Categories
creepy empathy deficit entitled babies evil underage girls men who should not ever be with girls ever men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny pedophiles oh sorry ephebophiles rape rape culture

Tyga is a Creepy Predator, But He’s Hardly the First Creepy Predator in the Music Biz

Tyga and Kylie Jenner
Tyga and Kylie Jenner

It’s not exactly news at this point that the rapper known as Tyga is, as a rather self-explanatory headline in The Daily Beast put it yesterday, “a Creepy Predator Who Is Attracted to Underage Girls.”

As the Daily Beast’s Marlow Stern points out, the rapper famously started dating Kylie Jenner when she was 17 — officially “jailbait” in the state of California, where she lives — and defended the, er, romance in a song featuring one of the creepiest couplets in the history of lyrics:

They say she young, I should’ve waited

She a big girl, dog, when she stimulated.

This star-crossed romance got even skeezier last month, with tabloids reporting that while Tyga was dating Jenner he was also creeping on an even-more-underage girl online — a 14-year-old “Instagram model.”

In a press conference on Monday, with attorney Gloria Allred by her side, the girl in question — identifying herself as Molly O’Malia.– told her side of the story, saying that Tyga had approached her online, sending her messages on Instagram and trying to convince her to meet in person.

If her story is true, Stern notes, it

shows that Tyga is a predator with considerable means and influence who targets underage girls, just as he did with a teenage Kylie Jenner. And the public—and tabloid media—shouldn’t laugh off this despicable behavior any longer. It’s this lack of seriousness and accountability that’s allowed a demon like R. Kelly to continue to flourish, despite the countless young girls he’s left violated and forgotten.

Unfortunately, as the mention of the henious R. Kelly reminds us, Tyga is hardly the first predatory pop star. And in most cases, the media has been content to trivialize the issue or simply look the other way.

Sure, rocker Jerry Lee Lewis famously faced a backlash after journalists discovered that he had married a 13-year-old girl who also happened to be his first cousin once removed.

But Elvis Presley somehow managed to avoid this sort of scandal even while he was actively pursuing Priscilla Beaulieu, whom he met when she was only 14. The two eventually married in 1967 after what Biography.com euphemistically describes as a “nearly eight-year courtship.” According to assorted biographers, Elvis was positively obsessed with girls in their early teens. The official story, for what it’s worth, is that the singer didn’t actually have sex with any of them, preferring pillow fights and girly gossip.

Elvis wasn’t the first or the last pop star obsessed with underage girls; most had a lot more than pillow fights in mind. In a spoken-word section of the 1977 Kiss song “Christine Sixteen,” Gene Simmons declares

I don’t usually say things like this to girls your age, but when I saw you comin’ out of school that day, that day I knew, I knew I got to have ya. I got to have ya!

But it hasn’t been just rock ‘n’ roll sleazebags like Simmons who have advertised their interest in underage girls. The Knack’s “My Sharona” was about a real-life 17-year-old who was dating one of the band members; the group returned to the topic of underage girls in another song,“That’s What The Little Girls Do,” which laments how these “little girls” allegedly torment older men, breaking both their egos and their hearts. Oh, and the album that followed the massive hit Get The Knack was titled “But the Little Girls Understand.”

The list goes on and on. There’s Foreigner’s “Seventeen.” There’s “Young Girl,” by Gary Puckett and the Union Gap. There’s Donovan’s “Mellow Yellow,” a surrealistic ode to yellow vibrators — and 14-year-old girls.

And then there’s Led Zeppelin’s Jimmy Page. He didn’t write musical love letters to 14-year-olds. No, he just sent roadies to bring them to him, no questions asked. Or at least he did on one infamous occasion in 1972. As Cracked describes the incident, Page was so taken by 14-year-old groupie Lori Maddox, whom he’d spotted in a nightclub, that he

sent roadie Richard Cole to Maddox’s table with the message, “Jimmy told me that he’s going to have you whether you like it or not.” The roadie then grabbed her and chucked her in the back of a limo, saying, “You fucking move and I’ll fucking have your head.”

