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MRA Jack Barnes is trying to silence me with increasingly explicit threats

Jack Barnes, in a screenshot of one of his YouTube videos
Jack Barnes, in a screenshot from one of his YouTube videos

Jack Barnes, the notoriously hotheaded Men’s Rights Activist and longtime contributor to A Voice for Men, has escalated his attacks on me. In a post on AVFM, Barnes addressed me directly:

I’m a junkyard dog with no owner and no collar. …

Didn’t anyone ever tell you that you shouldn’t piss off a redheaded country boy from the backwoods of Tennessee? I promise you David that for the rest of your life there will be nights you cry yourself to sleep in anger and frustration over me.

In a followup post on TwitLonger, someone claiming to be Barnes — and it seems abundantly clear that it is in fact him — threatened to drive from Tennessee to Chicago to confront me in

a face to face in person discussion … No cops. No lawyers or prosecutors. No judges. No jury. No hiding behind a computer. Just me and you. …

I don’t know of any parent that would blame me for stomping a mud hole in your fucking ass and walking that motherfucker dry for what you have done!

What I have done is, in fact, nothing — nothing beyond letting the world know of some of the disturbing things Barnes has posted online.

But as Barnes sees it, I am responsible for putting his family in danger. How? Well, not long ago, someone apparently doxed Barnes, posting personal information about Barnes and his family on Twitter.

Of course, I had nothing to do with the doxing and only learned about it later from an AVFM video. I don’t know who did it, and I have publicly condemned it several times.

I will condemn it again, right here: the doxing of Jack Barnes and his family was wrong and a deeply shitty thing to do; whoever did it is a shithead and no friend of mine.

But Barnes is convinced one of my “cult followers” did the deed and bluntly warns me that ” I hold you personally responsible for this occurring.”

Even though I did not dox him, don’t know who doxed him, did not tell anyone to dox him, and have publicly denounced doxing in general and the doxing of Barnes and his family specifically.

The TwitLonger post declares:

You have crossed a line David. This is no longer about the MHRM vs feminism. This is no longer about AVFM, which I have no affiliation with, and your website. This is no longer about Paul Elam publisher of AVFM vs you as publisher of your website. You have made this personal. This is now about me vs you.
I don’t care that your little cult follower doxxed me. But when he/she doxxed my wife and little girl it became personal.

The author of the TwitLonger post, almost certainly Barnes himself, says that he will only come to Chicago for the promised “face to face in person discussion” if his family members come to harm.

But I do not have the luxury of seeing the threats as conditional ones. There are no conditions listed when he writes:

I don’t know of any parent that would blame me for stomping a mud hole in your fucking ass and walking that motherfucker dry for what you have done! Hell, I bet even Gondi would be like “he did what to you family? Fuck him up!

He is not saying that he would only be justified in “stomping a mud hole in [my] fucking ass” if something were to happen to his family; he is saying he is justified in doing so now.

Because some person who is not me, and who is unknown to me, did something I only found out about later and that I have publicly denounced.

And a possible “stomping” is not all I have to worry about: in his AVFM post, Barnes made sure I know that he

live[s] in a state with more guns than people, where a side arm is as common as a cell phone and where it is legal for 10yr olds to hunt with high powered rifles and without adult supervision.

So I can only assume that if he ever decides to pay me an unwanted visit he will be armed.

The author of the TwitLonger post — almost certainly Barnes — declares that his obvious threats against me are not in fact threats but “simply a statement of fact.” I think any reasonable person reading these posts would see them as clear threats, and I am treating them as such.

And it is plainly obvious to me that Barnes intends to terrorize me into silence with his threats — as his “promise” on AVFM that “for the rest of your life there will be nights you cry yourself to sleep” thinking about him makes abundantly clear. His threats are consistent with the threatening language he uses against feminists online, particularly on Twitter, which are clearly intended to shut his opponents up. As he put it in one notorious Tweet

https://twitter.com/Jackbarnesmra/status/559761561028669440

Adding to the surreality of this all, Barnes and his allies at A Voice for Men are so committed to their bizarre caricature of me as some kind of cartoon supervillain that they not only blame me for things I haven’t done but for not doing things that I have done. In this case, their eyes seem to have blurred over when they’ve come across the things I’ve written condemning the doxing.

