So Amanda Marcotte has a nice piece in Salon today on the adoration the world’s most repellant pickup artists feel towards Donald Trump:
Pickup artists like Daryush Valizadeh, who goes by the name “Roosh” … and James C. Weidmann, who goes by the ridiculous name Heartiste, absolutely adore Trump. In him, they see a kindred spirit, a man who believes women exist to be submissive and flattering and provide sex and have no value outside of that.
I shared some thoughts on the subject with her via email:
“Trump is, in many ways, their ideal alpha male, an arrogant, deliberately obnoxious asshole who treats women like shit but has a former model more than twenty years his junior as a wife,” Futrelle told me over email. “It doesn’t hurt that she’s Eastern European; PUAs like Roosh Valizadeh contend that American women are basically spoiled by too much feminism, and see Eastern European women, by contrast, as relatively unspoiled.”
Marcotte takes a look at some of the gushing tributes to Trump that Heartiste and Matt Forney have spilled on the internet, then peeks into the Red Pull subreddit, which, she writes,
is teeming with discussion threads positing that Trump is a role model and that the disrespect and abuse he dishes out to women is behavior to imitate.
“Donald Trump teaches us something very important. Never bow down when put on the spot in front of a women,” one poster’s headline declares. In it, the poster explains that the way Trump treated Megyn Kelly, i.e., being a dick to her, was how men generally should, uh, handle women.
“This is a vital lesson to all men. Never ever let the hottest girl in the room manipulate you and break your frame. Never give in,” the poster writes. (“Your frame” is pickup artist lingo for trying to project an aura of overconfidence and stubbornness, or mostly just about being a bully.) “Even if you make a mistake, NEVER apologize to a girl.”
Kelly is 45, a bit old to be “a girl.” Come to think of it, isn’t she way too old to be the “hottest girl in the room,” at least according to Red Pill dogma, which posits that women all “hit the wall” by age 30, if not earlier, and are shortly afterwards transformed into ancient crones fit only for cohabiting with cats?
And, wait a minute, isn’t Melania Trump 46? Why hasn’t alpha dog Trump traded her in for some 19-year-old Ukrainian hottie?
Could it be that the “the wall” isn’t really a thing. not even to the Red Pillers who talk about it all the time? Could “the wall” be little more than a revenge fantasy of Red Pillers who desperately want to believe that the young women who turn them down will someday face their comeuppance by suddenly contracting a case of the uglies?
Marcotte finds herself wondering something rather similar, suggesting at the end of her piece that perhaps
“pickup artistry” is not really about improving your game with the ladies, so much as it’s about giving men permission to belittle and bully women under the guise of becoming “alpha.”
That such men would love Trump, then, is no surprise. Trump is loud, orange, stupid, and ridiculous, but he is a bully, and to the pickup artist community, that’s what it takes to be a man.
Yep.
Welcome Back
Missed you, David!
It’s presumptious of me, but I cannot resist tinkering a bit with the following:
I read an article a year or two ago where women from countries such as Poland and umm… a Southern American country? As well as England or France of something went to the US and rated it for how female-oriented it was. All (including the Polish woman) were aghast at how ingrained misogyny is in policy and focused particularly on things like access to health care and maternity leave.
All of which makes me wonder why Eastern European women are considered “unspoiled” by these intrepid, groundbreaking, man-bullies.
Always nice to see a little more light shone under the fridge.
Also that photo collage with the two Trump mouths freaks me out a little.
Oh, that’s easy. Most of these garbage humans are US in origin, and thus they are suffering from a severe case of “The Wimmens be Hotter on the Other Side of the World”.
Kind of like how most of them are young enough to not know what it was like in the fifties, and yet jab their fingers at it and say that was the “ideal era” of good ‘ol ‘Murrica, and we should totes go back to the time where women were women and stayed in the kitchen, and men were men and made all the big decisions.
TL;DR: They always assume what they don’t have is always the better option, partially because they’re hellbent on being miserable with everything they have, and partially because they’ve convinced themselves they’re too good for everything they have.
P.S. WELCOME BACK DAVID!
To be fair, David, Trump offered women high-level executive positions in his companies back in the early ’80s, when this was still uncommon.
Also, his daughter Ivanka seems to be very intelligent and well-adjusted (admittedly from only a few interviews I’ve seen). She’s definitely not cut from the same vapid socialite cloth as Paris Hilton, for instance.
Yeah, that’s pretty spot on. I don’t even see Roosh or any of his fans even trying to keep up the pretense that he’s super popular with women anymore. Just look at his recent whine fest about how hard it is to find an 18 year old submissive hottie to marry him and have his kids. If PUA and red pill induced such panty creaming in women, sexy young women should be lining up for Roosh. But no, instead he’s getting beer thrown at him and complaining about having to wipe his own ass.
Thanks, WWTH, for reminding me of a Fun Fact I saw today on an Animal Planet show (Dr. Dee: Alaska Vet for those wondering): You know what they do with cats who are too fat to clean their bums? The vet takes a razor to their butt hair to get all the dingleberries off.
The lady vet Dr. Dee (who also used to be a female body builder and who lives in Alaska), also did a lot of neutering, and just about every guy who was present for her neuters was very clearly uncomfortable. (Though one guy did join in so he could learn how to neuter his piglets.)