Page apparently did his best to keep the three-year “romance” that followed out of the press — and Maddox herself largely confined to his hotel room.

But the story has been out for decades now, and no one seems to give a shit about it. Page is still treated as a rock god, his creepy years-long exploitation of the extremely underaged Maddox seen as little more than a colorful example of seventies rock excess.

Some might say that it’s unfair to put Tyga’s skeezy but failed online seduction of a high school junior in the same category as, say, Page’s exploitation of Maddox. He didn’t kidnap her; they never even met in person.

Indeed, two other Daily Beast writers, Lizzie Crocker and Tim Teeman, sniff that

[i]n the annals of Allred cases defending pretty girls as victims of lurid celebrity scandals, this particular scandal was hardly a scandal at all before Allred entered the fray. … 

it was not clear what made O’Malia … a victim in this case, until she had been transformed into one by Allred.

But that’s not really the point. It’s a good thing that Tyga’s pursuit of a 14-year-old is a scandal (and it definitely was one, albeit a somewhat smaller one, even before Allred got involved).

Pop stars’ exploitation of their young female fans used to be such a “normal” and expected thing in the music business that some of the rock ‘n’ roll predators not only wrote songs about it, but wrote songs in which they — shades of Humbert Humbert — made themselves out to be the victims. 

Today, Tyga is getting called out on Twitter and in the tabloids for his predatory behavior. That’s a good thing.

I only hope that Jimmy Page and R. Kelly and all those other musicians who have happily exploited underage fans will eventually be held to the same standard.

Subscribe
Notify of
guest

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

159 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
peaches
peaches
4 years ago

@falconer, yeah, this was fairly recent. After Fowley died, Jackie went public with what had happened to her. Joan and Cherie Curry had been in the room while she was drugged and raped. Then Joan, for some reason, decided to deny that it was a rape. Guilt? Unable to admit she had done something wrong by not interfering? I have no idea.

Freemage
Freemage
4 years ago

User name subject to change
January 6, 2016 at 9:26 am
As a woman that used to date older guys when she was a teen I kind of resent the implication that I was somehow molested or abused. I actively pursued older guys because the ones my age were douche wads . I’m not saying those men aren’t predators, just that I was not a victim. Maybe Kylie Jenner is not a victim either since she is a bigger star then Tyga, and isn’t indebted to him in any way.

No one has the right to tell you you were a ‘victim’. That is true.

However, the key thing is not how you felt about the situation. It’s the motives of the men that’s at the crux of it. You may have just been seeking affection from someone not as douchey as your peers, but yes, those men were predators, looking to capitalize on your apparent lack of experience. Kylie Jenner may not be a victim, but Tyga is a predator, as his later activities demonstrate.

Ellesar
Ellesar
4 years ago

Joan Jett joined Chrissie Hynde and Whoopi Goldberg in the ‘women who really should know better’ club.

Lee
Lee
4 years ago

“Yandere” is a term from anime fandom that means something like “alternating between loving and dangerously obsessive”. (I’d link to the TV Tropes page, but holy ableism, Batman.)

Viscaria
Viscaria
4 years ago

I am really quite shocked to see a woman referred to as a sex toy in these comments. Women aren’t things.

peaches
peaches
4 years ago

@Ellesar –

Aw fuck, what did Chrissie Hynde do? I have no heroes left anymore.

Falconer
Falconer
4 years ago

@Ellesar, thank you, I was trying to remember “Whoopie Goldberg” in relation to “said it wasn’t really rape” but for some reason I kept drawing a blank.

AsAboveSoBelow
AsAboveSoBelow
4 years ago

Chrissie Hynde said of her own sexual assault that she should have known better, pretty much. She describes some bikers as wearing patches that read “I <3 Rape" and how she did not take that at face value. She said she was naive, which she probably was. Anyway, here’s an article about it: http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/sep/16/chrissie-hynde-clarifies-comments-on

dhag85
dhag85
4 years ago

I think most ephebophiles are turned on by the power difference in the relationship.

