We’re still running a meme surplus in the We Hunted the Mammoth offices, so I’m going to drop a few more on you today. Enjoy the FLAWLESS STEM LOGIC and KEEN GRASP OF REALITY displayed in the following memes, gathered from A Voice for Men’s Facebook page. I’ve lightly censored a couple of them.
WE INVENTED THE MAMMOTH TO FEED YOU
Ha Ha! Girls are stupid and can’t do math amirite fellas high five!
Damn you gals for keeping men out of this low-paying profession that men could easily enter if they wanted to because it’s not actually a “hiring scheme” that keeps them out!
THIS ISN’T ACTUALLY TRUE BUT MAYBE IF WE PUT IT IN ALL-CAPS NO ONE WILL NOTICE!
> Comes at us saying we’re all terrible fucking people who are “closed-minded bigots” because they feel like we don’t treat men properly.
> Gets mad when we make fun of them instead of treat them with kid gloves.
I was wrong, this is getting more interesting than Batman Beyond reruns.
Jamie
8 years ago
I think the most pressing issue is a hard pick. Uneven sentencing? Domestic violence? Boys in schools? Legal fairness in parental rights? Honestly I’m not sure I can pick.
And the plan is, to create a unified, networked mens rights movement first. To opposed oppressive feminist dogma. And then to protest, petition, move and shake society, until it changes.
Just like any movement. Our job, is to flip the script, so that, one day, it will be known to be sexist by all to treat men the way they are currently being treated.
You just treat outside opinion holders like shit, and dismiss them with no consideration for your intellectual honesty or opinion, just like any fundamentalist. You behave like a bunch of 4chan arseholes to anyone who disagrees – and it doesn’t look smart, it looks _really_ immature. I can’t help but imagine you all as 15 year olds. Like I find it hard to imagine any of you being over the age of 25.
Anything you can come up with, to change the topic, avoid the issue, justify, rationalize or perform cognitive dissonance. And those links, that my five minute google produced – you can guarantee that doesn’t suddenly shift the conversation into some detached, objective, rational discourse. There’s no way. Your fundamentalists, you don’t give a crap about rationality, or evidence. Your not remotely interested in exploring outside ideas, entertaining them, researching them. That’s a joke.
Jamie
8 years ago
And now the children are pretending, I cast the first stone.
Jamie
8 years ago
I don’t mind that. I have other fish to fry than the societal fear and disgust around male genitals. It’s a major thing, but shit that does not come first on the plate, we are WAY to sexist as a society for that dialogue yet.
Didn’t you say you were a double major and a scholar and whatnot? Don’t you have access to jstor through your school? If you took the 30 seconds it took me to look up the full article and skim through it, you would find that it references much better studies than this one, which isn’t examining the magnitude of disparities in sentencing and provides no data for gender disparities at all. You’d be much better off finding the actual studies that actually examine this problem. This article references for you so that it should have been really easy for you to find them, but instead you took the lazy freshman route of referencing the literal first thing you found without even bothering to read it.
I am disappoint.
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
8 years ago
I’ve discovered the one thing more of an annoying time-waster than Aris Sock: Taking a cab all the way to the other side of town to buy a new 3DS charger, then coming home and discovering it’s such a cheap piece of shit it won’t even fit in the plug socket. Fuck it, we’ll do it live I’ll go back tomorrow.
Fabe
8 years ago
I don;t think any one here is denying that there are a lot of serious issues facing men that need to be dealt with. We’re just refusing to allow you top lay all the blame for these problem at the feet of feminists.
Jamie
8 years ago
As i said, five minute google. And I am no longer in uni.
You will not, cannot change your mind, and perspective unless you are open to it. If you are open to it, you’ll investigate yourself. If your level of effort is zero, you can’t even open a tab, and type into google scholar – you have zero willingness to find out, if you are wrong. And in which case, there is no rational, no justification, no reasoning for me to spend a large amount of time sourcing things you will all definately ignore and dismiss.
isidore13
8 years ago
Thank you for the links, I’ve been looking them over and they do contain some interesting information. Feminists are working to improve a lot of these things, of course, but men will have to do some of the work in dismantling patriarchy so it no longer causes the issues for boys and men. Feminists can’t do everything, you know!
