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Why are Bernie supporters posting anti-Hillary memes inspired by Trump fans and literal Nazis?

Hillary Clinton as "le Happy Merchant." Found on the Bernie Sanders Dank Meme Stash Facebook page
Hillary Clinton as “le Happy Merchant.” Found on the Bernie Sanders Dank Meme Stash Facebook page

If the remaining #BernieOrBusters want to convince the world that they are something other than “ridiculous” — as the far more grounded Bernie fan Sarah Silverman so aptly characterized them at the DNC last week — the Bernie Sanders Dank Meme Stash on Facebook isn’t exactly helping.

Bernie himself has bowed to political realities, endorsing Hillary and lending his support for her fight against Trump. Not so Bernie’s Dank Memers. The anti-Trump memes there are surprisingly few and far between. Far more common are memes supporting the Green party’s Jill Stein. And far more common than those are memes attacking Hillary and her supporters with all the subtlety of a channer who’s just mastered MSPaint.

While the anti-Hillary sentiment isn’t that much of a surprise, what is surprising, even a little shocking, is how utterly backwards many of the memes are, echoing classic misogynistic tropes and tinfoil-hat conspiracy theories, and in a few cases, even more bizarrely, repurposing antisemitic propaganda popular amongst GamerGaters and Internet Nazis.

Why would the supporters of a Jewish socialist repeatedly post pictures of Hillary Clinton as the “Happy Merchant?” You’ll have to ask them.

Let’s take a look at some of the more, well, colorful memes.

There’s this lovely reworking of an old sexist joke:

bdm1bill

And this slightly more original offering.

bdm2crab

Here’s Hillary as a beauty pageant winner.

bdmhil

And as a porn star:

bdmpor

Here’s a meme inspired, I guess, by Pokemon Go?

bdmpoke

This one manages to add transphobia to the mix:

bdm3penis

This meme links Hillary with a woman who was famously not convicted of murdering her daughter. At least in a court of law; in the court of public opinion she was considered guilty, guilty, guilty. Apparently in the mind of the mememaker, Hillary not being indicted for deleting emails is the literal equivalent of Casey Anthony getting away with murder?

bdm5casey

There are memes that echo Trump’s, er, “critique” of Hillary:

bdm4crooked

This one, while directed at disgraced DNC chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz, offers an apologia of sorts for Melania Trump’s plagiarism.

bdmmelania

And here’s one promoting a hashtag that originated with far-right attack dog — and fervent Trump fan — Mike Cernovich.

bdmtongue

And no, I have no idea what’s really going on with her tongue.

There are some memes that reek of conspiracy theory, though it’s a little hard to tell how many Bernie fans take these seriously.

bdmballoons

There are a surprising number of memes depicting Hillary as a reptilian space alien. I’m going to assume they’re all meant as jokes, because it’s too depressing to contemplate otherwise.

bdmreptiel

Naturally, there are more than a few memes attacking Sarah Silverman for her “ridiculous” remark, with many of the mememakers assuming she was paid to make it.

bdmsara

But it’s the “Happy Merchant” memes that truly baffle.

Here’s a typical “Happy Merchant” meme, using the now-infamous cartoon that originally appeared in a neo-Nazi newsletter.

happy2

And here’s Hillary in the same role, from the Bernie Sanders Dank Meme Stash:

hilhappy

The most depressing thing? This isn’t just some random Facebook page. The Bernie Sanders Dank Meme Stash page has more than 438,000 members. I can only hope most of them are less backwards than those posting memes on the page today.

H/T — r/againstmensrights

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Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ Kat

As for helping the “worried well” (no offense, Alan–you’re a smart guy and a good guy), it helps my cats and plants. I don’t think they could be fooled by a placebo.

Yeah, I think it’s a bit of a disparaging term, but it’s the one they used, hence the quotes.

It is interesting that it seems to work on animals (a friend of mine swears by it for her dog). If we assume it is placebo, how does that transfer? Do the animals pick up on the owners belief or is it just they feel better for the attention and caring?