In his AVFM post, Barnes wrote that while other feminists had denounced the doxing,

there was one person who has remain eerily silent about all this. That person is David Futrelle. Seems odd since all of this doxxing was done to avenge him. There is not a peep from Futrelle about this on his site or on social media anywhere that I could find. As a parent I know my kid is up to no good when she is quiet. Wonder if the same goes for adults (assuming the word applies)?

In fact, I had condemned the doxing two days earlier in a post that Barnes has publicly acknowledged reading.

On Twitter, AVFM’s “Chief Public Relations Officer” Suzy McCarley did Barnes one better, somehow managing to miss my denunciation of the doxing in a Tweet of mine that she was literally quoting at the time, leading to this rather surrealistic exchange:

Suzy McCarley ‏@SuzyMcCarley Suzy McCarley Retweeted David Futrelle Boobz had to know it and he didn't make a peep until he was called out. @DavidFutrelle STILL hasn't condemned it. Suzy McCarley added, David Futrelle @DavidFutrelle . @Jackbarnesmra I DID NOT DOX YOU OR YOUR FAMILY. I DON'T KNOW WHO DOXED YOU OR THEM. WHOEVER DOXED YOU/THEM WAS WRONG. RETWEET 1 LIKES 3 Bob LorinczMike KlengenburgMel Liflora 9:19 PM - 8 Nov 2015 Reply Retweet Like More Tweet text Reply to @SuzyMcCarley Who's in these photos? David Futrelle ‏@DavidFutrelle Nov 8 @SuzyMcCarley I called it out as soon as I heard about it. I condemned in in a post and in the tweet you just fucking quoted.

It is almost as if they are so committed to seeing me as a monster that they cannot handle it when reality defies their expectations.

Another longtime AVFM supporter, so-called “Honey Badger” Hannah Wallen, has added a decidely Kafkaesque series of Tweets to the Twitter dogpile, including one that puzzled me greatly until she explained her “logic” in more detail:

Eventually, I was able to understand that she was taking my concern over Barnes’ threats … as proof that I was planning to harm his family.

She explained her “logic” in a blog post I discovered later. Utterly ignoring my denunciations of the doxing, and of doxing in general, she declared that if i didn’t immediately “admit”that my worries about Barnes’ threats were “a completely irrational overreaction to being held responsible for the effects of his dishonest shit stirring on his followers” I was essentially admitting that I was planning some sort of attack on Barnes’ family:

[H]is current response indicates .. that he intends for harm to come Jack’s family as a result of his shit stirring, that he DOES encourage his readers to engage in this type of behavior, and that he DOES intend for one or more of his readers to respond to his writing by engaging in violence against HIS political opponents.

After all, “If X, then Y” only infers Y on the condition of X… so responding to “If you X, then I’ll Y” as if the individual has only stated “I’m going to Y” is an admission that you’ve planned on X happening.

This, I have to admit, is pretty ingenious. Kafka would be proud.

But just in case anyone thinks there is anything to Wallen’s sophistry: I do not support doxing in general, and have made this clear on numerous occasions. I did not, do not, will not support the doxing of Jack Barnes or his family, nor do I have the slightest idea who did it. I do not “intend … for harm to come [to] Jack’s family” or to him. (Indeed, I don’t even know where they live; not only did I have nothing to do with the doxing of Barnes and his family, I didn’t even know about it until after the doxing tweets were deleted.) I do not support violence against my political opponents.

All of this is obvious to anyone who actually reads what I write on this blog without their perceptions distorted by MRA-induced prejudice or preconceptions.

That said, I will not apologize for taking Barnes’ threats seriously.

