Never underestimate the ability of Men’s Rights Activists to get worked up over the most ridiculous nonsense.
I found the meme above on the Men’s Rights Australia Facebook page, accompanied by this explanation:
Women are allowed to wear whatever they like to work, including sleeveless tops, short skirts, and even thongs. Yet if a man were to wear sleeveless tops, shorts, or thongs you can be sure he’d be sent home from work or even fired. In summer men have to suffer in the heat wearing trousers, long sleeve shirts, and tie. Feminists claim they also care about inequalities facing men so why aren’t they fighting against this? -ms
YEAH FEMINISTS WHY AREN’T YOU FIGHTING AGAINST THIS TERRIBLE INJUSTICE, WOMEN NEVER HAVE TO WEAR ANYTHING UNCOMFORTABLE OR AWKWARD AT WORK 0h wait
Note: I should point out that the “thongs” being referenced aren’t the ones that ride up your butt, but rather are the ones you wear on your feet and that are also called flip flops, at least here in the US.
BONUS MEME: This isn’t a Men’s Rights meme, obviously, but it literally made me laugh out loud.
Apparently the best way to fight communism is to do nothing while the oceans rise. I guess the Communists have their secret bases on the Marshall Islands?
I’m reminded of this legendary toilet paper ad.
A spectre is haunting the bathroom — the spectre of really really scratchy toilet paper.
@sevenofmine, PoM:
Thank you for those takedowns. They brought a tear to my eye and a smile to my lips reading them.
@Scildfreja:
Welcome back! The game sort of fizzled out, I suspect, but we can get it back on track if people are interested. I’m so glad to hear about your dad and I hope he continues getting better.
@Kat:
You win. Here’s your €4.39.
Chauvinists and MRAs would likely also find insults like ‘f*ggot’ or ‘p*ssy’ to strike a nerve, too. Do you use those to denigrate them, as well?
@EJ (The Other One)
That was such a sure thing that I can’t take your money.
Candy from a baby & such.
The population of my high school and the surrounding town was/is mostly middle-class, and we students used “trashy” to refer to anyone who did things we saw as embarrassing/questionable/offensive/crass, regardless of their socioeconomic level. I used it here because I’d gotten back into that high school mindset. I apologize for my inadvertent classism. I love this site and I hope you all can forgive me.
guest, I agree that cat photos would definitely have been more appropriate.
On the matter of men complimenting their female colleagues on their appearance:
(Disclaimer: I am male and so what follows should not be taken as authoritative upon the matter of how to relate to women.)
I have a colleague who is an excellent scientist and a dark genius at the art of getting past review. She’s also a huge fashion nerd and takes great delight in putting together outfits that work really well. That’s her hobby: she spends her time and money doing it and she’s very good at it.
From this, the following pieces of etiquette follow.
Complimenting her on her outfits in such a way as to create a conversation opening for a fellow nerd to talk about her topic of nerdery: Acceptable.
Complimenting her on her outfits in a way that indicates that I think I’m a judge of her appearance or that she owes it to me to look good: Unacceptable.
Mentioning her outfits on days when she isn’t really feeling it: Unacceptable.
Having this be the only thing I talk to her about, or having it be a regular thing: Unacceptable.
Complimenting her on her outfit when I’d first met her, before I realised what a fashion nerd she was: Unacceptable.
Complimenting my non-fashion-nerd female colleagues on their outfits: Unacceptable.
Complimenting her on her outfits in a time and place where she can’t talk about it as she would like to, and has to simply smile and take it: HOLY SHIT NO WHY WOULD YOU DO SUCH A THING.
If in doubt: Unacceptable.
This isn’t actually that difficult. It’s about consent, boundaries and dealing with people as individuals. I suspect that men who have trouble with it are people who are scared of the concept of consent or who insist on thinking of women as a collective. You know, misogynists.
