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Super Tuesday Open Thread

voteasyouplease_phixr
Wait, why is she using a gun to hammer the nails in?

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Open thread! It’s Super Tuesday here in the US. Discuss today’s primaries, the evil that is Trump, politics in general.

 

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Johanna Roberts
Johanna Roberts
5 years ago

Just hanging around at home, in LEO and took the chance to actually get my dishes done! \o/ I hope I can get out to vote later but with my disability it will be up to my health at the end.

Falconer
Falconer
5 years ago

She’s using a gun as a hammer because somehow Hollywood got the idea that that’s what sheriffs and cowboys did in the Old West when they didn’t have an actual hammer: They misused a deadly firearm.

I think the last place I saw the trope was in that Star Trek episode where they hallucinate that they’re the Clancy gang and the Earps are going to kill them stone dead … because they done bothered the wrong aliens.

Chiomara
Chiomara
5 years ago

Okay, I need to get this off me: Trump is on brazilian news everyday now. Its truly disgusting, its like they were campaigning for him. They say like “Aaaand Trump seems to win the pre elections in another city!” ” Rubio takes back the bad things he said about Trump now theres a real possibility for him to win!” “Now lets know more about Donald Trump!”. They never mention how horrible he is!
I need to know: Is there a REAL possibility he wins?!
Also, is he buying foreign televisions? Because its honestly bizarre.

iknklast
iknklast
5 years ago

Is there a REAL possibility he wins?!

Short answer? Yes.
Long answer? AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!

Unfortunately, Cruz is even worse in many ways. And Rubio? If he’s a moderate, I’m a vermicious kinit.

I blame Reagan. He started taking us down this road. Of course, the country didn’t have to actually follow him over this particular cliff.

lightcastle
lightcastle
5 years ago

Another theory on what’s going on with Trump.

http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424/trump-authoritarianism

guy
guy
5 years ago

I need to know: Is there a REAL possibility he wins?!

Not especially. Projections say he probably becomes the Republican nominee and loses badly in the general election.

WeirwoodTreeHugger
WeirwoodTreeHugger
5 years ago

I’m upset because my caucus place is about a mile away but it would take three buses to get to. So I’d have to walk. Normally not a problem but I’m feeling I’ll today and it’s freezing cold today. I really, really want to go but it’s bizarrely difficult for me to do so. Gah!

Nothing would keep me away from the general but for the caucus, I don’t know.

Alpine, RN
Alpine, RN
5 years ago

Ah the Republican primary, where the choices are:
1. A carnie who appreciates Mussolini
2. A lizard-person whose skin suit seems uncomfortable for him and
3. A man who failed the Turing Test…

oh and since apparently he’s still running…
4. A surgeon who brags about having stabbed a guy (wtf?)

and all of them want to control my reproductive options….and possibly cause World War 3

Alpine, RN
Alpine, RN
5 years ago

oh and the supposed “Moderate” who has legislated against women every single chance he gets

snork maiden
5 years ago

If he does win the nomination, I’m hoping against hope all those lifelong Republicans who have an ounce of common sense and actually do want what is right for their country will vote Democrat rather than see a dangerously stupid megalomaniac in the White House.

I realize the other Republican nominees aren’t much better than Trump, but they strike me as at least being intelligent enough that they wouldn’t attempt to build a wall across the Mexican border, or get rid of the internet.

ej
ej
5 years ago

@Chiomara
I think you’re seeing a lot of Trump on television because he is the most controversial. He’s loud and aggressive and always seems to be doing or saying something horrible. In short, he’s much more of a news story than any of the others.

This extra coverage probably does help him. It keeps people talking about him and may give him more votes, but it’s usually the more extreme voters who participate in the primaries. If he gets the nomination, Trump is going to have a very hard time appealing to the moderate voters that he will need to actually win the Presidency.

kupo
kupo
5 years ago

I could see Trump winning if Clinton gets the Democrat nomination and Bernie Bros organize a write-in campaign (Sanders has said he will not run as independent), causing more red wins because of blue being divided. I don’t think it’s likely, but I think it’s possible.