Nor will I apologize for exposing misogynistic Men’s Rights activists to the light of day — not by “shit stirring” or engaging in Wallen-esque sophistry, but by quoting their own words and reporting their real deeds.

And when people harass and threaten me — whether that’s Barnes, those at AVFM who have aided and abetted his threats, or anyone else — I will take every legal step I feel is necessary for my safety and the safety of others.

This post is one of those steps.

 

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Zeb Berryman
Zeb Berryman
6 years ago

athveg34f: Let’s not go down that road. There have been way to many times that MRA’s have dismissed genuine harassment this way. We can acknowledge that they’ve been victimized while still saying that Barnes is a terrible person.

MexicanHotChocolate
MexicanHotChocolate
6 years ago

Barnes talks tough but his post reads like every other internet tough guy I’ve seen on the web. Invariably internet tough guys are all talk. Barnes will rant and rave, but ultimately, he won’t do anything.

Denteavvelenato
Denteavvelenato
6 years ago

This is old hat for JackBarnes he already threw a tantrum and accused several others of “doxxing” him on a website called Experience Project YEARS AGO, he also explicitly threatened various forms of violence and harassment to a few feminist members of Experience Project. (He denied they were actual threats. ) No proof of the doxxing ever existed and all people he accused repeatedly condemned doxxing. So this is a repeat performance from JackBarnesMRA (formerly known as KnightrunnerMRA,) and anyone with enough time can dig through the comment history on ExperienceProject.com to see what a fraud this accusation is.

Carayak
Carayak
6 years ago

Thank you, Mr. Futrelle, for your dedicated years of flipping over rocks and exposing the squirming filth underneath to the rest of the world. I’m continually astounded at the cognitive connections these people must repeatedly refuse to make in order to continue in their worldview, but that quotation of you actually denouncing doxxing is remarkable, even by MRA standards. Stay strong, and know that justice is on your side.

crimvulgar
crimvulgar
6 years ago

Pretty solid demo of their logic here, tbh, given that “If X then Y” in no way implies “If Y then X.” It’s actually a named logical fallacy (Affirming the Consequent, because all logical fallacies sound like Coheed and Cambria songs).

I just can’t even begin to see why someone would so obsessively argue that without thinking about it for a few seconds. I know there are more important, hurtful things going on here, but that really alarmed my mathematician brain.

Paradoxical Intention
6 years ago

I’m totally supporting you on this, David. Barnes has stepped way out of line because he apparently completely believes you’ve doxxed him somehow, and the fact that they’re ignoring you saying that it was shitty and you don’t condone it is both frustrating and hilarious.

If he believes you’ve doxxed him somehow, I’m in agreement with others: gather some evidence, Mr. Barnes. If you think that David, or someone else, has doxxed you, gather up the evidence, and send it to police. Make a fuss, get them to take care of it and find who’s responsible.

Of course, you won’t do that, because that advice comes from another proud feminist, who is happy you want to protect your family, but still thinks you’re a shitweasel because you proudly harass and attack feminists on the internet using terrorist tactics because you’d rather we just shut up instead of listen to anything we have to say.

rugbyyogi
6 years ago

Also adding support, this must be very stressful and I’m sorry that you’re going through this, but I admire what you’re doing. I find it almost humorously ironic that they’re accusing you of doxxing when you’ve condemned Internet harassment in general and drawn a very reasonable line between exposure of what people have already published and what needs to remain veiled. You absolutely could not have been clearer about that even in your own recent interactions with them – that Tweet is absolutely hilarious (but frustrating, too.)

And even though it’s not my right to do so, as a Tennessean, I’d just like to say ewww – not happy with his characterisation of my people and #NotAllTennesseans. Although I do know us well enough to say that you’re absolutely right to take this seriously.

mildlymagnificent
mildlymagnificent
6 years ago

Keep on keeping on, David.

And we’ll keep on being as feminist as we damn well please.