Another take on how compliments can get lost between the giver and the receiver:
https://quiteirregular.wordpress.com/2015/03/14/he-said-she-heard-a-conversation-in-a-bar/
To add to the thong and flip-flop confusion, in Hawaii they’re called slippers. And what everyone else calls slippers, we also call slippers.
I worked a temp job that was partly in a corporate office, but my position often involved traveling around to various doctors’ offices throughout the city to retrieve information. I got away with wearing sneakers with my dress slacks and collared blouse in the “base” office for comfort and quietness, as long as I switched to the painful heels to look presentable to the offices I traveled to. But slippers/thongs were one of the things the rules specifically forbade.
As for the majority of this thread,
http://cdn.meme.am/instances/57350773.jpg
I think I made a good deed. I managed to convince my friends who were a bit naive on sexual assault culture with facts, charts and much bombast to change their positions like how they didn’t understand how little people actually falsely sexual assault and the perpetrators of sexual assault. And then afterward it didn’t end with us in an awkward spot, instead we just chattered like birds over how we’d improve the train and subway systems to reduce traffic substantially and other delightfully nerdy things. Honestly it’s a huge relief off my back to know my friends aren’t going to be the sort that ends up believing the same garbage that’s everywhere online.
@EJ (The Other One)
No you see it’s not all women, just all the picky young ones that infest my neighborhoo- blegh I can’t even finish that without a sense of disgust.
@Brittersweet
I really don’t have the words other than, how? To be honest I’m still rereading the entire chain and I’m still confused as to exactly what he was trying to achieve.
*reads POM and sevenofmine’s eloli takedown*
Daaayyyummm, I TOLD him I was being nice compared to what other commenters can do, haha! You articulated my feelings about the discussion well. Mostly what bugged me by the end was his refusal to address my actual points and decision to tone troll instead. I hate not being listened to, who doesn’t?
Missed this whole thing. Glad he fucked off.
@ sunnysombrera
This is a dynamic about discussions with people like eloli that I’m just permanently out of patience with. One person says something in an exasperated tone and from that point forward they fixate on how very rude everyone is being to them for no *pout* reason *pout*. No matter how many people are engaging with them on their terms, they ignore them all and just grouse incessantly about incivility.
And that’s why I refuse to be polite to the elolis of the world. They don’t want civil discussion; they don’t want to learn; they don’t actually want to help women achieve equality. They want to be fawned over as the great male savior which is just a plausibly deniable way of exerting power over women. They want to flaunt their progressive card but glob forfend anyone suggest that anything about *their* behavior needs to change.
@Eloli
I just wanted to adress some of your particular insults towards MRAs. Do you not realize you`re perpetuating the same stereotypes they do? I`m talking about things like “micro-penis“ and “pussy“. Those may be insulting to them but using them continues the same harmful stereotypes. I just want you to know that. Don`t sink down to their level. Take MRAs as an example of what not to be like. You can be better than them. There are other ways to describe them. Just look at how some of the regulars describe them here. But i`m guessing you haven`t been here long or haven`t paid much attention. Also, please read the comments policy. It`s at the bottom.
I hope you`re still reading. I`m always late.
Damn, I missed the meltdown! =P
The discovery that Eloli’s a creepy-ass harasser makes wonder if his username’s supposed to be spelled “eLoli”… *shudders*
Years ago a friend asked me to read this woman’s autobiography:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immacul%C3%A9e_Ilibagiza
It’s a powerful book, the author is an amazing woman, both in her ability to survive and her ability to forgive, and my friend had obviously got a lot out of it. But I couldn’t help but notice something she wrote toward the beginning, describing her life before the genocide. Her mother made clothes for the poor in the village, her father, owner of the only car in the village, ran errands for people in need, and everyone was happy in their assigned place; the people in the village loved, honored and respected them. She, and presumably a lot of other Tutsis, were totally blind to the social dynamics of their situation.