Jamesworkshop
Jamesworkshop
5 years ago

Not American myself, but the UK for geopolitical reasons needs a good U.S President (gonna be close to whoever gets elected no matter what) so don’t stuff this election up.

syntax
syntax
5 years ago

Trump’s nebulosity and lack of seriousness might win him the primary, which would prompt serious election reform efforts on the part of the right for the first time in ages, but the fact that he’ll probably make money on this campaign because of the way he structured the loans should be nauseating enough.

If he goes up against Hillary in a debate he would be crushed by her comprehensive understanding of facts and actual political experience. He is a master of stagecraft and that is all that is keeping him afloat, he just says the most extreme version of whatever the right wants without deference to their power structure.

Swales
Swales
5 years ago

@ Johanna Roberts: is it hard to do the dishes in Low Earth Orbit? Doesn’t the water go everywhere?

Nequam
Nequam
5 years ago

California’s primary isn’t ’til June, so not much to say here.

kupo
kupo
5 years ago

@Swales
From the videos I’ve seen from the space station it looks less messy than here on earth, though I haven’t seen any videos of dishwashing specifically. I’m thinking of videos of astronauts wringing wet towels, for example.

Also, I hated the scene in Gravity where she cries because I’ve seen actual footage of zero g crying and it was wrong. Of course, other stuff was wrong but that one bothered me.

RosaDeLava
RosaDeLava
5 years ago

@Chiomara
They did comment on some of his more… unortodhox positions, but even then it wasn’t treated with the seriousness it probably deserved.

I think ej is right. So much of journalism seems to be about shocking people rather than relating useful information – And given how many people in Brazil have been getting horribly reactionary as of late, I think Trump might even have quite a few fans here.

Pendraeg
Pendraeg
5 years ago

I’m really excited to caucus for Sanders this year, it’s the first election in years where I’ve actually really supported a candidate rather than just feeling like I’m holding my nose and picking the least distasteful.

Chiomara
Chiomara
5 years ago

@iknklast
HOLY SHIT,THERE IS?!!?!?

@EJ
Of that I know! But what is TERRIFYING is that he is not being portrayed as a monster! You see, if I was presenting him to the public I’d say “And Trump won another primary. For who doesnt know him, he is basically a fascist monster. And you should be terrified of him, especially being latinos or women. This guy hates your guts. He said xyz about latinos. Lets pray for him not to win.”
But what they are saying instead is “Trump won another primary 🙂 . For who doesnt know, he is a millionaire with some businesses in Brazil and he is controversial and funny. Other candidates have their jimmies all rusted up cause they cant stand how popular and different he is. He said xyz about Hilary, isnt that hilarious? Ah, good old Trumpy. She was so mad, but she had to pay for her tongue, cause he won again!”

It’s just terrifying. It’s very alike what they do with terrible brazilian polititians they support, making he seem a witty, moral lonely warrior fighting against all odds. But the difference is that I have no idea why would they do that for Trump. I fear Brazilian politics is getting so horrible his views are not even seen as that absurd by people here, nor by the news channels nor by the general public.

Tovius
Tovius
5 years ago

@lightcastle

Another theory on what’s going on with Trump.

http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424/trump-authoritarianism

That was both fascinating and worrying.

Mike
Mike
5 years ago

I need to know: Is there a REAL possibility he wins?!

Though many of us in the U.S. can barely believe it ourselves, the truth is that yes, there’s a real possibility. Someone on Twitter (sorry I forget who) said something that disturbed me with its utter plausibility: since this is America, the odds are very good that there will be at least one very deadly mass shooting between now and November. So, what if whoever commits the shooting says that they’re with Islamic State (or maybe even just has a vaguely Arabic-sounding name)? It might generate enough fear, rage, racism and xenophobia to send Trump over the top.

At this point it’s doubtful that he would win against the Democratic candidate, but a lot of people in the U.S. are angry and afraid about the state of the world, and Trump is the one most directly speaking to that anger and fear.

AthVeg34F
AthVeg34F
5 years ago

Re: why is she using a gun to hammer that nail?