(That includes hoping that the witless Jack and his long-suffering family stay safe. Everyone should be safe. In Jack’s case, that also means staying where he is and Shutting Up Forever about threatening David or anyone else. Lacking the sense to know when he goes too far, he’ll get into more police/legal trouble than he can cope with if he continues like this. Shutting Up Forever is the best strategy for him and a great boon to the rest of the world.)

As for the non-feminist Hannah and Suzanne, my wish for them is that one day soon they become completely and totally aware of just how nasty, misguided and downright stupid they’ve become. They should wake anew every single morning to the sinking, guilty, ashamed feeling that they’ve done wrong and allowed themselves, willingly, to be misled by Elam and his ilk. Every morning for several months and a resolve to do better every afternoon followed by a good night’s sleep and a dreaded awakening. Katie will know when to let them off the hook.

Ghost Robot
Ghost Robot
6 years ago

Stay strong Dave. You do crucial work with this blog.

autosoma
6 years ago

Dear David, I lend my words and voice in support of you. Keep safe and stay well, take appropriate legal action as your state allows.

To Mr Barnes you do not have go be like this, you have the ability to make the choice not to be this way. Take it from me Jack, I was once you. It’s a awful, difficult path to take, to look deeply at yourself and your behaviours and be accountable to yourself for the way if affects those nearest and dearest to.

I say this to you Jack because if you follow through with your rage and temper, egged on by those who do NOT have your best interests at heart. You will cause immense amount of emotional pain and suffering to those you desire to protect. Stop and think about the logical outcomes of your threats, you will get into a lot of trouble. Take time to care about your family and that your actions have outcomes that will not be nice for them.

Stop over reacting, calm down, you are making yourself a patsy to those you believe support you but once you act, they will disappear very quickly.

It’s a difficult thing to do, take it from me, I’ve lived your life Jack, I know the rage you feel and I’ve been very, very close to completing what your saying. Something always stopped me and it was knowing what the outcome would have on those closest to me. You may want to believe that they (your family and supporters) support your actions, but in the aftermath they will suffer far more than how you believe they could suffer if you took an alternative to what you feel you should do.

Jack, leave David alone, he is not the cause of your rage, your rage is stired up by the people who claim to be on your side. Calm down and stop, be still and quiet and let it be.

GardenGallivant
GardenGallivant
6 years ago

As a fellow feminist I am grateful for this honest mockery of the mra’s quoted dishcharge of rage, melodrama and pseudologic about females. Your ability to present this steaming mess with humor makes the content, well, tolerable to read.

I have been a regular reader of both your posts and the comments over the last three years so I can say I have not read any support from you or others for doxing, swatting or harassing members of the manoshpere under whatever collection of letters they use to designate themselves. Like others, I hope this barrage of threats and accusations fails to intimidate. Stay strong and keep petting the moggies.

Kootiepatra
6 years ago

MRA logic: One of us got doxxed by someone, who could be a feminist behaving badly, or a manospherian drumming up support, or some apolitical rando who merely has a personal vendetta against Barnes, or an 8channer who got bored and wanted to watch some fireworks. Since we don’t know for sure who it was, we can pin it on one guy we don’t like, and can threaten and harass him directly and personally as if he bragged about doing it.

Also MRA logic: Decrying doxxing doesn’t count if it happens before we write about you. Also, now that we’ve thrown those instances out, we are right to be mad at you for not decrying doxxing before we write about you.

Yet more MRA logic: People who say nice, supportive things to a guy we hate are clearly a breath away from SWATing us. They’ve practically done it already.

Such logix. Much human rights. Wow.

R Cawkwell
6 years ago

Best wishes to you David. I can’t believe how ridiculous this has got, it’s almost as if they haven’t read anything you’ve written at all.

AltoFronto
AltoFronto
6 years ago

I’m hoping that this plays out exactly as others have predicted – that this is all BS, that Jack will do fuck all apart from fling impotent threats around on Twitter and that his family will remain safe, because nobody gives enough of a damn about Jack Barnes to want to actually hurt him*.