I defer to your experience, notwithstanding you lose some judgment points for thinking I’m smart 🙂

ETA: I’m a big fan of Bach flower remedies so I certainly not going to be judgmental about this.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@BVH

Hmm. You say that Jill Stein’s a kook and you link to her quote:

We should not be subjecting kids’ brains especially to that. And we don’t follow that issue in this country, but in Europe where they do, they have good precautions around wireless—maybe not good enough, because it’s very hard to study this stuff.

Assuming what she says is true, then Europe is kinda odd too!

I’m no expert on electromagnetic fields, but I’ve listened to a few radio shows about it, so I know that Jill Stein isn’t the only person in the USA speaking out against kids using wireless phones.

I’m not a kid. But I strictly limit my time on my cell phone because my ear gets warm and my head feels buzzy, like there’s too much energy in it.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Alan
Flower remedies!

Like homeopathy, Bach flower remedies are energetic medicine.

I’m a big fan too of Bach flower remedies, along with other brands of flower remedies. My cats and plants get them too. A kidney remedy from Pet Essences helped keep my cat with end-stage renal disease alive. She died when she was nineteen and a half.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ Kat

Random musings (it’s one of those days)

Re: electromagnetic interference

I got a client off having to wear a tag because he had a doctors report saying he suffered from that (the tags don’t emit but the transceiver you have in your house does). The court was a bit sceptical but they accepted the report.

Radiation from phones:

Had a case about that once too. Can’t go into details but at one stage got to play with the device they use for measuring radiation. It’s basically a human head model with a detector in it.

“So what do you use to replicate bone?”

“Nothing, that’s a real human skull in there”

*Drops £25,000 worth of expensive equipment*

Flower remedies:

There’s probably a gap in the market for macho versions, so I’m going to knock some up with things like thistles and Venus fly traps.

Ghost Robot
Ghost Robot
4 years ago

I followed the Bernie Sanders Dank Meme Stash right up till the primaries started, only for it to flood my FB timeline. The memes were pretty funny and clever back then, but I can only imagine what it’s like now with the Bernie-or-Bust shitheads and Jill Stein tragics. I regularly tussle with them in other forums – and as an Australian, I don’t strictly have a dog in this hunt – and the sheer volume of overwrought conspiracy babble is as bad as any lunar right nonsense I’ve encountered. I even gave up on one of my favourite American political comedy podcasts recently (The Jimmy Dore Show) after one Bernie-or-Bust tirade too many.

Scildfreja
Scildfreja
4 years ago

We should not be subjecting kids’ brains especially to that. And we don’t follow that issue in this country, but in Europe where they do, they have good precautions around wireless—maybe not good enough, because it’s very hard to study this stuff.

o_o

The dangerous kind of radiation is ionizing radiation.

That’s the sort that actually interacts with larger molecules by busting them apart – those scary Free Radicals that you drink your antioxidants for. (I do love me the cramberry juice)

You will take more ionizing radiation by holding a banana to your ear for a half hour than you will by doing the same for a cellphone.

homeopathy

Please don’t take this the wrong way, @Kat! <3

Homeopathy does have a long and venerable history, and it does work. Just like a placebo. Placebos are useful! Placebos aren’t a fake thing, they have real-world biological effects. They can be very pronounced!

And, yes, there’s good evidence that mammals experience the placebo effect as well. For example:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19912522

There’s no evidence to suggest that homeopathy is anything but placebo in action. That doesn’t make it worthless, though! The big questions are 1) whether the effect of the treatment is sufficient for you, 2) whether there isn’t a more comprehensive treatment available for you, and 3) whether your provider is either treating you with respect or taking advantage of you (with high prices, for example).

Investigate #2 and #3, but if #1 is true? Go ahead and keep taking it. That’s a real effect, and not at all a sign of weakness or gullibility.

Bernie and the Election

I am Canadian so don’t really have any horse in the race, so to speak, beyond all of my lovely american friends whom I care for a great deal. I supported Bernie because he represented a change in the way the game of politics is played down there, a change towards honesty and the removal of corporate influence. A pivot away from the oligarchy which the United States has become.

That said? Politics isn’t about getting a person into an office. I never supported Bernie for Bernie, I supported him because I like his ideas. I still do – and I see that Hillary has started talking about the same things. She also has a lot of good things to say of her own, too, things that Bernie frequently ducked and dodged.