^This

And the “untouched beauty” crap is also about power.

peaches
peaches
4 years ago

@asabovesobelow ,

You know, I can understand that. I’ve got stuff from my past I try to rationalize too. I hate that she thinks it’s her fault, and that she thinks that is the logical conclusion. But I get it. There’s plenty of predators out there that tell young girls just that.

CDBurn
CDBurn
4 years ago

Are…are there any old-school muscians who aren’t massive shitheels? Like, any at all?

Robert
Robert
4 years ago

I’m glad now that the only musician who I am an actual fan* of has not had any (reported) history of such behavior.

One of the things that disturbs me about adult men who are fixated on young people as objects of sexual/’romantic’ interest is how it makes long term relationships impossible. While a short term relationship between adults can end in a variety of ways, an exploitive adult/youth one would necessarily end when the youth grows up. The predator is not interested in the adult person the victim is becoming; that might involve treating him/her as an equal. Nothin’ sexy ’bout THAT.

*Sananda Maitreya, formerly known as Terence Trent D’Arby.

peaches
peaches
4 years ago

@CDburn

Well, I’d like to think that Ronnie James Dio was without flaws, but I doubt it.

brian
brian
4 years ago

re: Japanese age of consent – to mostly echo someone previously, the “It’s 13 in Japan!” thing is something I hear parroted a lot too, but I am also under the impression that that’s the national age and, in practice, nearly every prefecture has it at 18.

Weirwood: I might have started it, I guess… and I did so because people were talking as though it was objectively, inarguably, fucked up that there are song lyrics about 16 and 17 year olds. And I don’t think that’s right… I brought up the legalities, because those are at least objective things you can point to. Whether or not it’s morally and ethically wrong for an “adult” to “go after” teenagers is something that can be debated, and, IMO, would vary greatly depending on the specifics of the people and the situation.

PinkiSyddyKitty
PinkiSyddyKitty
4 years ago

When I read about what Page did; I’m like DAMN!

I knew that he messed around with underaged girls (which is icky enough) but I had NO CLUE that he actually KIDNAPPED a girl and kept her as a sex slave!

Why isn’t this guy scrutinized? The other stuff is bad but what Page did is MEGA-BAD!

Lady Mondegreen
Lady Mondegreen
4 years ago

Just chiming in to echo what others have said about Police and Sting. Those songs Don’t Stand So Close To Me and Every Breath You Take are not mindless skeeve. EBYT is a look inside a stalker’s mind–it’s pretty damn chilling.

What’s really scary is the fact that people hear those lyrics and think the song is about love.

I once argued online with someone who thought Lolita is a love story. (Spoiler: it’s not.) The title character is orphaned, kidnapped, and abused, and we’re told she cries every night–but her nickname is used as a synonym for “underaged girl who seduces older man.”

Unreliable narrators: what’s those?

.

P.S. Nothing wrong with Every Little Thing She Does is Magic. Anybody can feel tongue-tied around someone they’re in love with/crushing on. I think the tone is more admiring and self deprecating than self-pitying, but either way, I can relate.

Matt
Matt
4 years ago

he was also creeping on an even-more-underage girl online — a 14-year-old “Instagram model.”

Who does he think he is, Ted Nugent? 😉

RainbowCJ
RainbowCJ
4 years ago

I agree with the earlier-stated idea that it’s not about the youth being a victim or not, it’s the predatory nature of an adult going after a child.

Even a very independent under-18 is lacking the legal-rights and experience (read: NOT maturity, experience) to be able to defend themselves if they end up with someone who is dangerous. So though they may seek out older people as intellectual and sexual peers, in reality (and the predators know this) their situation leaves them vulnerable if someone does treat them in a way they don’t want.
That and the large amount of teens who are still coming to terms with their sexuality, selves, and are desperate for belonging to a degree that leaves them largely open for exploitation on every level means that that age group would largely benefit from protection.

Hambeast, Social Justice Beastie
Hambeast, Social Justice Beastie
4 years ago

Most of the time, these revelations about famous people and their art don’t bother me much, in terms of being disappointed in them, that is.