Nevertheless, I wouldn’t want to wait for it to pan out that way without also having a contingency plan for an angry man with a gun scenario.
I doubt that Jack even knows where to find David, apart from “Chicago” which is a pretty big haystack in which to go looking for a needle. But on the offchance, David, I hope you’ve got the support of friends if you need to vacate your house for a short while.

I’m pretty sure Jack is afoul of several laws concerning threats, intent to harm, slander if he keeps insisting you’ve doxxed him, etc. If he’s going to make himself a problem to you, I’d call in Pest Control in the form of whatever lawyers, law enforcement, etc is available to you.

* I may be wrong here – has anyone been abusive to the Barnes’ family using the doxxed info so far? Or are Jack Barnes’ “enemies” actually decent human beings? He makes a big thing about “defending” his family, but neglects to mention any actual harm that they’ve received apart from the original doxxing, which is malicious in itself.

Love to David, Boo to Jack Barnes’ shitty behaviour, Boo to whoever thought doxxing people was an appropriate thing to do. I hope the real doxxer reveals themselves, and that Jack admits he was wrong to accuse you, but I can’t imagine that either of those things would be likely.

Be safe, David.

Joe
Joe
6 years ago

[comment about CPS deleted by DF]

dhag85
6 years ago

@athveg34f

At this point I think it’s pretty obvious that’s exactly what happened. It was a coordinated plan that backfired spectacularly. They had obviously anticipated we would be applauding the doxing, and when that didn’t happen they decided to go along with the pre-planned strategy anyway, resulting in this massive failure we’ve seen play out over the last few days.

But to be clear, I also think it’s terrible for Jack Barnes to dox his own family, if that’s what happened, so it doesn’t really make any difference to our response whether the doxing was real or not. Doxing is still terrible, and it shouldn’t be done even to shitty people, not even if it’s the shitty people doing it to themselves.

Basker
Basker
6 years ago

I hope you’ve called the police on this nappystain of an alleged human being. I suspect he wouldn’t have a pasty white leg to stand on if it came to court.

Luzbelitx
6 years ago

Adding my support to David from a “third world” anti-colonialist peronist feminist!

You are one brave guy and I’m proud of you, and also a little worried so please stay stay safe.

Here’s an adorable yet not feline turtle duck, use it in case of emergency!

http://38.media.tumblr.com/e2f21633c0c5de329069a5932b70662b/tumblr_mgbzr90X611rraalgo1_1280.gif

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

@Joe – You said:

This person has a daughter?! I hope CPS helps that little girl SOON! I’m thinking about calling them myself!
Really? He seems like a garbage person, but he might be a very loving father.

People are complicated.

For instance, one of my childhood neighbors was apparently rather high up (regionally) in the KKK*, but was just the most considerate neighbor (on our rural, all-white and very integrated Hispanic road), a doting father to his daughters, and openly wept when he failed to recussitate a neighbor’s young grandson who had wandered into some water.

Disagreement – even vehement, core-principles disagreement – is no basis for attacking someone’s family.

* We had no idea of his affiliation at the time – he didn’t fly the stars and bars or go about in full regalia, people aren’t caricatures. We found out later from his daughter who, when she discovered the truth, made as public a break from him as possible.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

Dammit, sloppy blockquoting.

My response starts with

“Really? He seems like a garbage person, but he might be a very loving father.”

schadrach
schadrach
6 years ago

I’m just going to point this out: You know that whole recent internet drama between Laughing Witch and Thunderf00t?

OK, in overall structure this isn’t really any different, with Futrelle holding the position analogous to Thunderf00t. The main difference is instead of bad Yelp reviews, someone doxxed Jack Barnes and threatened his child, and did so expressly invoking Futrelle as a reason.

I hate to have to say it this way, but there are a lot of people who will get irrational and aggressive when someone threatens their children.