I’m pleased as punch that Bernie’s supporting her, and that their platforms have merged into the Democratic platform. The next step is getting her elected, but the big one – the important one – is to hold her feet to the fire once she’s in. Make sure that she follows through on that platform. That takes a level of political interest and activity in the general American populace that hasn’t been seen in some time. It’s my hope that the Bernie phenomenon represents that, but we’ll see after the election.

Right! Enough rambling. <3 everyone, ta.

(((Hambeast))) Now With Extra Parentheses
(((Hambeast))) Now With Extra Parentheses
4 years ago

Dalilama – You’re certainly not wrong in anything that you replied to me, so no, I’m not offended by it.

None of that changes the fact that the Khan’s lost their son in military service and that Trump decided that they were a suitable tweet-target for saying things about him that he considered “unfair” or whatever. (Ever notice how Trumplethinskin is never simply offended, but rather being “treated unfairly”?)

Having a standing military force is kind of fraught, if I think about it. Military members join for lots of reasons, but all know that it can result in injury and death and for reasons that they may or may not agree with.

Recruiters have long said that military service is basically just like a regular job, and it is for the most part, except you live and work with the possibility of doing it in a war zone at the behest of people who never live with that risk.

buttercupia
4 years ago

I feel proud that I made it to the end of the comments. Long time lurker, first time commenter, life time feminist, I’m with her.

Interesting to think that trumpheads might be driving the dank meme stuff. I have a couple of hard core BoBers on my facebook feed and i’ve never seen anything this atrocious come across courtesy of any of them. But I’m old enough to remember when the vast right wing conspiracy started, and it never really stopped, and it feels like misogyny is getting uglier and uglier all the time, which helps all this along.

I admire the skill of the commentariat here.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Scildfreja

You will take more ionizing radiation by holding a banana to your ear for a half hour than you will by doing the same for a cellphone.

I usually have links to support what I’m saying. I don’t have that kind of time right now.

I’ll just say this: (1) Other people report the same phenomenon; (2) I have to rely on what my body tells me is true for me; (3) Science doesn’t know everything.

Please don’t take this the wrong way, @Kat! <3

No worries. I know that you have no interest in hurting my feelings. (Visualize a sideways heart here.)

Homeopathy does have a long and venerable history, and it does work. Just like a placebo. Placebos are useful! Placebos aren’t a fake thing, they have real-world biological effects. They can be very pronounced!

I’ve got nothing against the placebo effect. I’d be very happy for it to work for me. But when it comes to homeopathy (and Bach flower remedies and acupuncture and all energetic medicine, that is, medicine that works on a subtle level), it’s important to get the right remedy for your symptoms. Yes, the remedy that’s not quite appropriate might very well help you. (Or not.) But the remedy that’s truly appropriate can do amazing things.

One homeopath who treated me really did have a jerky side to his personality. Ick. But his remedies worked very, very well. Yay!

My current acupuncturist is very nice but the language barrier can be formidable (she’s a native of China). Because of that language barrier, I spent many treatments lying in an uncomfortable position on the table. (Not anymore; I finally made myself understood.) Despite that discomfort, I returned time and again because her treatments worked.

The study about epileptic dogs and the placebo effect was intriguing. What the abstract did not discuss was any theory as to why it worked. Possibly they got extra attention.

My plants and cats get their remedies in their food or water. That’s zero extra attention. When my cats are in greater need, I’ll rub the flower essence into their skin several times a day. That’s extra attention, but it involves wetness on animals that notoriously hate wetness.

The big questions are 1) whether the effect of the treatment is sufficient for you, 2) whether there isn’t a more comprehensive treatment available for you, and 3) whether your provider is either treating you with respect or taking advantage of you (with high prices, for example).

Yeah, I’ve used conventional medicine, which in the USA can be staggeringly expensive. Alternative medicine is often less expensive — way less expensive. Over-the-counter homeopathic pills or flower remedies are about $10 to $14. If something doesn’t work, I move on. If it does work, it has an extra economic advantage.