But. Mellow Yellow has always been a favorite song of mine and this bums me out a bit. I’ve never looked up the lyrics since I’ve been pretty confident in my own mind what they were; seems I was wrong. Before today, I would have sworn up and down that it was “Fontaine” and not “fourteen” so, BAH.

WeirwoodTreeHugger
WeirwoodTreeHugger
4 years ago

Brian,
The age of consent in my state is 16. When I was 16 (and I didn’t look any older) I got hit on and catcalled by much older men all the time. This stopped happening with such frequency when I looked properly adult. I experienced this as predatory. So did the majority of my friends when it happened to them. I had a few friends and acquaintances at that age involved with guys more than 2 or 3 years older. Every one of them came from abusive or neglectful backgrounds or had mental health or substance abuse issues. In other words, they were vulnerable and ill equipped to make decisions well.

Teen girls may fantasize about teachers, coaches, rock stars, movie stars etc. That doesn’t make it okay for those adults to take advantage.

Age of consent laws tend to be old and were written by adult men.

There may be a few exceptions where a 16 or 17 year old is mature enough to be with a much older man, but please don’t mansplain about how we shouldn’t be so quick to judge and bring up consent laws. I know what predatory behavior looks and sounds like because I’ve been on the receiving end of it.

There’s a reason that it’s men 90% of the time who bring up the fact that some places have age of consent below 18.

Dalillama
Dalillama
4 years ago

@ Mike

I always thought it a little disconcerting the way The Beatles start “I Saw Her Standing There:”

To be totally fair, Lennon & McCartney were only about 20 themselves when they wrote that, so romantic inclination towards a 17 year old doesn’t really set off my creepdar. That said, Lennon was a domestic abuser, but I haven’t heard anything problematic about McCartney.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

@Kat:

If you actually wrote that, I’m kinda understanding she flew off her handle. Bebe Buell might be a symptom of how crappy the music business is for women, but it’s hardly her fault it’s like that.

Girls don’t get to play rock music unless they’re extremely talented or extremely pretty, and even then they’re not taken seriously. Guys, however, get to be both mediocre musicians and/or hugely unattractive. Imagine how much worse that must have been in the seventies…

No, I didn’t actually say that to her; I was paraphrasing. It came out as a lot harsher than it really was, because arguing with her was like arguing with a nastier, more dense version of JudgyBitch, and the memory of it started to get my dander up all over again, and my rhetoric got heated. Sorry about that. My actual comments to her were a lot milder. Basically I was pointing out the same frustrations with the music business as you, and questioning Buell’s defense of the status quo with regard to the groupie-rock star relationship.

The original reviewer said she was a musician in the New York scene and had witnessed a lot of sucky, degrading things happening to female groupies. She saw terrible behavior by male musicians, girls with low self-esteem, girls who were taken advantage of, drugged, and trampled on, all in exchange for proximity to talent. The book made her sad for that reason. She wished that more women felt inspired to participate in music as equals, not as conquests, which I fully agree with. I don’t see why that’s an unreasonable position to take, or what’s anti-feminist about that.

The problem I had with Buell is that she was claiming that the label “groupie” is inaccurate, that it should be considered an equal relationship because groupies are muses and goddesses (her term) who inspire lust, which in turn inspires songs and creative output. Keep in mind that she herself was making this argument from a position of relative privilege, having gotten close enough to several major rock stars to form long term relationships with them. She’s claimed elsewhere that a few songs have been written about her, including Todd Rundgren’s “Can We Just Be Friends” and The Artist Formerly Known As The Artist Formerly Known As Prince’s “Little Red Corvette” (according to her Prince was singing “Bebe, you’re much too fast”, which seems a little dubious, but okay).

The average groupie’s experience is far less equal, and *that* is what I was arguing. I wasn’t in any way arguing that groupies are sluts, or don’t deserve respect. The reality is that there is often a power discrepancy between older musician/young groupie, and unfortunately, male musicians don’t always regard groupies as equals or treat them respectfully. Some are straight-up callous and predatory, and that attitude trickles over into their songs. It goes with the territory, and it sucks. I felt it was disingenuous of Buell to try to paper over that imbalance and pretend it doesn’t exist, just because her experience was different. My other point was that “inspiring lust” is one degree removed from inspiring the music, so why not encourage young girls to eliminate the middleman and write/play some music of their own?

