In the interview with the Today show in which he acknowledged that he’s HIV positive, Charlie Sheen declared that HIV is “a hard three letters to absorb.”
Over on Reddit’s Men Going Their Own Way subreddit, the regulars are responding to claims that Sheen may have had sex with 200 or more partners since becoming HIV positive with three other letters: LOL.
In a post with the told-you-so headline “Hypergamy Bites Back: Sheen Fucks 200+ Women After Being Diagnosed With HIV,” Redditor Factushima, whose comment history is filled with contributions to the MGTOW, MensRights and TheRedPill subreddits, declares:
The possibility that “cock carousel”-riding women may have contracted HIV from Sheen makes some of Reddit’s MGTOWs positively giddy. Some of their responses:
(I assume that in this context, TS means either “Tough Shit” or “Totally Sweet.”)
There were a few critics of Sheen as well. Like this gentleman with the lovely username “drippingdownherbreas” (sic).
As are you all, MGTOWs, as are you all.
*interestingly
The whole ‘hypergamy’ thing is the Manosphere’s ‘big brilliant bad idea’. It’s disturbing how it can easily seep into other areas (I’ve seen a comment thread on the Guardian where someone was saying that ‘alphas’ get most of the sex, and a comment on a geek blog – discussing what issues should be discussed in contemporary scifi – where someone mentioned most men being overlooked in favour of the ‘top 20% of successful men’. Hypergamy (at least the concept of it that the manosphere talks about) has absolutely no scientific evidence, but it can be used to explain such questions as ‘why I’m not getting laid’, ‘why women can’t be trusted’, and, at the paranoid end of the scale (see Black Pill) ‘why women/feminists don’t care about most men and would happily kill them’.
Wishing everyone making jokes about this situation would go and read Randy Shilts’ And The Band Played On, and then take a good, hard look at themselves. Sheen’s a terrible human being, but I can’t find any schadenfreude in this, especially if others have been infected.
Kale — fwiw I made that gif literally years ago in response to MRA idiocy about their being no birth control for men, and I think we were all (or at least mostly) talking about now that he knows he’s positive. But yeah, saying that it’d 100% prevent it and if he’d only used one! is shitty.
I just mostly wanted to break out the gif.
I just want to check:
No one uses “hypergamous” except for these assholes, right? Can I go ahead and add that to my list of words/terms like “SJW” and “cuck” and “cultural marxism” and “miscegenation” that immediately let me know that I am not dealing with a rational human being?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypergamy
So, that’s a solid “Yes, feel free to add it.” Unless the Internet has a sudden influx of social scientists who specialise in India’s caste system.
Brian, you are mistaken. It is a legitimate term in sociology(meaning something completely different).
And of course actual sociologists have found its incidence has been on a negative trend over the past few decades. Because, you know, there’s less of a patriarchal culture that expects it and women are free to make a choice that suits them rather than be dependent on men.
Wait, THAT’S what it means? Is that how they’re using it? Maybe they are and I didn’t realize… from context and, well, guessing, I thought it was just used for “sluts who ride the cock carousel” to use their gross language.
@ikanreed:
I didn’t mean “is it a made up word?”. I knew/assumed it had an actual meaning and wasn’t invented by them. But, AFAIK, “Cultural Marxism” is a real thing that actual people might talk about… but I never hear about it from anyone other than MRA-ish/Neo-Nazi-ish types… and, so far at least, the same has gone for “hypergamy.”
Oh, in that case, yes for sure put it on the list.
They think women deserve to be punished with pain and death for having sex with men who aren’t them.
That is so creepy.
All over the world women are punished to death for just that.
They think that is great. They think that makes them super smart, good people.
The mind. She boggles.
@Kale
I completely agree with what you said. I understand people’s reaction to jump on the condom thing, but it does feel a bit like blaming someone after the fact for contracting the disease which really serves no good purpose. Also, the idea that someone here expressed of ALWAYS using a condom even in a monogamous relationship is absurd to me. I get it, people cheat, but come on, are you really going to use condoms til the day you die even if you’re married or in a committed relationship? I mean, that’s your choice but I really don’t think it’s reasonable to suggest that it’s what everyone should do. The implication of that suggestion is if they trust the wrong person they have no one to blame but themselves.
Argenti – no worries 🙂
What I dislike about hypergamy is the way misognyists have turned it into a slur: “Those conniving gold-digging bitches, they’re all out to suck resources and money from men!” I also really dislike the assumption that it’s biologically wired into women (and therefore not to be tampered with) (but still awful and terrible and bad), rather than, say, a cultural side effect of denying women access to wealth.