For example, my acupuncturist virtually (99.9 percent) cured the eczema I had experienced for many years. I was so happy to go off cortisone, which got more and more expensive and has nasty side effects.

The bottom line? I feel better. Conventional medicine has come through for me sometimes. Alternative medicine has come through for me more often.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Alan

Flower remedies:

There’s probably a gap in the market for macho versions, so I’m going to knock some up with things like thistles and Venus fly traps.

You’ll need some people to test that stuff on. I’d be happy to test the thistles — I need more protective energy in my personality.

Venus flytraps? You’ve gone too far!

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
4 years ago

@Kat

Science doesn’t know everything

“Of course science doesn’t know everything. That’s the point. If science knew everything, it’d stop” -paraphrased, Dara O’Brien

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Axecalibur
Yes, that’s exactly what I’m saying.

And it’s true about every field of study and every field of endeavor. (Or at least that’s what it looks like to this human, here and now. I keep an open mind!)

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
4 years ago

@Kat

Yes, that’s exactly what I’m saying

Not really… Doesn’t matter, talk of this subject just makes me tired, and it’s important to me that we get along, so I’ll leave y’all to it. Laterz

Dalillama
4 years ago

@Hambeast

(Ever notice how Trumplethinskin is never simply offended, but rather being “treated unfairly”?)

No, I never pay any attention to what politicians say if I can avoid it. That said, it’s a pretty standard right-wing routine; there’s a quote going around the internet to the effect that when one is used to privilege then equality feels like oppression. Also he’s a whiny spoiled jackass.

Having a standing military force is kind of fraught, if I think about it.

Very much so. I am a staunch advocate for its total abolition, ASAP. I would personally prefer to abolish the National Guard as well, but I realize that’s a bridge to far for many. At any rate, the Guard, Air Guard, and Coast Guard are more than sufficient to deal with any current or foreseeable military threat to the U.S. (as a note, there are no current military threats to the U.S. and wouldn’t be even if we melted all our guns tomorrow).

Military members join for lots of reasons, but all know that it can result in injury and death and for reasons that they may or may not agree with.

Recruiters have long said that military service is basically just like a regular job, and it is for the most part, except you live and work with the possibility of doing it in a war zone at the behest of people who never live with that risk.

A lot of jobs offer the chance of dying at the behest of someone who doesn’t face your risks. Some of them underpin industrial civilization (mining, frex.), or indeed human society itself (farming, hunting, fishing). Virtually none, however, call upon you to kill strangers because other strangers told you to. That is where the problems start to come up for me. I recognize that people join for a lot of reasons, often including a strong element of economic necessity, but that doesn’t change the essential nature of the job. I generally do not judge individual members of a military organization for the operations of same, but neither will I agree that it’s worthy of more respect than any other stressful, strenuous job, of which there are a myriad, most of them of far more use to society than an army.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
4 years ago

Assuming what she says is true

That’s kind of a big assumption though. I’ve lived in Europe all my life, and I’ve never heard anything about this.

In general, when American politicians or pundits talk about what “they do in Europe”, the truth is normally closer to “someone in Europe did this once, I’ve heard”.

Johanna "Actually Godzilla" Roberts
Johanna "Actually Godzilla" Roberts
4 years ago

Wow. I’m glad I took a break from this.

Hey, Squirrel, no one is going to fucking kill you for a fucking bumper sticker. My life, my family, we are actually AT RISK. So you can take your victim complex and fucking shove it.

Fuck you from a victim of abuse and extreme bullying. I love being told I can’t be angry for people implying my life isn’t worth enough to actually follow through on the ideas Bernie pushed by drifting to the Green party which is full of anti-science jack assery.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v145/Sephirajo/tumblr_mmntq4h7yi1qa69wso5_500_zps897fccb8.gif

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@IP
I can’t say for sure. I did an Internet search but came up with nothing conclusive to this non-science major.

But what I said before still stands. I rely mostly on how things feel to my body.

Tragedy of the Commas
Tragedy of the Commas
4 years ago

A thing this thread has really put into perspective is–whatever the flaws of the Democrats or the DNC–how much from a privileged position it is to say that, in this election, that Trump is a typical Republican, no more dangerous than the others have been, or that others are wrong for saying only the Democrats have a real chance for defeating Trump. Real people’s lives, from not having to fear a police state to bodily autonomy, are at stake.