Obviously you’re aware that it’s because of patriarchy that women are considered too weak to be the abuser in an IPV situation, right?
With skimming, your second link actually asserts that women in het relationships experience the greater amount of physical violence and control: “Women were significantly more likely than men to experience physical or sexual IPV (relative risk [RR]=2.2, 95% confidence interval [CI]=2.1, 2.4) and abuse of power and control (RR=1.1, 95% CI=1.0, 1.2), but less likely than men to report verbal abuse alone (RR=0.8, 95% CI=0.7, 0.9).”
Policy of Madness
8 years ago
I think the most pressing issue is a hard pick. Uneven sentencing? Domestic violence? Boys in schools? Legal fairness in parental rights? Honestly I’m not sure I can pick.
You might want to consider trying, because nobody can focus on everything. That is too many issues for one person. You will accomplish zipola if you try to change all of them. You need to choose the one that is most near and dear to your heart, and trust that others will pick up the slack on the others.
And the plan is, to create a unified, networked mens rights movement first. To opposed oppressive feminist dogma. And then to protest, petition, move and shake society, until it changes.
This is too vague to be an action plan. That’s a pipe dream.
Just like any movement. Our job, is to flip the script, so that, one day, it will be known to be sexist by all to treat men the way they are currently being treated.
How do you plan to do that? What is your action plan? Is your plan to do it through legislation? What is your model legislation? What is your plan to get that legislation before lawmakers?
Is it your plan to do it through lobbying cultural leaders and makers, like movie studios? How do you plan to get their attention and convince them that they should listen to you? What concrete steps do you plan to provide to them, guidelines that they should follow, presuming that you get a meeting with the assistant director of marketing at Disney?
Agitating and marching and shit accomplishes jack-all on its own. Protests are designed to raise awareness and get people’s attention. Once you have that attention, you need to have something you can put before folks with power, actionable items that can be implemented and are not vague wishes that rely on magic powers of mind control.
If this is all you’ve got, you’ve got nothing. If this is all the leaders of your movement are providing to you, they have nothing either, and are accomplishing shit.
Of course, we already knew this, but I’d like for you to sit down and think very hard about what you think you’re doing with your time and energy.
Jamie | March 29, 2016 at 8:24 pm
And now the children are pretending, I cast the first stone.
> Comes to a feminist site to tell us all what vile “bigots” we all are. Because reasons.
> Pretends like they didn’t start anything.
Self-awareness, thy name is not Jamie.
Though, let’s quote Shakespeare in this: “Brevity is the soul of wit”. Something Mr. SciencePants Jamie wouldn’t understand, I suppose. English must not be important to a MAYUNLY SCIENTIST.
Jamie | March 29, 2016 at 8:23 pm
I think the most pressing issue is a hard pick. Uneven sentencing? Domestic violence? Boys in schools? Legal fairness in parental rights? Honestly I’m not sure I can pick.
And not a one of us said that this shit wasn’t important, nor that it shouldn’t be addressed. We simply said that blaming women and/or feminists for it all is barking up the wrong tree.
And the plan is, to create a unified, networked mens rights movement first. To opposed oppressive feminist dogma. And then to protest, petition, move and shake society, until it changes.
Okay, mind telling us what “oppressive feminist dogma” you want to “opposed”?
Just like any movement. Our job, is to flip the script, so that, one day, it will be known to be sexist by all to treat men the way they are currently being treated.
And there goes the Saturday Morning Cartoon Villain talk again.
You just treat outside opinion holders like shit, and dismiss them with no consideration for your intellectual honesty or opinion, just like any fundamentalist.
You walked in here and called us “bigots”, spammed the fuck out of our comments sections, socked multiple accounts, and refused to back anything you had to say up, and now you’re turning around and saying that we’re just “treating you like shit” (despite plenty of people actually addressing your “arguments” on several occasions, myself included), and we’re “intellectually dishonest” because we don’t believe what you have to say is valid.
