different people have different definitions of what a woman is and does.

Fuck that. The only thing that you’re demonstrating is YOUR definition, which is bullshit. You directly contradicted yourself when you forgot for a second that you’re playing a character who isn’t anti-trans. That’s what happens when you lie about yourself: you wind up a 329 year old engineer.

With they I mean feminine misogynists

Why the fuck do you keep harping on feminine misogynists? Why is it so fucking important to you that they be feminine and have woman-envy, with “woman” being synonymous with “people who have functional uteri” except when you are pretending to be trans-inclusive for a hot minute? Why is this the hill you’re willing to die on? I can tell you why it’s mine: I have zero tolerance for trans-intolerance. You want to say anti-trans things and still pat yourself on the back for your trans-inclusiveness, and I’m not fucking having that.

Bye bye now, I will not be replying on your trolling

Promises, promises.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Schnookums

I don’t. You could’ve written that you disagree with me. I don’t care.

These particular theories can neither be proven nor disproven.

@dlouwe, ok, I mean cis-women, hope this now answers your question

weirwoodtreehugger: communist bonobo

the control over women’s wombs (envy) manifests itself throughout history and still today across the globe.

Funny how I didn’t see you in the Andrew Anglin thread arguing that he has womb envy. Even though he’s explicitly arguing that white women’s wombs belong to white men and should be controlled by them.

Steampunked
Steampunked
4 years ago

@Policy_of_Madness
Do you know, I have no real idea. The whole thing folded due to a misunderstanding of how much capital a startup requires (ie., two years total costs), and I was only part time myself. I remember being just so fucking puzzled, like…it was an alien world to me. I couldn’t speak the language. There was a cocktail bar opening and I met a few fashion editors of women’s fashion and they were almost all very flirty men. I was supposed to shmooze, and I didn’t know how, but it did become obvious that there was a specific way fashion was supposed to work. Light hearted, sexy, effortless, all of that coded stuff that makes you fun? I couldn’t do it. Besides, I’m not conventionally attractive and I’m a nerd. I suspect the article went down well, from the fashionista reaction to it, I fear.

I was used to the goth scene, also full of open queer folk and with a strong appearance aesthetic, but the goth scene has very different internalised norms on physical contact and acceptable humour. And everyone bloody well knows teasing your hair up to look like the Bride of Frankenstein takes hours. Effortless, my ass.

@Scildfreja Unnýðnes (Undertale?)
Yeah, in the swallow shit or ruin an afternoon scenario, I usually go for mutual annihilation 🙂

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@wierwood

I don’t know who andrew anglin is. I now googled him and he is a nazi-right winger as far as I understood.

Don’t you think that he isn’ t envious about women baring children? Something he has no control over?

White women can sleep with different races, he has no control over it.

He can’t just by himself pump out an army of white babies, he has to control white women…

(That’s what I get about this man from your post)

Sound pretty much like womb envy, but is not manifesting itself as in feminine misogynists.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
4 years ago

Actually glad I missed all this. Jebus.

Scildfreja Unnýðnes
Scildfreja Unnýðnes
4 years ago

@Scilfreja

We agree to disagree then. Not everything that Freud wrote about is bullcrap and not everything that the womb envy theory suggests can be discarded.

But psychology is like that, it is not something that can be easily proven or disproven.

Good luck with your research, no matter what kind of conclusions you arrive at the end.

Thank you! The research is on pause, i’m sorta on the unemployment queue as of November! Lab lost funding for the winter. Back in May at the latest, though.

As for the womb theory stuff, well, yes, we will have to agree to disagree! Do realize, though, that you disagree in the face of most people working in that field, and have pinned your hopes to someone who isn’t actually a psychologist, but someone who’s studying in a seminary. Shaky ground.

(Also, the rationalist in me is screaming at me to say that the unprovability of the womb theory is very much not a point in its favour. I could present a number of points of evidence against it if you’d like; we know a lot more about what motivates people than we did in the late 30’s when the theory was first proposed, after all…)

Anyways! You’ve sorta said that you’re gonna believe it regardless of the evidence, so I’ll stop hunting. Interesting topic, though, thank you.

weirwoodtreehugger: communist bonobo

Hint: look in the recent post portion of the sidebar and click on the title with the word “womb” in it.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@Scildfreja

I am sorry for the unemployment thing.

No, I haven’t said that I will believe it regardless of any evidence, I just believe that it is to not completely possible to prove or disprove psychological theories.

Especially if manifestations can be seen in everyday life. But yeah, thank you for the discussion and good luck.

KafkaNoMore
KafkaNoMore
4 years ago

@wierwood

I can’t find where this is right now, it’s 4am, my concentration is gone

If I find time I will search for it tomorrow night (actualy today night).

If not…thanx for the discussion

Good night