I’m re-reading this piece on the “perils of lesser evilism” by Matt Taibbi. In light of the comments here, it just comes off as an attack on straw men. No one here, for example, is saying that Democrats must never be criticized. He certainly doesn’t address how Nader actually helped change anything or fostered a Green movement, e.g. what Freemage spoke of earlier.

@ Ghost Robot

Did you see Sam Seder’s debate with Jimmy Dore? It’s very long, but kind of a nice counter to the TYT’s crew Bernie or Bust-ing.

Catalpa
Catalpa
4 years ago

You will take more ionizing radiation by holding a banana to your ear for a half hour than you will by doing the same for a cellphone.
I usually have links to support what I’m saying. I don’t have that kind of time right now.

I’ll just say this: (1) Other people report the same phenomenon; (2) I have to rely on what my body tells me is true for me; (3) Science doesn’t know everything.

The Nocebo Effect (the placebo effect but it causes harm instead of health, due to belief in the effects) is also a real thing, and something that produces real symptoms.

Ddog
Ddog
4 years ago

I don’t know if it’s quite appropriate but a friends relative died recently because they decided to go with homeopathic remedies instead of chemo to rest their cancer. They died. Not in comfort either.

I don’t think it’s fair to be peddling that kind of alternative medicine stuff here guys. If commenters disagree fair enough I’ll just stay out of it, but that “science doesn’t know everything” stuff actually harms a lot more people than it helps. Sorry if this hurts feelings, but that just spreads non info and fear (the whole wireless radiation thing) and it’s quite raw for me.

Fair enough it might have worked for you but it worked the way lucky charms work. Again I’ll shut up if people disagree but this stuff really gets my goat.

Also thank you Axecalibur, that Dara O Briain quote Is one of my faves.

marinerachel
marinerachel
4 years ago

Science is a toolkit. It knows literally nothing. People apply it and, from doing so and upholding their results to the rigorous standards or peer review and then repeating, science provides us with knowledge.

Homeopathy demonstrably doesn’t work. Water doesn’t possess memory. Homeopathy is no more effective at treatment of anything than chance or placebo. People die when they reject evidence-based medicine in favour of homeopathic remedies. Penelope Dingle’s horrific death by colorectal cancer, which may have been quite treatable if medical intervention had occurred early, is but one sad example of this.

If using non-evidence-based remedies for non-life-threatening conditions makes you feel better, that’s great. Placebo is real. Spend your money however you like. Promoting them as legitimate medicine based on personal anecdotes though is not cool and I really don’t think peddling such here (or, in my personal opinion, anywhere but that’s neither here nor there) is acceptable.

Cellphones and WiFi aren’t harming people or any animal. Yes, they radiate. Different kind of radiation. Words like “radiation” shouldn’t frighten people and necessarily influence their decision making but most of us are woefully uneducated, particularly in chemistry and physics, and so charlatans and cranks and quacks can use them against us.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Ddog, @marinerachel

You’re making a leap of logic. You seem to think that I would tell someone with cancer to ignore what their doctor says. Not true.

You also seem to think that my opinions are like an out-of-control fire and will spread from vulnerable building to vulnerable building and then — who knows?! Also not true.

My opinions are just that: my opinions. And they are not dangerous.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

Paging EJ

Hey, didn’t know you were down our way. Pop in for a cup of tea.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/02/lion-on-the-loose-in-cornwall-sparks-police-hunt1/

rugbyyogi
rugbyyogi
4 years ago

my ex just shared the Hillary ‘happy merchant’ meme in Facebook. I can’t believe my son is exposed to his shit several days a week. WTF?

Ddog
Ddog
4 years ago

@Kat thsts a leap right there, I never said you’d tell someone to do that but I do think talking about these things like they actually do work is dangerous since it can be pushed easily on vulnerable people. Commenters here regularly call out bullshit whether they’re just someone’s opinion or not. In my opinion peddling alternative medicine is actually dangerous so I called you out on it.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Ddog

I’m peddling alternative medicine — even though I have nothing to sell.