Maybe that’s where South Park got their idea for Puff Daddy’s Vote or Die video?

iknklast
iknklast
5 years ago

Chiomara – I don’t know if the chance is huge; I’ve seen some polls that has Trump beating Clinton and some that has him losing big. That means yes, there is a chance.

And if Hillary is the nominee for the Dems (likely), she will be the target of the most coordinated hate campaigns we have seen in a long time. Will they exceed what they threw at Obama? Don’t know, but it is possible. After all, they’ve hated Hillary since before Obama was old enough to run for President.

Sexism doesn’t hurt the Donald with his own group, but it could in the larger election. Even a lot of casual sexists hate the blatant nastiness of people like Trump and his supporters, so his open disdain for women may turn the tide. Or not.

If he does win the nomination, I’m hoping against hope all those lifelong Republicans who have an ounce of common sense and actually do want what is right for their country will vote Democrat rather than see a dangerously stupid megalomaniac in the White House.

I live with a lifelong Republican. He will not vote for any of the current Repub possibilities. Problem is, he’s talking about not voting for President at all, because he doesn’t much like the Dems either. That’s another possibility – just voting in the local elections and leaving the Presidential blank empty, which won’t help. However, he’s worried enough about the current dastardly foursome that he might be willing to make a vote against them rather than for Hillary (who he doesn’t hate, and actually sort of likes, but doesn’t trust).

Chiomara
Chiomara
5 years ago

@James
The whole world does. 🙁

@Rosa Yes. The news seem to treat him like he is funny. Much like Bolsonaro. I honestly do not understand how is the general public not more afraid of these guys than they are of the devil. I don’t know if I worry too much, but I am honestly… I used this word in this thread several times already, but here it goes: I am terrified.

ThatBear
ThatBear
5 years ago

I’ll agree that Trump is authoritarian. Bluntly, openly, loudly authoritarian, to the point where I think a lot of his “supporters” think he’s joking when he really isn’t.

I can’t get my head around why so many libertarians like him, other than they aren’t libertarians so much as “edgy rebel assholes” who would gladly crash the whole country into a telephone pole if it meant a “pussy liberal” might be offended. Priorities!

Anyway, congratulations, GOP. You’ve successfully allowed a situation such that I will cast a vote for Hillary Clinton in the generals if need be. I didn’t think it could be done.

Steampunked
Steampunked
5 years ago

Our newspapers that are less Murdoch controlled are publishing articles to the tune of ‘a Trump win will destroy Australia’.

Hmm, time to go see what the ass, I mean, arch, conservatives are saying about him here. I’m a Guardian, not an Australian reader.

Theladyinsomnia
Theladyinsomnia
5 years ago

+1 on the Vox article. Strong and disturbing theory.

I’m American in the UK. Worrying from a distance tonight.

Speaking of disturbing – these photoshopped images of Trump as president…

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/9354014

leftwingfox
leftwingfox
5 years ago

@lightcastle: Good article. It’s interesting they didn’t mention Robert Altemeyer at all, as his work on The Authoritarians was relatively popular during the Bush “You’re either with us, or with the terrorists” phase and the rise of conservative media.

His book is here, and it’s absolutely recommended reading:
http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/

(And yes, I agree completely that the structural issues behind Trump aren’t going away any time soon. The GOP attack is that Drumpf is “too liberal”. I predict a few more election cycles of hard Alt-right candidates and wins.)

Pendraeg
Pendraeg
5 years ago

@leftwingfox #MakeDrumpfGreatAgain

XD

leftwingfox
leftwingfox
5 years ago

@ThatBear: I’ve noticed a disturbing trend towards authoritarianism in self-proclaimed “libertarian” circles. A few people I’ve talked to have suggested that a dictator that refuses to trample on economic liberties (i.e. Pinochet) is superior to a democratic government which engages in “economic coercion” (i.e. taxes and public utilities).

I think that comes from the Ayn Rand Objectivist school primarily. Her philosophy and books promote the idea of Great Men acting selfishly for the betterment of the petulant mooching masses.

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
5 years ago

Voted today in my Super Tuesday state. Aside from the presidential stuff, I voted for a sheriff candidate who wants to de-escalate the whole armed confrontation approach, spend more time on violent crimes and property crimes (less time on low-level possession charges), and slow down if not stop the whole “school to prison” pipeline.