Yeah, that’s totally grounds to give you deferential treatment and think what you have to say is valuable and adding to the discussion. [/sarcasm]
You behave like a bunch of 4chan arseholes to anyone who disagrees – and it doesn’t look smart, it looks _really_ immature. I can’t help but imagine you all as 15 year olds. Like I find it hard to imagine any of you being over the age of 25.
You can italicize and bold things in the comments box, by the way. They’re the “b” and “i” buttons at the top of the new comment box.
Though, I suppose you’re too busy spamming to notice.
Also, I’ll be turning 26 this year, so I’m actually only technically older than 25 by 10 months.
Anything you can come up with, to change the topic, avoid the issue, justify, rationalize or perform cognitive dissonance.
Like how you ignored people who did actually discuss the topics you brought up and just said that they’re full of shit?
And those links, that my five minute google produced – you can guarantee that doesn’t suddenly shift the conversation into some detached, objective, rational discourse. There’s no way.
Well, considering it didn’t start that way when you came in here and started calling us all “bigots”, I can see why the well has been poisoned against you, poor babby.
Your fundamentalists, you don’t give a crap about rationality, or evidence. Your not remotely interested in exploring outside ideas, entertaining them, researching them. That’s a joke.
*You’re. It’s not a good idea to make spelling errors when making a sorry attempt to lecture people about “rationality” and “evidence”.
And what you’re failing to understand is, if you want us to “explore outside ideas, entertain them, and/or research them”, they’d have to be actually new ideas, and not the same garbage we’ve heard regurgitated by so many before you.
What you’re saying isn’t some grand, new idea, Jamie.
We’ve discussed these topics hundreds of times before you waltzed in here and demanded our attention and deferment. You just don’t care what we have to say on the topic, and you’ve proven that time and time again. You don’t really give a shit about us “not listening to outside ideas”, you’re just mad we didn’t capitulate to you immediately, even though you came in here and started accusing us of being “bigoted towards men” without hearing us out.
So, congrats, you’re a hypocrite.
EDIT:
Jamie | March 29, 2016 at 8:26 pm
I don’t mind that. I have other fish to fry than the societal fear and disgust around male genitals. It’s a major thing, but shit that does not come first on the plate, we are WAY to sexist as a society for that dialogue yet.
And apparently a transphobe too. Shway.
Policy of Madness
8 years ago
If your level of effort is zero, you can’t even open a tab, and type into google scholar – you have zero willingness to find out, if you are wrong.
Dude, I put more effort into your link than you did. Don’t lecture me about effort until you demonstrate that you are willing to put in some yourself. You can’t claim the high ground if you’re not actually standing on it.
Not all men have penises. It’s kind of hard to buy the MRA claims that they’re human rights activists when they have no concept of intersectionality.
Jamie
8 years ago
This is such a seriously large waste of everyone’s time. There’s not exchange here. There’s no open minded, detached rational discourse. No amiability.
It’s just like some sad 4chan debate, or points scoring argument on facebook. There’s no respect, and never was.
And there is SO much sexism here. I only just fully realized the extent of this in society myself like two days ago. And it disgusts and disturbs me. There’s not way I should be in a place like this right now.
So I am sorry to ruffle your feathers. I can’t be here. For me, this is not a safe space for men. And I am way to new to this, and accepting the world as it is, seeing as it is, and being shaken to my core by that bigotry and bias, to sit here having some conversation with people who see me as a villan before I even open my mouth.
It makes no sense. have a good day, or try to. I’m not trying to attack female rights, I am not a bigot, I love women, most of my friends are women – I’m not trying to make life hard, and I am not evading debate with you because I am scared – because instead I know for a fact it can not possibly bear any fruit, and it will stress both of us out. And I literally cannot handle the sexist, and attack, and oppression right now. It’s too much. This place is just way too shitty for me, like a negative quagmire of sexism, oppression and justification for it – it’s the opposite of human, and compassion.