You’re warning people against a real and present danger — but I’m reasonably sure that I won’t see you in front of Whole Foods this weekend, protesting their sale of homeopathic remedies.

https://www.boironusa.com/wheretobuy/

booburry
booburry
4 years ago

I think it’s important to push back on woo woo medicine and junk science, even if it’s just someone’s opinion. There are always lurkers reading and I’d rather them see what science actually says about any given topic if possible. I don’t really see what is objectionable about it, I guess.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

It’s amazing what Cuba has done with health care, especially given that their GNP per capita is $2,270 (2005 figures). At the very least, one could conclude that alternative medicine hasn’t hurt them.

Family Medicine in Cuba: Community-Oriented Primary Care and Complementary and Alternative Medicine

Cuba’s GNP per capita is one of the lowest in the Western hemisphere (Table 1). Nonetheless, Cuba, unlike most Latin American countries, has achieved health outcomes comparable with those of the United States (Table 1).

In Cuba, family physicians learn the science of CAM [complementary and alternative medicine]in medical school. Students spend 200 hours in the first 2 years of medical school on CAM rotations (Figure 4). In addition, it is integrated into physiology, anatomy, and clinical courses. Examples of CAM taught to Cuban physicians include acupuncture, herbal medicine, trigger point injections (Figure 5), massage, heat therapy, transcutaneous electrical nerve stimulation, magnetic therapy, pyramid therapy, moxibustion, fangotherapy (mud), cupping, laser/photograph therapy, floral/essence therapy, homeopathy, yoga, meditation exercise training, and music and art therapy.

http://www.jabfm.org/content/18/4/297.full

BVH
BVH
4 years ago

Re: Jill Stein’s Wifi Woo

What Scildfreja said.

This link to xkcd might help put things into perspective:

https://blog.xkcd.com/2011/03/19/radiation-chart/
http://xkcd.com/radiation/
http://xkcd.com/radiation/sources.html

The “wifi” conspiracy misinformation takes advantage of the average person’s fuzziness about science. It piggy backs on the message all “radiation” is bad, forgetting that visible light is radiation.

All the “concerns” I’ve read originate from the “woo-sphere”, with non reproducible studies of dubious provenance. For more, Google
wifi radiation snopes site:message.snopes.com

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@BVH
Thanks for that info. I had a look at the chart, some of the links, and Snopes.

Joel Moskowitz, PhD, at the University of California School of Public Health believes that we need stronger cell phone radiation regulations. He’s got testimony submitted to the FCC on his website. A long list of experts and organizations agree with him, including the American Academy of Pediatrics. So that does seem to support Jill Stein’s concern about cell phones and children.

I tried several times to post a link to Moskowitz’s website without success. Please do a search for this:

joel moskowitz cell phone

Virgin Mary
Virgin Mary
4 years ago

I think the Bernie being a Jewish atheist thing really upset voters. It’s not a done thing in US politics to be irreligious. We had a Jewish atheist Labour leader in Ed Milliband. The papers papped him eating a bacon sandwich.
Jeremy Corbyn has been wiser than to let the press know his spiritual beliefs or lack of them. He comes from a Methodist family, and has been personally involved with multi faith groups. When asked by the Huff Post, he claimed his environmentalism was a for of ‘spiritualism’ and that he was not an atheist.
In the USA, I doubt this would have been good enough. See how Drumpf has got himself ‘in’ with the evangelicals, despite having no former Christian faith. There is actually a video of him and a great swarm of prosperity preachers including TD Jakes, Kenneth Copeland and the Crouches laying hands on him for an ‘anointing’. This is truly sickening, and an affront to honest Christians because they only worship the God of Mammon. Trump is like the Golden Calf.
OK, so you all know I’m a commie, but you might be surprised I am not an atheist. (Although I draw the line at calling myself ‘Christian’ as it is used to often to imply bigotry and ‘moral superiority’, I do no such thing) They do not have to go together, the main reason they do is that the Church establishment props up the ruling class, just like the CofE does in England. Even Nietzsche considered socialist ethics to be bound to Christian moral teachings. What Jesus, historical or otherwise taught was socialistic. I believe in fairness, healing the sick, feeding the poor etc. The problem is, what I mentioned on another thread, that Calvinism, the form of religion which calls itself Christian in the US sees material wealth or ‘prosperity’ as a blessing from God, and poverty as a result of sin. You see this writ large when you see stories in the right wing press about white trash families with loads of kids on welfare, covered in tattoos and drinking whiskey out a boot! We have this too, it’s called the Daily Maul, thank you Murdoch. The demonisation of the working class is part of the process.
It’s worth watching the Michael Moore documentary ‘Capitalism, a Love Story’, if only for the scene when he talks to a number of priests about Capitalism being unscriptural, unchristian and exploitative.
Bernie showed that now in the wake of the Occupy movement, people frustrated with party politics had a glimpse of a different style of politics. He, like our Corbyn is a Socialist Democrat, not a commie, not a trot, more like a Bennite, a reformist working Socialist ideas into an established capitalistic system. But talking about socialism on the world stage is a big step forward.
Maybe Bernie was not the right man for the job, being too old, to atheist to pull in the popular support, but maybe another will rise in his wake?