Such misandry.
My childhood cat was fat and he lost a lot of flexibility when he started to get old and he got dingleberries sometimes. We nicknamed him crusty butt. We would sing the Smelly Cat song from Friends to him but substitute “crusy butt” for “smelly cat.”
@Pierre-Paul
Thanks but no thanks on the Trump apologia. Let’s not be fair to him.
And hands off the Paris Hilton jokes! Those were mint in box, I was saving them for when Jay Leno dies and people get nostalgic.
No kidding. It looks like a nostril with teeth.
@Mike, if you can’t be fair to your opponents then you might be wrong. Don’t open up the possibility. Especially when there’s so much that makes his current persona loathsome to be had, and it’s illustrative that that behavior is in part related to that change that shows that misogyny is central to that frothy ideological sludge.
@Pierre-Paul
@David
We missed you! We talked amongst ourselves while you did other stuff.
@Pierre-Paul
Yeah, his daughter Ivanka. The one he loves so much, arguably his closest adviser.
I wonder how well she’s dealing with the creepy, incestuous photos of him and her when she was 15. The world has seen them.
http://hollywoodlife.com/2016/02/02/ivanka-donald-trump-throwback-photo-daughter/
Also of interest to me: how well Ivanka, a convert to Orthodox Judaism; her Jewish husband; their Jewish children; and her Jewish in-laws are dealing with Donald Trump’s whimsical Heil Hitler salute, other photos seen round the world.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-right-hand-salute_us_56db50d8e4b03a405678e27a
I’m thinking it could take a lifetime (possibly longer) for Ivanka to come to terms with this.
So glad that you’re being fair to Donald Trump — the mild-mannered have-not who’s never caught a break in his life — that is, before you stood up for him.
Welcome back!
@RosieLa It was these women:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/foreign-women-assess-us-gender-equality_us_566ef77de4b0e292150e92f0
I particularly liked this line: ‘The men repeatedly shouted, “You’re murdering children!” at them as soon as they neared the clinic, even though Raday said they are clearly past childbearing age.’
Being married seems pretty antithetical to pickup artistry.
@Jamesworkshop You might be surprised.
When your philosophy is the same as that of many six-year-olds who think girls are icky and have cooties, you can’t claim the title of Philosopher King. Or anything even tangentially related to philosophy.
P.S: Welcome back, David!
Hey everyone, thanks, though I’m still not 100% back, this was a lil quickie to highlight Amanda’s piece. I’ll be back for realzies soon tho.
That pic of the Donald is a bit creepy, huh?
*sudden realisation hits* : OMG of course: the whole Manosphere is a nothing but revenge fantasy, a whole you-dissed-me-now-I’ll-diss-you cult, held together by the thinnest thinnest veneer of logik.
@Argle Bargle
Playing the commonsense card, huh? That’s because it’s all you’ve got.
Or maybe you’re trying to shove PC common sense down our throats. Let pickup artists be pickup artists!
Pickup artists don’t need no stinkin’ common sense. That is for mortals.
Pickup artists defy you by claiming the title you would deny us: I’m the Philosopher King of the world!!!
http://www.today.com/id/6662425/ns/today-today_entertainment/t/king-world-dubbed-cheesiest-movie-line/#.V1Pk9SHCdLY
All-time cheesiest line in a movie?
Cheese is delicious.
Wait — I’m on the Titanic?! Oh shit.
Trump: GOP will become ‘worker’s party’ under me
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/05/trump-gop-workers-party-223598#ixzz4Ah2m8Rba
Hmm. Workers’ Party — where have I heard that that term before?
Oh yeah.
The National Socialist German Workers’ Party (German: About this sound Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (help·info), abbreviated NSDAP), commonly referred to in English as the Nazi Party (/ˈnɑːtsi/), was a political party in Germany active between 1920 and 1945 that practised Nazism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party
Donald, you’re beautiful when you flirt with Nazism!
Welcome back David! Hoping you’re enjoying your break from the manuresphere!
Also @pierre-Paul so glad you cut the Donald slack, God knows the poor billionaire could do with people standing up for him. *eyeroll*
Paris Hilton has made millions out of her character that’s portrayed as a ‘vapid socialite’ so don’t compare two business women who went down different routes to make their own millions in order to disparage one while upping Trump.
As an aside I believe that a lot of hatred of reality stars like Hilton and the Kardashians is rooted in misogyny.
I hope you’re enjoying your time off, David!
I think we need to ask the other, vitally important question: what size are Valizadeh’s hands? Maybe that’s why they admire Trump so much.
Typing this in a huge rush, but Poland and feminism is an interesting case. Many Poles will claim to be non-feminist or anti-feminist, but a lot of that is connected to the fact that gender equality was a big communist slogan and is thus linked with political oppression within living memory. Add to that the affection for the Catholic Church which provided national cohesion under not only soviet domination, but also partition and feminism has an uphill battle.
However… as RosieLa says, the situation on the ground is that in many areas, Polish women do quite well. Abortion rights are a disaster, but workplace equality is really good in a lot of areas. I haven’t studied it in detail, but the court system in custody cases is very much in favour of awarding custody to mothers – in fact perhaps even too much so.
Loads more to say, but I’m getting shouted at to get off the computer…