So I do really have to go. I hope this conversation isn’t misinterpreted as an attack. For me, it’s just defending people being treated as equals, and as human beings, as ironically far from being treated as equals and humans being as this conversation has gone.
And yes, I attacked feminism. I did. I did that because it contains bigoted, hateful and oppressive ideas. Not some people inside the movement, like MRA. But the very core ideas themselves, the very central ideology that people spread around, and try to police and force on others. For us, as mens right activists, we will always be attacking those ideas. Because are oppression. Because they are hate.
I’m sorry we can’t avoid that, we HAVE to do that. And always do it.
I am not a bigot, I love women, most of my friends are women
All misogynists have women they know. Some of them even have mothers, aunts, sisters, cousins, nieces, and some of them are women themselves.
That doesn’t make them any less of a misogynist.
Policy of Madness
8 years ago
This is such a seriously large waste of everyone’s time.
Especially yours. If you actually care about problems that disproportionately affect men – of which there are numerous examples – you need to find a group that actually works on one of them and join it. If you can’t find one, start one. Writing the Wall of China of text on WHTM isn’t directing your energy toward fixing the problems that concern you so much.
And the plan is, to create a unified, networked mens rights movement first. To opposed oppressive feminist dogma. And then to protest, petition, move and shake society, until it changes.
This is too vague to be an action plan. That’s a pipe dream.
I can’t remember if double blockquotes work here, but THIS exactly.
How is talking shit about feminists on the internet going to get men’s shelters built? Feminists got women’s shelters built after years of campaigning and fundraising. They worked for it. Attention and funding from the government didn’t come overnight. If you want men’s shelters built in your country, fucking do something about it! It won’t be easy and it won’t happen right away. But hating women won’t get you there. That’s for damn sure.
Spamming feminist blogs also won’t help boys who are struggling in school. Wouldn’t your vastly superior intellect be better spent on something like tutoring boys who need it?
Jamie
8 years ago
I’ve said nothing bigoted against women. And yet still you call me a bigot, or imply it – for my belief system onky. That ironically, is bigoted.
Fabe
8 years ago
And yes, I attacked feminism. I did. I did that because it contains bigoted, hateful and oppressive ideas. Not some people inside the movement, like MRA. But the very core ideas themselves, the very central ideology that people spread around, and try to police and force on others. For us, as mens right activists, we will always be attacking those ideas. Because are oppression. Because they are hate.
Did he bother to give any examples of these bigoted ,hateful and oppressive ideas or is that something we need to research over selves?
Jamie
8 years ago
Policy, I’ve got to go. I’m shaking. I’m emotional. I’m close to tears. I’ve got to get out.
But I am part of a mens rights group, protection for men. It’s just hard you know. You live in oppression, and with sexism and it’s going to be decades before it changes. And in the meantime, no one listens. People attack you for wanting equality. The people who oppress you, don’t even know they are doing it. It’s major headfuck to come to realize this.
Jamie
8 years ago
And for fucks sake I don’t hate women. Fucking hell.
brooked
8 years ago
My point was, that any study of merit, one that replied on direct question answering of the participants, anonymously, rather than unreliabe reporting, showed 40-60% of dv was female perpetrated.
Well, I guess that means the links Jaime provides back up that specific claim.
A total of 28.9% of 6790 women and 22.9% of 7122 men had experienced physical, sexual, or psychological IPV during their lifetime. Women were significantly more likely than men to experience physical or sexual IPV (relative risk [RR]=2.2, 95% confidence interval [CI]=2.1, 2.4) and abuse of power and control (RR=1.1, 95% CI=1.0, 1.2), but less likely than men to report verbal abuse alone (RR=0.8, 95% CI=0.7, 0.9).
or not.
FYI, no one here denied the existence of male domestic violence victims.
As weirwoodtreehugger pointed out earlier, you seem vaguely aware of Murrey Strauss’s Conflict Tactics Scale and have decided his work is the one source of all truth. You keep acting like domestic violence is a simple topic that you have completely figured out and feminists are too thick-headed to accept all your amazing wisdom, but that’s not actually what’s happening here. You know less than you think you do.