I don’t have any problem with women wanting to sleep with musicians – hey, talent is incredibly attractive and I’ve felt the same urge on a few occasions – but when people like Bebe claim that it’s empowering for underage girls to put themselves in situations they don’t understand that may endanger their well-being just for the sake of getting close to fame, well, that’s a problem, and I felt like I needed to say something, as well as stop her from flaming all over this poor person’s book review. It wasn’t just me. She was mercilessly bullying and attacking anyone and everyone who disagreed, even mildly. It reminded me of the Honey Badgers.

Frankly, I’m a little surprised that you’re defending her and accusing me of being retrograde. That seems backwards.

Also, you pretty much said “you’re just some pretty slut, no one really cares about you, have some self respect” to her. So classy, much feminist.

Nowhere did I ever say that. Look, I’m a friend (even if I’m not one of the WHTM regulars). Please put down the troll stick.

dlouwe
dlouwe
4 years ago

I think Canada does a decent job with age of consent laws; the general age of consent for sexual activity is 16, but it contains anti-exploitation protections for persons still under 18, for things like relationships with someone in a position of power/trust/authority, pornography, and prostitution. It also takes into consideration the “nature of the relationship” for subjectively predatory-but-not-otherwise-illegal situations. I can be okay with acknowledging 16 and 17 year-olds as soon-to-be adults with sexual agency, but they’re still very vulnerable and deserve adequate protection.

Hambeast, Social Justice Beastie
Hambeast, Social Justice Beastie
4 years ago

The worst Beatles song by far is “Run for your Life” and I cannot understand why it still gets airplay on the “Breakfast with the Beatles” radio show.

peaches
peaches
4 years ago

@buttercup

I agree with you for the most part. I’ve said it for years: being a muse is a lousy job. Having your personality serve as the creative grist for somebody else’s mill rarely works out well. I’ve been there, I did serve as inspiration for a few, when I was young and active (and mis-diagnoised and unmedicated) and in the long run, it doesn’t mean much. You wind up living up to some other person’s idealized version of you.

Also, if someone writes a book or a song about you, you don’t get royalties!

Ashley
4 years ago

I’ve been thinking about what it means to be a predator/pedophile ever since the Jared Fogle story broke out. Now Janet Bloomfield claimed in one of her posts earlier last year titled, In Defense of Pedophilia” that “Being attracted to the body of a sexually mature 13 year old male or female is not pedophilia by definition!”

But is pedophilia always about physical sexual characteristics? Jared Fogle talked in one of those phone confessions that he loves young, naive girls. “The younger, the better.” This isn’t just about physical characteristics. It’s normal to be attracted to breasts and developed bodies, but it’s an entirely different thing to act upon those who are underage. The ones that do, for them it’s not all just about sexuality either. It’s about preying on young people that have a child-like state of mind. A mind that is vulnerable, naive, and easy to manipulate. Power and domination.

Ellesar
Ellesar
4 years ago

peaches – it wasn’t Hyde’s reflection on her own experience that pissed me off – it made me sad, but that is her prerogative. It was the way she applied this to other women/ girls and judged them.

Falconer
Falconer
4 years ago

@Hambeast:

The worst Beatles song by far is “Run for your Life” and I cannot understand why it still gets airplay on the “Breakfast with the Beatles” radio show.

I paid it no attention when I was little, but as I grew up it started to disturb me. Privilege in action! And yeah, really horrible and threatening.

EJ (The Other One)
EJ (The Other One)
4 years ago

Buttercup Q. Skullpants, you’re definitely a friend and a regular. You’re one of the nicest of all of us.

peaches
peaches
4 years ago

@ellesar

Ah, yeah. Sorry.

Selt
Selt
4 years ago

I don’t really have much to add on the subject, beyond agreeing that there’s a ton of skeeviness in the music industry.