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ Virgin Mary

We had a Jewish atheist Labour leader in Ed Milliband. The papers papped him eating a bacon sandwich.

That wasn’t anything to do with religion though.

The story was all about how he’d tried to make himself look suitably working class (as opposed to Cameron eating a hot dog with a knife and fork) but cocked it up. In all fairness it is hard to eat a bacon sarnie with dignity and I liked the ‘eat a bacon butty for ed’ thing that’s sprung up with people posting photos of very messy sandwich eating.

(Notwithstanding that we shouldn’t eat poor piggies)

ETA: also it wasn’t a pap thing; it was a pre-arranged photo-op.

Virgin Mary
Virgin Mary
4 years ago

@alan

Now with Corbyn it’s Pot Noodles, Marrows and granola bars!??

http://news.images.itv.com/image/file/779104/stream_img.jpg

Virgin Mary
Virgin Mary
4 years ago

@kat

Sorry to bring up Michael Moore again, but have you seen his documentary ‘Sicko’?
He actually takes some patients from the USA, including a few 9/11 hero firefighters to Cuba to get medical assistance they could not afford back home.
The government actually tried to try him for treason.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ Virgin Mary

It does amuse me how obsessed we get with politicians’ personal food habits. Of course that’s all down to spin doctors and trying to show their clients have “the common touch”. Hence all the forced smiles as a PM downs a pint of bitter in a pub.

Personally I don’t care if you’d rather have a gin & tonic (just remember to not leave your daughter behind); just tell me about your policies.

Speaking of which, I wonder what Ed thinks now that Theresa May has adopted his “far too leftish” economic policy. I think he’s entitled to a bit of a splutter and some snarky emails to Milbank.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Virgin Mary

I believe in fairness, healing the sick, feeding the poor etc.

Yes! Liberation theology.

Sanders said he believes in God, though not necessarily in a traditional manner.

“I think everyone believes in God in their own ways,” he said. “To me, it means that all of us are connected, all of life is connected, and that we are all tied together.”

Hmm. I don’t think his kind of of belief in God would have gone over with either believers or nonbelievers. But yeah, I hope another leader comes along to inspire us.

ttps://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bernie-sanders-finally-answers-the-god-question/2016/01/26/83429390-bfb0-11e5-bcda-62a36b394160_story.html

And I’m not surprised that you’re not an atheist. Jesus wasn’t either.

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@Virgin Mary
No, I haven’t seen Sicko. Your video is blocked in my country. Too bad!

I am not uncritical of Cuba, but I am excited about their excellent health care system. There have been legal tours from the USA to Cuba for years now to study the health care system. And you probably know that medical school is free there, even to foreigners — stunning!

moda
moda
4 years ago

OK – you asked “Why?”

The reason is because they have deserted Bernie Sanders and have have gone to Stein.
They have decided “Never Hillary”; even though, as Bernie has said, “Going forward and continuing the struggle is what matters. And, in that struggle, the most immediate task we face is to defeat Donald Trump.”
They really shouldn’t be using Bernie’s name any more.

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