Fabe
8 years ago
And for fucks sake I don’t hate women. Fucking hell.
And who really buys this story that he took the red pill or whatever only two days ago and our meanness has convinced him that feminism is teh evil.
Policy of Madness
8 years ago
Here in Louisville, our sewer utility is under a consent order from the EPA to stop discharging untreated sewage into perennial streams that lead to the Ohio River, or straight into the Ohio itself, every fucking time it rains. One of the steps MSD is undertaking to comply with the consent order is building retention basins that will hold stormwater/sewage overflow during rain events until the treatment plants can handle it.
There are 11 facilities being planned. One of them can’t be put underground due to environmental constraints. 9 are being built at grade, and parks or similar greenspace is being constructed atop the facility.
The 11th basin, located in Smoketown, was proposed to be built above-ground, with a solid, windowless brick building that extended the length of the block. Guess what kind of neighborhood Smoketown is? Go ahead, guess. I’ll wait.
The neighborhood organized resistance to this plan. They had an action plan, Jamie. They had plans for what to do, with whom they needed to talk, whom they needed to convince, and they had a design on-hand for how they wanted this facility to be built.
They didn’t get onto the Internet and yammer about it in the comments to news articles. They didn’t give the mayor vague platitudes about environmental justice and long speeches about racism. They had actual steps they wanted MSD to take. Yes, it’s about environmental justice, and yes it’s about racism, but their action plan was more than just talking about those things in general terms. And it definitely involved offline work, because offline work is still the most effective kind of work, far and away, lightyears above online work. In this case, online work would have gotten them jack shit.
This story is still underway, but MSD is bending and the Smoketown facility is very likely to be buried to grade. Because people had concrete steps that they wanted to see implemented.
Unless and until you take the first step down that road of doing shit, you are not a men’s rights activist. You are not an activist at all. You are someone who is disgruntled, but not put out enough to bother with doing anything about whatever has disgruntled you. You are proving that men’s rights don’t really matter all that much to you, because all you can be bothered to do is be mad about it and write poorly-thought-through essays. If the Smoketown neighborhood had been full of people like you, they’d be getting an industrial nightmare instead of a beautiful park.
> Comes at us saying we’re all terrible fucking people who are “closed-minded bigots” because they feel like we don’t treat men properly.
> Gets mad when we make fun of them instead of treat them with kid gloves.
I was wrong, this is getting more interesting than Batman Beyond reruns.
I think the most pressing issue is a hard pick. Uneven sentencing? Domestic violence? Boys in schools? Legal fairness in parental rights? Honestly I’m not sure I can pick.
And the plan is, to create a unified, networked mens rights movement first. To opposed oppressive feminist dogma. And then to protest, petition, move and shake society, until it changes.
Just like any movement. Our job, is to flip the script, so that, one day, it will be known to be sexist by all to treat men the way they are currently being treated.
You just treat outside opinion holders like shit, and dismiss them with no consideration for your intellectual honesty or opinion, just like any fundamentalist. You behave like a bunch of 4chan arseholes to anyone who disagrees – and it doesn’t look smart, it looks _really_ immature. I can’t help but imagine you all as 15 year olds. Like I find it hard to imagine any of you being over the age of 25.
Anything you can come up with, to change the topic, avoid the issue, justify, rationalize or perform cognitive dissonance. And those links, that my five minute google produced – you can guarantee that doesn’t suddenly shift the conversation into some detached, objective, rational discourse. There’s no way. Your fundamentalists, you don’t give a crap about rationality, or evidence. Your not remotely interested in exploring outside ideas, entertaining them, researching them. That’s a joke.
And now the children are pretending, I cast the first stone.
I don’t mind that. I have other fish to fry than the societal fear and disgust around male genitals. It’s a major thing, but shit that does not come first on the plate, we are WAY to sexist as a society for that dialogue yet.