Just a reminder that we’re voting for more than presidential candidates today.

Steampunked
Steampunked
5 years ago

Ok, the Australian describes Trump as non-conservative and is generally neutral with a passing reference to how he hates women and Mexicans, because that’s a pretty neutral position for that paper. The Australian is a highly right wing newspaper, so they are more concerned with getting titles right than giving a fuck about women or brown people.

The Herald Sun says about the same (identical wording!) but has omitted the comments about women and Mexicans. It’s a ‘working class’ conservative newspaper and doesn’t have a dog in the race aside from explaining a current big news event.

The Age is our centerist paper and is ‘what the fuck, KKK?! What?!’

Steampunked
Steampunked
5 years ago

@leftwingfox I despise those guys. They want to enjoy the feeling of nobility without the essence of it – sacrifice of the self.

guy
guy
5 years ago

I’m not sure I agree with the Vox article’s deeper analysis; unless the pattern of correlation is consistent across ethnic groups and nations I’d be inclined to say that it demonstrates that people who feel socially or morally threatened trend towards authoritarian responses and if civil rights were trending in the other direction we might well see Democratic authoritarians; it’s not like civil rights movements don’t have radical fringes. They’re not dominant, but on the other hand people are broadly optimistic on trends and expect things to get better rather than worse.

Granted, left-wing moral issues and physical security issues tend to be intertwined, so it’s plausible that they won’t become dominant absent people being afraid of physical threats.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
5 years ago

I’m still convinced there’s no chance Trump would win in the general. Too many people see him as a joke candidate.

Kirbywarp
Kirbywarp
5 years ago

Here’s yet another explanation for why Trump is leading, and why the future might hold more Trumps unless something fundamental changes. The basic idea is that Trump is the inevitable outcome of a process that the GOP has gone through with discrediting fact-checking and rewarding bombastic rhetoric, as if the party had worked to create a weakened immune system that Trump could take advantage of.

http://weeklysift.com/2016/02/29/trump-is-an-opportunistic-infection/

And I’d have to echo that Hillary being nominated would play into one of the most targeted hate campaigns we’ve ever seen. It’s been literally decades in the making, to the point where even liberals have been convinced by it and continue to parrot its talking points.

At least she’s used to it by now. 😐

On the bright side, maybe the GOP elites will be so repulsed by Trump that they set up an independent candidate and split the vote. It’s really a question of which is bigger; their Hillary hate or their Trump hate. Not exactly encouraging.

Man.. if Trump wins the general election, I’m seriously considering moving out of the country. I don’t even know if I’m being hyperbolic or not.

Fishy Goat
Fishy Goat
5 years ago

@leftwingfox Thanks for the Robert Altemeyer link. 🙂 Nice to see good stuff coming from my (former) home province.

guy
guy
5 years ago

Bernie Sanders is a self-described socialist and I really don’t think the Republicans will find it hard to run a smear campaign on him.

I’m somewhat worried about Trump winning, though he’s strongly predicted to lose for demographic reasons. This is the sort of climate where his brand of rhetoric wins elections or powers revolutions; there’s a lot of people who think the current system is broken and want it replaced, and Trump is offering a replacement. So is Sanders, it’s just a different replacement and appeals to different people. Or sometimes the same people.

They’ve got different platforms, but the same kind of platform: the party is beholden to wealthy special interests and won’t [defend against terrorists and keep foreigners from taking your jobs | provide universal healthcare and boost the minimum wage] but [Trump | Sanders] doesn’t depend on their support and is his own man, so he’ll change things. And that is the answer to why some people support Trump but are interested in Sanders or support Sanders but are interested in Trump; might well be some sexism in there on the left but that doesn’t explain the people whose Fox News-watching relatives are curious about Sanders.

EJ (The Other One)
EJ (The Other One)
5 years ago

Back in July of last year, I entered a betting pool on how long Trump’s little roadshow would last. At the time, I said that Trump would stay strong for a long time because there’s no impetus for any real adult behaviour from Republicans: Machiavelli himself could not win this election, so candidates who appeal to the instinct for denial will do better than candidates who make the party face uncomfortable truths.