Those of us lower down on the pyramid are well aware that it’s a lot less risky to pretend to be happy, laugh at the boss’s jokes, smile at insults, than to allow our true feelings to escape. Those of us at the top of the pyramid learn that we don’t actually have to care what those below us think, and are perfectly satisfied to take these signs of contentment, respect and happiness for granted.
(Also for an important take on Rwanda check this out: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Watched_Over_by_Machines_of_Loving_Grace_%28TV_series%29)
@SFHC
I want to give him the benefit of the doubt that he was referring to the clothing brand.
Men who talk about “appreciating the view” or “admiring women’s bodies” or “praising women’s beauty” are automatically on my list of people I never want to interact with again. They invariably turn out to be the fucking worst.
@Scented Fucking Hard Chairs:
Nope, “eloli”‘ is just my nickname irl, it has been four 40+ years now.
“Oli” is a short version of my first name, I was called “oli” for that reason.
When I a baby, my parents lived in Chile.
In Chile, people adress each other colloquially by using gender articles before your name, as in “la Juana” for Juana, “el Carlos” for Carlos, etc.
The nanny who took care of me (this was in 1973) called me “el oli”, and I got suck with that nickname ever since, I write it “eloli” because Chilean Spanish speakers talk really fast.
Yup, that’s what everyone calls me irl, “eloli”, family, friends and acquantainces.
Since I never was into anime, it was only until very recently I became aware that my nickname can be associated to lolicon manga and sound creepy in certain contexts when a guy in another website made the same comment. Yup, I use the same handle on every site I post.
Also, I’m not some creepy ass harasser as your stated.
I know I’m not suppossed to post here anymore, but I just wanted to clarify that.
If you need to check my story, just ask the site’s admin for my real name, email and contact me.
Bye.
FSM but yes, this. To say things like this without qualifying them, as if it’s just some innocent statement in a vacuum, is such a huge godsdamn display of the fact that they are totally ignoring the context in which we actually live – the fact that women and men are not objectified in the same way, the fact that women are expected to exist in relation to the way they look to others while men are expected to look and identify with the subject of the gaze. Of course men get looked at too and want to look good, but we just don’t live in a world where men’s value as human beings gets dismissed to the same extent purely on their looks. Men, sadly, get dismissed on poverty (and so do women!), on lack of access to education (and so do women!), on lack of competency and social skills (and so do women!). Women get all that plus the extra added bonus of getting policed and harassed or dismissed on the way they look as well. If a man is competent and skilled he’s “allowed” to be ugly without that negating his competence and skills.
I worked at a private prison that had transitioned from a straight prison to a prison for illegal immigrants and was thus coed now, so had to hire female guards for the female prisoners. I was only there for a short time before I quit because I totally disagreed with the entire concept, but one notable thing happened; they insisted on providing our uniforms, but refused to buy new uniforms for female guards, so all the female guards were issued pants cut for men, so there was way too much room in the crotch and the hips were ridiculously binding for such a physical job.
@opposablethumbs
What does FSM mean in this context? 🙂
@isidore13
But did the uniforms have SLEEVES?
I was totally fine with crushing poverty and poor treatment in the workplace until I wiped my ass with low quality toilet paper.
Now I’m the Superintendant of Gulag 13!
@imaginary petal, come to think of it, they did! MISANDRY!!!!!
I have to give one of my kitties a bath next week. Maybe not a whole bath, but her butt-half is whiffy (I may need to get different type of kittylitter).
Which one I should wear?
a) skimpy chain bikini (because of THE VIEW!)
b) full mail (misandering for fun and profit)
c) nothing, because Carisma is going to claw the fuck out of me anyway and I will turn wet (EVEN MORE SCENERY WITH ADDED CARNAGE & SPECTACULAR PRACTICAL EFFECTS)
IP – sorry, I should have clarified! Habit. 🙂
Flying Spaghetti Monster; I tend to use FSM when I want one of those passe-partout emphasiser words, whatever is the proper term for them (as in “god yes”/”god knows”/”ye gods yes”/”dog yes”) Flying Spaghetti Monster yes/FSM knows etc.