Didn’t you say you were a double major and a scholar and whatnot? Don’t you have access to jstor through your school? If you took the 30 seconds it took me to look up the full article and skim through it, you would find that it references much better studies than this one, which isn’t examining the magnitude of disparities in sentencing and provides no data for gender disparities at all. You’d be much better off finding the actual studies that actually examine this problem. This article references for you so that it should have been really easy for you to find them, but instead you took the lazy freshman route of referencing the literal first thing you found without even bothering to read it.
I am disappoint.
I’ve discovered the one thing more of an annoying time-waster than Aris Sock: Taking a cab all the way to the other side of town to buy a new 3DS charger, then coming home and discovering it’s such a cheap piece of shit it won’t even fit in the plug socket. Fuck it,
we’ll do it liveI’ll go back tomorrow.I don;t think any one here is denying that there are a lot of serious issues facing men that need to be dealt with. We’re just refusing to allow you top lay all the blame for these problem at the feet of feminists.
As i said, five minute google. And I am no longer in uni.
You will not, cannot change your mind, and perspective unless you are open to it. If you are open to it, you’ll investigate yourself. If your level of effort is zero, you can’t even open a tab, and type into google scholar – you have zero willingness to find out, if you are wrong. And in which case, there is no rational, no justification, no reasoning for me to spend a large amount of time sourcing things you will all definately ignore and dismiss.
Thank you for the links, I’ve been looking them over and they do contain some interesting information. Feminists are working to improve a lot of these things, of course, but men will have to do some of the work in dismantling patriarchy so it no longer causes the issues for boys and men. Feminists can’t do everything, you know!
Obviously you’re aware that it’s because of patriarchy that women are considered too weak to be the abuser in an IPV situation, right?
With skimming, your second link actually asserts that women in het relationships experience the greater amount of physical violence and control: “Women were significantly more likely than men to experience physical or sexual IPV (relative risk [RR]=2.2, 95% confidence interval [CI]=2.1, 2.4) and abuse of power and control (RR=1.1, 95% CI=1.0, 1.2), but less likely than men to report verbal abuse alone (RR=0.8, 95% CI=0.7, 0.9).”
You might want to consider trying, because nobody can focus on everything. That is too many issues for one person. You will accomplish zipola if you try to change all of them. You need to choose the one that is most near and dear to your heart, and trust that others will pick up the slack on the others.
This is too vague to be an action plan. That’s a pipe dream.
How do you plan to do that? What is your action plan? Is your plan to do it through legislation? What is your model legislation? What is your plan to get that legislation before lawmakers?
Is it your plan to do it through lobbying cultural leaders and makers, like movie studios? How do you plan to get their attention and convince them that they should listen to you? What concrete steps do you plan to provide to them, guidelines that they should follow, presuming that you get a meeting with the assistant director of marketing at Disney?
Agitating and marching and shit accomplishes jack-all on its own. Protests are designed to raise awareness and get people’s attention. Once you have that attention, you need to have something you can put before folks with power, actionable items that can be implemented and are not vague wishes that rely on magic powers of mind control.
If this is all you’ve got, you’ve got nothing. If this is all the leaders of your movement are providing to you, they have nothing either, and are accomplishing shit.
Of course, we already knew this, but I’d like for you to sit down and think very hard about what you think you’re doing with your time and energy.
> Comes to a feminist site to tell us all what vile “bigots” we all are. Because reasons.
> Pretends like they didn’t start anything.
Self-awareness, thy name is not Jamie.
Though, let’s quote Shakespeare in this: “Brevity is the soul of wit”. Something Mr. SciencePants Jamie wouldn’t understand, I suppose. English must not be important to a MAYUNLY SCIENTIST.
And not a one of us said that this shit wasn’t important, nor that it shouldn’t be addressed. We simply said that blaming women and/or feminists for it all is barking up the wrong tree.
Okay, mind telling us what “oppressive feminist dogma” you want to “opposed”?
And there goes the Saturday Morning Cartoon Villain talk again.