Likewise, when people are threatening children because of you, you might need to rethink your platform, your audience, or both.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

@schadrach – Big difference:

TF was saying that LW deserved it / that these were the “consequences” to her actions…

…David’s saying no such thing and has, in fact, condemned this at every turn.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

Also: TF is actually the person who posted LW’s information.

David didn’t even know about this until he was accused.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

And, just to add – David’s does nothing but quote these people verbatim so we can mock them with like minds.

He documents.

I found this site because I was initially sympathetic to the MRM – their public face talks some good game on issues that do actually need to he addressed – but once I looked into them further, I saw the misogyny on display in their comments forums, read their actual internal talking points, and watched how they conversed amongst themselves, I recoiled.

This site provides an antidote to that awfulness, a place to say, “It’s not just me, right? This stuff really is as off the rails as I think, right?” and to laugh in relief.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

(Sorry for the typos – on my phone in a rush.)

autosoma
6 years ago
Reply to  mockingbird

Mockingbird I really don’t like @joe’s statement, it feels rather inflammatory to me. Making it sound as though a mamotheer is actually going to do something regrettable.

dhag85
6 years ago

@schadrach

You are an idiot.

promisedlandpastor
6 years ago

Dave,

Consider that at least some of these folds are ignoring what you say intentionally because they are violent hotheads who simply want a punching bag. There is no logic to bullying, and this should be reported to law enforcement discreetly.

ikanreed
ikanreed
6 years ago

I’m about as afraid to announce publicly that I’m a feminist as I am to mention that I don’t own any slaves.

Funkula
Funkula
6 years ago

Uh, Jack? You can’t be a “junkyard dog with no owner.” A junkyard dog is, by definition, owned by the manager of a junkyard. What you’re thinking of is a stray, which seems more appropriate than you perhaps intended.

promisedlandpastor
6 years ago

Fact 1: Jack Barnes’ information has been made public. It was immoral for someone to have done that and whoever did it should be punished, but nevertheless, his information is public.

Fact 2: Jack Barnes has publicly threatened David Futrelle, specifically staying his desire to physically assault him AND tacitly suggesting he would be illegally armed with a firearm (they’re illegal in Chicago) when he did so.

Fact 3: If any harm ever comes to David Futrelle, it strikes me that there would be prima facie evidence in the form of motive and opportunity to investigate Mr. Barnes as suspect #1.

Fact 4: Since Mr. Barnes has a family, I assume he doesn’t want to make an obvious follow-through on an obvious threat that will land him either in prison for life without mercy or in a gas chamber serving a death sentence, surely it is very unlikely he will do anything physically damaging to David.

Given these facts/surmisals, I would conclude that if Mr. Barnes takes any action against David at all (other than chest thumping to drive up his online traffic and whip MRAs into a tizzy), it will take the form of a DDOS on his website, defamation that can’t be traced easily, etc.

This would be a nuisance, but not threatening ultimately.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

When people are threatening children because of you

What? What makes you think David is responsible for this other than Jack’s say so? This is a huge leap to make. You’re saying that because Jack Barnes thinks, without any evidence, that David or one of his readers doxxed him, that means misogyny should be tolerated and feminism, which is a movement far older than the MRM by the way, is somehow inherently flawed.

That just makes no sense.

Vanir (@Vanir85)
6 years ago

Likewise, when people are threatening children because of you, you might need to rethink your platform, your audience, or both.

– schadrach

Tell that to the people David write abut then – ’cause all he really does is show the world the misogynists own words – it’s mostly *quotes* with added comments, snark and kitty-pics to make it less horrible.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

I’m not too comfortable with all the comments saying he’s just a blowhard who won’t follow through with any threats. It’s probably true, and I’m sure it’s meant to be reassuring. But it comes a little too close for comfort to the argument that nothing should be done about internet harassment because it’s not real life. Even if it’s a small chance a threat will be taken out, they should always be treated seriously.

reimalebario
reimalebario
6 years ago

Soon they’ll probably interpret your use of the phrase “ninjaed!” to mean that you’re threatening to send ninjas against them …

autosoma
6 years ago

I agree with WWTH. A threat is a threat and there are plenty of laws to deal with threats. The medium is irrelevant, its the intent if the message (sorry Marshal McLuhan this time it’s the other way round).