Hell, even Danny Elfman wrote a song about it with his usual…demented vigor.
http://youtu.be/jItz-uNjoZA

Buttercup Q. Skullpants
Buttercup Q. Skullpants
4 years ago

Aww, thanks, EJ! I don’t post very often, so I don’t count myself as a regular. WHTM commenters are a hilarious and smart bunch, and I hate the idea of rubbing anyone the wrong way.

I wish I had more time to post in depth and chat back and forth with everybody here. Usually when I’m reading WHTM, my twins are distracting me with Legos that need to be pried apart, or some catastrophe involving suntan lotion and the cat, or a drawing that requires someone to LOOKIT LOOKIT LOOKIT NOW RIGHT NOW, so I have to be content with occasional drive-by snark. If I say moronic things and use bad word choices when trying to type longer posts (see above), well…they’ll be out of the house in 18 years and maybe I’ll get my brain back.

Meanwhile, I’m mostly keeping my mouth shut and larnin’.

The worst Beatles song by far is “Run for your Life” and I cannot understand why it still gets airplay on the “Breakfast with the Beatles” radio show.

Yeesh, that one is up (or down) there with “Under My Thumb” in general horribleness. Compared to the Stones, the Beatles weren’t always cuddly and fuzzy. John had a lot of issues with abandonment and jealousy (no surprise, considering his chaotic early life).

Paul was pretty sympathetic towards women, especially the struggles and loneliness of working women, single women, and mothers. I always liked his character songs. George strikes me as the most ambivalent of the three. He wrote some beautiful love songs, but it’s not always clear whether he’s singing to God/Krishna or a woman.

It seems like attracting girls is a major impetus for many young guys to learn a rock instrument and join a band. I’ve seen advice on PUA and seduction forums to that effect – “Learn guitar and instantly slay (unpleasant slang for genitalia) !” Maybe that drives a lot of the icky behavior and lyrics, and some musicians just fail to outgrow it.

dlouwe
dlouwe
4 years ago

@Selt

I’m not sure what to do with the sudden knowledge that Jack Skellington’s singing voice (and also one of my favourite film composers) was also the lead singer in Oingo Boingo.

Fruitloopsie
Fruitloopsie
4 years ago

Reading about Elvis Presley and being a fan I just had my heart pierced and cried for the truth that has killed me inside. Rest in Peace.

Hugs for all who have been with creepy predators. And ones who have found out the “truth”.

http://youtu.be/sbwTZPjieLA

Speaking of yanderes, I don’t mind having one there are really good ones out there, they are very rare but they’re out there.

Nequam
Nequam
4 years ago

@Selt: FWIW, I’m certain Elfman was mocking the whole thing. I’ve never heard anything skeevy about his offstage life.

Bina
4 years ago

She had taken umbrage with a review on a book written by a former groupie, and was insisting that groupies aren’t just sex objects, they’re muses and goddesses worthy of respect in their own right who inspire great love songs.

Uff, PLEASE, Bebe. Most of those “great love songs” are forgettable bilge, and amount to little more than “Oo, baby-baby, you’re so young and tight, I wanna get into your pants and boff you all night, so I wrote you this song. Now don’t take long. And while you’re at it, couldja gimme some head!” Deathless poetry, they are NOT. And these dudes are not gods, and being passed around among them doesn’t make you a goddess. Sleep with whom you want to if that’s your thing, but don’t kid yourself about what you really are to them.

I also note in passing how little of music — or indeed ANYTHING artistic — is devoted to women fetishizing and using under-age boys this way. Other than the afore-noted Joan Jett song, which I take to be ironic, because Joan is openly gay. (I twigged to that from the moment I heard her cover of Tommy James’s great “Crimson and Clover”, and was a bit surprised that she didn’t switch any pronouns.) And because it’s not apparent from the lyrics who’s being the real aggressor, anyway. (I always kind of figured it was the dude. I could be wrong, though.)

PS: Age of consent in Canada used to be 13, but was upped to 16 some years ago, probably because people were finally getting skeeved out by early teen marriages to older men. Teachers are expected to keep hands off students because they are in a position of power and trust, regardless of how small the age gap between them and their students might be. And because quid-pro-quo grades-for-sex shit is inexcusable, no matter who’s “seducing” whom.

raysa
raysa
4 years ago

Iggy Pop dressed up like a woman, and said that there was no shame in dressing as a woman, because there is no shame in BEING a woman.