You walked in here and called us “bigots”, spammed the fuck out of our comments sections, socked multiple accounts, and refused to back anything you had to say up, and now you’re turning around and saying that we’re just “treating you like shit” (despite plenty of people actually addressing your “arguments” on several occasions, myself included), and we’re “intellectually dishonest” because we don’t believe what you have to say is valid.
Yeah, that’s totally grounds to give you deferential treatment and think what you have to say is valuable and adding to the discussion. [/sarcasm]
You can italicize and bold things in the comments box, by the way. They’re the “b” and “i” buttons at the top of the new comment box.
Though, I suppose you’re too busy spamming to notice.
Also, I’ll be turning 26 this year, so I’m actually only technically older than 25 by 10 months.
Like how you ignored people who did actually discuss the topics you brought up and just said that they’re full of shit?
Well, considering it didn’t start that way when you came in here and started calling us all “bigots”, I can see why the well has been poisoned against you, poor babby.
*You’re. It’s not a good idea to make spelling errors when making a sorry attempt to lecture people about “rationality” and “evidence”.
And what you’re failing to understand is, if you want us to “explore outside ideas, entertain them, and/or research them”, they’d have to be actually new ideas, and not the same garbage we’ve heard regurgitated by so many before you.
What you’re saying isn’t some grand, new idea, Jamie.
We’ve discussed these topics hundreds of times before you waltzed in here and demanded our attention and deferment. You just don’t care what we have to say on the topic, and you’ve proven that time and time again. You don’t really give a shit about us “not listening to outside ideas”, you’re just mad we didn’t capitulate to you immediately, even though you came in here and started accusing us of being “bigoted towards men” without hearing us out.
So, congrats, you’re a hypocrite.
EDIT:
And apparently a transphobe too. Shway.
Dude, I put more effort into your link than you did. Don’t lecture me about effort until you demonstrate that you are willing to put in some yourself. You can’t claim the high ground if you’re not actually standing on it.
Not all men have penises. It’s kind of hard to buy the MRA claims that they’re human rights activists when they have no concept of intersectionality.
This is such a seriously large waste of everyone’s time. There’s not exchange here. There’s no open minded, detached rational discourse. No amiability.
It’s just like some sad 4chan debate, or points scoring argument on facebook. There’s no respect, and never was.
And there is SO much sexism here. I only just fully realized the extent of this in society myself like two days ago. And it disgusts and disturbs me. There’s not way I should be in a place like this right now.
So I am sorry to ruffle your feathers. I can’t be here. For me, this is not a safe space for men. And I am way to new to this, and accepting the world as it is, seeing as it is, and being shaken to my core by that bigotry and bias, to sit here having some conversation with people who see me as a villan before I even open my mouth.
It makes no sense. have a good day, or try to. I’m not trying to attack female rights, I am not a bigot, I love women, most of my friends are women – I’m not trying to make life hard, and I am not evading debate with you because I am scared – because instead I know for a fact it can not possibly bear any fruit, and it will stress both of us out. And I literally cannot handle the sexist, and attack, and oppression right now. It’s too much. This place is just way too shitty for me, like a negative quagmire of sexism, oppression and justification for it – it’s the opposite of human, and compassion.
So I do really have to go. I hope this conversation isn’t misinterpreted as an attack. For me, it’s just defending people being treated as equals, and as human beings, as ironically far from being treated as equals and humans being as this conversation has gone.
And yes, I attacked feminism. I did. I did that because it contains bigoted, hateful and oppressive ideas. Not some people inside the movement, like MRA. But the very core ideas themselves, the very central ideology that people spread around, and try to police and force on others. For us, as mens right activists, we will always be attacking those ideas. Because are oppression. Because they are hate.
I’m sorry we can’t avoid that, we HAVE to do that. And always do it.
All misogynists have women they know. Some of them even have mothers, aunts, sisters, cousins, nieces, and some of them are women themselves.
That doesn’t make them any less of a misogynist.