It’s pretty hypocritical for accusations of hypergamy to come from a group of people whose main mission in life is to score nubile teenagers with an attractiveness level well beyond their own. How is that not a form of hypergamy? In sociological terms, hypergamy simply means it’s human nature to seek the best partner out of the pool of available people. Not a remarkable observation, but MGTOWs think it’s a moral failing when women do it, and a moral imperative when they do it.
As for Charlie Sheen, it’s really sad that HIV still carries such a stigma that he felt he couldn’t reveal his diagnosis for fear of harming his career. The only reason he’s going public now is to put an end to the hush money he’s been having to pay out to various people in his circle (to the tune of $10 million). The blackmail fees are bankrupting him, and the National Enquirer was preparing to publish an expose later this fall, so he really had no choice but to come clean.
And of course, MGTOWs aren’t questioning their cherished alpha ideals over this. There’s a lesson here about the way extreme wealth and fame breed arrogance, attract grifters and opportunists, corrupt relationships, and cause a lot of mess and pain and dishonesty. But nope, not the fault of the alpha bad boy or a system that simultaneously worships and tears down celebrities. It’s those evil CC riders who ruin everything.
I guess what I’m trying to get it, is here’s a guy who’s living the Alpha Redpill Male fantasy life – rich, good-looking, famous, constant female companionship – and he’s a hot mess and his life is a nightmare. You’d think MGTOW would be all “hmm, maybe this is not the best lifestyle to aspire to, maybe we’re not really missing out on anything” instead of pointing at the women and going “HAW haw!!!”
But then I remember this is MGTOW we’re talking about here. People who have the emotional maturity of a taco.
*trying to get AT. My fingers are moving faster than my brain today.
If Zazzle doesn’t stock it, I don’t stock it. :U (Though, it does give me ideas.)
In store-related news though, I have recently replaced my long-lost tablet pen, now presumed lost to the black hole that is my room.
The new pen, now dubbed Lady ScratchySketch the Second, has graciously accepted her new post, and while we still hold out hope for Lady ScratchySketch the First’s return to her home, the Second has taken up her duties in the meantime.
This now means I can (attempt to) do illustrations for ze store, though most designs will most likely stick to Illustrator work.
I might be nitpicking here, but sociology does not include in its field of expertice the decoding of “human nature”.
I think it would make more sense to say in sociological terms, hypergamy means people who seek the best partner out of the pool of available people.
Asking because you sound authoritative on the matter and so you can hopefully field questions:
Doesn’t this mean that we’re all hypergamous? I mean, we all have our own definitions of “best person” but are going to try to find our own optimal partner within that definition. If the pool includes a cute feminist who can knowledgeably discuss Foucault, Beaudelaire and GRR Martin, I’m going to date her rather than someone who thinks E.L. James writes the perfect romances. Does that make me hypergamous?
(I’m going to a gig with such a person on Saturday. Wish me luck!)
Contracting HIV is not at all a death sentence for anyone who can access the right meds – CS can afford to pay for meds for anyone that he has infected – if he has infected anyone he should be court ordered to do so.
No one is going to be happy about contracting HIV, and there are quite a few downsides to the anti retro virals currently available, but with good treatment and support it has fewer physical downsides than diabetes, for example.
The social stigma is another issue entirely. I worked with people with HIV and a woman was terrified of informing the school of her son’s condition. It was likely that they had a pretty good idea already, but she was absolutely not going to take the risk of telling them. I couldn’t blame her – it only takes one arsehole to fuck it all up with their ignorance.
In real sociological terms, hypergamy is “marrying up”: people or families advancing their status by joining higher-status families. In manosphere lingo, it means “sleeping with people who are better than MRAs,” which is everyone because MRAs hate themselves. And it’s only bad when women do it.
EJ: Yes and no, on hypergamy.
In general, the term seems to mainly apply specifically in societies with a relatively strict social hierarchy. The more rigid your class-system is, the easier it is to track individuals who marry out of their birth-class. Since we live in a world full of patriarchal societies, hypergamy usually ends up involving women marrying men of a higher social standing. In nations where both patriarchy and class structure declines, you end up with a decrease in hypergamous activity (as well as a shift away from a strictly gender-based concept of it; in some countries, it’s becoming more common for less wealthy men to seek out a richer/higher standing wife).
@EJ,
Hypergamy has nothing to do with finding the “best partner” or “most attractive partner” or anything like that, and it’s also not really a drive or a personality. It’s a practice (sociology mostly describes customs and practices, not drives)
Hypergamy is marriage between partners of different social class; or rather, it is marriage to a person of higher class. Class is of course notoriously difficult to define, but it’s some combination of wealth, special legal rights, and/or customary deference and “social status.” Beauty, intellect, or virtue are not class markers. So no, most people are not hypergamous, because most people in most countries marry other people from their own social class.
@freemage, Orion:
Thanks. That makes a lot of sense to me and clarifies the term (as well as making it clear how horrendously misused it is by MRAs.)