Lester Bangs
Lester Bangs
6 years ago

What you do is important, David, and you have been standing tall. That said, there is no shame in backing off here and letting law enforcement look into things a bit.before you bring up this joker again.

eyesopen
eyesopen
6 years ago

@promisedlandpastor

‘Fact 4: Since Mr. Barnes has a family, I assume he doesn’t want to make an obvious follow-through on an obvious threat that will land him either in prison for life without mercy or in a gas chamber serving a death sentence, surely it is very unlikely he will do anything physically damaging to David.’

An assumption is not a fact – it is your opinion.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

And of course the comments on the AVFM article are full of projection, assertions that David is a sociopath, and for some reason a thread about how feminists only oppose rape because we secretly want to be raped.

mrex
mrex
6 years ago

@auto “Mockingbird I really don’t like @joe’s statement, it feels rather inflammatory to me. Making it sound as though a mamotheer is actually going to do something regrettable.”

Thirded. We have no proof or even reasonable suspicion that Barnes is abusive or neglectful towards his daughter, and we won’t get it through the Internet. He can be a sexist, angry jerk and still be a good enough father. CPS is every parent’s (and child’s) worst nightmare, and we shouldn’t be condoning threats.

nparkern
6 years ago

Hi everyone, its my first post here (been lurking for a while)- I just wish it was under slightly lighter circumstances than this. Anyway, just wanted to voice my support too, David- you do an absolutely brilliant job exposing the things these hateful bigots do and say, and I wish you well in facing their wild accusations and threats.

Jack Barnes (along with the other MRA leader figures) is clearly scared that they know deep down that they will never be able to dent feminism in any way, and they will be long forgotten while feminism will stay in the history books. Your efforts in documenting their hate speech have angered them so much that they now resort to blaming you for something you’ve explicitly condemned multiple times- I find it difficult to understand just how people can think like this- its utterly baffling.

Anyway, I sincerely doubt that Barnes will follow through at all, but I hope you’re safe, and feeling safe- he’s definitely broken laws with this.

davidknewton
davidknewton
6 years ago

Wow, this thread got going quickly 🙂 I also want to say thanks to David for doing everything you do – even though it covers really distressing subject matter, this blog is great for having gathered a community that can support each other and make fun of these so-called people rather than be intimidated by them.

Jack’s tone in his post is an uncanny mixture of really frightening and absolutely laughable – it’s the kind of threats a twelve year old might make (an impression furthered by things like not knowing how to spell “Gondi”) but from an adult, this is disturbing stuff. I hope that you can take whatever steps are necessary to protect yourself from coming to harm.

These people, born in a position of privilege, so desperately want to be oppressed – I think they must see women getting support against people like them and just want to draw some of that attention back to themselves. What kind of disconnect do you have to have to say that feminists can’t take a joke or are just doing it for attention, and then say “ooh, I’ve prearranged funerals for my family”?

I often wish I could do more to support you and your message, but in the meantime, thanks for highlighting these dreadful people, for allowing us to laugh at them as they so richly deserve, and for being a David 🙂

Luzbelitx
6 years ago

someone doxxed Jack Barnes and threatened his child, and did so expressly invoking Futrelle as a reason.

How exactly do you know they are one and the same person, to begin with?

David has stated many times, every time he wrote about do**ing actually, that do**ing is wrong and no one should be subject to it.

Nobody here is ok with do**ing anyone, ever, for any reason, punto.

Trolls come often trying to bait the people here into agreeing with doxxing or other harmful and/or abusive actions, and they are shown the door like the willfully idiots they are.

Which is probably what will happen to you if you insist on pretending facts don’t matter and words don’t mean things.