Especially yours. If you actually care about problems that disproportionately affect men – of which there are numerous examples – you need to find a group that actually works on one of them and join it. If you can’t find one, start one. Writing the Wall of China of text on WHTM isn’t directing your energy toward fixing the problems that concern you so much.
I can’t remember if double blockquotes work here, but THIS exactly.
How is talking shit about feminists on the internet going to get men’s shelters built? Feminists got women’s shelters built after years of campaigning and fundraising. They worked for it. Attention and funding from the government didn’t come overnight. If you want men’s shelters built in your country, fucking do something about it! It won’t be easy and it won’t happen right away. But hating women won’t get you there. That’s for damn sure.
Spamming feminist blogs also won’t help boys who are struggling in school. Wouldn’t your vastly superior intellect be better spent on something like tutoring boys who need it?
I’ve said nothing bigoted against women. And yet still you call me a bigot, or imply it – for my belief system onky. That ironically, is bigoted.
Did he bother to give any examples of these bigoted ,hateful and oppressive ideas or is that something we need to research over selves?
Policy, I’ve got to go. I’m shaking. I’m emotional. I’m close to tears. I’ve got to get out.
But I am part of a mens rights group, protection for men. It’s just hard you know. You live in oppression, and with sexism and it’s going to be decades before it changes. And in the meantime, no one listens. People attack you for wanting equality. The people who oppress you, don’t even know they are doing it. It’s major headfuck to come to realize this.
And for fucks sake I don’t hate women. Fucking hell.
Well, I guess that means the links Jaime provides back up that specific claim.
or not.
FYI, no one here denied the existence of male domestic violence victims.
As weirwoodtreehugger pointed out earlier, you seem vaguely aware of Murrey Strauss’s Conflict Tactics Scale and have decided his work is the one source of all truth. You keep acting like domestic violence is a simple topic that you have completely figured out and feminists are too thick-headed to accept all your amazing wisdom, but that’s not actually what’s happening here. You know less than you think you do.
and we don’t hate men.
Ooh. Flounce number 2. Will he stick this time?
And who really buys this story that he took the red pill or whatever only two days ago and our meanness has convinced him that feminism is teh evil.
Here in Louisville, our sewer utility is under a consent order from the EPA to stop discharging untreated sewage into perennial streams that lead to the Ohio River, or straight into the Ohio itself, every fucking time it rains. One of the steps MSD is undertaking to comply with the consent order is building retention basins that will hold stormwater/sewage overflow during rain events until the treatment plants can handle it.
There are 11 facilities being planned. One of them can’t be put underground due to environmental constraints. 9 are being built at grade, and parks or similar greenspace is being constructed atop the facility.
The 11th basin, located in Smoketown, was proposed to be built above-ground, with a solid, windowless brick building that extended the length of the block. Guess what kind of neighborhood Smoketown is? Go ahead, guess. I’ll wait.
The neighborhood organized resistance to this plan. They had an action plan, Jamie. They had plans for what to do, with whom they needed to talk, whom they needed to convince, and they had a design on-hand for how they wanted this facility to be built.
They didn’t get onto the Internet and yammer about it in the comments to news articles. They didn’t give the mayor vague platitudes about environmental justice and long speeches about racism. They had actual steps they wanted MSD to take. Yes, it’s about environmental justice, and yes it’s about racism, but their action plan was more than just talking about those things in general terms. And it definitely involved offline work, because offline work is still the most effective kind of work, far and away, lightyears above online work. In this case, online work would have gotten them jack shit.
This story is still underway, but MSD is bending and the Smoketown facility is very likely to be buried to grade. Because people had concrete steps that they wanted to see implemented.
Unless and until you take the first step down that road of doing shit, you are not a men’s rights activist. You are not an activist at all. You are someone who is disgruntled, but not put out enough to bother with doing anything about whatever has disgruntled you. You are proving that men’s rights don’t really matter all that much to you, because all you can be bothered to do is be mad about it and write poorly-thought-through essays. If the Smoketown neighborhood had been full of people like you, they’d be getting an industrial nightmare instead of a beautiful park.