Kurt Cobain said that he couldn’t understand why we teach women to DEFEND themselves from rape, that we should be teaching men to NOT rape.

dhag85
dhag85
4 years ago

@Buttercup Q. Skullpants

Post more if possible, though! 🙂

weirwoodtreehugger
4 years ago

Iggy Pop dressed up like a woman, and said that there was no shame in dressing as a woman, because there is no shame in BEING a woman.

My mom’s friend had a one night stand with him when she was younger (but not underage!) A secret she divulged very loudly in the middle of a restaurant after having a bit too much to drink. Her exact words were “I fucked Iggy Pop!”

Kurt Cobain said that he couldn’t understand why we teach women to DEFEND themselves from rape, that we should be teaching men to NOT rape.

He was my first celebrity crush and I’m so glad I’ve never had to be embarrassed about it. I still love him and wish he was still around.

Bina
4 years ago

Now Janet Bloomfield claimed in one of her posts earlier last year titled, In Defense of Pedophilia” that “Being attracted to the body of a sexually mature 13 year old male or female is not pedophilia by definition!”

Ugh, trust HER to go there.

Having seen 13-year-old boys (and been a 13-year-old myself many eons ago), I can’t imagine what the attraction is for adults; it was hard enough to feel it myself at that age. They’re as immature at that age as the girls, if not more so. The only person with any right to feel sexual attraction to a 13-year-old is another 13-year-old, but at that age, everybody is so cliquey and dorky and perpetually awkward and emotionally labile that it’s a wonder they can feel anything for each other at all.

When I see high-school boys now, I never think “young stud with a body that won’t quit”, because all I ever see is a gangly (or chubby), pimply, ill-defined kid with a lot of growing up left to do. I do prefer younger men, but the operative word here is MEN. I want a fully developed pair of frontal lobes, not just a working set of ‘nads. That’s where MY lowest bar is set.

“Sexually mature” doesn’t mean jack shit, beyond being able to produce sperm or eggs that could lead to a viable pregnancy. Just because a boy that age can get an erection, or several a day, doesn’t mean that he’s not still very much a kid. Or that he’s any more of an adult than he was when he wasn’t yet spending hours in the bathroom wanking over a Playboy he stole from his dad’s hidden stash.

And it doesn’t give anyone the right to take advantage of his erectile capacities, either.

NickNameNick
NickNameNick
4 years ago

[i]n the annals of Allred cases defending pretty girls as victims of lurid celebrity scandals, this particular scandal was hardly a scandal at all before Allred entered the fray. …

it was not clear what made O’Malia … a victim in this case, until she had been transformed into one by Allred.

Jesus fucking Christ, what kind of ass-backwards logic is that?

It’s only a scandal because of Gloria Allred’s involvement? What about the fact that, I dunno, an older man was trying to seduce underage girls? I understand it’s a (outdated) social norm, where younger women marrying men a decade or more their senior is sometimes encouraged, but I thought we got to the point where it stops being an excuse for anyone under the age of 18.

Pop stars’ exploitation of their young female fans used to be such a “normal” and expected thing in the music business that some of the rock ‘n’ roll predators not only wrote songs about it, but wrote songs in which they — shades of Humbert Humbert — made themselves out to be the victims.

And, of course, it’s rather infuriating when they do that – being these successful entertainers who can get away with a lot.

I notice it with comedians and comicbook artists as well, this weird notion that being criticized or called out for bad behavior makes them victims of “political correctness” or the Ess-Jay-Dubews. Yeah, it’s so unbearable to take responsibility for the work they put out and how they compose themselves in public – all while sitting atop their ivory tower, weeping into silk hankies embroidered with their initials.

We unwashed commoners obviously can’t comprehend the tragedy that is their often decadent lifestyles…

raysa
raysa
4 years ago

I’m old now, but I was a drummer from the time I was about 14 up until my 30s.