[I’m using ** because I’m fond of the letter X and can’t bring myself to type it twice in a row for such a horrible meaning, so I’m saving them]

nparkern
6 years ago

@Joe

I’ll echo the thought that you never can tell how people are going to act in areas of life different to the ones they are hateful bigots in- there were self-proclaimed Quaker members of the KKK even! (A religion centred around pacifism and everyone being equal combined with violence and racism- it makes no sense whatsoever, but people are complicated.)

While I would think Barnes is mean to his family, I agree it wouldn’t necessarily be a given.

I do also wish for Barnes and his family’s safety- I mean, practically no one outside the manosphere knows who he is, so if you’re reading this Jack, you’re hopefully unlikely to come to harm but as I said to David, I still hope you and your family feel and are safe- like everyone else including David has already wished.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
6 years ago

Definitely further on the *NOT* involving child protection services, or indeed anyone here making any communications with the authorities.

It just plays into Barnes’ hands.

It’ll be taken as evidence that David has a team of minions ready to do harm to his opponents at his whim, or alternatively a bunch of cultists that David can’t control. They’ll use that as evidential support for the initial doxxing allegation.

Secondly, they’ll see it as equivalent to ‘swatting’.

Thirdly they’ll see it as justification for getting the authorities involved on Barnes behalf and we’ll just have David getting swatted.

kupo
kupo
6 years ago

I’m sorry you’re going through this, David. I hope everyone involved (including Jack and Suzy) remains safe and that the whole thing de-escalates soon.

vermillionbrain
6 years ago

Another reader and lurker coming out to show support for you and WHTH, David. You have consistently and vociferously denounced doxxing and any vigilante attempts to “punish” your ideological opponents. It’s just not who you are, or how you have comported yourself.

And really, anybody who sat down and thought this whole thing through would realize that. But this rant of his isn’t about the doxxing, or Barnes feeling threatened. It’s about using this bad thing as a club to justify further abuse under “both sides do it”. It doesn’t matter that he has no proof; because proof would only hurt his Jenga tower of justifications.

Funnily enough, I was watching Innuendo Studios’ “Why Are You So Angry?” series, when I clicked over and saw this. “Angry Jack” indeed…

sn0rkmaiden
6 years ago

@Schadrach,

this situation is very different to the ongoing spat between Thunderf00t and Laughing Witch.

Thunderf00t has a personal grudge against LW because back in January she took part in a letter writing campaign against him (which didn’t have any effect on his life). He’s recently decided to take revenge by posting her business details on his YouTube channel and encouraging people to leave her negative reviews, hundreds of people are now flooding review web sites with fake bad reviews with the intention of destroying her business, many of them referencing Thunderf00t, thus proving there’s a connection. TF has now made four videos specifically targeting LW and stirring up more harassment, when he could just as easily make a video urging his followers to quit.

David has never doxxed Jack Barnes on this blog, and has never urged anyone else to do so. In fact this blog and its comment section always condemns doxxing and threats of violence. There is no known connection between the person who released Barnes’ info and this blog. As far as we know, Barnes is not currently being subjected to any kind of harassment or specific threats and no one here is suggesting he should be. David has repeatedly condemned any such actions.

AVFM is once again attempting to construct a false narrative where lies and half truths are repeated until they sound plausible to their followers. These accusations are as spurious as when they accused David of being a pedophile, on the basis that he once wrote an article which didn’t call for the banning of the film ‘Salo’ (which depicts simulated acts of violence against teenagers).

TL;DR: David’s done nothing wrong and AVFM are lying, again.

sn0rkmaiden
6 years ago

Ditto on the leaving Barnes’ family well alone, child services have no place in any of this. As Alan says, that could be construed as SWATting which is worse than doxxing. Also, just because the guy’s a shit head doesn’t mean he’s a danger to his family.

Zolnier
Zolnier
6 years ago

I hope you’re not in any personal danger, David.