My bet was that Trump would win the nomination and last until late October, at which point reality would catch up and his campaign would collapse.

I don’t stand by everything I said last July, but I stand by that.

Trump is ugly, but he is a creator of ugly fictions like Frank Miller rather than a creator of ugly realities like Vladimir Putin. He has no chance of getting into power, only of creating vivid fantasy worlds in the minds of his followers which makes them forget that they don’t live in those worlds.

WeirwoodTreeHugger
WeirwoodTreeHugger
5 years ago

The upside to the decades long anti-Clinton rage on the right is that it means there are no skeletons left in Hillary Clinton’s closet. There’s nothing about her we haven’t heard before. All of the talking points are pretty stale.

Trump on the other hand, is less vetted. Sure, he’s been famous for decades, but there’s no scrutiny like running for president. A Trump candidacy is target rich and I don’t think either Clinton or Sanders will be afraid to go after him.

guy
guy
5 years ago

Yeah, I don’t think the anti-Clinton rage is going to move her polling numbers any further than it already has. Possibly in the other direction if a Republican says something too revealing in the vicinity of a live mike, but I think they’ve really run all their possible talking points into the ground.

Katie'sKittens
Katie'sKittens
5 years ago

I’m so nervous about the results of Super Tuesday that I’ve made myself completely nauseous. It’s going to be a long day for me. >_<

Moggie
Moggie
5 years ago

leftwingfox:

Good article. It’s interesting they didn’t mention Robert Altemeyer at all, as his work on The Authoritarians was relatively popular during the Bush “You’re either with us, or with the terrorists” phase and the rise of conservative media.

I was wondering about that. I found The Authoritarians pretty compelling, but perhaps his work is less well regarded in academic circles?

Steampunked
Steampunked
5 years ago

Isn’t the situation to the point now where any campaign against Sanders or Hillary by Trump could be identical? Quite literally?

You could accuse Sanders of betraying his roots as a woman. You could accuse Hillary of betraying her roots as a democratic socialist. The counter of ‘but you are saying something random and not connected’ would be pointless against Trump, because his entire campaign is based on ‘be funny, be disruptive, and yell louder’.

Dalillama
Dalillama
5 years ago

@thatbear

I can’t get my head around why so many libertarians like him, other than they aren’t libertarians so much as “edgy rebel assholes” who would gladly crash the whole country into a telephone pole if it meant a “pussy liberal” might be offended. Priorities!

Close but not quite. The are right-libertarians, which is to say high-SDO personalities who’ve lived their lives high on the privilege curve. They support fascists because they are fascists. Right-liberarianism is all about the haves having absolute authority by divine right over the have-nots, and its proponents always see themselves on the have side of things. Their rhetoric is all about how the almighty business owners should be able to treat lowly employees, and uninvolved neighbors, however they want and nobody saying different. Many of them openly advocate debt-slavery. They are, frankly, vile people.

@leftwingfox

I think that comes from the Ayn Rand Objectivist school primarily.

Nope, it’s a common thread throughout. Look at how they lionize the work of Hayek and his proteges in helping Pinochet destroy Chile.

dlouwe
dlouwe
5 years ago

As one of your northern neighbors, there’s part of me that kind of wants to see Trump win the nomination, but only in order to spectacularly fail.

More pragmatically, I hope the entire GOP implodes and Bernie runs unopposed.

Josh
Josh
5 years ago

The only good thing I can say about Trump is that at least he’s screwed over Ted Cruz’s chances.

Otherwise he’s a failed orange cry baby, a think skinned short fingered lying bucket of human waste, a chickenshit coward who likes to talk tough. He’s a fascist who’s too much of a wimp to call himself a fascist, he can’t make a business without having to File for bankruptcy.

But somehow this IDIOT is convincing people that he is legitimate because he’s willing to tell bigots and idiots what they want to hear. The republican base has gone so goddamn far to the right I’m surprised they actually want a president at all, they hate the government so much.

JoeB
JoeB
5 years ago

#TRUMP2016
comment image

Zer
Zer
5 years ago

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