In 90, I had just turned 18 and I moved from my small town to Atlanta, where I lived until 98. I auditioned for and subsequently played with about 100 bands. I knew 2 other female musicians, both guitarists. I met a few others, but they fell off the map, just like lots of guys did.

Anyway, every single audition that I went on, ALWAYS, it was “you sound good, but would you wear a corset, sweetie?” or some form of something about how I looked.

If I wanted to play, I had to look how the men running it wanted me to look. And I sat behind a huge drum kit, it’s not like anyone could actually see me all that well. After 8 years, I just quit. I wasn’t making a living, I was a hairdresser the rest of the time, but I did it because I loved it. It didn’t matter how much I loved it, I just couldn’t stomach it anymore.

I met some good people, I got to meet iggy Pop once, he was great. I knew the black crowes, their drummer was from the same small town I grew up in. I also knew drivin’ and cryin’, they were nice.

I also met some famous men that were horrible people. Let’s say that if anyone loves echo and the bunnymen, or anthrax, I won’t ruin them for you. But I could. 😉

Ken
Ken
4 years ago

@selt

Oingo Boingo’s “Little Girls” is supposed to be satire. Danny Elfman wrote it about all the older guys he would see in LA with much younger women. Hence the chorus:

They don’t, ask me questions
They don’t, want to scold me
They don’t, look for answers
They just, want to hold me

The basic idea being that these guys would date young women because they were less threatening to their fragile egos than grown women. Hardly a tribute to ephebophilia. Also, the live version from their farewell concert is much better:

[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vqn-w0wYzQ&w=420&h=315%5D

sorry, not really sure how to embed. Link works, though.

AltoFronto
AltoFronto
4 years ago

Ew, what the heck does JB define as “sexually mature”??

I have a 13-year-old family member, and while his cohort are all starting to think independently and develop their adult personalities, they’re nowhere near grown-up, and especially not in a sexual way.

I have never seen a 13-year-old with a fully mature body – Hell, I was a semi-early developer, and I’d barely got any pubic hair at that age.
13-year-old boys are all still short, and high-voiced, and none of them are close to having whiskers. They’re barely even pubescent.

They’re all kids with muddy knees, really. I have to explain the sex jokes in The Simpsons to my 13-yo.
There’s just nothing sexually appealing about kids that age, to a normal adult.

And it makes me want to puke to think that there are people who want to insist that it’s normal to sexualise children. Somehow it’s worse when the abuse apologists are mothers themselves.

Fruitloopsie
Fruitloopsie
4 years ago

I am so terrified for Jb’s children. Its terrible to be living with a pedo/rape apologist and being a rapist herself there is probably a chance she’s a pedophile as well.

AltoFronto
AltoFronto
4 years ago

@Fruitloopsie – I wouldn’t speculate about JB’s own behaviour in that regard, but I really hope her kids manage to grow up with a healthy perspective on things. It’s unlikely that her public opinions wouldn’t affect their upbringing in some ways.

AsAboveSoBelow
AsAboveSoBelow
4 years ago

@raysa: Ian McCulloch said I had pretty hair. That was about it. I’ve had good luck in meeting famous people. They’ve always been friendly and not creepy. The danger in meeting your idols is that they’ll be odious, freaky jerks.

Hu's On First
Hu's On First
4 years ago

One word: Lostprophets.

Jen
Jen
4 years ago

Buttercup, sorry if I’m gonna ruin George Harrison for you, but Patti Boyd’s autobiography about her life as the wife of first George Harrison and then Eric Clapton makes it very clear just how normalized behaviors were in that world that we would today readily acknowledge as sexist, abusive, cruel, and dangerous. I closed the book thinking, “Damn, she sure put up with a lot of completely insane shit.”

Pandapool -- The Species that Endangers YOU (aka Jackie; currently using they/their, he/his pronouns)
Pandapool -- The Species that Endangers YOU (aka Jackie; currently using they/their, he/his pronouns)
4 years ago

I’m happy I don’t know half the people listed here, although the Joan Jett thing still hurts. :'(